Important! - Nobody On This Forum Is AWAKE

[Water by the River]

23 minutes ago, Brivido said:

It seems that you are falling in the trap of believing that there is someone to save from unconsciousness. Each one of us is choosing to dream the dream of being a human, and again, you know that. There is no-one to save and, in the absolute sense, your work is completely useless because you are teaching to yourself.

Selling water by the river. Since "you" already are IT.

[bliss54]

What criteria is there for you to deem someone awake?

 

What about Frank yang he was on this forum, your more awake than him?

 

Why does it even matter who is more awake than someone else, what kind of ego games is this

Edited March 28, 2023 by bliss54

[Gesundheit2]

6 minutes ago, bliss54 said:

Why does it even matter who is more awake than someone else, what kind of ego games is this

More awake = more developed.

[Gesundheit2]

@Leo Gura

Now I remember a conversation I had once with one of your previous mods after your 30-day retreat. They had experience with psychedelics and specifically 5-MeO. So I asked them about their opinion on your state at that time, because you seemed unwell. They basically told me that they experienced alien stuff too, like stuff out of this human realm completely, and that ungrounded them for some time, so they thought you were going through a similar thing.

Anyway, and since I have no experience with drugs, I'll just assume that the overall awakenings of 5-MeO seem to be related to two main categories:

• Solipsism/God consciousness.
• Alien consciousness.

Is there more to 5-MeO than these two awakenings?

[axiom]

@Leo Gura I'm sure you can recognise the synecdoche effect here.

Seeking deeper states forever / a forum thread that lasts forever

[OldManCorcoran]

2 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Are you sure about that? There is only absolute reality, the relative just seems relative. The relative is the absolute, and i think it can be understood. Obviously it's not understandable in the conceptual mind level, the thing is deep understanding, consciousness understanding itself

It is very interesting that the presence of presence seems noticeable. We are conscious of the fact we are conscious, as some might understand it. But of course we know consciousness does not refer to anything other than existence... The presence of presence seems as known as the presence of purple when you see it.

That is very interesting.

I wonder if that could be considered understanding? Of course any sort of thought is going to be the presence of thought appearance. But is the fact of presence "understood"?

[Holykael]

2 hours ago, Brivido said:

I am going to leave some deep thought questions and considerations about the topic of Alien Consciousness and this thread, @Leo Gura feel free to answer or use the following as material for your future course.

1. If there is only Consciousness, why call it "Alien"? The concept of "Alien" is based on the difference between self and other, but as you very well know all is Self.
2. You have to explain in detail what you mean by "Awakening" because your definition is constantly changing and is confusing people. If you take "Awakening" to mean dissolution into formless consciousness, you aren't Awake either, because you are here reading this post. Give us a clear and concise definition of what you mean by the term "Awakening".
3. Your bar for "Awakening" is getting insanely high. In my vocabulary, awakening means the direct and constant realization that I Am the medium which creates any possible kind of reality: Consciousness. Everything is Me, everything is myself, everything is my Mind.      
4. When you say "Nobody on this forum is awake", you are undervaluing your own work and your own impact. There are people on this forum who have been as far as you went and I am one of them (leaving outside this Alien Consciousness business).
5. It seems that you are falling in the trap of believing that there is someone to save from unconsciousness. Each one of us is choosing to dream the dream of being a human, and again, you know that. There is no-one to save and, in the absolute sense, your work is completely useless because you are teaching to yourself.
6. In the absolute sense, the role of "spiritual teacher" is completely useless. From my POV I am the only one that can awaken and from your POV you are the only one, why constantly affirming that "nobody is awake"? Of course nobody is awake but you from your POV, because you are everyone.  
7. You have to accept that the majority of people will never go as far as you went and that other classic teachers are offering a valuable service to "normal people". 
8. Can you clarify why one week you state that you and Peter Ralston are the only ones awake and the next week you change your mind? What makes you consider Ralston awake, if you consider him so? Have you been talking with him?

What happened to your YouTube channel. It was pretty cool but now it's gone

[axiom]

@OldManCorcoran 

"Understanding" is also just appearance, and it relates to nothing. It is not actually understanding.

The appearance of understanding is the appearance of understanding. Nothing more.

It can be "understood" that the sky is pink, or that all humans have eight legs. 

Ultimately, understanding seems to provide some sense of reality and a locus, when actually nothing is ever real and nothing is ever understood.

Edited March 28, 2023 by axiom

[Thought Art]

1 hour ago, axiom said:

@Leo Gura I'm sure you can recognise the synecdoche effect here.

Seeking deeper states forever / a forum thread that lasts forever

Going on this trip together 

rabbit hole goes on forever 

 

[Brivido]

57 minutes ago, Holykael said:

What happened to your YouTube channel. It was pretty cool but now it's gone

I have realized that I need to take care of other areas of my life before I start creating spiritual content. 

[Breakingthewall]

10 minutes ago, axiom said:

@OldManCorcoran 

"Understanding" is also just appearance, and it relates to nothing. It is not actually understanding.

The appearance of understanding is the appearance of understanding. Nothing more.

It can be "understood" that the sky is pink, or that all humans have eight legs. 

Ultimately, understanding seems to provide some sense of reality and a locus, when actually nothing is ever real and nothing is ever understood.

Do you realize that what you affirm here is that you understand reality?

[SBJ]

Are any of you realizing the HUGE red flag this post of Leo is? If anything, saying he is the ONLY one on the PLANET who is really awake, is indicative of narcisism, ego and a huge messiah complex.

For those who actually think for themselves, like Leo tells you you should do, this post alone should be enough to never listen to Leo again, at least if it comes to spiritual topics. If spirituality is important to you, continue meditating and doing your stuff, you don't need Leo for this.

