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Leo you told us that you will have transformation caught on camera. What happened to your promise?

The goodness of the Paradise of Love is beyond anything I could have imagined. When you imagine the most beautiful world possible for yourself and for every human being, the Paradise of Love is infinitely more magnificent than that. When I first awakened into this Paradise of Love, the greatest transformation wasn't how the world around me looked, but how I felt. The most profound change was the awakening of life force. It felt as though a dormant power had come alive within me. My body became stronger, lighter, more flexible, and more alive than I had ever known it to be. Movement became effortless. Creativity flowed naturally. I felt magnetic, intuitive, charismatic, fearless, and deeply connected to life itself. For the first time, I understood why so many spiritual traditions speak about Divine power awakening within a human being. My surroundings transformed as well. The world became a shimmering tapestry of sacred geometry, vibrant colors, and Divine beauty. One of the most striking visions, especially outdoors during the daytime, was the presence of the wolf. Everywhere I looked, reality appeared woven together from countless geometric wolf faces quietly watching me. As my journey continued, I gradually came to understand the wolf as my Divine Mother Wolf, a loving guide who had been walking beside me all along. At times, it felt as though I were meeting my true self for the very first time. I found myself fascinated, amazed, and sometimes overwhelmed by my own beauty, not physical beauty, but the beauty of simply being alive. In this state of Love, relating to people became effortless. Conversations flowed naturally. I could easily connect with strangers, make friends within minutes, and feel genuine compassion for everyone I met. It wasn't manipulation, charisma techniques, NLP, or social psychology. It came from sincere love and genuine care. I felt as though I could read people's emotions through an invisible current of life that connected all of us. Movement itself became a form of meditation. My body seemed guided by an intelligence far beyond conscious thought. Martial arts movements arose spontaneously, flowing directly from intuition rather than technique. They carried the elegance of nature itself. Sometimes I moved like flowing water, sometimes like the wind, and at other times like the animals so often depicted in ancient martial arts traditions: the serpent, the monkey, the tiger, the crane, dragon, and the leopard. Dance also became something entirely different. While dancing to the icaros during ceremonies, it felt as though my master plant dietas themselves were choreographing my movements. Every gesture emerged effortlessly, with a beauty and harmony unlike anything I had encountered before. The movements felt ancient, intelligent, and deeply alive. My awareness expanded in extraordinary ways. During one heroic magic mushroom journey at a music festival, I found myself moving effortlessly through a dense crowd of dancing people without bumping into anyone. It felt as though I intuitively knew where every person's body would move before they moved. Dancing with another person became less like leading or following and more like two streams of water naturally flowing together. There were moments that still remain difficult for me to explain. Once, outside a maloka during an Ayahuasca ceremony, a much larger man suddenly charged toward me because he believed I had been too loud during the ceremony. In that instant, everything slowed down. My body responded on its own. I moved with incredible speed and precision, and he stumbled backward several feet without either of us making meaningful physical contact. Even today, I struggle to fully understand what happened in that moment. During many ceremonies, I experienced an overwhelming sense that obstacles simply did not exist. I knew, with complete certainty, that anything could be overcome through Love. Nothing felt impossible. One night, in the darkness of a maloka, I received powerful visions during a master plant dieta. Before me appeared immense luminous symbols resembling a mysterious combination of nature, royalty, and playing cards. They shimmered with immense beauty and power. I felt their presence as protectors, teachers, and allies. Although I could feel their extraordinary wisdom, I also knew I was not yet ready to fully understand or embody what they were showing me. Music also changed completely. On several occasions, while deeply connected to the medicine, I began hearing songs of indescribable beauty. They resembled master plant icaros, yet seemed to come from somewhere beyond human creativity. It felt as though I wasn't composing them. I was simply listening. One of the most beautiful aspects of the Paradise of Love was the complete appreciation of the present moment. Every moment became infinitely precious. Every tree, every face, every conversation, every ray of sunlight seemed worthy of complete attention. At festivals, this sometimes became almost overwhelming because there was simply too much beauty to explore, too much creativity to experience, and too much life to fall in love with. During some ceremonies, I experienced something even more astonishing. I was shown that all of creation was the Kingdom of Love. In those moments, I experienced myself as the King of Love, the ruler of this infinite kingdom, not in the ordinary sense of power or authority, but as an expression of the Divine manifesting itself through human form. I saw my family and many other people as radiant beings beyond all suffering, shining with extraordinary beauty, freedom, and love. In several ceremonies, I also experienced what felt like healing energy flowing through my hands. At times, I felt as though I had become an embodiment of the Christ consciousness itself, a living expression of unconditional Love. After experiencing these glimpses of the Paradise of Love over many ceremonies, one question remained. How do I embody it? Deep within, I sensed that merely visiting Paradise would never be enough. If I truly wanted to embody it permanently, I would first have to walk through something unimaginably difficult. I had been shown Paradise. Now I would have to earn my way home.

