undeather

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About undeather

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  • Birthday 06/06/1993

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    Austria
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  1. I think its better for both of us if we stop this exchange. We are pushing our perspectives and we wont resolve this anyway since I agree with basically nothing you are saying here (and vice versa). Personally, I see myself a yellow centered individual with some obvious orange/green tendencies.Its very easy for me to see why some people are stuck at a certain stage or where the problems are - thats how my mind works, thats what I do for a living, thats what I am good at. Lack of humility is the big problem in this actualized.org community. People here spout phrases like "big picture", "open mindedness" , "non-ideologistic" and "egolessness" - yet this is one of the most close minded and egoic communities I have ever encountered, at least when it comes to everyday worldly topics. Its a world full of contradictions where people who are neither enlightened, nor wise by any standard give you cookie cutter answers to complex life questions. People tend to lose touch with the incredibly complex dualistic problems once they experienced that "they are god". Maybe this realization is way too much for the human mind to process and only very few can deal with it. TJ Reeves was so right about this place! I have a great life. I love discussion. But this remembers me why I left this place long time ago - and its time to disappear again! Its nothing against you personally, you are for sure a beautiful human being. I just think you ran yourself into something that will cause harm in your life and so do a lot of others here in this forum. Obviously, I can be wrong since I dont know you personally. But you should ask yourself the same question about your believes here and there. Have a great life! Lukas
  2. Nobody here denies that stuff? I have read so much refusal of orange on this forum, which is again, pathologized green. Maybe not you, maybe not Leo - but its such a common theme in here. A second tier thinker would never act that way. Debates are important. But I agree with you that some of the debating structures nowadays are way to rigid and monotone. Debating a person over a topic is obviously not a bad thing if it happens in fair context. There is so much to learn for yourself if you are going into it with an open mind. It seems like a lot of people in here think they are over this process, which again - is the ego of dark green. Hell, there are videos about Sadhguru having debates. Not a visionary? This is completely your subjective opinion. Also notice how you instantly put political views into that argument, as if conservative people are unable to be visionaries, lol. This is incredible close minded. Look how nuanced his view of the political viewpoints actually is in the following video: And btw; Its not about his argument per sé, you can disagree with that. I disagree with a lot of things he says. But just look at the structure and the thought he put into that - he doesnt condemn the left or right, there is no value judgement. The only things he condemns are the extremist forms of both ends of the spectrum, which is a completely valid thing to do. Now look what you are writing in your incredible naiv analysis. This is one of the main issues that prevent people on actualized.org from entering the second stage. no ego transcendence, no access to universal consciousness: Peterson HAD mystical experiences, there is no doubt about that and there are videos about it. I agree with you, and this is one of my main points against him, that he should definitely follow along those lines and get a bit more into mysticism, which he is currently not really aware of. Nevertheless, this is also where your argument falls apart: Ego transcendence/access to universal consciousness is not a main pillar of yellow. If you transcend your ego, you are basically enlightened. Almost nobody on stage yellow is enlightened. Spiral dynmaics is not necessarily a scale for enlightenement, even though people on higher stages usually tend to get involved with consciousness work. Albert Einstein was yellow, but he definitely wasnt enlightened. What usually happens at yellow is awareness of higher conciousness and Peterson is a perfect example for someone who is at exactly that place at the moment. Einstein was on the same path, so was Maslow at the end of his life when he added self transcendence to his pyramid and so were the fathers of quantum mechanics like Schrödinger or Pauli. All great examples of high IQ, scientific minded people who broke through into that second tier - and if you read about their lifes, you will notice incredible overlapping between them and Jordan. Obviously you can become aware of higher conciousness at lower stages, especially green but that doesnt mean you are an integral thinker. There are so many examples of highly enlightened gurus with surpressed shadow elements of some of the lowers stages as well. "This is a trick of the ego. The ego always think he's right!" Thats such a Leo thing to say. But then its always Leo who thinks he is right about basically everything, at least when it comes to a lot of discussion here in the forum. He is a smart dude and he obviously very knowledgeable in a variety of things, especially enlightenment - but never have I ever seen that guy admitting he is wrong. As soon as you critcize him, he will tell you thats just your ego. But why can he do it then? He said so many ridicolous things about Peterson for example, which proved to me that he didnt really put a lot of time nor thought into studying him. So dont come with such platitudes, its ridicolous. You are doing exactly the same thing here. So you say that, then you tell me my point is wrong by giving one of the worst arguments I have ever seen in my life: "Hitler & Stalin wanted the best for people, male and female and the world in general" and "so does pretty much everyone on a daily basis": I mean I kinda get what you want to say but you should think again. There is a massive difference between someone who tries to push a murderous and genocidal ideology with all means and someone who tells people to "strive for the most possible good in their lives, so they can lift themselves and everyone around them out of the misery". I am from Austria. I live near the brithplace of Hitler. I have talked to people who met Hitler personally. So I kinda know what I am talking about.
