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Ive just had another moment of awareness, putting things into perspective. It feels like in daily life I am caught up in an pseudo-awakened alter ego and totally clouded, totally filled with concepts and beliefs, so clouded that it makes me depressed. An ego with stories around awakening, feelings and experiences that are clearly mind filtered. That is the default state of my mind. I begin doubting, feeling like I just pretend things happened a certain way when they actually were just mind-distorted so I could put them into words. I look at this self and it is so far away from reality. It makes me absurdly sad, very very sad looking how deep I fell. And yet I am still unconsciously always caught up in it. Pls take me out of it, this realization is very heartbreaking somehow. I have already had such realization where I cried because I realized how unconsciously deep I fell without even noticing it driving me to the point of thinking about suicide. This poor soul just didnt know it better because it got dragged away in the mind's stream of stories. That is probably the reason I have no clear sense of self - it is so clouded and manipulated by the mind.

Man... I am sorry to hear that. I apologize for assuming, you didn't try psychedelics, it just appeared that way from your post since I have never seen pink elephants or anything close to that on psychs. Psychedelics can definitely be challenging. I have also contemplated suicide from many angles myself many times with and without psychedelics. Delusions are definitely possible on psychedelics, but I see that as coming from the mind and not psychedelics themselves. It's better to ignore all of those interpretation - quiet the mind- and embrace breathing and being.

I experimented with ayahuasca 9 times in religious settings ("Santo Daime" and "UDV"). When i was doing some research, i found several reports of people who took ayahuasca for themselves in a non-religious setting and it went pretty bad, i read one that the experience went horribly, left most people involved traumatized and one even committed suicide. I am not saying that this will happen to you but maybe there is a reason that ayahuasca is usually taken in a controlled setting with experienced people/shamans. The one time i took a moderate/high dose of shrooms (5g) i found it very powerful and the trip was pretty similar from the ones i had with ayahuasca.

Signs of psychopathic behaviors Fails to address the underlying issue behind the argument Doesn't admit fault or responsibility for actions Doesn't apologize Dominating Tries to cast your family in a bad way so you lose all kind of emotional support Suddenly shifts the topic instead of addressing the concern Blames you for questioning his behavior Mocks when you are serious Gets serious when you are being light Jumps to premature conclusions and assumes too much without evidence Manipulative Doesn't give attention or time Makes you do everything as per his whims and fancies Shows retraint with anger and good self control Hides real intentions Does not show worry or concern. If you are ill Calculates his moves Blames constantly Anger issues Suicide threats Not available when you need or want Switches off his phone when convenient by blocking you Does not give you the freedom to express yourself Spies on you Controls your every move Lies.. Big lies Tries to maintain a good public image. Helps people so that they will call him a good person. Huge huge red flag of fake humanitarian Is rude to you, not in public but at home Does not respect your work assignment or boundaries Continues to talk to people who you don't want him to talk to Gets easily jealous when there was no need to Blames or guilt trips you for wanting help Does not lay out a clear plan for the future Does not invest money Abandons you when you need Creates drama Does not respect boundaries Does not allow you to sleep because he needs to talk Evokes sympathy when you are angry about an issue Triviliases your achievements and accomplishments Hardly ever praises you Infantilizes you. Wants you to be dependent Takes pride in being complimented Harasses you till you say yes to his demands or till he wins the argument Tries to prove he is morally superior to you Switches the topic when you want to have an important discussion Compares to other people Gaslights you by constantly trying to show that you are wrong Triviliases your logic Contradicts almost every statement Never tries to get along with you even if it's easier to do it, as easy as saying yes or no Neglects you for hours Gives very trivial excuses for his negligence of you Gives more value to friends. And family. Big sign Does not tell you openly and then blames you Finds a way to blame you or show you are wrong Blames you for his losses Shows how others are superior to you and you should measure up to them Compares others bad behaviors to you Forecasts a bad outcome for your behavior. That you will do so and so in the future Emotional blackmail Doesn't bother to help Shows fake emotions Constantly talks about his ex Talks friendly to people who have been mean to you or not getting along with you. Does not respect your ego. Calls you jealous if you called out on it Blames you if you trying to point out your issues with him Does not show serious commitment Takes revenge or gets vengeful Holds grudge for too long Humiliates you publicly Does not say sorry when he is wrong. Only says it when he sees he might lose you Argues till infinity Blames you for his mistakes You are the only one who seems to be interested in calling Everything is about him always Selfish Tries to demean you or lower your worth. Does not respect space Doesn't show committment Uses abusive language Abusive, Narcissistic, manipulative

