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Title: In Control? Awakened? Great Memory?

Not enlightened nor awakened, but I feel like surrendering is key.

I was suddenly inspired to create this thread. Hopefully I'll connect a few dots here with the forum's help. Some users might know that I'm a musician and that music is my greatest love. My deepest passion. I often shared bits and pieces of my story here. Speaking of how music saved my life, how it guided me through life and how it ultimately led me to Truth. Enlightenment - if you will. And although it's a story I enjoy telling and there is much to be said - I'll leave that part out in this thread. I want to focus on a specific 'issue' here. So in short - Here's what happened; Been making music since I was a kid. Reached a point where I kinda started seeing some promising results (in terms of success) and then... *enter massive awakening*. Full on and as deep as it goes. The experience was fast, scary and intense af. Kinda dramatic. But also beautiful and one of a kind. Point is; in a span of 5-6 years everything was wiped out of 'my life'. Pretty much everything you can imagine one can lose - I lost it. Music and my 'former self' included. From a rather limited point of view; it totally seemed like I was forced to give it all up. But in my heart I knew it had to be done. It wasn't easy or pretty. The fire swallowed me whole. But... We all come back... don't we? I was at 'ground zero' for some time and then started 'recreating' everything from scratch. Everything from how I want to talk, walk and take shit to how I relate to people, what my values are, my true vision, desires etc. And also; how to get to all those things. I created a brand new blueprint for my self and my life. I wanted to align everything with The Truth that I realized. Now I'm not saying I'm the most enlightened guy ever, or anything like that. I'm definitely in for many more awakenings. And I'm looking forward to that. But the one that was a complete and utter 'game-changer' is - in that sense - already behind me. So to get to the point: I don't fucking know what kind of music I want to make haha. I cannot do what I used to do prior to awakening. Even though those projects looked promising back then; it just doesn't feel right to continue down that road. But I also do not have a new, unique and distinctive style 'in mind'. You must understand that I enjoy A LOT of music. Both listening to and playing/creating it. So narrowing everything down to a single style and project seems hella challenging. But I know it can be done. I witnessed the magic happen 'for me' before. It's the most satisfying thing an artist can experience - imo. When all the stars align - effortlessly. When everything you are and stand for (and even more) somehow perfectly translates into a musical journey. When you give birth to something far greater than yourself. A true, timeless masterpiece. In a sense; I'm creating this thread more because I feel impatient than because I feel lost. I am so damn eager to cum all over the world - musically speaking. There's so much I want to say. So much I want to express. So much I want to share... But I know the timing isn't right yet. No matter how contradictory that may seem to woke people here haha. Time, space or any other illusory phenomena you try to fight off while waking up simply doesn't bother you all that much once you've awakened to a certain degree. You're completely fine with all those things - most of the time. Illusory or not. And you most certainly are not afraid of using words like time, space, people, identity, etc - in order to paint a picture. You see through the illusion but also respect the apparent process. Because you're wise enough to know that grand visions take time to actualize here. Even some blood, sweat and tears - sometimes. And that's all cool. All Love. All Goodness. So I think I'm doing the smart thing here. Hear me out; I committed to attaining a larger amount of money, first. I am focused on work and business much more than I am on my creative side - atm. And work, business and money kinda live in a different realm of existence than heart-felt creativity. Maybe I'm wrong - but that's what's true in my experience right now. I know why I'm not seeing the results I want to see when it comes to music. Simply because my focus and energy are flowing elsewhere. I'm kinda embodying a different frequency throughout my day. A very strict, from A to B, 'get the job done' kind of vibe. And that's not in alignment with gentle, love-making with your instrument. You cannot force a masterpiece into existence. And you also cannot calculate your way to it. My idea is simple and clear: Make loads of money, buy epic studio equipment, pay for courses/lessons to even further develop my skills, make epic, never-before-heard music, pay for proper marketing and management and really do this whole thing 'the right way'. Professionally - if you will. But also of course; there are many more benefits I see in pursuing money first and music second. In this period/phase - that is. In the long run; I obviously want to be fully dedicated to and focused on my deepest passion. Any time I pick up my guitar these days and I play or sing or try to write; I feel like something's missing. it's not the joy or the heart. The love is still undeniably there. It's burning even wilder now. But something is not quite there yet. A true (musical) identity. A signature. That's why I feel like an upgrade is needed. I must take things to the next level and reach higher definition. And that requires money, my friends. Unless you want to play small. Nothing wrong with that either - I guess. It's just not an option for me. Not my cup of tea. So what do you guys think? Anyone here went through something similar? You think I'm thinking smart? Or am I not seeing something? Thanks!

