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Spacetime itself can physically be infinite and eternal. So there is no need to "invent" something new to contain spacetime. (In fact, current evidence of the universe spacetime indicates it is infinite (flat spatially) and eternal into the future (though not in the past)) You also say "I'm perfectly conscious how my current "human experience" transcends space and time". It would be interesting for you to show us how, because by definition, humans are contained within spacetime. Unless you have come up with your own physics model. If you want to discuss this from a nondual perspective, it is not the human or person that attains freedom. Read more on radical nonduality (e.g Jim Newman, Kenneth Madden, Alexis Knight, etc...).

Why would it be impossible for God to create other minds? I’ve seen some people argue from a solipsistic perspective that God cannot truly create “others,” and can only create the illusion of others within himself. The reasoning seems to be that if God is the only absolute consciousness, then anything that exists would necessarily exist within God’s own being. If that’s the case, then other minds wouldn’t be genuinely independent, they would just be appearances in God’s consciousness. But I don’t see why this follows. If God is omnipotent, why would it be impossible for God to create genuinely distinct conscious agents? Even if they depend on God for their existence, that doesn’t seem to imply they are merely illusions within God. So my question is: what is the logical contradiction in God creating real “others”? Is the claim that it’s impossible actually justified, or is it just an assumption coming from a particular metaphysical view (like solipsism or nonduality)? Curious how people here think about this.

"we’re pointing to the same thing" Both of you are pointing to the same something that has nothing to do with enlightenment or nonduality. The illusion is so seductive it keeps the mind enchanted with states of non-aging, such as the one you're describing where the brain doesn't grow out of its childhood innocence. In fact there are many experiments now being done to prevent aging in the brain. And what is the most seductive characteristic of heaven, if not the fact that we don't age there, therefore remain in the constant state of childhood bliss. With such possibilities, why would anyone care about finding the end of the illusion? The issue is that it is only when the soul matures enough that it realizes that no state or condition is perfect--there will always be some flaw, something missing. Then the question of how arises. But there is no how or why to the Timeless. Any action doesn't bring you any closer to or farther away from the Absolute, because all there is is the Absolute.

What you're describing is a mental transformation--a change in your relationship to your thoughts. This is all in the world of relativity. Enlightenment is the dissolution of relativity back into the Absolute. With that, it's revealed that This is just the Absolute appearing as the relative. For more, read about/watch radical nonduality (Jim Newman, Kenneth Madden, Alexis Knight, etc..).

If that’s true it’s because there’s a you present in thoughtless experience that knows it’s having a thoughtless experience. Even though a you is only possible as a thought thing, and not a not thought thing, in this conception. It’s like the concept known as nonduality. Nonduality cannot be a thing known , because nonduality is not a thing.

Sounds like a nice trip. How much do you plan to increase your dosage by per trip? Be careful, how deep a mushroom trip goes increases a lot at higher doses, and they can get a little twisted (as in, your ego might start to get quite scared when you start to experience full nonduality) at dosages of 3.5g+. Great for understanding consciousness and Awakening, though, when you get past the fear. My previous understanding of reality got absolutely shattered at a dose of 3.5g.

Yeah you are presenting solipsism, but the problem is there is no one mind having one experience. There are many minds, each with its separate experience. You and I cannot be the Infinite Mind because we are not "located nowhere and everywhere" and also we are separate. Each one of us has a different experience. You can say we are configurations or parts of the Infinite Mind, but surely we are not the Infinite Mind, by definition. And in quantum mechanics, there is a consistent theory that describes how many minds emerged from One Mind or Infinite Mind. Since you said "Science has not and cannot ever prove there are multiple minds". There is the Hugh Everett's Many Minds interpretation, that states when a quantum event happens, minds branch off to experience their possible outcome. One mind becomes many minds, each unaware of the others, each experiencing a different outcome — but all equally real. (And there was a missing piece: why doesn't the observer see a superposition of all these outcomes simultaneously when the branching happens? Decoherence theory answers this by showing that when a quantum system interacts with its environment — air molecules, photons, your brain — the superposition effectively stops being coherent. The different possibilities stop interfering with each other and behave like separate, independent classical outcomes.) Anyways, I just brought this up as a valid theory in quantum mechanics that states multiple minds exist. So these minds exist and they all emerged from One Mind (which you can call God--the first Mind, Originator of all other minds). If you were to relate this to nonduality, you would say that the Self is the wavefunction which is whole and undivided. There's also another interpretation (Bohm's implicate order) that states many observers are locally unfolded expressions of the same undivided consciousness, appearing at different space and timepoints. So here you have multiple minds again.