@MrDmitriiV Sounds pretty similar to Wim hoff breathing or shamanic breathing both which I stopped as I feel can get to same place with regular meditation and I really don't like the side effects of these breathing techniques (nausea, dizziness, headace, etc) which precisely why I dont like drinks/drugs. @Dogsbestfriend I agree with you. Have you gone deeper and had a full samahdi experience yet? There is no breath or energy or body. Just completely being in utterly emptiness, a single thought of even "This is it" would break it. I'm still trying to master getting into this place, i notice some regularities. Intense energy and focus during meditation (can't be tired or sleepy) Blindfolded and earplugged, trying to removing every sense/experience possible. Intense self-enquiry, doubting all things, all body senses, and the mind. Intense enquiry to existence (many will disagree with me on this one) but enquiry into the nature of existence, and non-existence, similar to being a robot who's enquiring how could he could possible be "experienceing existence" when all he is material and software. State of facing existential fear and commiting suicide (ego death) Being. unfathomable power, like a blackhole, neither something or nothing. During this peroid I could die and stay here forever, theres no ego to argue against it. I dont see it as "love" or "happiness" its just like default mode but also very powerful, it's god (for lack of poor words to describe it). Then obviously you come back from it and the ego comes back, but the more consciousness work we do, the more that emptiness is apparent in the "now" the foundation of all things.

I can relate, I´m 18 too. As young men we have to find our place in the world and It´s not easy. Youth is the most difficult part in a young man´s life because we don´t have nothing to offer...yet. I can also relate to the suicidal thoughts, I don´t buy into the whole "suicide is bad, you are a snowflake, bla bla bla". Whenever I feel suicidal I renounce to my identity, to my expectations and plans, I simply let go of all of it, and a new playfulness arises, maybe I can´t do X at the moment, but I can do these other amazing things instead so who cares! Hope it helps, hit me up if you want