Any thoughts on this? Ive been a big fan for a long time of both Jung and psychedelics. Why Jung Was Skeptical About Psychedelics 1. Regression into Primitive Layers Jung worried that psychedelics could thrust people too quickly into archaic or primitive layers of the psyche. Instead of growth, this might feel like a regression — an overwhelming flood of imagery that leaves someone more confused than before. 2. The Risk of Inflation Jung also warned about inflation, when the ego identifies with powerful archetypal content and loses touch with reality. Under psychedelics, visions can feel like divine truth. But without grounding, this can lead to grandiosity, disconnection, or even collapse. 3. The Moral Burden of Knowledge For Jung, knowing more of the unconscious wasn’t always a gift — it was a responsibility. If someone accessed deep truths without the conscious maturity to hold them, that knowledge could weigh heavily, destabilize, or even mislead. 4. No Shortcut to Individuation Jung’s whole therapeutic model was built on individuation — the slow, lifelong process of becoming whole. He felt psychedelics might offer a glimpse of the depths, but not the path to walk them. For him, real transformation required time, patience, and an ongoing relationship with the unconscious. Source: https://www.saraouimette.com/blog/2025/9/15/what-did-carl-jung-say-about-psychedelics

I just read a super old note from 5 years ago. It was in a transformation mastery course from Julien Blanc. What a waste of money back in the day, but I was desperate to get out of my situation. What I can take away from it was how much more physical life was in school. An athletic classmate had automatically more statues and I looked up to them. And also trying to be nice and lovely seemed to be a survival strategy back in the day. Oh men oh men it hurts to read this.. No wonder I went to the gym though and my story is probably as un-unique as it gets.

The retro video game convention is done and It went well. despite me feeling super exhausted, mentally drained and anxious beforehand! Here’s all the details if you’re interested!: I got a quick glance at the AVGN and then left satisfied. Afterwards, I ate a $14 pizza that tasted like Complete Cardboard Bullshit, but I was so hungry and ate most of it anyway. The view outside where I was eating was *Muah*, so that saved the experience. Then, back inside, my childhood all-time favorite Pokémon WON the costume contest! She was AWW-mazing! Took a traditionally masculine mon and completely recontextualized it to be Super Fem and Beautiful! I loved the originality, attention to detail, and everything was hand designed from scratch. She even did a live evolution / transformation from Ivysaur to Venusaur live on stage. Can’t even put it into words. The audience went crazy for her to win, even before the judges announced her as the official winner. Finally at the end of the day, the voice actor of Super Mario and Luigi and a bunch of other characters did a Q&A panel. He’s in his 70s now and gave a lot of wise life purpose advice to the audience like a wise old sage. Mama-Mia!

Many men, even on this forum, STILL DO NOT INTERNALISE THE POWER OF THIER LANGUAGE & MINDSET Leo has, in other words and framing, gone over this with TENS of different videos, i have also discussed it at length But the theoretical part is only 1 half, you then have to EMBODY (work your ass off and apply it) IT FOR YEARS (Assuming u didn't have a rare perfect childhood, with an incredible father figure, environment ect.. and this is all done unconsciously) Positive thinking Visualization Self Talk Affirmations Goal Setting Mindset Beliefs, limiting beliefs, Not needing validation Being Uninhibited - low inhibition men, shameless, unapolagetic Not giving a fuck what people think Saying and doing what you want How u interpret reality Overthinking, OCD, anxiety within your body, lack of presence Authenticity, speaking with your chest, vocal tonality, eye contact All of these things can and should be msatered individually, and worked on for multiple years, EVERY SINGLE DAY BUT There is a core connector that needs to be unraveled That is that, many of these things are just extentions of a few core foundations The core foundation(S), once its truly mastered, everything else becomes a byproduct, or become smuch smoother to emoby and integrate And the core of it is subsconsious reprogarmming, core beliefs about yourself and your value Another foundation is the linguistic programming and brainwashing within your mind, which creates these core beliefs Another foundation is positive thinking - but much more specifically, is your mind, constantly, permanently, instantly, orientated towards solutions, success, the future (or enjoying the present), growth, transformation, dreaming, refining, improving, where you will be, how amazing your life will be ect.. and how deep and subconscious, instant and effortless this mechanism is And again the foundation to achieving this is affrimations, visualizations, self talk, but it sounds way easier than it is, easy in concept, not academic, but who actually drills it in, day and night, for years? who the fuck even does that Then, this becomes so deep and unconcious that when you talk, speak write on a forum, the actual emotionality of your language changes, i still see people on this forum casually mention how they're "absolutely terrifed of ... (insert mundane petty thing that really is just a linguistic reasoning shaped by the deep subconcious anxiety, insecurity, envy. desperation and inner inadequacy within the cells of there body, because they never truly repgrommaed themselves, they never went all the way, they just dabbled in self help as a fad, like everyone else, where is the god level of fearlessness, confidence, masculinity when a guy is fucking terrified of a basic ability of a 130 pound woman (an ability which, he could very simply learn thorugh work and struggle for a few months and benefit from inmediately for the remaining entirety of hisl life)? its pathetic, but if we're all honest, we are all pathetic and mediocre, and this post is how you rise above mediocrity, only when applied, daily, day and night, for years. This is just an honest reminder to myself I got some results but i still mostly dabbled with it all in practice I did not TRULY master it on a deep, subconcious level, to the level that lionel messi rapidly makes decisions, positions his body, knows where the next pass is, already knows the next 3 steps ahead of the defender, to the level of zidannes first touch, effortless, permanently ingrained, unstoppable, never bends or waivers, true mastery.

If there was a psychic person with real psychic abilities, they would be the most famous person alive. Why? Because they would be able to showcase their powers on YouTube and IG and everywhere online. We only need one person in order to prove pre-rational psychic abilities. But that one person doesn't exist. Spiritual awakening is a private inner experience/transformation. It's not a claim about external reality. It's a deep understanding of it.