  3. Holy moly. This thread is a clusterfuck of ideology, misinterpretations mixed with spiritual ego and entitlement to the monopoly of truth. Reasons, why I left this place long time ago and this is was one of the better decicions on my life. It seems like there is a lack of humility in some of the spiritual communities nowadays. Even Leo, the hero I used to follow, is provable contradicting himself, yet is unable to show some virtue in the face of his all too human existence. Do you want to know why I am sure that almost none of you guys are 2nd tier thinkers? Listen to a Ken Wilber. Listen to a Stan Grof. Listen to a Carl Jung, Maslow, Feynman, Shinzen Young, Wim Hof, Terence Mckenna etc. - When I listen to them, when I read their stuff, when I disagree with them - I still get this feeling of humility from them. Even when someone like Gabor Mate disagrees with Jordan Peterson, he does with a sense of humility. All I get from most peple here, including some moderators, is this incredible egoic mental masturbation soup, served with the arrogance of moral/spiritual superiority. I dont know most of you guys and I am sure that some of you are actually very well actualized human beings: But the way you present yourself and your argument shows me that this forum is a collecting tank for pathalogically green people. You are not yellow if you dismiss things like intellectualism, debate, science or rationality - you are a fool. You add on to that. You add the humanistic values and perspectives of green and thats the road to yellow. This is not what most of you guys are doing - you are surpressing orange and you havent intergrated some of the even lowers stages well enough. This is such a common theme I see here. Look at the picture above (taken from http://spiraldynamicsintegral.nl/en/overview-value-systems/). In all honesty: If you cant see that most of you guys are definitely NOT this, then I dont know how I someone can help you anymore. Then compare it to people like Jordan Peterson or Ken Wilber - much more fitting. Hell you can even link some of those attributes directly to what Jordan Peterson was saying in this lectures - and there are people who still think he is blue/orange? How could someone at the stage of blue/orange be even remotely intersted in Carl Jungs work? You realize that he is aware of many higher conciousness topics like psychodelics, non materialism (he is a non materialist btw), conciousness, synchronicity? He is acutely aware that he basically knows nothing and that reality is an incredible complex system, barely transparent for the human mind. Look even the "Shadows" in the graphic above are a perfect description for someone like Peterson. He is overcomplicating things, he is extremely headstrong, he can sometimes be perceived as cold. Look how many people he helped so far - millions! He started crying on a livestream once because he felt that emotional about the amount of gratitude he got from the people he helped with his lectures. He wants the fucking best for people, male and female and the world in general. Whats more green than that? Is it the armchair moralizing and incredibly egoic & unfair judgement of his ideas on the actualized.org forums? I dont think so! Its completely okay to disagree with Peterson on a variety of topics, but to call him a non-integral thinker is just a ridicolous claim. Also, I dont know why Leo has such a strong reaction against him. He is criticizing Sam Harris for his crusade against Islam but he is doing exactly the same against both, Jordan Peterson an Sam Harris. I mean he wanted to publish a whole video against Jordan Peterson - how enlightened is that? Wake up people.
  4. Yeah, at the end, the one thing to be sure of, is that reality is unbelievably weird. The more I learn about different stuff (i.e psychodelics, quantum mechanics, enlightenment, siddhis... and of course science) the more I realize that I dont know shit about anything. I try to become more an more open minded while still remaining a skeptic in some way. I think you are quite similar to that. I am a MD, so I know what you are talking about the concern that "enlightenment" strips away certain aspects of life or science. I had the same concerns for my field of expertise but that fear is baseless.
