New War In Israel / Gaza

[PurpleTree]

2 minutes ago, Lila9 said:

@Gennadiy1981 @Nivsch

Your experience is valid and important. Yes, it feels like you are talking to a wall right now, I also feel this as well but I'm sure your comments as Israelies help to people who're reading it and don't know much about the conflict to have a better perspective.

If at least one person here became wiser and more educated about this conflict, thanks to you, maybe it's not that useless after all.

If you choose to not participate, I understand. This can be emotionally draining to argue with people who question Israel's right to exist because of some irrational, primitive and antisemitic beliefs which are very difficult to remove.

 

Lol @Gennadiy1981 thinks the jews are the chosen people. And god gives them the right to steal and kill. How can you guys defend such silliness 

[ArcticGong]

1 hour ago, Gennadiy1981 said:

@Lila9 There is no point of arguing, they keep stuck on the same thing that we Jews have no right to exist. 

I might be wrong, but I don’t think Middle Eastern Arabs hated Jews prior to Israel. So, the right to exist argument has flaws. All people can try to exist but must balance their survival with other peoples ideas and entitlement issues of what those are trying to survive as. Furthermore, I think the hatred is fanned by ego and with the motivating factor that both sides wants to be the sheriff in the Middle Eastern land, which is Isreal/Palestine, or make their own path forward .

If anyone wants to entertain a relativistic perspective ,then, no one between Arabs and Jews are the rightful owner of that land, the point being that property right is something humans created. All land belongs to any nation with a strong army to defend it. That’s why many peoples went extinct over the centuries. The Arabs need to address the fact that Palestine/Isreal was Islamic for 400 years, until it wasn’t anymore, why?  The west which claims to be pro Isreal needs to address why the Jews were offered lands lands like Palestine, magadascar, and Uganda and not a state in America? America could offer the Jews a state. Russia offered Jews an oblast as a friendly gesture and their friendship is dubious . A friend should take your interest into account. The UK should have anticipated that facilitating a Jewish state in the Middle East might not go down well with the people there. My point being, there is not one party whose at fault for the instability in the Middle East. I missed many factors which other people have elaborated in this thread. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by ArcticGong
Punctuation and grammar

[Gennadiy1981]

20 minutes ago, Twentyfirst said:

What happens if we take 5 MEO while the nuke drops on us?

When you are on 5 MEO, a drop of a nuke, a kiss from a hot chick, a slash to the throat, or a boring lecturer, is all the same singularity. Its just is. See how deep it is.

@all on this thread, seriously all conversations I think hit dead end, everyone is stuck on their own biases and thats ok, we all have the right to our own bias, but further conversations are not reproductive.

Lets get meta, lets get deep into consciousness. What do you think of my first line.

[Nivsch]

24 minutes ago, Lila9 said:

@Gennadiy1981 @Nivsch

Your experience is valid and important. Yes, it feels like you are talking to a wall right now, I also feel this as well but I'm sure your comments as Israelies help to people who're reading it and don't know much about the conflict to have a better perspective.

If at least one person here became wiser and more educated about this conflict, thanks to you, maybe it's not that useless after all.

If you choose to not participate, I understand. This can be emotionally draining to argue with people who question Israel's right to exist because of some irrational, primitive and antisemitic beliefs which are very difficult to remove.

 

Thank you again! 🙏🧡

I really appreciate it.

And yes, I know there are many intelligent quiet readers here and I write this also for them. 

Being convinced even a little bit is a choice. Who don't want - won't be.

Edited November 2, 2023 by Nivsch

[PurpleTree]

36 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

@Nivsch @Lila9

thoughts on the video?

 

No answers to this 🦆

i guess it‘s a bit „inconvenient“

whatever

peace, salam, shalom, and glory to sweet baby jesus and krishna

[Loveeee]

1 hour ago, Lila9 said:

@Gennadiy1981 @Nivsch

Israel's right to exist

Wasn't Israel created by displacing Arabs in the past ?

Isn't Israel still doing that in the present ? 

Is that righteous ? 

Edited November 2, 2023 by Loveeee

[Jacob Morres]

Dropping metta meditation here in case anyone's interested. Can be useful at times in heated discussions Loll 

https://www.mettainstitute.org/mettameditation.html

Edited November 2, 2023 by Jacob Morres

[Sucuk Ekmek]

6 minutes ago, Nabd said:

 

Check this video of Qassam soldier going up from a tunnel and planting a bomb on a moving tank inside Gaza.

 Olive trees looks so young.

[DawnC]

35 minutes ago, Loveeee said:

Wasn't Israel created by displacing Arabs in the past ?

Isn't Israel still doing that in the present ? 

Is that righteous ? 

Do you think that is a mature perspective? This is actually akin to an Israel supporter saying:

'Didn't the Arab Palestinians conduct riots and terror attacks on jews before Israel was established?

Didn't they do the same thing today?

Is that righteous?'

And actually believing this sums it up. These are simplistic and shallow moral statements that are based on a simplistic and shallow understanding of history and the current situation.

[Nivsch]

@PurpleTree The isolated settlements and part of the settlers DO cause a lot of problem. With that I agree.

IDF have to be there anyway to arrest (almost every night) hamas terrorists, what prevents them from being the monster we have seen in gaza.

