Soonhei (Member of this community) killed himself to experience Conscious Death. :-(

[Dodo]

18 minutes ago, RMQualtrough said:

@Dodo If you were sober and seeing things which aren't there and thinking you are Jesus being attacked by dark forces, I would suggest looking into the possibility of schizophrenia. There's an actual easy at home test for schiz, involving sipping soda while making a certain facial expression.

Connor stops believing he is an alien etc. once he is given antipsychotics. If dark forces are causing you distress, something like Seroquel might make them vanish.

Look its not that simple. I get you and your point of view. But having been there, the actual realness of these things and events is of the same lucidity level as me writing to you right now and on the same waking level of experience. 

In my response to you I only skim the surfice of what happened, because its a long story, so I just said "forces of darkness" to shorten the story. 

I will tell you why I call them that,  in short:

Me, with light body, running on the street, rising vibration and intuition. 

I intuit one man was about to sleep with a little girl and pulled him with superhuman strength, as I wanted to help her. Then he ran away and suddenly a guy appears out of nowhere, hits me on the back and I start running again, as I was very fast. But then police appeared out of nowhere - no cars nothing,  pointing a gun at me to stop, and I did. 

Then they put handcuffs on me and put me in a van. The handcuffs were so painful, they were created to stop someone with an activated light body...  The pain was so sharp, it was like burning. The back of the van was moving in a way to harm me. Nothing outside the van was generated and I thought that this is it- the devil got me and now I will be tortured, so I wanted to end it - i placed my head on the ground, expecting to smash my head from the "bumpy ride" and as soon as I did that, there was no longer any bumps, just smooth road.

Does this seem like normal stuff? Well it did happen and I am not making it up. Trust me or dont, but there are things out there we might not understand, but are real af.

[SoonHei]

@Nahm @Dodo @Leo Gura 

I can tell you no one edited his comments. He was gone. And we were drowning in our own grief and barely got into his email and passwords and eventually this forum.

We wish he never stumbled upon spirituality or any of this stuff. What did he gain? He was already an amazing person. I know I sound biased but trust me. He helped others so selflessly - emotionally, financially, in any way he could. Always did the right thing. Since he was a child. I cant explain him in words here. He even guided people on their spiritual journeys and got them out of depression. Never charged a penny for it. He did everything from the pure goodness of his heart. All this spiritual jargon and ideas only hurt him and his family in the end... He was better off without it and already on the path to "heaven."

His ideas of "there are no others," and life being a dream that one shouldn't get attached to made sense for the most part. But I must say this whole incident has reiterated to me why one should stick with long-established religions such as Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, whatever.... and listen to well-known "Prophets" and their teachings. There is a reason why they have had billions of followers over thousands of years, without needing the internet to spread their message. And their message still gives people the tools they need to lead a good, moral life.

I have personally come to the conclusion that this whole new age spirituality especially on forums and youtube is extremely dangerous. And sadly, no one seems to have thought about talking explicitly about why suicide or hurting one's body is wrong. Needs to be the title of a Youtube video on your channels...

I have no words left... The pain is too much. None of this can bring him back.

Best of luck to all of you in the journey of your lives!

[StarStruck]

Probably it was the psychedelics. People who have depression should be careful. I made a topic on this matter a while ago. 

[Windappreciator]

@SoonHei  This fits the blame narrative too perfectly. I am not sure as to how real this is.

Quote

can tell you no one edited his comments. He was gone. And we were drowning in our own grief and barely got into his email and passwords and eventually this forum.

We wish he never stumbled upon spirituality or any of this stuff. What did he gain? He was already an amazing person. I know I sound biased but trust me. He helped others so selflessly - emotionally, financially, in any way he could. Always did the right thing. Since he was a child. I cant explain him in words here. He even guided people on their spiritual journeys and got them out of depression. Never charged a penny for it. He did everything from the pure goodness of his heart. All this spiritual jargon and ideas only hurt him and his family in the end... He was better off without it and already on the path to "heaven."

His ideas of "there are no others," and life being a dream that one shouldn't get attached to made sense for the most part. But I must say this whole incident has reiterated to me why one should stick with long-established religions such as Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, whatever.... and listen to well-known "Prophets" and their teachings. There is a reason why they have had billions of followers over thousands of years, without needing the internet to spread their message. And their message still gives people the tools they need to lead a good, moral life.

I have personally come to the conclusion that this whole new age spirituality especially on forums and youtube is extremely dangerous. And sadly, no one seems to have thought about talking explicitly about why suicide or hurting one's body is wrong. Needs to be the title of a Youtube video on your channels...

