Spiral Dynamics Stage Yellow Examples Mega-Thread

[Carl-Richard]

4 hours ago, LaucherJunge said:

@Carl-Richard
In a theoretical sense you might have a point, but in practice you make yellow to be something outworldly which it is not. Yellow interacting with the world that's below automatically steps down, which doesn't mean you should stop discussion altogether.
Yellow is finding systems which are the most beneficial for everyone involved in a systemic way basically. Sometimes it needs to downgrade because the system spoken off is lower tier, yet there is nothing wrong with talking about lower tier systems.

While what you said is correct, Steven Crowder is not yellow. He is a blue ideologue.

[Villager Albert]

Honestly I don't know shit about politics in the US and Steven Crowder but the concept of the show is cool. I think it could make people more openminded, it sure got me to question some of my beliefs.

[LaucherJunge]

@Carl-Richard
Would like to see you having a discussion with him then on how he is a blue ideologue, pretty sure wouldn't go your way.

[Raptorsin7]

@Raptorsin7

[Carl-Richard]

@LaucherJunge Of course it won't go my way: that's just in the design. Either way, you can't convice a blue ideologue that he is a blue ideologue. That would infact make him yellow

[Carl-Richard]

4 hours ago, Villager Albert said:

Honestly I don't know shit about politics in the US and Steven Crowder but the concept of the show is cool. I think it could make people more openminded, it sure got me to question some of my beliefs.

It's a cool concept, but in this case, I just feel it's a cover for making fun of stage green college students as a point scoring exercise. That is really why he became sort of famous: for poking fun at "crazy SJWs". If he really wanted "an intellectually stimulating conversation", he could rather spend time setting up formal debates with actual debaters. I think what the streamer Destiny is doing on Twitch is a great example of how this can be done (he is also really interested in debating Crowder on several issues).

[LaucherJunge]

12 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Of course it won't go my way: that's just in the design. Either way, you can't convice a blue ideologue that he is a blue ideologue. That would infact make him yellow

In fact you can. That's exactly what he is doing with many of the people he talks to. 
Shocking news for you, being an SJW doesn't make you green, many of them are blue in fact.

Edited April 19, 2020 by LaucherJunge

[Carl-Richard]

2 hours ago, LaucherJunge said:

Shocking news for you, being an SJW doesn't make you green, many of them are blue in fact.

Partially true. The most radical parts of any movement tends to devolve into absolutism and other blue qualities, and in the case of movements with primarily green values (social justice), they will sometimes contradict their own values. For certain SJWs, you could say that the way they "relate" to their core values has hints of blue, but if you look at the actual values themselves, there is very little blue about egalitarianism, diversity, sensitivity, tolerance, inclusion, cultural relativistism, and political correctness. 

[LaucherJunge]

@Carl-Richard
Yes, that's true.
The problem is just that they simply follow values not because they have grown into that level but because they put them on as ideology to fit into their environment, they don't know what these values really mean. Wouldn't you agree with me that it's the vast minority of people who really understand such values to their depths? This guy is simply revealing their hypocrisy, this guy is in actuality closer to the values most of these people claim to stand for.

[Carl-Richard]

@LaucherJunge Even though I do agree that he is primarily making fun of college students contradicting their own values, it's my understanding that he is also making fun of green values in general. I don't think his mission can be reduced to mere entertainment. You could maybe give me some examples that you think would convince me otherwise, but if he was truly a solid yellow, he wouldn't feel the need to ridicule green values in that fashion, or prey on the natural ignorance of young people. Granted, these people do have a strong voice and do influence their institutions to a certain degree, but like I said earlier, I think having these discussions in a more formal debate format is a more proper way to address these issues.

Edited April 19, 2020 by Carl-Richard

[LaucherJunge]

@Carl-Richard
I don't really want to invest time into looking for such examples, but from what I've seen he actually knows these values fairly deeply.
In the end we can't really judge this just by his outward appearence and by seeing a tiny fragment of his material, unless you've seen a large portion I would abstain from harsh judgement.
I am not seeing he is pure yellow, nobody is pure anything I pretty sure. But he has a fairly big chunk of yellow in my POV, but I don't wanna claim any absolute truth on this. Unless we really know him, we can only speculate.

[Forestluv]

This mega thread is for posting examples of yellow, not for lengthy discussions of whether a particular video is actually yellow. Most people in the videos in this thread are not yellow-centered (including Steven Crowder). It becomes difficult to identity spiral levels above one’s own level. In particular, those centered at Orange commonly mis-categorize relatively sophisticated orange as yellow.

If anyone would like to have an ongoing discussion/debate about the SD stage of a particular video / person and the criteria of different stages, feel free to start a separate thread. 

[Villager Albert]

 

[VerballyHazardous]

Such an intelligent man.

[Zanoni]

Good example of out of the box solutions. 

 

[Villager Albert]

I know it's long but if you're deciding between a vegan and non-vegan diet, this video is a must I'd say.

It's also a great example of stage yellow imo, Chris Masterjohn is arguably the most openminded nutrition guy.

[Carl-Richard]

It's not a yellow podcast per se, but I still really recommend watching the Rajj Royale Podcast on Twitch (https://www.twitch.tv/rajjpatel) if you want to see the whole spiral in action (atleast tier 1). It's a very free-form debate, starting with around 6-8 guests. People get eliminated as time goes, and it tends to get very heated (which is just fun really). Often comedic guests and topics, but they also invite political guests: everything from liberals, conversatives, communists, alt-righters, gender-fluid people, transgender people etc.. The most yellow person you should expect to see on there would be Destiny, although you shouldn't really expect seeing anything above green there.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Carl-Richard

[tenta]

13 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

The most yellow person you should expect to see on there would be Destiny

Who isn't even stage green and is just a horseshoe theory centrist who hates Bernie.

[Carl-Richard]

@tenta

Hahaha. I do sometimes sympathize with feeling that he is just a loudmouth orange dude, but the way I see it, he doesn't hate Bernie, but rather he dislikes the Bernie-or-bust phenomena. However, he does have many concrete examples of green values: 

• calls himself pro-feminism
• concerned with LGBTQ+ rights
• avoids ableist slurs and misgendering
• pro-UBI
• critical of American imperialism
• takes psychedelics
• in an open sexual relationship
• calls himself "extremely left-leaning"

The reason I see some yellow in him is because of how he talks about everything from metaethics to politics with all kinds of different people (very openminded). He is also a moral anti-realist (ethical subjectivism), has said things like "we only value knowing the truth if it benefits our life", uses words like "framework" and "model" when describing different world-views. Things that keep him away from yellow would be his attachment to materialism, reductionism, atheism, and capitalism.

Edited April 27, 2020 by Carl-Richard

[tenta]

27 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Things that keep him away from yellow would be his attachment to materialism, reductionism, atheism, and capitalism.

I don't believe it's just that, it's also him being uncharitable in debates and looking for any way to aggressively nitpick Bernie, he also agreed with someone else mocking Bernie for his heart.

You have named those examples, but how prominent are they? Not as much as you'd expect, he has more debates against Bernie supporters than against conservatives (where he relies on ideological talking points such as "these communist countries failed therefore you're wrong").

"we only value knowing the truth if it benefits our life" could be interpreted as stage orange self bias.