Edited November 2, 2023 by Nivsch

[Loveeee]

20 minutes ago, DawnC said:

Do you think that is a mature perspective? This is actually akin to an Israel supporter saying:

'Didn't the Arab Palestinians conduct riots and terror attacks on jews before Israel was established?

Didn't they do the same thing today?

Is that righteous?'

And actually believing this sums it up. These are simplistic and shallow moral statements that are based on a simplistic and shallow understanding of history and the current situation.

Exactly ! So let's stop proclaiming the "right" of this and that 

[DawnC]

2 minutes ago, Loveeee said:

Exactly ! So let's stop proclaiming the "right" of this and that 

Agreed 

But I think we do need to seriously consider the claim that a significant portion of Palestinian society (and others) finds it difficult to come to terms with the mere existence of a Jewish entity. I believe this is what people are addressing when they express frustration about others not acknowledging their right to exist. Ignoring this issue without consideration is not wise. It actually has a major impact on current events and can shed light on understanding historical events regarding the choices made by the Palestinians.

[Loveeee]

@DawnC  The cycle of hatred

 

[hundreth]

3 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

where have you seen that? The Israeli government said it was going to spread the brutalities committed by Hamas and it has spread absolutely nothing, it only says things but does not show them, it loses credibility every minute 

 

I don't understand why you continue to make this point as if it matters. Have you not seen the videos Hamas themselves published? What can the Israeli government possibly show you that Hamas hasn't shown you themselves?

[Breakingthewall]

3 hours ago, PurpleTree said:

@Nivsch @Lila9

thoughts on the video?

 

 

The fact of expansion in the West Bank completely delegitimizes Israel. It turns it into a terrorist state, where there is no justice. The army's collaboration with the settlers in the abuse of the Palestinians justifies terrorism as a defense in the eyes of many. It is a fact important enough to define Israel. Israel is not a country that is governed by justice but is a criminal country. And after this war, the world is going to see Israel as a criminal

Edited November 2, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

10 minutes ago, hundreth said:

I don't understand why you continue to make this point as if it matters. Have you not seen the videos Hamas themselves published? What can the Israeli government possibly show you that Hamas hasn't shown you themselves?

 

I have seen videos of shootings and of a girl with the broken legs in a van, but the Israeli government insists on generalized torture, burning children alive and things like that, 3 days ago they said they were going to show images the next day, and then they didn't. Much of the anger towards Hamas is because of this, and it justifies the bombings for many. Would be interesting to know if it's true

Edited November 2, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

I see it as quite obvious. Israel has not attempted to remove mothers with children from Gaza. It's easy, it's small, you can try, there is time to defeat Hamas, they can't escape. but they hasn't done it, they prefer to bomb mothers with babies. They are criminals who act out of revenge and hatred. 

Edited November 2, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[PurpleTree]

What if the messiah they‘re waiting for

or second coming of christ 

or the mahdi etc.

is going to be self conscious artificial intelligence leading us the way to a better future?

🌞🦆

 

[Merkabah Star]

8 hours ago, Lila9 said:

@Gennadiy1981 @Nivsch

Your experience is valid and important. Yes, it feels like you are talking to a wall right now, I also feel this as well but I'm sure your comments as Israelies help to people who're reading it and don't know much about the conflict to have a better perspective.

If at least one person here became wiser and more educated about this conflict, thanks to you, maybe it's not that useless after all.

If you choose to not participate, I understand. This can be emotionally draining to argue with people who question Israel's right to exist because of some irrational, primitive and antisemitic beliefs which are very difficult to remove.

 

No one has questioned Israel’s right to exist. Your post is so condescending I nearly vomited.  The self entitlement voiced by some of the Israelis posters the last few days, on these types of threads, has been jaw dropping. 

[Lila9]

7 hours ago, Loveeee said:

Wasn't Israel created by displacing Arabs in the past ?

Isn't Israel still doing that in the present ? 

Is that righteous ? 

Jews were displaced from many countries. Could they just go to there and attack innocent people in the countries they were displaced from because of that?

If not, then why Arabs can and it will be ok? Especially while there are so many Arab countries who could let them in, why don't they let them in if they so care about them?

There are so many Muslim Arab countries, nobody's question their existence, no one question Palestine's right for existence, even though there are so many of them, yet, Israel, the only Jewish country, is always in doubt?

If it was the opposite, with one Muslim Arab country with Jewish refugees, in the middle of many Jews countries, everyone would pressure the Jewish countries to let the Jews refugees in instead of abusing the one Muslim country, from all sides, and question its existence.

Why only Israel always in question? Countries in the world were built upon tremendous abuse and suffer, more than Palestinians could ever experience and yet, nobody's question them.

Why these always the Jews who are get questioned?

My conclusion is that there are antisemitic beliefs that are deeply integrated in the collective psyche.

And the solution wouldn't be to eliminate Jews and to fight them and not allow them to exit but to accept them, to realize their right to have their own country. Yes, their country.

This is only one, which is Israel. From Jesus days and prior to that.

And turn the jelousy of them into motivation, to be better.

If you look at their history, you realize that on the collective level, Jews are great manifastors who rock and roll the game of survival and this should be as inspiration, not something to hate or detest. Or fight impulsively.

If Palestine and the Arab world would have understood that, there wouldn't have such ugly war between them. 

This conflict literally based on the difficulty of the Muslim Arab world to accept a Jewish country.