For sure! Ego death is cool but scary. I recommend looking up grounding mechanisms before you go deeper into that path, they are ignored a bit here but important. Trans people are interesting, I had a trans girl I was working with almost a decade ago now but I didn't really have the balls(no pun intended) to go through with it at that time so we were just friends and sexted a bit but ended at that. It was interesting because at first she presented like a dude and had a guy name and then slowly transitionned and started taking hormones so I could see the transformation. It's cool I'm a big fan of boobs so the fact that one can take hormones and grow them clearly is a sign of great scientific culmination by the human race. Big w.

From the scraping, somebody should just generate an RSS feed file with the full posts embedded and with the OCR idea in a free static file hosting service like Cloud flare. So the user can just use his favorite RSS reader. There are probably some good ones that allows for full text search, if not that can be easily be done from the RSS feed file. This way we don't have to waste time maintaining more custom code than necessary, we won't be running multiple of those bots accessing and creating their own databases, and it will work in all platforms and provide the real-time update abstraction from RSS feed readers. If that's not enough, we can just write our own custom format if RSS happens to have some major limitation like maximum number of posts. Extracting the posts into their own respective HTML files cleaned and properly tagged for automation before doing any further format transformation should be the first step of this scraping pipeline, that will guarantee that it will preserve all the original features on the post, like the youtube embeds and whatever he might have included there. The major issue I believe would be the vimeo embeds, I believe leo configured them to not run outside of actualized.org. It has to be checked. What Claude Code gave there wouldn't handle if it's taking just the text of the posts and tossing away the original HTML. HTML already has a tag to add the text description of images that is used for accesability, that would be the correct way to extracting HTML and using OCR to embed back into the image the text, and then the later stages of the pipeline uses that. For searching quick right now just use on google: the tag "site:" followed by the address to search there. site:https://www.actualized.org/insights

This was an ICHING reading I got yesterday. Line 1. If the wanderer busies himself with trivial things, he draws down misfortune upon himself. This line can call attention to a fate a person has created by busying himself with concerns of the collective ego. Among such trivial concerns are judgments based on the human-centered view of the universe: about justice, crime, and the supposed guilt of others about supposed rights and privileges attributing catastrophes to weather, or Nature, when they have been the result of expectations projected onto Nature gossip and idle curiosity about others' relationships, including the intimate affairs of animals blaming one's fate on an outside cause, rather than seeing its cause in oneself watching whether others are conforming properly to the moral and behavioral standards (the oughts and musts) of the collective ego preoccupying oneself with things afar rather than with what lies directly in front of one 56. The Wanderer • dismissing things of real significance (such as money) as mun-dane, in favor of working on a spiritual self-image. When a person does not understand the Cosmic Way and has created a fate due to his incorrect views, the ego in him will seek to put the blame on something or someone else, the Cosmos, life, Nature, or even his true self, rather than having the ego itself recognized as the cause; in addition, it may put a heavy burden of guilt upon the person. He needs to catch onto this tactic of the ego before it plunges him into yet another fate. (See p. 539, Freeing Yourself from Mistaken Ideas and Beliefs, p. 542, Freeing Yourself from a fate, and p. 551, Deprogramming Guilt.) The line can also refer to a person who feels guilty for possessing something while others have nothing. Possibly he has been taught as a child to take on guilt for the starving children in the world, human maltreatment of animals, trees, the earth, etc. It is one thing to care about all these things, and act responsibly in regard to them, but it is another to allow guilt to drive one to fulfill the image of the "compassionate person." Striving to fulfil this self-image keeps the person from saying the inner No to wrong conditions and their causes, and from asking for help from the Helpers, which are truly able to correct these conditions through transformation.

Look, everyone wondering why Leo refuses to admit his alien transformation error, it's very simple. Most people can say "I was in a state of grandiose delusion". But Leo cannot admit this to himself, therefore he cannot admit it to you. And he never will. You will never get an admission because: "'Grandiose delusion' is the two words that, said sincerely, collapse the idealized self into the despised self in one move — and the entire architecture exists to make those two words unsayable. So he says everything around them, forever, because the one thing the expansive solution cannot do is name itself." Underneath the grandiosity is precisely the terror of being ordinary, small, self-deceived — the average human who fools himself and can't tell. "I was in grandiose delusion" doesn't just lower him to average. It drops him straight into the despised self the entire construction exists to escape. It's not a step down; it's a fall through the trapdoor the whole edifice was built to cover." - Karen Horney, The Expansive solution (Neurosis and Human Growth: The Struggle Toward Self-Realization)

Leo, banning people and unmodding mods for rightfully holding you accountable and questioning your outrageous claims will not make the problem go away. You have conveniently been dodging the question that many are looking for the answer to: Where is the alien transformation video? You said that the biggest obstacle to producing the video was finding a camera that would record your face transforming into a colorful alien god. And what is the obstacle now?

That's different from recording alien transformation. Sign me up! I'm all ears.

