Lila9

Hahaha thank Goddess you don’t find me attractive. I am so happy. The last thing I need in my life is the approval of low-quality men who don’t reach my level of integrity, spiritual development, emotional intelligence, and wisdom. If men with forest creep behavior would have approved of me, I would be so so concerned.

https://celestemdavis.substack.com/p/men-who-like-women The men who like women and the men who don't. Yes we can tell. Glenn Powell does. Tom Cruise doesn't. Like is different than love. A few weeks ago Anne Helen Petersen wrote about what makes actor Glenn Powell so appealing and I have not been able to stop thinking about something she said. What makes him so appealing? Obviously he’s no eye sore, but Peterson points out that it’s far more than that. She says the main thing that sets Glenn Powell apart from other actors is that he likes women. But isn’t that pretty basic? Don’t most men like women? You would think so wouldn’t you, but actually no. Here’s what Peterson says about Glenn’s revolutionary quality of liking women: “It’s different than knowing you can get women, or wanting to control women, or even loving women. He likes them. He appreciates them. He enjoys their company.” Specifically the part of the article that keeps running around my mind rent free is this paragraph: “Tom Cruise doesn’t like women. Neither does Miles Teller. Channing Tatum likes women. So does Ryan Gosling. Brad Pitt used to like women but doesn’t anymore. Leonardo Di Caprio only likes them occasionally. Bradley Cooper doesn’t, George Clooney does. Matt Damon doesn’t, Ben Affleck only does in that one scene in the J.Lo documentary. Marlon Brando didn’t, Montgomery Clift did. Paul Newman didn’t onscreen but did IRL. Cary Grant did, John Wayne definitely, definitely didn’t. Will Smith pretends like he doesn’t but I’m not convinced. Mark Wahlberg absolutely does not, but Daniel Day-Lewis does. So does Paul Mescal.” Whoa. Mind blown emoji. I had to set my phone down and chew on this for a moment. I was taken back by how even though I have never thought of this metric before, I could immediately pick out the pattern in my own life. Of its own accord my brain started scanning through the men I know. I was shocked how easily I could differentiate between who likes women and who doesn’t: Doesn’t: The man Rich and I played pickle ball with this morning who only spoke to my husband and ignored me. My friend’s husband whom in my presence has never asked a woman a question about her life, who once said women speaking in general conference1 were only good for naps and snacks. My uncle who after spending every Easter, Thanksgiving and Christmas with my family and I for 18 years, did not know my name. My last Mormon bishop. Does: The man we played pickle ball with who spoke to both my husband and I equally with humor and grace. My cousin’s husband who listened intently to my feminist soapboxing on a six hour road trip this summer responding with, “Wow, I’ve never thought of it that way before,” and “What was the name of that book again?” (Dan, you’re such a gem) My uncle who always asks me about what I’m writing whenever I see him. My second to last Mormon bishop. Perhaps these are unfairly stark delineations. Perhaps my uncle developed single-issue amnesia. Perhaps I had spinach in my teeth which pickle ball man #1 found so off-putting that he had no choice but to direct all his words to my husband. But still…. there’s something here. I can’t stop noticing. It’s in the listening, the curiosity, the respect. It’s in the eye contact. It’s how they speak of other women or speak over women. It’s whether or not they ever read women authors, listen to podcasts hosted by women. As Anne Helen Peterson put it: “It’s a lot easier to not be an asshole when you’re not obsessed with performing dominance….. It's palpable in the way Powell looks at all these women — he really, intently focuses on them, which is a surprisingly rare thing onscreen and in real life.” How is it that so few men like women? It’s certainly disheartening how rare this quality is in men, but something I read recently in Liz Plank’s book For the Love of Men helps explain why it is that so few men like women. Through hundreds of interviews she shows how men are penalized for not performing masculinity so early, so often and so intensely that to safely navigate the world, their unconscious north star becomes stuck on “be masculine.” Kindergarten boys get made fun of at school for liking girly shows like My Little Pony, parents don’t allow their boys to leave the house in girly clothes, teenage boys are ridiculed for having a girly voice. From the time boys are preschoolers on up through adulthood- the worst thing to be is like a girl. The worst way to run is like a girl, the worst music is girly music, the worst things to care about are the things girls care about, the worst way to act is like a girl. “The smallest transgression of traditional masculinity, leads to huge, enormous acts of rejection from other men. Often from the men they care the most about.” - Liz Plank Is it any wonder boys don’t like girls? Is it any wonder they grow up to be men who don’t respect women? When their entire lives they’ve been conditioned to shun all things feminine? Why would they like the embodiment of everything they’ve been taught to hate? But don’t men want to be seen as someone who likes women? Even if it makes sense culturally why they don’t like women, you would like to think men at least want to be perceived as someone who does. I would like to think that if Tom Cruise or Mark Wahlberg read Anne Helen Peterson’s article, they would be appalled to be listed as men who do not like women. I would like to think that concern and self-reflection would flood their system upon hearing the news. That they would rush out shoe-less like Ebenezer Scrooge on Christmas morning in their haste to ask the women in their lives if they are feeling heard and respected. That Tom and Mark would immediately seek to course correct and improve, bubbling with urgency to change their ways and start listening to women. But the unfortunate truth is… successful men have little reason to care if they are perceived as someone who likes women. How they treat women has little to no effect on a man’s career, monetary success, popularity or reputation. There was no penalty to Brad Pitt’s career when it came out that he hit Angelina Jolie on that plane. Tom Cruise still remains the highest paid actor in the world despite the gross, creepy ways he controlled and treated all three of his wives. David Beckham is hailed as good guy father of the century despite the numerous times he’s been caught cheating. The sad truth is that men don’t NEED to like or respect women to successfully walk through the world. Not at all. In men’s daily lives- in their jobs, in their church, in their friend groups- social capital is gained solely through other men. So they often don’t care if women feel disrespected by them. They care if men respect them. And the price of gaining mens’ respect often comes at the cost of disrespecting women. And I’m not talking about sexual predators. Our standard for who we call good men is astonishingly low (basically anyone who is not abusing women, but sometimes even then). Men get to proudly wear that title of “good” man WHILE not respecting women, not listening to women, not liking women. Treating women like an equal is not a requirement for being a good man. Earlier this year I wrote an article called Never Meet Your Heroes’ Wives. I wrote about how Albert Einstein, the hero of modern physics used his wife’s research without crediting her, was never faithful and then left her to marry his cousin. I wrote about how Carl Sagan, the hero of compassionate atheism hit his wife, about how Gandhi, the hero of nonviolent activism forced naked teenage girls to sleep in his bed. In order to be a hero in our world, in order to be labeled a good man, in order to be successful, treating women well is simply not a requirement. I wish it was. I wish Tom Cruise, Brad Pitt and Mark Wahlberg were awash with shame to be seen as not liking women. I wish it was terribly embarrassing for any man to not respect women.