Anyone else? It started like 15 months ago I think when i started watching Nonduality talks more often. Jim Newman, Swami something something etc. Then like 5 months ago started watching even a lot more Rolls Roye (Roes) Suzanne, Emmerson then Kenneth and a few days ago Alexis. It’s quite an enjoyable addiction thus far though. Just quite soothing to listen to this nonsensical stuff. I try to listen to other stuff like politics, war and whatever but it’s mostly just too annoying. Who cares about Trump, wars and all that nonsense (not judging just doesn’t interest me at the moment)

A few nice Nonduality (for the lack of a better word) talks I was listening to in the past few days Why am I posting it? Not sure. Maybe someone is bored, they can help someone or someone wants something soothing to listen to to sleep.

It isn't actually possible to 'delete' or erase the ego. I think it is foolish to think one can do this. All that happens is the we cling or identify to something new to replace the old that we think we erased. Spirituality becomes the new ground. Nonduality becomes the new ground to replace XXX. God-consciousness replaces nonduality etc etc ad infinitum. The 'ego-less' individuals I have met have been unconscious to the biggest and more detrimental egos I have ever encountered.

I've thought for awhile now that nonduality knows consciousness is everything but has no idea what consciousness IS.

Are you saying that after your 30 day 5-MeO retreat, during which God showed you how to love ever more deeply, and during which there was even a period when you were no longer able to close the singularity pulling you in during your sleep, you then went on to do another 90-day 5-MeO retreat?? And during that retreat, you did realize even more radical things, what you call something 'way beyond human nonduality'? Are you going to lay out these insights for us, or explain the implications of your realizations? After all, you seem to be the first human being to have accomplished something this radical.

Look I appreciate that, but thats not my main issue. I have some unhinged posts (not as unhinged as what you said, but still unhinged), but thats just one thing. A much bigger issue is being unhinged and then thinking that you were perfectly justified in being that unhinged and then combining that with using a plausible deniability tactic later when pushed on it and reframing things in a way thats dishonest given all the context of a given case. For instance you didnt ban flyboy because you had the wellbeing and the development of others in mind, you banned that person mainly because you were angry and you had an outburst like all people time to time. I don’t think Flyboy did anything particularly exceptional in that thread, that people who strongly disagree with you on spiritual matters don’t usually engage in. You had to edit that post to give a false explanation why you did what you did, and you also had to edit it because you included the sentence "If you try corrupt my teachings, I will fucking kill you". https://www.reddit.com/r/nonduality/comments/11xndwf/is_this_enlightenment/ You just layed down your rhetorical tactic in front of us in this thread - if an apology is given to strategically avoid drama and not because you genuinely think you engaged in a behavior that you shouldnt have engaged in - then that perfectly explains why you always fall back on a general tendency and it isnt just about your personality, but it is about what you genuinely believe in and about how you see the world and other people. Like you thinking more about "Look I dont give a fuck about any of this human drama shit, can we move the fuck on? Let me think about what behavior should I engage in and what I need to explicitly say and how I should pretend that im sorry, so that I can reach and realize my goals on this forum and avoid drama the most effective way" rather than having an internal dialogue driven by your conscience like "Where did I actually fuck up and did I actually engage in an unfair treatment, do I really think that I fucked up somewhere and if where and how and how can I change that?" As others have already layed down, you seem to have this general tendency in how you approach things and how you think about others and how you seem to look down on others. And the story that you tell about it how thats not the case and how you dont feel superior just simply doesnt match the general tendency that you outplay. You value intelligence a lot, probably the most, given you take it that intelligence is whats needed for understanding and in your model intelligence is just how much consciousness you have. And given that you take it that you had orders of magnitude higher consciousness than any other being in the Universe, you dont even look at yourself as a human anymore and you almost take it like you belong to a completely new and different species. There isnt any single instance where spiritual disagreement with others isn't automatically interpreted by you as them lacking intelligence rather than as them being equal and there being a genuine disagreement or as them offering something that you dont know or lack. Given the lack of behavior change (your natural tendency is to fall back on a particular behavior over and over again even if your skill to consciously overwrite it gets slightly better over time) and how hard it is for you to change that and how you need to exert consciously a lot of power to no want to look at forum users as just some incredibly stupid pigs and rats, it makes me think you do actually deep down think that everyone other than you is just like that. And the reason probably why you say you dont is to strategically and consciously avoid drama and to calm people down when they get offended by not just what you explicitly call them , but by your general treatment of them. For instance, you almost always end almost all disagreements with "You dont understand what im saying, im more awake than you, I wont explain this to you cause you wont get it" etc. All this stuff about behavior change feels more like about being a strategic tactic to do things more effectively to reach and actualize your goals and feels much less about you having a deep conscience driven desire to change because you genuinely think that you fucked up and you genuinely think and belive that other people are not below you. Improving your behavior feels more about improving your ability to actualize and reach your goals, than about having an internal desire to become a better person.