The Attraction for Drugs is Spiritual – Osho (No prohibiting the use drugs) Drugs are as old as humanity itself, and they certainly fulfill something of immense value. I am against drugs, but my being against drugs is for the same reason as for thousands of years people have been addicted to the drugs. It may look very strange. The drugs are capable to give you a hallucinatory experience beyond the mundane world. That is the experience that is being searched through meditation. Meditation brings you to the real experience, and drug gives you just a hallucination, a dream-like experience but very similar. To meditate is difficult. The drug is cheap. But the attraction for drugs is spiritual. Man is not satisfied with his mundane existence. He wants to know something more. He wants to be something more. Just the ordinary life seems so flat, so meaningless, that if this is all then suicide seems to be the only way out of it. It gives no ecstasy, no joy. On the contrary, it goes on piling you up with more and more misery, anxiety, disease, old age and, finally, death. From the cradle to the grave, the ordinary life is just a drag. People go on living it because they are cowards. Otherwise they will commit suicide. They don’t have the courage enough to commit suicide. But this is not something one can rejoice in. You can drag on but you cannot call it living. There is no dance in it, no color in it. It is just a vast desert spreading as far as you can see, with no oasis anywhere. I am reminded of one of the dreams of Leo Tolstoy. It is a rare dream. It is also unique that it went on repeating continuously almost his whole life. As long as he could remember, the dream was happening. And the dream is very strange. In his dream he sees a vast desert and two gumboots without anybody in them, just the two gumboots without any feet inside them, are walking. They go on walking and they go on walking, and there is no end to this walk. The desert is endless. And he always woke up perspiring, his heart beating louder, gripped with great fear. Without going to any psychoanalyst, he knew the meaning. He himself was a genius. He knew that this is his life, this is not a dream. It is not even symbolic. It is exactly his life. Where he is going? Wherever he goes he will end into the grave. Who is going he does not know. The gumboots are empty. He is unaware of anybody inside. He is unacquainted of the person who is wearing the gumboots. He is invisible. All that is visible is the gumboots and the desert, and the tedious journey, pointless, meaningless. This is the reason that drugs have attracted man since the very beginning. And they have at least given him a temporary relief. Only few people tried meditation. And my own understanding is, these people also tried meditation because drugs at a point become useless. You become immune. In the beginning they give you tremendous experiences, but soon they become almost part of your body chemistry. Then if you don’t take them you are in trouble. Your whole chemistry wants them. If you take them, you gain nothing. You go on increasing the doses. In India where the experiments with drugs must have been the oldest, because the oldest scripture in the world is Rigveda, the religious source book of the Hindus, it talks about a certain drug, Somras. Because of this Somras, Aldous Huxley has called the ultimate drug one day, when LSD is refined and there is no side effect, it will be called Soma. The name is from Rigveda. Rigveda according to Hindus is ninety thousand years old, and nobody has been able to prove that they are wrong because their arguments for its old age are almost irrefutable. They are not logical, otherwise it would have been easy. They are astronomical. In Rigveda there is a description of a certain combination of stars that had happened according to modern astronomers also ninety thousand years before. Now there is no way for the people who were writing Rigveda to describe it in absolute detail unless they have seen it. Now this is such an evidence that you cannot do anything about it. The astronomers say for ninety thousand years that combination has not been again in the sky. So certainly whoever was writing it was fully aware of the combination of stars at that time. For ninety thousand years Hindus have accepted drugs almost as part of their religious ceremonies. It was only under British regime that drugs created trouble, but because they were part of a religious ritual, which is the ancient most religion in the world, even the British government was afraid to interfere with it. It continued. Even in my childhood all drugs were available in the market. There was no question of any illegality. And every school of Hindu religion was using drugs, but they were using it in a very scientific way. They will give the drug in a certain quantity, create a certain experience in the man, and then when he will come out of it will tell him that, “This was only an illusion. It was simply because of the drug, because of the chemistry, your mind experienced. “Would you like to experience it in its reality? If the illusion is so beautiful, you can think how much more the reality would be. And the experience created by the drug lasts for a few hours, and again you are back to the same old rotten world. But if the experience is real, it is yours forever. You never lose it. It is not something that has happened to you, it is something that was already in you; you have discovered it.” So I don’t see that it was wrong to use drugs in this way. In fact, this should be the approach around the world for the modern man. And now we have more advanced drugs, synthetically made, and we are capable to purify them more. We can make drugs which have no bad effects at all. We can make drugs which are not addictive. And we can have in every hospital, in every university, a certain department which teaches people how to move from drug to meditation. Just to talk about meditation remains simply verbal. There is no way through the words to give you any experience. But drugs are immensely useful. The words can explain to you what meditation is, the drug can give you an hallucinatory experience of it. And then you can be initiated into a method. And now you will not be moving in darkness. Now you know that something… if an ordinary drug can do so much, then there must be some way to find an authentic transformation, to experience it without any dependence on anything. So the drug simply opens up a door and helps you to understand that man’s life and his experience need not be confined to the ordinary mundane world – he can fly high towards the stars — that he is capable of knowing things which are not ordinarily available. Under proper guidance — medical, meditational — drugs can be of immense help. I said I am against drugs because if they become addictive then they will be the most destructive for your journey towards the self. Then you become enchanted into hallucinations. And because it is cheap — no effort has to be done, just you have to go on taking bigger and bigger doses…. In India it came to a point…. Still today there are monasteries where they keep poisonous snakes because the people had become so addicted to all kinds of drugs that no drug has any effect on them. They can take any dose and they will remain normal. The only thing that gives them a little experience is a bite on their tongue by a cobra. That will be death to anybody, but to them it is a beautiful drug experience. Sometimes it has happened that these people become addicted even to cobra bites. Their whole bloodstream becomes poisonous. And it is on record, and once it happened in front of me, that a cobra was brought to bite. The cobra did it perfectly well on the tongue, and died. The man had become so poisonous… because the cobra is not poisonous in his whole body. He has simply a small gland which has poison, and that gland is just in his mouth. So whenever the cobra bites someone, he immediately turns upside down, because the gland in his mouth has the opening up. He will bite; that is not dangerous. That is simply making your blood available. And then he will turn over to pour the poison on your blood. The bite is not really poisonous. The poison comes from the gland which hangs above his tongue in the mouth. It has to hang that way, otherwise the poison cannot remain in it. So he turns upside down. The poison starts flowing out of the gland into the wounds that he has made by his bite. But before he could do that, biting the man was enough to get poisoned himself. For thousands of years people have been using drugs. Moralists, religious people, governments have been trying prohibition absolutely unsuccessfully. And I don’t see that they can ever succeed. The only way to succeed is what I am suggesting. Rather than prohibiting drugs, let the scientists find out better drugs which give deeper and more psychedelic, more colorful, more ecstatic experiences and without any side effects, and without any addiction. And these should be available in the universities, in the colleges, in the hospitals — wherever some kind of guidance is possible, that the person is not prohibited, is allowed total freedom to use anything that he wants. And we use his experience to help him grow towards some authentic process so that he can start experiencing something far greater than any drug can give. And only then he can compare that the first one was just a dream, and this is a reality, and the first one was just cheating myself through chemistry, ‘And the first one was not helping me in my spiritual growth. It was in fact preventing the growth, keeping me addicted and retarded’. The second one goes on growing, and now he starts gathering courage to explore more. He was never aware that these experiences are