  5. Look my friend I havent had any enlightenment experience in my life so far and I am currently not navigating into that direction either. Yet there is undoubtably "something" that people like Leo or the mystics experience on a regular basis which changes the whole game for them. This is my starting point and this should be yours too. If you really want to know what the fuck they are talking about, take their advice and try it out. If you really want answers as bad as air to breathe, then go find them for yourself, using their blueprint. There is no way around this. I realized long time ago that fundamental discussion with people on this forum are not very fruitful. This is not the right place for discussion and in my mind there are 2 possible reasons for this: 1. They know/experience something you dont and you should show some humility towards the seemingly ungraspable nature of reality. 2. They are all deluded fucks and all this is bullshit. Stop challenging their world-view, trust me. You wont get the intellectual discussion you are waiting for. You need to find it out for yourself, that is the only way you will get a satisfying answer.
  6. You, my friend, need to get your life in order before doing more of the deeper stuff. This sounds like real depression to me and this forum is definitely not the right place to treat that. There seem to be a lot of unmet needs in your life like basic friendship, realatioship, sex etc. - so in my opinion, those are things you have to solve first. I was at a similar point once. Go visit a psychotherapist/psychoanalys if you are not already doing that. If needed, you can take an antidepressive drug to get over this depressive episode. A lot of people, especially on this forum, will tell you SSRI's are bullshit and maybe you have this opinion too but this is such an one-sided view of that matter and ignores all the good things it can do for people. Get better, wish you all the best!
  7. Found this video couple of years ago and always thought its fake. Yet the more I got into actualized.org and some of the stuff Dean Raddin is talking about, the more I am aware that I know nothing Looks incredible to me:
  8. I know those LMS videos. They are the direct correlate to all the "You can get any woman you want and looks dont matter" bs on the other side of the spectrum. Its way too narrow minded and superficial for a huge topic like attraction. The truth lies somewhere between those extreme point of views and there is really not more to say about this because anyone with an ounce of rational thinking knows the difference.
  9. Is it really that easy though to say "good" or "bad" doest exist? At least if you take a contextional approach: I mean clearly, if you become higher conciousness you extend your views on serverel issues and see them from angles you have never been before. Even if in the end, everything is a unity, there are still value propositions along the way. Non-suffering is better than suffering. Not killing someone is better than murder. Pollution is worse than a clean world. Tribal warfare is stupid. The higher you get up the spiral, the wider your conciousness becomes, the more "bad" things you are able to see. If we dont have any compass at all, there would be chaos. Maybe I am wrong though - this is a new territory for me!
  10. Found this video to be quite interesting and non dogmatic!
  11. The notion I get from someone who is "always positive" is a person who has completely lost touch with reality. I mean what does it even mean to be always positive? Is it standing at your parents grave with a smile on your face, trying to get something good out of the death of a loved one? What about a doctor who has to tell a mother that her son didnt make it? Negative emotions are part of life in my opinion and resisting them is the wrong way. I cant speak for enlightened people though since I have no clue what this would mean for someone like that. I am talking about 99,99% of the people with such attitude, who try to hide behind this fassade because of some dragon lurking in the depths. Of course, this is not everyone - there are a lot of people who are just very positive without any hidden demons - but it comes from somewhere else. The same goes for always neagtive people of course.
  12. Just came across this video and found it to be pretty shareable! In my opinion this is what healthy orange looks like. I also believe that this guy has some amount of yellow in him. A lot of people will disagree with this, but there is clearly some notion of stage-awareness in the way he talks. Nevertheless, its a great video if you feel stuck. What do you guys think?
  13. Yes, I do! Political decisions are going to affect my life, even if I dont want them to. I spend about 10 minutes a day browsing through my news-app on my cellphone - thats more than enough time to get a picture of whats going on. Its true that too much of that can potentially fuck you up but I believe that if you are mindful and open minded enough, this shouldnt happen.
  14. Whats your opinion on all the "woo-woo" you can find in the spiritual enviroment? Did your rational mind ever had problems with this?
  15. If you cant relate to the masses, you will never be a leader. As I got into this whole personal developement stuff some years ago, I fell into the same hole. I ditched my friends, gave up on "low conciousness" activitives and focused on the "important work". Yet what happened was that I ultimately became very, very sad. I ditched people I actually liked as friends, great people - who were just not interested into the same stuff or journey. I actually looked down at those guys, not realizing that I was just harming myself with this kind of behaviour. So finally I came to this point where I didnt know what to believe anymore - On the one side I missed all my old friends and the activities, on the other side the thinker of this thoughts doesnt exist - so what now? I followed my heart and got back on the right tracks: Returning to my old social circle, doing the personal developement work in private and adding its fruits to my day to day life. I balanced my life out and this is what personally makes me the happiest