If him saying he is the ONLY ONE ON THE PLANET who is awake is not enough for you to immediately stop taking him seriously, you are seriously deluded and dogmatic. Following such a cult-like leader will NEVER bring you enlightenment/awakening/God realization or whatever you think you are after.

[OldManCorcoran]

42 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Do you realize that what you affirm here is that you understand reality?

He is saying there isn't anybody who understands, because there is only the understanding itself. Like there isn't anybody who hears a sound there is only the sound itself. The fact of being appearing as understanding, being appearing as sound.

It is a very consistent framework where the witness is dropped from all pictures. Whenever you say you _, then this user would frame it as just _. Like that post.

[Devin]

33 minutes ago, SBJ said:

Are any of you realizing the HUGE red flag this post of Leo is? If anything, saying he is the ONLY one on the PLANET who is really awake, is indicative of narcisism, ego and a huge messiah complex.

For those who actually think for themselves, like Leo tells you you should do, this post alone should be enough to never listen to Leo again, at least if it comes to spiritual topics. If spirituality is important to you, continue meditating and doing your stuff, you don't need Leo for this.

If him saying he is the ONLY ONE ON THE PLANET who is awake is not enough for you to immediately stop taking him seriously, you are seriously deluded and dogmatic. Following such a cult-like leader will NEVER bring you enlightenment/awakening/God realization or whatever you think you are after.

          There's only three users out of thirty in this thread that don't think there's a problem and haven't tried to put Leo on the ignore list. You can't put any mods on ignore for some reason. I think he posts inflammatory claims to get people chatting and coming up with insights, but I think it drives the insightful people away.

Edited March 28, 2023 by Devin

[Breakingthewall]

22 minutes ago, OldManCorcoran said:

He is saying there isn't anybody who understands, because there is only the understanding itself. Like there isn't anybody who hears a sound there is only the sound itself. The fact of being appearing as understanding, being appearing as sound.

It is a very consistent framework where the witness is dropped from all pictures. Whenever you say you _, then this user would frame it as just _. Like that post.

1 hour ago, axiom said:

@OldManCorcoran 

 

It's the same. what there is is existence, you can call it self or if you don't like that word, another. if there is understanding, there is. existence understands itself. it is indifferent that there is no witness. the witness is created to be a witness for existence. you go deeper and deeper and you understand more clearly since existence is you, even if you are a creation, you are existence. there is no real/unreal dichotomy, there is what is, and what is is understanding

[Ramu]

Leo:  a little clarity on alien consciousness.   Do you mean alien, as in God consciousness is alien to the human egoic consciousness or alien consciousness being separate from my God Realization...i.e., another God?  It's like you're intentionally misleading us with questionable terms.

[spiritual memes]

5 hours ago, Squeekytoy said:

Truth is not an experience at all, why the hell would truth be an experience... All experience is subjective, do you think truth is subjective? Do you think what's true depends on who you ask or when you ask them, or what chemicals are floating through their brain?

No but someone's access to the truth is absolutely an experience. If you disagree, then why do you need a fuckton of 5-meo to realise truth? If it isn't an experience, then why do you need psychedelics? Why do you need literal chemicals floating through your brain to realise truth?

5 hours ago, Squeekytoy said:

And why is that? Isn't it to obtain maximum understanding?

Reaching peak states means very little if you can't integrate them into your life. Any understanding will fade once the drugs wear off.

5 hours ago, Squeekytoy said:

Your dichotomy wasn't just false because you presented two examples as if they were of two different alternatives, when they were really just examples of the same.

They are not the same.

Leo's work: Take extreme doses of psychedelics repeatedly to get temporary peak states. Everything else is useless.

Everyone else: Use meditation and other various practices to increase you baseline state of consciousness. Psychedelics are just a glimpse.

5 hours ago, Squeekytoy said:

But also because neither of the alternatives you presented have anything to do with truth at all.

Again, unless you have direct experience of the truth right now, your 'truth' is a meaningless construct. You can play whatever games you want but you aren't awake and know nothing about truth. These are Leo's words not mine. I can talk about god realization and solipsism and infinite love, but they are just mental games unless I am awake. The Tao that can be told is not the eternal Tao.

[Thought Art]

@spiritual memes You are wrong about psychedelics not increasing baseline state. Mushrooms for example removed any glimpse of suicidal thought from my mind for 3 months afterward and one trip was a major life improvement. This was a baseline improvement. 
 

Some of the states offered by tripping you don’t want to be in all the time. that’s why they are bottled up in substance, not constant. 
 

Leo, in my view clearly teaches to balance manual spiritual practices and psychedelics. Don’t distort what he teaches. If you trip but don’t contemplate, and do manual spiritual practice you might as well be a retard.

You don’t understand the distinctions, nuances and paradoxes of relative and absolute truth.

Edited March 28, 2023 by Thought Art

[Moksha]

8 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

Are you sure about that? There is only absolute reality, the relative just seems relative. The relative is the absolute, and i think it can be understood. Obviously it's not understandable in the conceptual mind level, the thing is deep understanding, consciousness understanding itself

Absolutely sure, and entirely ignorant of everything else 

Direct realization is where absolute meets relative reality. It is the purest expression of the absolute. Lucidity is the paradoxical intersection of seeing clearly, even within the dream. All forms, thoughts, feelings, experiences, and epiphanies are seen to be imagination, or the absolute pretending to be other than it is.

Comprehension is always conceptual. It is imagination imagining itself. A fun game but not absolute truth, which is only directly realized.

[Devin]

9 minutes ago, Moksha said:

All forms, thoughts, feelings, experiences, and epiphanies are seen to be imagination, or the absolute pretending to be other than it is.

Imagination and pretending are concepts of the mind, so is "the absolute pretending", everything is real.