I want to talk about death and reincarnation. The first question is being that when you die does the physical world and universe cease to exist? Because fundamentally there was never a physical objective universe, the universe was something you were imagining. How can this be well explained? Because someone may say "no the physical world and universe will continue on and it existed before you were born." But It's a chicken and egg problem. The second question is reincarnation. I have always asked the question of what was I before I was born and did I ever have previous lives prior to this one in some parallel universe. These are deep existential questions for everyone, because what is awareness? and did this awareness exist before you were born? is the awareness consciousness? And when you die do you just rest in this formless empty void forever or do you reincarnate? Another thing that I dont understand about reincarnation is that why even do it even after you awakened? You're just going from one ego form to a next? Doesnt that go against the whole purpose of ego death? I will hear many things about reincarnation, this one in particular I will hear alot from Buddhist and other spiritual teachers... "If you dont get it right you will reincarnate, but until you do get it right or awaken you will stop the cycle" What are they specifically talking about? To love everything?

If you find yourself alone, that is solipsism. When you see the sameness of yourself in everything else, that is another step toward enlightenment. There's nothing wrong with solipsism. It is a common stepstone on the spiritual path. Celebrate each step, and let go of self-judgment. It is all about the journey, which once realized, turns out to be the same in the "end" as in the "beginning". It's funny, really. When I talk to people that I consider awakened, there is little discussion about ultimate reality. More than anything, we just laugh

Aligning relative reality with ultimate reality is the greatest challenge, purpose, and reward of life. It is easy to claim that you are awakened, but the proof is in the existential pudding. Do you still suffer? Are you afflicted with desires, aversions, boredom, laziness, and anxiety? If so, you have not yet reached the end of the enlightenment journey. That destination is ultimate freedom, and it is only realized within. As I have said, I have only one purpose: to make man free, to urge him towards freedom, to help him to break away from all limitations, for that alone will give him eternal happiness, will give him the unconditioned realization of the Self… Again, you have the idea that only certain people hold the key to the Kingdom of Happiness. No one holds it. No one has the authority to hold that key. That key is your own self, and in the development and the purification and in the incorruptibility of that self alone is the Kingdom of Eternity… You are accustomed to being told how far you have advanced, what is your spiritual status. How childish! Who but yourself can tell you if you are beautiful or ugly within? Who but yourself can tell you if you are incorruptible? You are not serious in these things. But those who really desire to understand, who are looking to find that which is eternal, without beginning and without an end, will walk together with a greater intensity, will be a danger to everything that is unessential, to unrealities, to shadows. And they will concentrate, they will become the flame, because they understand. - Jiddu Krishnamurti

What's the point of pursuing our Life Purpose if we don't need it to be enlightened (which is said to be what truly makes us fulfilled)? I am currently working on making my Life Purpose my full-time career, but I am questioning whether it's worth continuing. Wouldn't self-transcendence contradict every need below it on Maslow's Hierarchy of needs? Is it better to have my life-purpose in place before pursuing enlightenment? (If I plan on becoming awakened in the future that is)

Look man, you've already said you didn't know this stuff and are just hypothesizing. You also repeatedly said something, I agreed 100% with it and that its the same thing that Leo and I are pointing to, yet you still seem to think its not. Again, you consistently say you don't know this stuff, but when you do, you'll prove your right. You now make claims "a being who's Done with a capital D doesn't say stuff like 'I don't know'". Like, what are you talking about, how do you know, this is just pulling stuff out of your ass and saying it would be this way because you think its so, not because it is so. Fine you don't believe Leo or I are awakened or to a degree that can understand where your coming from, then go somewhere else. This is arrogant madness on your part, being one who admits they don't know the truth, have read some stuff, who say they want to find out and then argue with people who make claims to understand this stuff, that they are wrong. Go somewhere else, find someone who talks your lingo you trust, and stop wasting Leo and the forum and my time..... Either open up to learning and introspecting, or be banned (for your own good really, so you can find out whats behind JOURNEY INCOMPLETE). Its in your hands man and I just hope you find what your looking for, but don't waste our time if its not the place your open to learning.