Ok it seems you can inject it. Chatgpt: Yes. In India, there was a historical connection between spirituality, alchemy, and preparations containing metals. The traditions most relevant here are Rasaśāstra and Rasāyana. Gold and other metals were repeatedly “purified,” ground, and heated through complex procedures. The resulting gold preparation is called Swarna or Suvarna Bhasma. It was taken orally in very small quantities, often with honey or ghee—not injected. One related practice is Swarna Prashana, which was traditionally associated with improved memory, intelligence, vitality, immunity, and longevity. The spiritual background sometimes went far beyond ordinary medicine. Certain Indian alchemical schools aimed to perfect or rejuvenate the body, or even create an enduring “divine body” that could support meditation, extraordinary abilities, and ultimately liberation. However, the most important alchemical substance in many of these traditions was usually mercury, not gold alone. The key distinction is: The goal was usually gradual physical and spiritual transformation, longevity, and mental clarity—not an immediate psychedelic or mystical “gold trip.” Modern studies have confirmed that some Swarna Bhasma preparations contain very small or nanostructured gold particles, and that gold can sometimes be detected in the body after oral use. However, this does not prove that it improves the nervous system, intelligence, cognition, or spiritual awareness. Current clinical evidence is insufficient to establish such effects reliably. “Traditionally prepared” also does not automatically mean safe. The composition and quality of these products can vary significantly, and some Ayurvedic products have contained harmful amounts of lead, mercury, or arsenic. There is no well-documented Indian spiritual tradition of injecting gold.

@Olaf Good self observations you made! You noticed the dividend it payed back in terms of energy. More conscious awareness,,, Higher degree of being,,, Understanding human behavior better @UpperMaster Excellent commentary and to the point. A trap many people fall into, not to mention actualizers of denying their own negative feelings. Repression grows the shadow. In the fourth way work this is called the second conscious shock. Turning a negative experience into a positive one. Usually accomplished in part by "holding one's tongue", as the saying goes. I'll give an example that happened in my past. I was trading into a new Subaru. When the salesman told me the offer on my old Hyundai. The adrenaline hit. I was angry and he could see it. I hadn't said anything yet and was stewing,,,, As is said in the Work, It was hot in the kitchen! After several seconds had passed. He said, "Please, we shouldn't have to become antagonistic in what we're trying to accomplish". With what he said. It made me see myself and the ridiculous way that I could have spoken something in anger that would have knocked a lot of energy out of me. If you can kind of read into that situation,,, I actually smiled and later on, complemented him for how he handled my potential anger on hearing their offer for my trade in. Speaking in anger is so easy to do and so difficult to not do. To not deny one's feelings but to not let the passion of anger turn one into an "unguided projectile" or an "unguided Golum" as one of my favorite Fourth Way teachers says. some notes- Like Dislike Understanding the Second Conscious Shock in the Fourth Way In the Fourth Way teachings of P.D. Ouspensky, the first and second conscious shocks are key moments in the process of self-remembering and transformation. They are not random events but intentional, often difficult experiences designed to break habitual patterns and force awareness. What the Second Conscious Shock Is The second conscious shock typically follows the first conscious shock, which is the moment of sudden realization that you are acting mechanically or out of habit. The second shock is the experience of defeat or the tension between desire and inevitability — the moment when you confront the reality of your own mechanicalness and the lack of proper energy fourthwaytoday.org. It is often described as: A tension between the fire of your desire to remain present and the chill of the inevitable fall into old patterns fourthwaytoday.org. A sacred direction in the octave of development, where the process of defeat becomes a catalyst for transformation fourthwaytoday.org. A psychic death experience — the “life” of your habitual self is temporarily extinguished, creating a flatness or stillness that is not dullness, but a deep sense of peace and “all-rightness” gurdjiefflegacy.org. How It Works with the First Shock Ouspensky explains that the first shock is the recognition of mechanicalness; the second shock is the confrontation with the consequences of that mechanicalness. Together, they form a synergy — the first shock creates the awareness, the second shock deepens the transformation YouTube. The second shock is not just about discomfort; it is about sacred direction — a moment when the process of defeat aligns with a higher purpose, leading to a shift in energy and awareness fourthwaytoday.org. Purpose and Outcome The second conscious shock: Breaks habitual patterns by forcing a confrontation with the self. Evokes transformation rather than just resistance. Aligns the self with higher functions by moving beyond mechanical reaction into conscious, intentional action. Can lead to a stable, inner peace and a deeper understanding of the temporal and eternal aspects of life gurdjiefflegacy.org. Practical Context In Gurdjieff’s groups, such shocks might be triggered by: Sudden commands (“Stop!”) that interrupt habitual movement to-be-able.blogspot.com. Intentional labor or discomfort that forces presence to-be-able.blogspot.com. Moments of self-observation where you realize you are acting without awareness gurdjiefflegacy.org. The goal is to stop the expression of negative emotions and to change attitudes so that the shock becomes a stepping stone toward higher consciousness SelfDefinition.Org. In short: The second conscious shock is the moment when the realization of mechanicalness meets the reality of its consequences, creating a transformative “defeat” that, when integrated, moves you toward higher states of being in the Fourth Way.

