Important! - Nobody On This Forum Is AWAKE

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Squeekytoy said:

How can there be structures to the absolute... All of that is part of creation at large, all of which is a mirage.

You would call your life a mirage ? It's a complex structure that have a reason. The reality is complex, and can be understood. Simplify is...simple . The reality isn't simple at all, despite we would like

 

[Water by the River]

5 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

This is a common mistake. The mistake is trying to reduce Consciousness to some bottom line. This leads to Buddhism. You will not become very conscious that way. Consciousness is about grasping higher, not reducing down to a bottom line. You cannot comprehend GOD through bottom-lining. That's what all these enlightened people get wrong. They treat GOD as though it were some kind of substance or atom that you just need to discover and then you are done.

> Consciousness is about grasping higher, not reducing down to a bottom line.

You can go higher in appearances in consciousness. 

What is this consciousness? What is the real You? Does that have a higher or lower? What is that Singularity?

> The mistake is trying to reduce Consciousness to some bottom line.

I agree on that. You can't reduce Reality to anything.

And Reality/True You is aware, perceptions seing themselves... No location, no higher or lower, infinite in every aspect, but able to manifest it all and be aware of it. And the appearances and perspectives can be higher or lower, more encompassing or not.

 

[Jahmaine]

Such an approach, greatly detailed by Alan Watts, which explains the relationship between Leo and the Audience and the nature of the approach it, he’s real proper ain’t he?

 

Regardless, if reality is all subjectivity, then these types of statements are both just matter of fact, but also narcissistic and egotistical in nature, since they both contain truth - by the fact it’s being perceived that way - it’s true that what’s being said can be true and it’s true that when people explicate it in that way it can be perceived as egotistical, even if not the intention - since it’s a “truth” based perspective and not inherently illogical and subject to context, it is the case. 
 

What a funny way you’ve come at me today shiva, I see your act  

[Moksha]

4 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

It's the healing of the trauma and the acceptation of the reality. This in my opinion is the beginning of the journey, not the end. up to this point you were swimming in the waters of self-created suffering. well, you have transcended suffering, your subconscious has no mysteries for you, there is no more fear, you are no longer a beggar of human love. but you are still limited. This is where psychedelics come in, not out of necessity but out of passion.

Transcending suffering is the beginning of living lucidly. Attention is the currency of life, and we profligately spend it without regard to the return on our investment. So many wasted years trapped inside my head pursuing false fears and promises, instead of letting go and flying.

Don't get caught down the rabbit hole tunneling for transient realizations, no matter how mind-blowing they seem at the time. It's like eating an entire bag of potato chips in a single sitting. Tastes great, but when the bag is empty you are still hungry.

The only realization needed is the direct realization of who you are. Once you see clearly, you are finally free to embrace life unconditionally. As you climb into the sky, the cosmos unfolds beneath you, and the winds of life pass through you with stunning clarity that you never knew was possible. Lucid living is the pinnacle of the dream. Beyond beggaring love, it is being it.

[CARDOZZO]

 

It's actually amazing to see so much reaction for just telling that you're not AWAKE.

Everyone trying to prove that their own maps/methods of awakening is right. 

Nobody knows, just work on your direct experience and getting what is true.

 

Edited March 27, 2023 by CARDOZZO

[Water by the River]

19 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

You would call your life a mirage ? It's a complex structure that have a reason. The reality is complex, and can be understood. Simplify is...simple . The reality isn't simple at all, despite we would like

 

Imagine when all perspectives/beings of the Absolute are switched off. Nothing or totally infinite. Something like Deep-Sleep for all perspectives/beings. "It" would initially unaware of itself, but with the potential for sentience.

Then a water-pistol is being imagined. Because is in the Nature of the Infinite to imagine form. Or a planet. Et voila, you have appearance, duality, form, and self-awareness. Very nicely described by the way in Benthino Massaros in "Spiritual Conversations with a Skeptic: On God Consciousness and The Absolute". Whatever you may think about the guy, the book is nice.