I have no words left... The pain is too much. None of this can bring him back.

Best of luck to all of you in the journey of your lives!

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by Windappreciator

[Tim R]

6 minutes ago, Windappreciator said:

This fits the blame narrative too perfectly. I am not sure as to how real this is.

I can't believe I have to say this, but please keep all your speculations to yourself and show some respect and decency. It's not appropriate. 

[QandC]

If this is true, then Sorry for your loss.. really tragic

Edited May 19, 2021 by QandC

[kieranperez]

2 hours ago, Nahm said:

I have never supported the notion or concept of Mahāsamādhi

Jumping off a bridge is not fucking mahasamadhi ?? This is not a “conscious death” where one is entering a very powerful state of samadhi and transcends the traces of karmic bonds (which, even that is debatable). This is just suicide and a very irresponsible one at that as a result of needlessly confusing psychedelic states of mind with actual truth. That’s all that is. A reckless abandonment fueled by utter delusion. 

Best wishes to his wife and 2 kids. 

[Eren Eeager]

.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Eren Eeager

[Forestluv]

Please keep in mind family members may be reading this thread

[kinesin]

Here's the issue -

There is a reason why responsible spiritual teachers purposefully withhold advanced teachings from students until they've demonstrated clear evidence of having reached preceding levels necessary to understand them.  There is a reason why a responsible spiritual teacher has a close, in-person relationship with their students.

Leo is not a responsible teacher.  Leo is simply a guy like any of us, a regular person who is trying to navigate his way along the spiritual path.  Why do we fall into the trap of believing that Leo is anything more than this?  Because Leo has turned his personal spiritual journey into a brand, in order to make money.  This public image, the youtube channel with many subscribers, the forum, all of it creates a public perception of 'Leo Gura' which is much larger and more significant than the man himself.

The fact is, many of us here have long seen the warning signs of these dangers.  Not only the most tragic examples such as Connor and Soonhei, but also the countless smaller examples we see nearly every day where a person comes to the forum experiencing mental distress only to be told by Leo, Nahm or others that their feelings and situation are nothing more than a dream.  I find myself pointing out regularly that it is not helpful to simply state advanced teachings as if they are facts, without even acknowledging the mindset of the listener.

Something needs to change.  A personal spiritual journey isn't supposed to be public like this, it isn't supposed to be presented as if it were teachings from an enlightened master.  Spirituality should not be reduced to the status of a brand.  The fact that Leo Gura is generally thought to be a cult leader outside of this community is a major issue - those people are not entirely off-base, they're referring to something which Leo himself is fully aware of.  Because he has a brand and a known public name, Leo's words carry more weight than they are worth, and that is a dangerous thing.

[Tim R]

10 minutes ago, kinesin said:

Here's the issue -

There is a reason why responsible spiritual teachers purposefully withhold advanced teachings from students until they've demonstrated clear evidence of having reached preceding levels necessary to understand them.  There is a reason why a responsible spiritual teacher has a close, in-person relationship with their students.

Leo is not a responsible teacher.  Leo is simply a guy like any of us, a regular person who is trying to navigate his way along the spiritual path.  Why do we fall into the trap of believing that Leo is anything more than this?  Because Leo has turned his personal spiritual journey into a brand, in order to make money.  This public image, the youtube channel with many subscribers, the forum, all of it creates a public perception of 'Leo Gura' which is much larger and more significant than the man himself.

The fact is, many of us here have long seen the warning signs of these dangers.  Not only the most tragic examples such as Connor and Soonhei, but also the countless smaller examples we see nearly every day where a person comes to the forum experiencing mental distress only to be told by Leo, Nahm or others that their feelings and situation are nothing more than a dream.  I find myself pointing out regularly that it is not helpful to simply state advanced teachings as if they are facts, without even acknowledging the mindset of the listener.

Something needs to change.  A personal spiritual journey isn't supposed to be public like this, it isn't supposed to be presented as if it were teachings from an enlightened master.  Spirituality should not be reduced to the status of a brand.  The fact that Leo Gura is generally thought to be a cult leader outside of this community is a major issue - those people are not entirely off-base, they're referring to something which Leo himself is fully aware of.  Because he has a brand and a known public name, Leo's words carry more weight than they are worth, and that is a dangerous thing.

This is true, but one-sided.

In the end, Leo can't be held responsible for anything his followers/listeners do, it's 100% up to them. 