This is my last reply in this clusterfuck thread and I wont waste any more time on this. So allegedly some people here have big issues with closed-mindedness and with someone not using proper learning frames (because "lessons will be lost on them," because "they are not open enough"). I want these people to present a definition of closed-mindedness to the readers under which they can establish that Leo isn't closed-minded (but me and Carl are). If they can't do that, then I will take it that none of them really care about any of their listed norms in a principled way, and that it is just empty mini-Leo rhetoric on their part. Present a definition of closed-mindedness, under which a guy who has repeatedly claimed to be the most awake being in the universe, has repeatedly claimed that no one else knows what they are talking about, claimed that he is the standard of epistemology, claimed that he has little to nothing to learn from humans anymore (with regard to spirituality), and who stops 99% of his debates with "you don't know what you are talking about" and then frequently refuses to elaborate; and a guy who wants to dictate what definition of cult ought to be used by everyone; and a guy who has made multiple inferentially justified, highly confident statements about alternative spiritual pathways (like what certain forms of meditation or yoga can do for you or get you to, even though he hasn't seriously practiced them for multiple decades); and a guy who explicitly stated that he can't be wrong about being the most awake being on the planet <--- that this guy isn't closed-minded, and that this guy is inside a proper learning frame (in which he can learn new things and correct false beliefs); but a guy who gives detailed arguments about why he thinks the way he does, who qualifies most of his statements, and who immediately acknowledges epistemic limitations and clarifies how he can be wrong <--- that this guy is the closed-minded guy, and that this guy isn't inside a proper learning frame. [ It's very transparent that none of you seriously care about any of these norms. These norms and mini-Leo ticks (where you use one-word catchphrases like "closed-minded" to derail conversations) are exclusively used to enforce Leo's dogmas and none of them are used in a serious, principled way. The moment you would need to apply these norms to Leo, that's the moment when all of you suddenly stop caring about them. ] ------------------------------------------------------- Some people here have been dead silent about a lot of things, and it's clear to me that Aurum is only interested in highly selectively engaging with arguments. So here is Leo's alien transformation failure spelled out again, since most of you guys extremely conveniently ignored it last time. By the way, do you guys know how your trusted guy responded to @UnbornTao's "Where is the video, Leo?" question? He said, "I'm not going to bend over backwards over your closed-mindedness." <---- Even though he created the enforcing "bullshit" standard for himself. That's your Tier 2, epistemically responsible guy, who is true to his own standards and words, who can own up to things, and who won't discourage you from holding him accountable using the standard that he created for himself (perfectly describes a guy, who cares a lot about not creating or contributing to cult-like dynamics, right?). Aurum - I dont see you holding Leo accountable , but I see you a lot throwing around the label of "closed-mindedness" towards people who do want to hold Leo accountable. Your only way out this is to claim that you didnt know that Leo claimed these things about the alien transformation thing - but in that case , that just shows your very low level engagement with the arguments here (where you come in here with big wide shoulders and throw the "closed-mindedness" label and implication around without having any fucking clue about the relevant context some of the Leo critiques target). And this is just one of the points you failed to engage with, I gave you a lot more than just this, and I left other effort posts here with a lot of links and - but it is very clear at this point that you only highly selectively want to engage with things and you are disinterested in actually reading through the posts and the links in detail before you chime in with your quick uninformed emotionally baiting comments on things. Let's correct that. He doesn't just think highly of his awakening; he thinks the highest of himself while degrading everyone else. To this day, he still makes childlike comparative judgments like "I'm stronger than you, and you guys are weak as shit compared to me," about every other being in the universe. And yes, that claim is extremely unwarranted on his part. He is pretentiously using extremely weak inferential judgments, and that's supposed to be his "justification" for claiming that he is the most awake. He has no fucking data or direct access to who has what level of awakening. And even if he had direct access to the content of the awakenings of every other being in the universe (and to the awakenings of every being who has ever lived), he would still need to presuppose his own circularly justified notion and norm of what "being the most awake" even means. So: 1) Let's not pretend that he has any substantive reply to any of these problems, and lets not pretend that his claim has any serious leg to stand on, or that he carefully and rigorously worked through all of this before vomited out his pretentious statements. 2) Let's also not pretend that you would ever entertain this kind of reasoning from any teacher other than Leo. You conceded that it is an inferential comparative judgment, so it is subject to being wrong. Yet I haven't seen you once press Leo on his credence with respect to that claim. I haven't seen you once press him on why he makes comparative judgments in the first place, and I haven't seen you once question what purpose those explicit comparative and degrading judgments serve. I guess all of this is also included in your "trust" in Leo, along with his infinitely delayed alien transformation-on-camera claim and his healing claims. (Before you make your usual thought-terminating "you're closed-minded" move again, I'll qualify my position once more: the argument does not rest on the premise that these things must be impossible. The argument is about adjusting credence based on evidence and owning up to failure—and failing should obviously lower your credence in such claims.) My original example had a lot to do with ethics, but you couldn't engage with that, so you went with your own modified version instead. You also had a very hard time entertaining the idea that there is no contradiction in someone agreeing with Leo on all of his spiritual takes while also having issues with some of Leo's teaching methods and behavior. But in any case, the argument that "I have seen him make awakening claims, and I managed to verify some of those claims. Therefore, the more I manage to verify, the more I'm going to trust that his other awakening claims (that I haven't yet verified) are true as well" could work. But your special privileging of Leo and your dead silence about his failures and about some of his behavior go beyond any reasonable notion of trust you can appeal to. Leo hasn't demonstrated a single empirically verifiable miracle yet, so you have zero reason to trust him on miracle claims. And yet, you have been dead silent about his failure to produce the alien transformation on camera and about his healing claims. It doesn't matter how many of his awakening claims you managed to verify, because there is no straightforward bridge from that to his empirical claims. It would be like taking some verifiable facts from the Bible (for example, that Jesus existed) and then pretending that it is therefore reasonable to infer and trust that every other fantastical claim presented in the Bible is likely true as well (such as the miracle claims surrounding Jesus or the claim that Jesus is the Son of God). Given your trust standard, the exact same "I'm just trusting my teacher" argument can be made by many other people whom you would negatively label as "blindly putting their teacher on a pedestal and taking certain claims to be true from their teacher without verifying them first." Buddhist and nondual students can use the exact same argument: "Im going to trust my teacher's w,z claims, because I managed to verify that his x,y claims were true." So I guess, all of the students who managed to verify some of the things their teacher told them are justified (by your standards) in giving special privilege to their teachers as well. And I'm sure you won't put any negative label on them for it, and I'm sure you won't reassure Leo about how these supposedly low-consciousness, cognitively undeveloped, conformist individuals are lost and not doing proper spiritual work. I thought this was supposed to be about "doing the work" (like using the suggested methods) and not about special-privileging your teacher's explicit propositions and dogmas, or about maintaining some kind of polished, special image of your teacher. But again, this is nothing more than empty virtue-signaling on your part. You don't seriously care about these standards and norms, because you make your own judgments about other teachers, and you are perfectly fine with being closed off, labeling them with a bunch of negative labels, and special-privileging Leo - even though you haven't gone through their exact methods for their exact suggested timelines. (you havent done half a century worth of meditations or yoga work and yet you are perfectly okay with placing your bets and with judging those methods and the efficacy of those methods and the efficacy of other teachers). And the exact same shit applies to Leo as well, but you will never, ever publicly assert to have an issue with Leo being 100% confident in his stance and with him being 100% closed off to all other teachers, despite the fact that he has only directly practiced a fraction of a fraction of other teachers' methods (for a fraction of a fraction of their suggested timelines) Yes, that's why debate won't resolve this. One of us is just going to be mistaken. "One of you is going to be mistaken," but the moment I present you with similar epistemic challenges, you suddenly categorize them as "me trying to gaslight you with nonsense," even though it's clear that you have no substantive reply to those epistemic challenges. Yet you are still perfectly confident that you are right and that Leo is right, and you talk down to everyone who disagrees with you from your pretentious high horse, even though the exact same "I've personally verified claims x, y, and z relative to a different body of work" argument is equally applicable to many other people. Neither you nor Leo has any substantive response to underdetermination issues, and neither of you arrived at your position by carefully and exhaustively ruling out all alternative options. Yet both of you pretentiously act as though you have some kind of high horse to ride and some kind of special epistemic leg to stand on. You and Leo both refuse to acknowledge your epistemic limitations, and instead you play the "I'm absolutely certain in my position" game. Then, whenever someone challenges that certainty, both of you dismiss it as "gaslighting."