possible, that these experiences are not just fiction. So drug can be used in a very beneficial way, to make the person realize that this is hallucination, and the hallucination is so satisfying, would not you like to try the real? We have the real drug also. I call it meditation. And it takes you to the uttermost blissful experience possible. Then only drugs become useless for you. If we want humanity to get free of drugs, then meditation is the way. But before we can get free of them, they are very important and can be used to introduce people to meditation. So this paranoia about drugs is not helpful to humanity. You can make drugs illegal, it makes no change. In fact, they become more attractive, more exciting. Particularly to the youth they become a challenge. I am amazed sometimes, is man going ever to learn even the ABC of human psychology? The same stupidity goes on which God did with Adam and Eve: prohibition. Don’t eat the fruit of this tree. But that becomes an invitation. That becomes a challenge. And thousands of years have passed, but the authority figures are still in the same mood: don’t use the drug, otherwise imprisonment for five years, seven years. And nobody bothers that drugs are being made available in jails. Just you have to pay a little higher price. And the people who come out of the jail are not cured. They go back again because … the reason is the drug gives them something which your society is not giving. They are ready to destroy their health, their body, their whole life becomes a mess, but still that drug gives them something which your society does not give. So rather than preventing them, create a society which gives something which is better. I have been fighting in India with one of the most idiotic prime ministers India had, Morarji Desai. He is absolutely fanatic, is not ready to listen to any reasonable argument. Alcohol has to be prohibited. He prohibited the alcohol. That does not make any change. People start making alcohol but that proves dangerous. Thousands of people died because the alcohol they drank was poisonous, was not made rightly. The people who were making it had no idea what they are making. And this has been happening around the world. Once in a while some idiot comes in and tries to prohibit, but nobody asks why people drink alcohol. Your life gives them nothing. You suck them of their blood and in return what they get? No joy, just anxieties upon anxieties. Safe alcohol makes them relax for few hours, sing a song or have a little dance — or a fight in the pub. But for few hours they are transported from your world. The very attraction proves that your society is wrong, not that alcohol is wrong. Your society should help people to dance, to sing, to rejoice, to love. The alcohol will disappear. The other drugs are far better than alcohol. There are many drugs which have less bad after-effects, particularly synthetic drugs taken in a right atmosphere, in a right mood, for example, LSD. It simply enhances your mood, it does not do anything to you. If you are in a despair the LSD experience will become a nightmare. But if you are feeling a well-being, that is the time to take LSD. Then it can give you a really positive ecstatic experience, although it will be hallucinatory. But if you don’t know the real, it looks almost the real. Even a man like Aldous Huxley, one of the most intelligent men of this generation, thought that through LSD he has achieved the same experience as Gautam Buddha, Kabir, Ramakrishna. If you don’t know the real, naturally you cannot call it hallucinatory. It is so real. Huxley had no experience of meditation. He has really no right to say such a thing. You can say such a thing only when you have experienced both, that it is the same experience as Kabir. Kabir never used any drug. His experience was purely of meditation. On what grounds Huxley can say it is the same experience? He does not know the experience of Kabir. I can understand that he has been through a tremendously beautiful experience, but that experience disappears as the effect of the LSD goes out of the system. But Kabir’s experience remains twenty-four hours, day in, day out, his whole life. Once it happens, it is always there. This is a simple criterion. But he was so much fascinated by the experience, and he corrupted almost a whole generation. They thought that if a man like Huxley says that LSD can give you samadhi, then what is the need of going into so much trouble for meditation with no guarantee whether you will be able to succeed or not? I am against drugs because they can become addictive and they can prevent your spiritual growth. You can start thinking that you have achieved what you were seeking, and your hands are empty. You are just dreaming. But, on the other hand, I am a very scientific mind. On the other hand, I would like drugs to be used, not to be prohibited — but used under proper guidance as a stepping-stone towards meditation. And governments should pay more attention for improving the drugs rather than preventing people. If improved drugs are available, then other drugs will already be out of the market. There is no need to prohibit anything in the world. Just produce something better — something better, cheaper, legal. Then who is going to bother about marijuana, hashish, heroin — for what? There is no reason. Something better is available with the medical store, without prescription. Even in the hospital you can book a place for yourself that doctors can look after you while you are in the drug experience. Meditators can help you to understand what has happened to you. And this is possible very easily through meditation. One thing more, that if something even hallucinatory happens to a person, meditation becomes easier. Something in him becomes certain. Something in him is now perfectly guaranteed that meditation is not just fiction. And the hallucinatory experience also opens some doors. The guidance can be of very much importance. For example, when somebody is under LSD and is having an ecstatic joy, that is the moment to teach him the method of meditation, because he is very sensitive, very clean and clear as he is not ordinarily. He is dull and cloudy. Now the whole sky is a clarity. You can teach him meditation more easily in this moment than you can teach him when he is in an ordinary state. He seems to listen but he only hears. It does not go deep. His sleep is thick. But in certain moments under LSD he is very close to awakening. Under a right guide he can be introduced to the technique of meditation. He can be given what is called post-hypnotic suggestions for which he is absolutely vulnerable. He can be told that, “This meditation, you will be able to do it when you are out of LSD experience.” You can go on repeating it that, “You are going to succeed in it.” It is a simple method and there is no problem in not succeeding in it. Just one or two sessions with a guide will be enough. The man can be moved towards meditation. And once he moves towards meditation, drugs have no importance at all. All the efforts of scientists and the government should be to understand that if a certain thing has been so attractive for the whole history of man, and no government has ever been successful to prohibit it, then there must be certain need that it fulfills. And unless that need is fulfilled in some other way, drugs are going to remain in the world. And they are destructive. And the more governments are against them, more destructive they are, because nobody can make any refinements on them, nobody can make any experiments on them, nobody is even allowed to say what I am saying. But I can say it because I am against drugs. But that does not mean they cannot be used. They can be used as a means, they are not the end. And if we can hope a future free of drugs, if man becomes naturally meditative…. And that is possible. If a child finds his father is meditating, his mother is meditating, everybody is meditating, he will start being curious about it. He also wants to meditate. And that is the age when meditation is very simple because he is not yet corrupted by the society. Yet he is innocent. And if everybody around him is doing something and enjoying in doing it, he cannot remain behind. He will sit with them with closed eyes. First they may laugh at him, that it is not possible for children. But they do not understand. It is more possible for children than for the so-called grownups. Just the atmosphere of meditation in schools, in colleges, in universities — wherever the person goes he finds that atmosphere which nourishes his own meditativeness. I would love to see that no drugs are needed in the world. But not through prohibition, but through creating something better, something real. Drugs will be defeated without any difficulty, but these idiotic governments go on giving importance to drugs and they go on destroying the youth around the world. The most precious time of life is wasted in hallucinations, and by the time they realize what they have done to themselves, perhaps it is too late. They cannot come back to a normal state. Their body has become accustomed to have certain chemicals in it. Then even unwillingly they have to go on injecting themselves with all kinds of poisons. Or if somebody has not been on hard drugs, returns back, then he finds life very much dull, more dull than you find it because he has seen something beautiful. It always remains a comparison. He has made love under the impact of drug and he had felt at the very top of the world. And now he makes love and finds that it is nothing but a kind of sneeze. It feels good; you sneeze and it feels good, but it is not something that you live for. Nobody can say that, “I am living here for sneezing.” -Osho From The Last Testament, Vol. 4, Chapter Six