Then imagine that this orginally unaware infinity forgets all other perspectives/beings "in space". Only "your" perspective is known in your case. You know whats forgetting in time is (what did you do exactly one year ago, for example), so something like that is also possible in space. You are just not aware of them right now.

Check this picture, and notice the non-euclidian-space: Infinite perspectives. In this non-euclidian space, infinite perspectives fit in. You see only one of these perspectives, but Leavitt has had this vision with seeing an infinite amount in non-euclidian space. 

 

And the crazy thing is: You think (I assume at least : ) that you are located somewhere, head or body. But these arisings that feel like this being-locatedness can completely drop away, if you are able to spot them fast enough, and are familiar with them. Awareness has no location. You can never ever find it. The appearance bubble of each perspective/being is self-aware, perceptions perceiving themselves. Potentially as mere appearance, but with Karma/ignorance rock solid material/out there. But it CAN be seen as mere appearance. And once its not solid anymore one time, its proven that the solidity has only been fake appearance, never really has been like that, just appeared. That solidity is optional, if so imagined.

But when you remove all these separation and being-located-feeling-arisings: The structure of your perspective reveals itself (perceptions perceiving itself, no center/awareness-location anywhere).

Any maybe you can imagine that these appearances can become infinitely complex. But they are the real You, arising in you, as you, perceiving itself.

And in that way the awareness of the abyss of awareness that you are (you can never define it, find it, measure it: INFINITE. Not finite). And you are also all appearances, nondual and infinite style.

And if you switch it all off, all appearances/perspectives off, in all perspectives that you imagine in parallel and forget, you are back to square one. And that is the infinitely simple core of you: An Absolute Reality initially unaware of itself, but with the potential for sentience as soon as something shows up, in any perspective. And its not located in 3D-Space. 3D-Space is imagined in you, as object. And you can't go anywhere, can't disappear, can't die. You can only imagine to do so ( : 

And fully understanding the structure of you own perspective (the appearances of the visual field as mere appearance, insubstantial hologram-like (Yoga of One Taste), the whole perspective being infinite because 3D-space is also something imagined in you, and especially not believing ANY separate self-arisings arising in you (which needs a lot of practice to spot them fast enough, and see them arising and moving in you as objects), then you get and understand is what this perspective of yours is. And that awarness has radically no location. That awareness is really radically no-thing. Yet Awareness happens, perceptions perceiving themself. No lense of perception remains.It feels like the whole field is self-aware, perceptions perceiving themselves. But the field can imagine any kind of identity, location or lense, or ideas about itself.

Then imagine there are no appearances, all switched off: The infinite Reality, initially unaware of itself, but potentially aware with sentience as soon as a appearance shows up.

And this insight is valid for all perspectives, since any real boundary between perspectives would be just an arising, nothing solid, and not the Infinite Awareness. So it is understood that these insights must be valid for all perspectives/beings.

 

But of course, people way smarter and wiser just would say:  The old pond, A frog jumps in: Plop!  Or the One Hand claps.

As always, selling water by the River that is you. Bon voyage.

PS: Maybe you can find a few Alien Godmind in the non-euclidian space of perspectives in the picture. For sure a fun ride...

[Water by the River]

3 minutes ago, CARDOZZO said:

 

It's actually amazing to see so much reaction for just telling that you're not AWAKE.

Everyone trying to prove that their own maps/methods of awakening is right. 

Nobody knows, just work on your direct experience and getting what is true.

 

> Everyone trying to prove that their own maps/methods of awakening is right. 

Thats why I prefer selling water by the River. No story or map/method is absolutely true. But some make more happy than others....

>Nobody knows.

Nobody knows: Safer than if somebody knows...  Sorry, just kidding ( : 

> just work on your direct experience and getting what is true.

Fully agree. Who else kind find out what you are than you?

 

[Water by the River]

22 minutes ago, Moksha said:

The only realization needed is the direct realization of who you are. Once you see clearly, you are finally free to embrace life unconditionally. As you climb into the sky, the cosmos unfolds beneath you, and the winds of life pass through you with stunning clarity that you never knew was possible. Lucid living is the pinnacle of the dream. Beyond beggaring love, it is being it.