@tatsumaru What your calling wholeness is the same as what Leo is referring to as Oneness, so in that sense your debating semantics. There's still a lot you don't understand and I think shin may be pointing some of that. Love/Bliss/Ecstacy of its own accord may be one of those things which you have not awakened much or at all to. The emptying of mind is to see the lack of opposites, its just another way of understanding such. There are perhaps infinite paths to understanding this stuff so to say, don't get to caught up in your lineage. It may even be wise to be open minded, drop what you've learned and take a dive into other "paths", experiment, it could be just what you need to round out awakening.

The limit to being permanently awakened and free and in awe of the world is authority. It's the fact that you can't feel or say anything to people. Or get in fights with anyone who pisses you off. Or ogle at women. Or get yelled at by your Dad. You are always in fear of the police being called. Or in fear of being shut down. You have to follow the rules. None of this works.

Absolute Inclusiveness includes everything, it does not exclude killing criminals who refuse to cooperate. Notice that your mind is actually being exclusive here and not coming from the highest Love: which would accept everything without exception. I generally agree. But we are not at all in an awakened society. Nor will we be in our lifetime.

@Leo Gura that isn't true. love is inclusiveness, forgiveness, and companionship. An awakened society would not have jail systems. that's darkness, not light.

(my short story, painting by MindVenture Club member Patrick Jeremy McCollum) Darkness Comes I stood watching from the highest tower as darkness descended upon my kingdom in thick swirling smoke. This was it. Though I'd tried everything, my power to hold back the coming calamity was failing quick. All I had done was for nothing. The land was lost and I would die alone, the last prince of Mithryndale. No, there must be something more I could do. Perhaps by channelling the last of my power, I could suspend the castle in a pocket of time. It was risky, and sure to rip me apart-- but the castle must not fall at any cost. When needed, a destined hero is always awakened to restore the fallen kingdom; but the next one wasn't due for years to come and this destruction grew swift and furious. Everything I did to stop it only fueled it's relentless growth. If I could suspend the castle in time, the coming hero remained the only other soul who could wield the time crystal. She'd know what to do... With any luck, the castle would freeze while I yet remained in tact. That way, I thought, when the hero arrives, she'll see my face and I'll be remembered. You'd be surprised how much memory can be stored in a face. The whole of Mithryndale, perhaps. From my window I could see the cascading Rivers of Harmony thicken to a black muck, as the grasslands decayed to oblivion. The time to act was now. Goodbye, my love... Eyes closing, the familiar golden light appeared like an orb around my clasped hands, humming with ethereal resonance. I would need to expand this light around the entire castle and then activate the time crystal, the most prized royal heirloom. Perched on top of a pedestal in the center of the room, the time crystal was like a tall cluster of galaxy-blue quartz. It glowed from within, illuminating its countless imperfections into intricate constellations. I walked there slowly, expanding my light with each careful step. This golden orb was the size of the room now. Soon, half the castle would be engulfed--the largest I've ever attempted. (Which was quite painful and I slept for hours afterwards, but no time for that now. Soon there would be no time at all…) Lightening struck the Hope Tree down in the royal garden when suddenly the tower door slammed open, sending large splinters flying past my head. My dome of light flickered as I startled. "Stop!" came a strong voice, then a tall figure in the doorway. Grimacing, I focused more energy into the expansion. The intruder, clad in a long dark cloak and spike-heeled boots, crossed the threshold with one hand brandishing a mighty silver axe. The other was reached back to draw a sword harnessed to their slender back. Face hidden within the dark hood, the only revealing marker was the long yellow braid falling out and down to their mounded chest. No… it couldn't be… "Prince Killan!" she cried, and the hood retreated like magic to reveal the very face I thought I'd never meet: Deliza, the next hero of prophecy. "You must not freeze the castle! This path is doomed!" She drew her sword and pointed it to the crystal; the sleek blade shone brighter than my golden power. I couldn't respond. The castle was nearly engulfed in my light, and the pain nearing intolerable. I focused harder as she crossed the room, claiming there was another way to save the kingdom. No, the only way. Too withdrawn to stop her, Deliza grabbed the time crystal and tied it securely into a leather pouch. "You're... e-early...." I managed through gritted teeth. "Prince, we must leave now. The portal is waning quick..." When I let go, she gently caught my fainted collapse. I couldn't debate whether to trust her, at this point my unwavering faith in the hero of destiny was literally all I had left. The orb retracted back into me and I felt a bit restored, enough to stand. Deliza took my hand and we rushed down the tower to her portal. I didn't ask where it led. I'd find out soon, anyway. Outside, the darkness crept slowly in.