@Someone here i dont expect leo to honestly engage or answer any of those questions. He is a master at being a weasel. This was to demonstrate to others how Leo refuse to walk back claims and refuse to change his credence on claims and refuse utilize more epistemic humility given that he failed to deliver on the alien claim. Its cool that you suddenly recognize now that harsh rhetoric isnt effective and isnt good (when its used against Leo), but you very rarely had to bring this up when Leo used this kind of rhetoric against other people. Maybe I should have used the "you dont know what you are talking about" , and "im more awake than you" and "im the standard on epistemology" as a response and then my rhetoric would have been more acceptable. This point about the alien transformation has been brought up multiple times now. Do you know what Leo's last response to this question was? He told unborntao, "I won't bend over backwards over your closed-mindedness." So that's how he clarifies things and owns up to things. Again, to be super clear on this: he created the standard for himself. He said that a camera should be able to record his transformation, and when someone asks him about it, they are the bad guy(the closed-minded one) for asking for it. How is that not enforcing cult-like dynamics, where he can freely make any bullshit claim and, when held accountable for it, infinitely gaslight you into believing that you are the bad guy for holding him accountable for the very thing that he explicitly told you to hold him accountable for?

I honestly have no idea what happened with his claim that he would demonstrate an alien transformation on camera. Only Leo knows what actually happened.. unfortunately he still hasn’t clarified it..but instead he’s offered excuses that avoid addressing the obvious possibility that it was another psychedelic experience he misinterpreted As @UnbornTao suggests. That said..this is exactly why I don’t see the value in aggressively attacking him. People make mistakes. Humans get things wrong.If he’s mistaken then criticize the claim..point out the inconsistencies..and move on. What I don’t understand is the endless hostile rants. They accomplish nothing. They don’t help us..they don’t help Leo and they don’t bring anyone closer to the truth. All they do is fuel ego battles between keyboard warriors and deepen the divide instead of creating any chance for understanding or meaningful discussion. If the goal is understanding each others then criticism should be rational and polite .If the goal is just to vent outrage and score points..that’s a different conversation. And stop calling me a Leo fanboy . It’s not like I hang out with him everyday ..I just watch him on a screen .

You do not understand your own claims, since you couldn't deliver on any of them. To be extremely clear on this, you haven't delivered once on your miracle claims or your alien transformation claim, and you still refuse to adjust your claims or your credence regarding those claims. You pretend to know much more than you actually do. If you knew how this shit worked, you would have already delivered on your claims and wouldn't just talk big with 0 results after years of failure. The only thing we have seen so far from you is you talking grandiose about yourself, you making excuses and delivering 0 empirical results with respect to your empirical claims. But sure, sure—we are the ones who don't know what we are talking about, while you do. That's why, once again, you haven't demonstrated shit yet. I guess we are in the infinitely "sit tight" period and you are in the "I will make infinite excuses why I cant deliver on my own claims and I will infinitely weasel my way out of my own standards" period, right? Anything but having the spine and the epistemic responsibility to own up to your own claims and to your own standards. The camera was the issue and not your lack of understanding of how reality works, right?