This is not true. This is just a justification to remain a low-quality man with a doomer mentality. What men think women are attracted to and value in men is not what women are attracted to and value in men. This is why men struggle with dating. They will come up with all sorts of doomerist evolutionary psychology theories, which have never been proven and are pseudoscience, only to avoid listening to women or doing the work to become a man who is actually attractive to women.

There may be things in the left which are too idealistic to happen any time soon or ever because of the state of consciousness of the majority of people today, but idealists have an important function in society. Idealistic people were always misunderstood and demonized by the more practical and survival-driven people in their era, but they were the ones who shaped the reality of the next generations to come. Practical people accept reality as it is, they have their survival strategies and fear change, while idealistic people always see the flaws of society and imagine a better world. They understand that they are reality creators and they have role in shaping it and creating new narratives and stories, and that they have an active role in it, they are in alignment with God. They are also usually artists, writers, musicians, mystics, prophets, healers etc. This is not a bug but a feature.

Yes, so well written! This is why I don’t subscribe to men’s doomer mentality, and I don’t buy their biologically unproven justifications or rationalizations for not being better men. I expect them to do better. Because they can. They are not infants. I was always stunned by their lack of understanding of women, their flat view of women, lack of empathy for women, and hatred for femininity despite their self-proclaimed spiritual development.