Thank you for putting yourself out there and expressing yourselves @Nos7algiK @LastThursday @Preety_India @Applegarden8 @Loving Radiance I agree in general and this may seem like splitting hairs but I see a clear distinction when complaining is also giving voice to a negative emotion regardless of how reasonable or even noble it might seem. When I give voice to that part of me that has a trace of violence in it, I can tell. Sometimes immediately or as it’s often been in the past, when I cool down and am reflecting. Maurice Nicoll said that all negative emotion all leads to violence. That may need to be framed by statements that at the present, are not with me. Another statement he made which stands better on its own and is somewhat related is the claim that a fully awakened person is actually incapable of violence. Yes, incapable,,,,, It deserves pondering I think. I have pondered it a lot and at times have felt like I’ve truly seen the truth in it. Arnold Keyserling said if a person can go 2 years (a Martian year) and not express any negative emotion at all then that person for the remainder of their life will never experience anything in a negative way again!

@justfortoday I wanted to ask you how is it possible for one consciousness to appear in different states.. If "my" and "buddha" consciousness is the same one why one is awakened to its true nature and other is not?

Purification of the emotional center as it’s referred to in the Fourth Way is the elephant in the room. This task isn’t accomplished in just a few months or even a couple of years. Some may scoff at this claim but I would hold the mirror up to reflect their derision as a pointer to how we are all prone to feed on negative emotion. As has been said by others, it’s not sex that makes the world ‘go around’ but the feeding on negativity. Look at our culture and other cultures and see how it manifests. Having grievances and keeping accounts, complaining, gossiping, displays of one-upman-ship in found in most areas of life including spiritual communities,,,, How many can say that they have seen these aspects in themselves previously or more importantly presently? Who is willing to potentially lose face this way? Who is willing to look at or even admit to a deeper level of self hatred that is often encountered by those who do very in-depth shadow work? Emotional mastery is realizing that we have a right NOT to feel and be negative, to paraphrase Maurice Nicoll. It is to have an awakened conscience. Gurdjieff remarked once that in the world, a man who has an awakened conscience among contemporary men will often be considered as,,,, well,,,, an embarrassment. To me, a sign of having emotional mastery is to truly wish others well. It means forgiveness or overlooking others transgressions. It means inspecting the world through a perceptual filter of Love. Am I there? No. I’ve had brief instances of it though. Also it’s how I make sense of the phrase “the kingdom of Heaven is at hand”.

How do you want to be awakened while needing to be out of fights, need to be free from your dad yelling and need to avoid the police? Realize that you don't need anything. You are already complete.

It's an outer journey as much as inner. Inside and outside are One. I know extroverted awakened folk. Extroverts might have it easier to awaken because they are not stuck in their private world so much. It's easy to awaken when you don't think much.

It can be safely assumed that introversion is shared by most awakened beings. At least most I know are natural introverts.

Doing this makes me feel uneasy. Any tips? @Vittorio Wow! This looks very helpful! I am going to be contemplating this tonight. @mandyjw I feel like a lot of my goals are distractions and that I should work on getting awakened. @Intraplanetary But it's so hard. I never feel full. Thank you @Gen Sue Rodriguez