I used to have crippling anxiety I still can remember the feeling, I just wanted to escape my life, and meditation gave me that, so I used it for escapism until I experienced the bliss that comes with mindfulness, when it hit me I realized this new realm of possibility, everything changed. But then bipolar hit me and I started drowning in an endless spiral of misery until recently I had my first glimpses of enlightenment, for once in a very long time I felt liberated for my self, it might be a self-deception tho because I was about to commit suicide and I couldn't bullshit myself anymore so my mind had to do a trick it never did before, or maybe it was real bliss idk, either way it worked. Needless to say I still get bipolar depression physical symptoms (including the dark thoughts and dull mind) but for some reason reason it doesn't bother me much anymore, even anxiety doesn't bother that much anymore, don't get me wrong I still have to do so much work to balance my brain chemistry, correct my thoughts, cultivate awareness, etc. But my god it's so much better now. This is unnecessarily long, but I ain't deleting ?

Pluck might have made a mistake Sheela made. He might have idolized Leo so much without doing meditation and then his life got fucked up and he blamed Leo for it. I like Leo because he seems to have empathy towards others. I disagree with some of his ideas though. Just some. For example: Leo prefers Sadhguru over Osho. Honestly, I don't like Sadhguru. He seems to me a harsh man saying HEAVEN OR HELL, YOU CHOOSE. From what I see, Sadhguru wants to people to create a traction in their life, the traction that he considers good, fitting with his eyes. He seems to think one is 100% responsible for his life. . From the way I see, the answer is no. Most people were born poor, not intelligent, not emotionally well-grounded. And it's understandable why they feel depressed. To be honest, I don't want to be born. It sounds negative but it's the truth. However, instead of continuing to take my anger on others, I'm starting to meditate to master my emotions and live blissfully. What I want to say is we should be more empathetic and focused on ourselves at the same time. If we focus too much on who gives us the ideas, we do not take the ideas seriously. If things get too difficult for me, I can just commit suicide like Osho. No need to get angry at anyone. I'm not good at expressing my point of view, hope you guys understand.

@Viking lol ? If you choose to commit suicide, I think silver bullets will do it.

Actually a very strange thing happened to me. I was looking at the moon and I felt sort of "download" of energies from it. I felt a sensation in the belly, it was as though it was growling and I was hungry. I didnt think anything of it, but then about 30 minutes later, I was with my friends, the moon became more red I felt this energy in my hands and back and i started to freak a little, but it passed. at around 10pm when the eclipse was at it's peak I felt a sensation in the back of my head. I concentrated on it and it went to the front of my head. at that point the sensations in the upper back and the hands came back again, but much stronger. the energy continued and continued to increase and I felt a sharp pain in my teeth, they actually became very large, and a lot of hair was coming out of my hands and my back!!! my nails also started to grow bigger and i couldnt help the energy in my throat chakra and just started howling. everyone around me looked at me terrified. then I felt this anger and that hungry feeling again and I couldnt hold myself back and slaughtered and ate all my friends. im now covered in blood, I ran back home just to write about it here in the forum!! and what a synchronicity that you posted a topic about this!! all the hair fell out and I dont know what to do now, im contemplating suicide, help.