The real danger doesn't lurk in the things Leo says, but in the way people interpret those things. When Leo or whoever else says "life is a dream" or "you're god" or "death is infinite love" or "you're imagining me" or whatever, these statements mean nothing whatsoever, per se. 

I agree with you on the point that "advanced teachings" maybe shouldn't be shared out in front of god and everybody, but even then, there simply is no way at all to make sure that people don't take these things literally or interpret them in ways that are harmful to themselves or others.

[Snader]

I am so sorry for your loss.

A horrific consequence of misunderstanding spiritual work has happened and there is a lot to be learned from this.

My prayers go to the little ones and the rest of the family.

[Etherial Cat]

I'm sick to my stomach.

RIP Sunny, and my condolences to all his family members. My thoughts also go to everyone who has been shook by his death. This is an absolute tragedy.

[Cubbage]

My condolences, he was a truly valuable member of the forum, tragic to hear what has happened. 

[somegirl]

I have a question. If he died on May 3rd, why is OP and Sunny's sister talking about it just now ,after some days have passed?

If this is true, it's truly sad and I wish his family and friends to find peace soon. 

[Shin]

47 minutes ago, kinesin said:

Here's the issue -

There is a reason why responsible spiritual teachers purposefully withhold advanced teachings from students until they've demonstrated clear evidence of having reached preceding levels necessary to understand them.  There is a reason why a responsible spiritual teacher has a close, in-person relationship with their students.

Leo is not a responsible teacher.  Leo is simply a guy like any of us, a regular person who is trying to navigate his way along the spiritual path.  Why do we fall into the trap of believing that Leo is anything more than this?  Because Leo has turned his personal spiritual journey into a brand, in order to make money.  This public image, the youtube channel with many subscribers, the forum, all of it creates a public perception of 'Leo Gura' which is much larger and more significant than the man himself.

The fact is, many of us here have long seen the warning signs of these dangers.  Not only the most tragic examples such as Connor and Soonhei, but also the countless smaller examples we see nearly every day where a person comes to the forum experiencing mental distress only to be told by Leo, Nahm or others that their feelings and situation are nothing more than a dream.  I find myself pointing out regularly that it is not helpful to simply state advanced teachings as if they are facts, without even acknowledging the mindset of the listener.

Something needs to change.  A personal spiritual journey isn't supposed to be public like this, it isn't supposed to be presented as if it were teachings from an enlightened master.  Spirituality should not be reduced to the status of a brand.  The fact that Leo Gura is generally thought to be a cult leader outside of this community is a major issue - those people are not entirely off-base, they're referring to something which Leo himself is fully aware of.  Because he has a brand and a known public name, Leo's words carry more weight than they are worth, and that is a dangerous thing.

The thing is, we live in an age with youtube.

You can't possibly contain this knowledge, it will spread one way or another on social media.

[kinesin]

@Tim R "Leo can't be held responsible for anything his followers/listeners do, it's 100% up to them." is a cop out.  That may be legally true, but it isn't morally true.  In truth if Leo wants to be a responsible 'teacher' to so many people, his approach will need to change fundamentally.

He simply isn't careful enough, considering the number of people out there who mistake him for an enlightened holder of absolute truth.  He's far too glib, he gives short superficial answers to questions which deserve far more care.  Just a few days ago I saw him post this, which at the time I called out as irresponsible.  It's a good example of the issue -

[Bojan V]

@kinesin

1 minute ago, kinesin said:

@Tim R

Leo did not talk about physical death and did not advocate suicide. To many people misinterpret his words and then blame him for their own misinterpretations.

[SpiritualAwakening]

2 hours ago, WaveInTheOcean said:

In Truth life&death is identical. Completely identical.

I think you are roughly mistaken on this view. Birth and Death are illusory, relative, opposites and only have a significant meaning within this time/space dimension to the extent one is attached to these concepts. Life in it's totality is not a part of the two and these concepts have no foothold in the imagination manifested by Consciousness.

[Ryan R]

@Muhammad Jawad

My condolences to you and all those who loved and were loved by Sunny.

You doing alright mentally and emotionally all things considered Muhammad? See the thing is when our "best and only friend" kills themselves sometimes we are next in line.

Are you having any suicidal thoughts? Do you have a support system, family, a therapist, or clergy you can turn to? If not, and even if so, maybe seek out a local suicide prevention phone number wherever in the world you are. If you have even a hint of seriously contemplating suicide after this crisis and tragedy of Sunny's, please get help and talk to someone immediately. It is not weakness to have such thoughts nor to seek help. It is courageous to be self honest and seek assistance in preserving life.