We live in illusion and the appearance of things. There is a reality. We are that reality. When you understand this, you see that you are nothing, and being nothing, you are everything. That is all.

― Kalu Rinpoche

Love says: I am everything. Wisdom says: I am nothing. Between the two my life flows.

― Nisargadatta

 

[Breakingthewall]

25 minutes ago, Moksha said:

The only realization needed is the direct realization of who you are

I can have the realization of absolute infinity whenever I want, even just by meditating, but there is much more. we are called to understanding, to rise from the mud of the animal to the level of the gods. the absolute is a bottomless pit where everything is, realizing that fills you up, but there is a magical jungle to explore. The deeper you go, the clearer everything is, and that's just beginning.

[SunnyCyn]

The body mind is typing these words. Nothing else is happening here. 

[CARDOZZO]

Cheers to people teaching enlightenment and spirituality.

This can become so paradoxical that people tell you're crazy.

It happened to myself when i was reading my first spiritual book (The Power of Now) in 2016.

I was thinking "This guy has a serious mental problem". 

But i kept reading  

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Squeekytoy said:

No issue with that, if that's what your life is about. I just don't think it serves to conflate that with unveiling and realizing the truth of existence. Nor to dismiss the latter as buddhism or neo-advaita (I agree that they are mostly full of shit, but that's because they haven't realized truth). Nor to suggest that there is anything more than or "beyond" truth. Alien intelligence and magical jungles are entirely dream phenomena.

2 hours ago, Moksha said:

 

.The way I see it is that there is a step 1, which is to realize the absolute, to become infinite. full opening (5meo many times is normally necessary). get out of the human paradigm, of being an entity doomed to death that must survive. once you achieve this, which is a lot, you settle in the present. but you also abandon human games a lot, they lose interest.

then step 2 begins: the understanding of what reality is. psychedelics are needed once again, without them, the mind is too limited. I don't know about aliens, I know that understanding, when it happens, is magic. it is openness, depth, beauty

Edited March 27, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Leo Gura]

If you insist on reducing consciousness down like trying to understand a frog by throwing it into a blender and analyzing its juices, then I can tell you what you'll find: Nothing.

But you will not understand frog nor GOD.

Edited March 27, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Gesundheit2]

18 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

If you insist on reducing consciousness down like trying to understand a frog by throwing it into a blender and analyzing its juices, then I can tell you what you'll find: Nothing.

But you will not understand frog nor GOD.

Reducing down can be very valuable for understanding reality, just not necessarily always down to the lowest levels. It's also not always the best idea to look at the biggest picture possible. Each level can give insights into things and how they relate to other things both on the same level and on different levels.

[Rigel]

Well you are right I wouldnt consider myself awake. I read this thread and none of it makes any sens to me. I think i exhausted trying to get the answers from others. Every answers about God I read is obviously not what I am seeking.

[Breakingthewall]

29 minutes ago, Squeekytoy said:

agree, again no issue at all. But the first thing you have to understand is that, in the end, it's all arbitrary. It could have been anything. And you're never going to put a dent in infinity, no matter how much you explore. Think pale blue dot. That's your magical jungle. It's a joke. Still, could be fun.

 

The infinity is me. Do you realize the enormity of what this means? It is not something distant, theoretical, fantastic...it is reality. this, now, is the infinite in action. How not to delve into it once you realize it? impossible

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Squeekytoy said:

The only thing I insist on (mostly in the privacy of my own thoughts these days), is distinguishing what's true from what's not.

What's True is that there are thousands of different kinds of Awakening, at various degrees.

Consciousness is way more complex than enlightened humans comprehend. They have fooled themselves by getting trapped inside merely one state of Consciousness. Consciousness is capable of much higher states which they simply cannot imagine. And they have fooled themselves into stopping seriously thinking about Consciousness. They think they have figured it out by reducing it so low that it cannot be reduced any more. They are right, it cannot be reduced any more than Nothing. But they are wrong in using the reductive approach. They use that approach because that's all meditation and self-inquiry can allow. They have no other methods. I present another method which can overcome all those limitations and open you up to a completely new kinds of Awakening which no human could naturally have no matter how many years he meditates or does self-inquiry.