Hey guys! I have a quite difficult situation which may or may not determine my future and I don't know how to decide. My situation is that I am a 20 year old male student from Hungary whose just gotten admitted to a university as an IT engineer (that pushed me to take action and seek help). I am an only child and been spoiled by my mum, she protected me from a lot of things and partially due to that I have little life experience. The other part is me who gets scared when something radically new emerges and tries to go back to it's comfort zone, to maintain homeostasis. I have two choices. The first one is I stay with my mum, finish the university and continue this trend. The second is I enroll in another university, which is a college in Slovakia (it's not far, about 50 km), on a similar course. I have been invited by a friend (The only person I call a friend. I realized upon watching Leo's video about stage orange that I truly suck at relationships. I've only been contacting people only when they were of any use to me. I've been a loner most of my life) with whom I would go, enroll and live there. I would meet new people, finally socialize and experience a great deal of new things which have been absent in my life until now. I've tried talking about this to my parents, but they were defensive about it. My mum's reason is not to destroy my future, my possible career by following my friend and going to a (possibly) weaker university. My dad just doesn't want to lose me. The situation regarding my parents is a complex one as well. They divorced when I was 2, but my mum allowed my dad to be around me for me to have a 'role model' when I grow up. My dad is still around, but there is a twist to the story. He has epilepsy and tried to commit suicide once. It's one of the strongest forms of epilepsy when he starts shaking, loses consciousness and his muscles in his whole body starts jerking out of his will. He often bits his tongue and gets a couple of bruises. He is a disabled pensioner and thanks to that has difficulties finding a job. He is currently working as a security guard at a place for a company that deals with construction. His bill is low, he is barely able to live on his own. However, thanks to his illness, he can't be left alone else he may even have a fatal accident. If it wasn't for this, he may not be around me anymore. From my point of view he is closed-minded and would not want to lose me, as I am the only reason he can visit us. Both of them got irritated and angry upon I mentioned it and would not want to talk about it. Moving on, I also did a silly thing. I got admitted to the university in Slovakia and paid the fees of enrollment and translation of the required documents without telling my mum that I am going there. Now we are having a vacation in Croatia and I don't want to spoil her vacation by telling her now. I would go there, and I wouldn't at the same time. When I was there in Slovakia, I felt like 'This is it! This is the place where I will change my life for the better!' However soon after I just don't feel the same enthusiasm. I would rather stay here and enroll the university, learn new skills in IT and get a diploma with which I would have more than one choice as to where to start working. It's me again trying to stay in my comfort zone, but is the enthusiasm I used to feel authentic there? There are also a lot of factors to consider when making someone's choice of career. I am not even sure IT is something I would build a career out of. I have had good grades and understood most of the things and I am particularly happy when I finish a small project in 3d modeling in Inventor or a code that works and does something more than displaying text or do basic math. However, I rarely find the motivation to even start something like these. Most of the time I spend endulging in my internet, social meedia and video game addictions, I still spend half of my day at the computer unless I have something else to do. There is a lot to work on myself. I would appreciate any input, and thanks for reading.

I have recently gotten into Bradshaw's work on the "inner child," which has been more immediately transformative than a lot of what I've dabbled in psychologically and spiritually. If you grew up in a dysfunctional family (absent parent, addict parent, emotional/physical/sexual abuse), I highly recommend you look into this realm of psychology. Quick background on my childhood: Alcoholic father who went to rehab and dominated it when I was 16 (so 16 years of total insanity in my home, proud of his recovery). Suicidal mother (an attempt every few years, stopped by a random intervening force she wasn't expecting each time). Major Traumatic Events: 1. Attempted sexual assault at age 10 by my father, who was so drunk I believe he thought I was my mother while napping in their bed. I fought him off and no one spoke of it again. The rest of the family doesn't know about it - I don't think he remembers it. 2. Father broke into our home with a shotgun and threatened to kill us all while separated from my mother. We ran to the neighbors' in the middle of the night. 3. Some physical violence events. 4. Mother's suicide attempts, hospitalizations, escape from hospital on Christmas. Daily Trauma in the Home: Having to be quiet and not-annoying, parental screaming, anger, crying mother, being blamed for parental discord and separations, etc etc. Usual chaos in an alcoholic home. Inner child work operates on the premise that you were not nurtured and provided for appropriately at your various developmental stages. The energy of need is trapped physically and emotionally. The loss must be re-experienced, grieved, and another healthy adult must provide the nourishment (you, now). Effects of a fucked up inner child are addictions, dysfunctional romantic relationships, lack of self worth, neuroses of all shapes and sizes. Healing Techniques: Looking at photos of yourself as a child, writing letters to and from yourself as a baby/child (using your non-dominant hand to write as your inner child), guided meditations, group work. I haven't done a lot of work yet. I have written to and from myself as a baby and a child. I have looked at pictures of myself and imagined holding myself. Two Experiences of Note: 1. I listened to a hypnosis session on "Letting Go of Past Relationships" that I have listened to several times before with no real benefit. This time, I listened to it and imagined myself as a baby doing the hypnosis instructions - my adult self held the baby in the imagery. I noticed instant results and no longer felt the pangs and desperation of wanting to reach out to an ex boyfriend I have struggled to get over for a year. 2. After this hypnosis, I simply imagined my adult self holding, playing with, and kissing my baby self. This is the trip report. I have never felt so completely consumed by the feeling of love. I did this for perhaps 2 hours because I did not want to stop. It felt so good - it was a feeling of simultaneously giving and receiving a gigantic reservoir of love. I am reading more about family dynamics in dysfunctional families. I have learned that I was what is called the "lost child" - this is the one who stays quiet, stays in the bedroom, daydreams to escape, focuses on something else in life like school, people pleases, doesn't ask for or express anything out of fear, and ends up in codependent relationships as an adult. I will continue my work in this realm because I have already experienced big shifts. I wonder where the fuck my therapist has been at all this time, not telling me about any of this, but recommending Byron Katie so I could further shove my needs and feelings off to the side - an already unhealthy manifestation in the "lost child." Again, if you grew up in a dysfunctional home, look into actual psychological healing through these methods in addition to your other work.