Underneath I’ve pasted a bit from Chance and Choice. It goes along with the excellent material @kinesin posted. Esoteric traditions have always known that the autonomic nervous system is the key to Awareness and thus to spiritual development. The autonomic system is the doorway to the wisdom of the body. The body systems may be unconscious, and the autonomic nervous system may be outside "our control," that is, our ego control, but it is still a part of us, the holistic self. For this reason some people have learned to control some of the autonomic systems, and a few Yogis for instance, can slow down, or even stop, the heart for a short time. The autonomic nervous system is divided into two parts: sympathetic and parasympathetic. The sympathetic system accelerates the twelve organ systems of the body with adrenaline. It is tuned to the left hemisphere of the brain -- the ego, time and waking consciousness. The parasympathetic system does just the opposite. It slows down the organs. It is tuned to the right hemisphere of the brain -- to self, space and dreaming. The sympathetic design system connects the organs to the spinal cord horizontally. The spinal cord is related with one nerve to the cerebellum, and 20 nerves to the organ systems, through the twelve chest vertebrae and the five lumbar vertebrae. Thus in waking we are not just apprehending the real world, but are also processing the reactions of the organs. For that reason we naturally create the human environment in part as an organic projection. For example, we build kitchen's for our stomach, and toilet and sewer systems for our waste elimination organ system. Our skeleton is like our machines, our brain is like our computers. We build facilities like our liver for power and energy production, and our fashions are related to our skin and sensation system. We have to get in tune with our body and its twelve systems to understand our environment. The slowing parasympathetic nervous system is only connected to the head nerves and to the sacrum. There are no connections with the vertebrae. The directive tenth nerve, vagus nerve, which actually changes it position over time and is thus known as the "wandering nerve," branches out to other organ systems. But the vargus nerve does this in a 1:1 relation, not 20:1 as in the sympathetic system. The deceleration side of the nerves is tied to the spiritual side of man. The quickening is tied to the material. For example, in the male sex organs, erection depends on the parasympathetic system, on romantic love. Ejaculation comes from the sympathetic system, from the movement of love making, from quickening. Consciousness is inherently fragmented. It follows the numbers one to infinity. Awareness is holistic, unifying. It follows the number zero. Slowing down and quickening have a limit which leads to the same experience from two different directions. Slowing down the associations in Yoga creates a state of meditation. Quickening can lead to the greatest velocity, the speed of light, illumination. The slowing down is stopping, absolute zero, which again is illumination, but of a different character. As soon as you come to a full stop and reach complete silence and center, you are in the same place as the speed of light, and illumination will come by itself. This has been described by many Asian traditions and scientifically by transpersonal psychologists like Charles Tart. Thus Yin/Parasympathetic and Yang/Sympathetic blend in total awareness of Chi. With this blending a human can be totally awakened to both this and the next world. Taken from chapter four - http://www.chanceandchoice.com/course-overview/brain-and-mind/

This is not exactly true. It's a generalization. Some health problems are genetic or environmental and outside of human control. If your mother was toxic with chemicals when she gave birth to you, that's something you might suffer from your entire life and have little control over. If you got some weird genes that make you more sensitive to chemicals in the food supply, that's also very difficult to control. But also many health problems ARE within your control if you change your lifestyle. It doesn't matter how conscious or woke you become, you can still have health problems. And many awakened people do. The body is easily broken. BTW, I have improved my heath A LOT through improving my perception. If I hadn't done that, I would probably be dead by now. The bottom line is: Consciousness of Absolute Truth or God will not give you good health.

Perhaps intellectually. But intellectually awakened is not experientially awakened. The difference can be seen in the manner in which the message is conveyed. The intellectual, by the manner of their words and the way they are conveyed cannot awaken another. On the other hand, the one who is abiding experientially in and speaking from that Reality,can awaken many, with only a few simple uncontrived words,as it is the clear undistorted Truth itself speaking. When real truth is spoken by the one abiding in and as the reality, it will bring silence to the mind of the one who hears them.

Ya, interesting isn't, all these "awakened" interpretations and subtle differences. Some say they are all saying the same thing, and others appearing to claim whats being said is different. Random enlightened guy 0: Your not awake, because Buddha said this, blah blah blah. Random enlightened guy 01: No your not awake because you haven't merged the emptiness and the everything. Random enlightened guy 010: But wait you didn't notice infinity or God. So its not complete. Whats a guy like you to do. Right? From your perspective, are the perspectives you shared true, possible, or neither? How would you actually be able to validate it? Is the source of your perspective, true, possible or neither? Is the fact that there is a perspective happening wether it matches your perspective or not, proof that "something" is in fact going on? Like could there be illusion/not real stuff if there wasn't at least "something" to be the source of such illusion/not real stuff? And if there is in fact "something" is it possible that it is separate from anything? Put more complicatedly, where would anything come from to begin with, 1. Wouldn't there need to be something always eternally so, like a basic ground in which stuff manifests from and as? Like you can make clay into many shapes and functions like a house or a chair, or a table or a car, but its still clay. Some may say this eternal is projecting illusion/imagination/dreams, but still these are from and as Eternal. 2. Some may say it arises from an actual No-thing or is a projection of, but still this would mean everything comes/connected to No-thingness, ie; an illusionary projection of/from No-thingnes is still No-thingness itself. This may take time to let in and understand, but once you do, you may notice, that essentially these metaphors are the same in practical purposes so to say. You see, as a questioner, which you appear to be, with a perception, in either case, are connected to Source/Sourcelessness. If that doesn't make sense, perhaps this video may help bridge some assumptions or lack of insights...

Awakening “practice” is nothing more than pointing out the obvious. Why do you think noting works so well? ? The awakened state is indescribable, not because of how “amazing” it is, but simply because of how immediate it is.