Oh my god, they're trying to push it off onto banks now(government insured) we're FUCKED If you thought trump corruption was bad "We are in, you know, a global transformation like we probably have never seen before," BlackRock's Jean Boivin said Tuesday in a Bloomberg Television interview. "The world will have to leverage up as a result. Leveraging up comes with risk that would need to be managed, but there's no real alternative to really build out the AI or the global infrastructure that are needed to get to a place where we're going to require more funding" "Private credit is poised to take on an even bigger role in financing the "massive amount of infrastructure investment" for artificial intelligence as companies look for capital to fund outsized expenditures, according to the head of BlackRock Inc.'s research arm." https://finance.yahoo.com/technology/ai/articles/blackrock-sees-private-credit-taking-172100680.html "BlackRock reduces AI exposure amid sector volatility: CNBC 2 days ago — BlackRock's Rick Rieder has announced a strategic shift, reducing and rebalancing exposure to companies heavily linked with artific" https://cryptobriefing.com/blackrock-reduces-ai-exposure-amid-sector-volatility-cnbc/ BlackRock is who I consider to be the engine behind the global AI push and they're backing off. They have about $2T invested in AI related businesses, about half of AI industry is related to BlackRock investments.

The narcissism critique, the "he is narcissistic" critique, the "lack of integrity" critique, and the "you shouldn't bring attention to the idea or declare yourself to be more awake than every other being in the universe" critique do not rely on the premise that Leo is not the most awake being in the universe. You can go back and read my previous posts. I provided numerous links throughout this thread documenting the behavior I consider problematic. Feel free to actually go through those examples, respond to them individually and/or comprehensively, and provide an explanation that makes them no longer problematic while still preserving your view that Leo has integrity and that his commitment to teaching is more important than preserving his special image. You can criticize the morals, judgment, rhetoric, or behavior of a spiritual teacher without assuming that their spiritual realization is false. These are separate questions.(unless you want to make a weird move, where you want to collapse that seperation, and where you want to imply that every instance of bad behavior was necessary (that it was the optimal strategy for accomplishing Leo's teaching goals and that only Leo possesses the special knowledge required to understand why behaving that way was both necessary and beneficial). Lets suppose, for the sake of argument, that Leo actually is the most awake being in the universe. Lets also suppose that he genuinely possesses special abilities that allow him to know (with absolute certainty) the level of awakening of every conscious being in existence. Even if I grant all of that, the criticism still stands: You can be the most awake being in the universe and still choose not to repeatedly create threads declaring that you are the most awake being in the universe while explicitly undermining everyone else's cognition. If the stated purpose of this work is helping people awaken, making them more sovereign, encouraging independent realization, and emphasizing that people should "do the work," then repeatedly redirecting attention toward yourself and your own exceptional status is obviously counterproductive. A Tier 2 guy who is the most awake being in the universe and can telepathically (with certainty) perfectly read everyone's level of awakening somehow failed to recognize how ineffective his "I'm the most awake being in the universe for the 1000th time, and everyone else is a fucking spiritual rat and should be beaten with a crowbar" rhetoric is (even though multiple people have given him very clear negative feedback about it) - Especially, again, if his main goal is to teach us, keep us receptive, help us awaken, and make us more sovereign. If his primary objective is teaching, , helping people awaken, and increasing their sovereignty, then it is very weird why he continued using rhetoric that many of us repeatedly clarified was producing a negative effect. Again, notice that this criticism does not depend on the claim that he is not the most awake being in the universe. His rhetoric is problematic (regardless whether he is the most awake or not) : because of how it comes across; because Leo would never grant comparable claims if they would came from someone else; because many members of his own audience have repeatedly made it clear that this rhetoric makes them significantly less receptive; and because it predictably creates cult dynamics that undermine the very goals he claims to value (especially again if you combine that specialty claim with undermining the cognition of disagreers). More specifically: It undermines people's sovereignty. It encourages exceptional trust in Leo's authority. It encourages people to become increasingly dependent on him while simultaneously distrusting every other spiritual teacher, because all of them supposedly belong to the category of "they don't know what they're talking about." It also encourages people to distrust their own judgment and discernment (If the claim is that every single advanced spiritual teacher in history failed to reach Leo's level of realization, and if no one else truly understands consciousness, then why would anyone on this forum ever trust their own discernment?) And no, the reply that "every other spiritual community has the exact same problems" does not work - because not every other spiritual community has a leader who claims to be more awake than everyone else in the universe , not every spiritual leader undermines the cognition of every single student every singe time when there is a disagreement ,not every spiritual community is set up in a way where your progress can only be evaluated by the leader (again, the "you can validate everything for yourself" doesnt work in practice, because if you do the work and disagree on things, then that can only mean that you havent done enough work and there is no possible scenario under which you can do enough work and disagree with Leo on spirituality - the "did enough" standard can only be called by Leo and there isn't any independent standard from Leo's judgement. ). Now, let's temporarily stop assuming those two premises: (That Leo is the most awake being in the universe and that Leo can flawlessly determine everyone else's level of awakening.) And lets challenge the implication that the reasonable default position is simply to grant those premises until someone can disprove them with absolute certainty. Lets be clear and honest here - Neither you nor Leo would ever consistently apply that standard. Imagine someone else making exactly the same argument to you.: Imagine a scenario where a teacher behaved in ways you considered manipulative or morally questionable. And then one of the teacher's follower told you: "The reasonable thing is to simply assume this behavior is necessary because this person is the most spiritually advanced being in existence. He understands the effects of his rhetoric better than anyone else, so you should trust the process, regardless of how much negative feedback his students express." In what world would you ever accept an implication or response like that? Now, If your response is something like "Of course I would grant that someone other than Leo could be the most awake being in the universe." Okay. then let's check how serious you are about that. Grant that special priviledge to me (After all, you cannot be absolutely certain that I am not the most awake being in the universe, right? - And thats the standard you are asking everyone else to adopt) So, from this point forward, assume that I am more knowledgeable than you: Assume I am the ultimate authority on epistemology. Assume that whenever we disagree (about spirituality, definitions of cults) that I am correct by default and that everyone ought to use the definition of cult that I provided Do not rely on the possibility that I might be mistaken (because again, the reasonable move is to grant those things to me, because if you dont then you are closed-minded or not ready for this advanced work). And from now on, you need to accept all of my rhetoric and behavior because you don't yet understand how this is going to be beneficial for you and everyone else. You can validate everything that I say, but you need to keep in mind that, as long as we disagree about anything I care about, that that will automatically mean that you are wrong and that you need to do more work. This is because sufficient validation is analytically defined as you agreeing with me on all the things I care about, and there is no standard outside of me that can tell you when you have done enough and proper work. (So, let me take on that role and be an absolute authority on what "enough work" and "enough validation" means - actually let me contradict myself since this work is paradoxical and say that there is a standard that is technically outside of me - this is the standard: Keep doing the work until the point where you agree with me perfectly on everything I care about. Until then, any disagreement simply indicates that you have more work to do) if you acknowledge that all of that shit is completely unreasonable and you can entertain for a moment that Leo is not necessarily that special or infallible as he trie to pretend to be - then we can begin discussing Leo's epistemology. Explain: Why is there no video demonstrating the alien transformation that Leo repeatedly claimed he both could and would perform on camera? (Also - Why, when confronted about failing to deliver on that prediction, was his response dismissive rather than reflective ( where he acknowledge that he was wrong or at the very least acknowledge that he failed to deliver on that claim)? Why has there never been any healing miracle done by Leo ? How do you explain the repeated situations in which Leo denies making statements that he demonstrably made, even after evidence is presented? (One example that illustrates [this was one of my interaction with him] , you can search for my post related to this, its in this thread and I provided relevant links there) This was the situation: Leo said : "I never claimed that I can't be wrong." I then presented him with a post where he wrote: "I can be full of shit, but not on this." His response then shifted from: "I never claimed X." to "Just because I claimed X doesn't mean X is true." (Those are entirely different propositions - The first concerns whether the claim was ever made and the second concerns whether the content of the claim was correct) This is a sneaky and spineless shift in the discussion so that he doesnt need to take responsibility when he is cornered. He then ended with one of the most manipulative moves, when he uttered (paraphrased): "I cannot ultimately be wrong because I once uttered the claim that self-deception is endless. Therefore, if I turn out to be wrong about something, that will just confirm my broader claim that self-deception is endless." - Given this logic, you can't be held accountable for any false or incorrect claim, because you can always pivot back to, "But I already told you that self-deception is endless."