Wanting to know Truth is not enough. If you need to know it like it's eating at you from the inside out night and day and even if it kills you you're willing to die to know it,then I'd say you're ready. "willing to die to know it" doesn't mean physical suicide either. That's a cop out reserved only for elite pussbags who can't stand themselves and don't deserve to even sniff the sweet taint of truth.

The desire for oneness can sometimes look like "sin". When the drive "I need you to love me" doesn't get fulfilled, it may turn into suicide, murder, rape, power, control, and manipulation. People feeling unloved is dangerous.

i didn't say "horrific", but alaska is quite isolated and cold and people from switzerland have major issues with depression and suicide.

@Durka_Durka Come on! Suicide is not an option! I know,no matter how shitty you feel and think, it doesnt have to end like this. Why end your life cause of those stupid thoughts? Have a little faith.Something to hold on to even if its totally fake,not existing,a bubble . Cause life is a bubble anyway. So why not? "I look out of this window and I think this is a cosmos, this is a huge creation, this is one small corner of it. The trees and birds and everything else and I'm part of it. I didn't ask to be put here, I've been lucky in finding myself here." Morris West

@Revolutionary Think Yes. Accept and love them for who they are. Dismiss their ways of thinking without being obnoxious yourself ( even in your own mind, keep it healthy ) Create more space and time between your interactions. Be the one in control with the power of suggestion Stay true to yourself I wrote a long article but cannot post it, sorry. I wish I could share my life that much, I really do, but in my case I had to be a warrior in a 3rd world post communist country while being a hippy with purposeful implementation. I've been manipulated, experienced betrayal and even had to accept the fact that a family member committed suicide. I wrote that small list because I gradually developed them in order to survive while not severing the love bonds between us. One more thing : "With great power, comes great responsability" [Uncle Owen from "Spiderman"]. Most of the time accepting the limits of others while still loving them, can solve more problems than you can think. Take control of the moment, wisely. Want a job ? https://www.freelancer.com/ http://upwork.com/ https://www.fiverr.com/ // Hope this helps // I am currently working on financial independence and found these platforms very useful for starters, at least for gathering resources ( money ) // I posted these ideas since I saw you said that you do not like complicated math (didn't mean to offensive), so content writing, web development or even programming could be a great start. Peace

@Mikael89 I may have been unclear. I'm not saying consciousness can be annihilated. I'm not even saying phenomena can be annihilated, just that to the enlightened it wouldn't make any difference if it was. If you're so indifferent to the world that you couldn't care less whether all phenomena disappears tomorrow or continues, what difference does it make whether it does or it doesn't? So it is annihilation. Re reincarnation, my mind has long been open to that concept (it makes sense), but I don't believe dogmas without evidence and certainly wouldn't bet the governing strategy of my entire life on it. In any case, it's beside the point, we're not considering actually committing suicide, we're using it as a thought experiment. Think of a time when you didn't know about enlightenment or believe in reincarnation. Someone says 'Life sucks. Why don't you kill yourself? Then you'll know what happens when you die'. Would you have done it? It's the same question. Re 'life is bullshit', perhaps this summarises our differences and reinforces my point about the reasons anyone would want to be enlightened. I don't think life's bullshit. .................................................................................................................................................................................................... I won't have internet access for a few days now so I'm going to wrap up my part in this discussion. I know I've been provocative, and I'm sorry if I've ruffled anyone's feathers, but I stand by my tiny effort to balance a discourse that too easily leads to unrealistic expectations and a careless 'of course enlightenment' perspective. Views some have expressed here such as 'there are no cons to enlightenment' reinforce my theory that many seekers don't know what they're asking for, and are expecting a big pay off that isn't going to happen. 'There are no pros or cons to anything' might make more sense, but could you say it and mean it? I used to think enlightenment was a no-brainer, too, but you know what - there is absolutely no obvious answer to whether it's a worthwhile pursuit. From the perspective of the human being, of course it isn't. From the perspective of God, nothing's worthwhile, who cares? For my part I will be probably be contemplating this for a while before deciding whether I return to seeking or not. Special thanks to @Solace @Emerald @Victor Mgazi for the food-for-thought.