The mistake is assuming that a sober human can every comprehend GOD. This is impossible. It will not ever happen. A human is simply too weak to do that, just like the human body is too weak to move a mountain. But certain technologies can allow humans to move mountains. But only if they are openminded to the technology. But these fucking Buddhists and nondualists are simply not open to it. They have fooled themselves into thinking they can move mountains by hand. But all they move are pebbles and call them mountains. Then they deny that real mountains even exist.

Edited March 27, 2023 by Leo Gura

[spiritual memes]

21 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

What's True is that there are thousands of different kinds of Awakening, at various degrees.

Consciousness is way more complex than enlightened humans comprehend. They have fooled themselves by getting trapped inside merely one state of Consciousness. Consciousness is capable of much higher states which they simply cannot imagine. And they have fooled themselves into stopping seriously thinking about Consciousness. They think they have figured it out by reducing it so low that it cannot be reduced any more. They are right, it cannot be reduced any more than Nothing. But they are wrong in using the reductive approach. They use that approach because that's all meditation and self-inquiry can allow. They have no other methods. I present another method which can overcome all those limitations and open you up to a completely new kinds of Awakening which no human could naturally have no matter how many years he meditates or does self-inquiry.

The mistake is assuming that a sober human can every comprehend GOD. This is impossible. It will not ever happen. A human is simply too weak to do that, just like the human body is too weak to move a mountain. But certain technologies can allow humans to move mountains. But only if they are openminded to the technology. But these fucking Buddhists and nondualists are simply not open to it. They have fooled themselves into thinking they can move mountains by hand. But all they move are pebbles and call them mountains. Then they deny that real mountains even exist.

Buddhists and nondualists have different goals to you. Your goal is to reach the highest level of awakening, while their goal is to bring awakening down to normal life to elevate themselves and humanity. in other words your goal is the highest state while their goal is the reach the highest stage.

You have probably reached insanely high levels of awakening but do you really live from there? If you stopped taking psychedelics, would you stay at the god realized level?

Edited March 27, 2023 by spiritual memes

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, spiritual memes said:

Buddhists and nondualists have different goals to you. Your goal is to reach the highest level of awakening, while their goal is to bring awakening down to normal life to elevate themselves and humanity. in other words your goal is the highest state while their goal is the reach the highest stage.

Basically, yes.

Quote

You have probably reached insanely high levels of awakening but do you really live from there?

It's impossible for a human to live 24/7 from such states of Consciousness. I would not be able to feed myself, drive a car, or do any work.

My only goal is really just Understanding. I don't care about anything else. Nothing else matters to me. Although of course it is important to also develop yourself in everyday life. I don't neglect that. The understanding I get from those crazy high states informs how I run my whole life. It allows me to see through all sorts of self-deception in myself and in others. That's the practical value of it. It is a potent antidote to all human bullshit and games. Deep understanding is helpful in all areas of life.

Edited March 27, 2023 by Leo Gura

[spiritual memes]

3 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It's impossible for a human to live 24/7 from such states of Consciousness. I would not be able to feed myself, drive a car, or do any work.

My only goal is really just Understanding. I don't care about anything else. Nothing else matters to me. Although of course it is important to also develop yourself in everyday life. I don't neglect that. The understanding I get from those crazy high states informs how I run my whole life. It allows me to see through all sorts of self-deception in myself and in others. That's the practical value of it.

I think this is the core of the conflict between you and other teachers. To most teachers, living from a place of high consciousness is more important than simply reaching extremely high states. And more important than just understanding is bringing it down to earth to help awaken others and raise the consciousness of humanity.

In the future, if humans evolve in the right way, the alien consciousness you talk about could be someone's daily baseline. But we have to get there first.