But we have a frontal cortex, remember? We can use it. The more we use it for reasoning and critical thinking, introspection, self management and self awareness the more developed it becomes. And we also have the capacity to imagine a better world and actualize it.

There are actually a few egalitarian/matriarchal societies that have survived thousands of years of patriarchy, colonialism, and imperialism. One of them (Iroquois) are your neighbors in America. Mosuo: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mosuo minangkabau: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minangkabau_people Khasi: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khasi_people Akan: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akan_people Iroquois/Haudenosaunee: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iroquois Bribri: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bribri_people Tuareg: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuareg_people

Matriarchy is not about masculine women controlling men. This is about women reclaiming their femininity. A society that integrates the divine feminine, which the current patriarchy, hyper-masculine and neoliberal, is oppressive and lacking. Men and women reclaiming both their feminine and masculine. It is about valuing the community, motherland, children, and men being actual protectors of the community rather than predators or passive, entitled “forest creeps,” as they are in patriarchy.

The topic is the rape of women, a real issue that ruins women’s lives. Do you like women enough, not as sexual objects for consumption, but as humans to try to understand their issues and their point of view? Are you open to seeing them beyond your male bias, as a man who was socialized in a patriarchal, women-hating culture? This is not about victim-blaming, justifying it, or trying to move the focus to men’s issues and women’s flaws, but rather about understanding. There are already many complaints about women here and many points of view from men. You have the entire dating and relationships forum. Aren’t you tired of hearing the point of view of men all the time?

Men seeing women as merely objects for sexual consumption rather than as human beings (who are also sexual and sexually attractive) is purely socialization. And the belief that this is something natural is just gaslighting to make women compliant with sexual violence, mistreatment, and abuse. If a man cannot see the humanity and individuality of women which make 50% of the people he shares space with on earth, this is not natural or normal.

Experiencing romantic heartbreak is painful, and obviously there is some bitterness, but people eventually outgrow it and learn to look at things from various perspectives. They learn that the world does not revolve around them. They learn that women are humans, individuals with their own desires and tastes, not objects who must obey, and that being romantically or sexually rejected does not mean the women are evil. No one likes to lose, but loss is part of life. Toddlers also do not like to lose, but at some point they grow up and understand that losing is part of life. Life involves losing a lot, time, health, people, and money. This is inevitable. This is part of maturing. Do you really think that a healthy man should throw a tantrum and treat all women with hatred just because he was romantically rejected? Where does this entitlement come from? He was socialized this way. Isn’t it healthier to try to figure out how to be a better man, more attractive, and more interesting? Why is the latter often ignored while the first is often justified and enabled in men by patriarchy? Doesn’t the first create weaker men? But I am not talking merely about individual misogyny as part of heartbreak, but about a systemic one that affects the lives of women and children something that is deeply integrated into society and affects people’s perception of reality, distorting the truth.

Fantasy is expecting women to be compliant with an oppressive system, to value infinite economic growth above anything else, to neglect nature and believe it will not backfire. The future is feminine, as many mystics say. Not feminine dominance (reversed patriarchy in which women aggressively oppress men), but a society in which Shakti (the divine feminine) is present and respected. When motherhood is appreciated, when children are nurtured and protected, and when people are supported by communities rather than separated and isolated.

If men are systematically socialized to control and objectify women, this is not love. This is hate (not always conscious though). Misogyny is real. Women experience it both on a personal and systemic level, whether this is from a potential lover, the media, our doctor, our religion, the government, the police etc.

Yes, but you conflate a failed romantic relationship with sexual violence. This is not the same. Those who rape their drugged wives, and the men who consume this content, do not do this because of a failed romance. Men commit 97–99% of sexual violence. 91% of the victims are women, while 9% of the victims are men. Why are men responsible for so much sexual violence, or at least silent or indifferent about the sexual violence of other men? Because there is a systemic reason for that. They were all socialized under patriarchy, which enables and encourages such behavior in men. It ties manhood to the domination of women’s bodies. It's a systemic issue. https://www.humboldt.edu/supporting-survivors/educational-resources/statistics

The species is horrible but there is a solution.