Yeah, and given how some people reacted to your question in that thread, that was also interesting. Leo backed himself into a corner by creating a standard by which he can be held accountable (specifically related to that point), and it's clear that he doesn't give the slightest fuck about it and will imply that you're wrong for even attempting to hold him to his own words. Hours and hours of ramblings about epistemology, integrity, maturity, self-deception, epistemic responsibility, and how scientists fall into the trap of infinitely delaying paradigm change—and then, when shit hits the fan, he can't embody or live by anything that he preaches about. " I'm Leo. I made some claims in the past, and I created a standard for myself. Now, should I acknowledge that I was wrong, or at the very least lower my credence in the belief that I can undergo such a transformation after years of failure? Naaah, let me choose the other option,where I label UnbornTao closed-minded for holding me to my own words, and then call it a day (like a mature, epistemically responsible, non-manipulative, 'truth is my highest virtue and value' guy). " Some people here did not pick up on the significance of Leo's reaction to your question. His reaction shows that he doesn't have the spine or the integrity to acknowledge failure and be responsible for his own standards and his own word (especially when it comes to things he cares about - like maintaining a special identity). His reaction to your question simultaneously targets and undermines his epistemology, integrity, and his alleged deep care about what's true.

@UnbornTao - look what Leo said about how to hold him accountable (related to his alien transformation claim): I guess your main error here was forgetting that we're indefinitely stuck in the "sit tight" period .

Your own awakening is the greatest gift you can offer the world. By doing the inner work of self-transformation, you naturally radiate clarity, compassion, and presence, shifting how you impact everyone around you. If you want to awaken all of humanity, then awaken all of yourself. Truly, the greatest gift you have to give is that of your own self-transformation. You have only yourself to thank for that. 🌻

It's cool how the more shifts I have its like when I read things I read them with knew eyes every time and it can be more and more mysterious what it means or the opposite I believe they have had some profound breakthrough from their mind but not this overall holistic multi level transformation so thats why they focus on the mind as if thats the main thing only