@Stretch I think you missed my point. Awakening is not about ending the dream ,you can't end something that has no beginning. It's simply about being aware of the dream, the same way you would be aware in an actual dream that you are dreaming so even if you get shot(or be held at gun point) in the dream that wouldn't matter to you. Awakening is not suicide or death, it's the realization that there is no one to commit suicide or die. Similar to the way that there's no one to get shot in the dream. Everyone (including you) in that dream are happening in your head and even in this reality. You are simply part of the dream and once you awaken you will still be part of the dream because you only exist in this dream. Even the concept of a truth is part of the dream, everything you know is part of the dream! So yeah you can choose to be conscious of that or not. Maybe you like all the pleasure and pain in this dream so do what you will. It's very simple.

@Outer Once again, this argument took it as a given from the start that believing in a seperate self is a delusion and truth can be found in stillness. Doesn't answer the question. 'No thoughts is the goal' only applies if you're already assuming enlightenment is a desirable thing. Frankly, some of you here sound brainwashed. @Victor Mgazi So we're back to the 'truth for truth's sake' line. All you get from enlightenment is to end the dream of life. So really it doesn't make any sense if you're not sick of living. It's the 'life sucks, just kill yourself' argument. If enlightenment wasn't dressed up with fantastical, misleading appeals to the ego (mystical states you also have to ultimately renounce, the ridiculously nonsensical prospect of being some blissed out 'enlightened being', etc), I wonder if any mentally stable person would give it any more consideration than a suggestion of suicide? Unless, (I'm addressing everyone now), knowing the truth just for the sake of it matters more to you than everything else in the universe combined, and you'll gladly do that trade. Think you fit that category? Ask yourself why you're still doing anything at all.

@Mikael89 Sure, my mind is rebelling totally. That could be said of anyone who ever changed their mind. Only if you already assume that enlightenment is a desirable thing does that become a concern. And lol, yeah if I ask a teacher of enlightenment they're sure to promote enlightenment. If I ask a teacher of terrorist suicide bombing they're sure to promote suicide bombing. Doesn't make it a good idea. @Bobby Go on then, what have I missed? @cirkussmile Yes, enlightenment is the end of suffering, and is natural of course, as it's truth. We're going round in circles here, that was established at the beginning.

My girlfriend has serious emotional problems and has been trying to overcome them for a few years now, going to therapy, meditating, reading, trying different exercises but she feels she is still in the same place, and has lost hope. She often says she wants to be dead, and says nobody understands her, she feels alone and hopeless. She has been hinting she will do something to call the attention of the people around her, so they can see how bad she feels, she has talked about suicide. What should I do?

I’m having some problems to determine where on the spiral could I be and therefor I don’t know where the hell to begin working on. From one hand I’m still trapped en a very blue sense of guilt because of a lot of thing I’ve done in the past, but in a lot of things I’ve also trascended blues guilt. I think I’m mostly in orange, but in a kind of inward orange or a low stage orange because I’ve being very depressed for around three years ive had an intempted suicide a couple months ago, I am very disinterested in accomplishing anything with small lapses of entrepreneurism. Because I don’t have any money I started to attend to AA meetings (Ive never had problems with any substances or so, but I’ve found a place to empty my self of those thoughts) but even in AA I see a lot of delusion as Leo has explained. There is something inside of me that knows that what Leo is teaching is the way, but at the same time I know I have so many things to work on my self first. It’s strange! It’s like I understand everything that Leo is saying (I know that “believing” doesn’t matter at all) but my reality is so basic, and every time I plan to work on stage Orange to fully embody my stage, Thoughts of “Why even try if it’s delusion?” Comes to my head. You can see in my writing that it’s so confusing, but that’s how I feel right now. I really really hope you can help me and that I’m ready for the help.

@Primentex thoughts of suicide are just a distraction. Suffering comes in many forms, small and large, simple and complicated. But all mental suffering occurs because you want to force 'reality' to your will. And when 'reality' doesn't do what you want it to, you suffer. All distraction is just suffering in disguise; you distract yourself because you do not like reality and you do not like reality because it's not happening the way you want it to. Step away from the suicide. Step away from the distraction. Embrace reality as it is.