It's different in that a much deeper consciousness of God is reached. God is realized more and more deeply, to shocking levels. Such stunning levels of God are realized that nonduality looks like child's play. Nondualists cannot even imagine these degrees of God exist.

Leo claims to have gone beyond nonduality but can't explain HOW is awakening is different from nonduality. This can either trigger you, inspire you or just make you curious myself I'm curious

If you're interested in nonduality, but don't follow an organized religion, how important is the concept of faith to you? I'm curious because for a couple of years I grooved on nonduality, meditating on oneness, and reading about Brahman. I thought I lived in an impersonal universe. Turned out I didn't read far enough ahead. Earlier this year, Ishvara, or just something more akin to infinite intelligence, or a more traditional idea of God has been revealing itself to me. I'm never exactly sure what I'm perceiving, all I really know is that I know nothing, right. But I've been surprised the last few months how resistant, resentful and unsettled I am that an all-powerful and aware transcendent intelligence really has been watching me this whole time (hey God!)... I'm still really resentful about the religious school I attended as a kid, and it's a severe mindfuck that there is something more than just the base, ineffable substrate of the universe. You mean you were watching the whole time? I feel like I'm right back to being a kid, struggling with free will vs fate, and really struggling with humility. The way I feel by default is very resentful about this, but I know that's not very skillful or helpful. I have been paralyzed in terms of returning to the world in much of a meaningful way since discovering nonduality, because I feel like I simply don't know where I stand. It kinda helped my emotional health a little bit, I was severely suicidal, depressed and dysfunctional leading up to that discovery, and since then I've been kinda limping along, thinking maybe one day I would figure out how to motivate myself to do things like socialize, start a business, try to get a job that isn't near minimum wage, but I feel like if there's an intelligence watching me, and I have already befallen the many struggles and crises and just overall complete and utter psychological and spiritual dysfunction I've felt in my life, and that intelligence oversaw all that suffering, I don't have much hope for the future. I literally had more hope when I believed God didn't exist, and I'm kinda not sure how to proceed now. I've just been defaulting to Vipassana meditation and gratitude practice, but it's kinda like once the high vibe wears off after a couple hours, I'm just back in the ego mind, which feels absolutely hopeless, and of course is conditioned to be fearful and is not at all welcoming of the "good news" that I am surrounded by intelligent Love. I seem to be vacillating between being high on meditation and prayer practices that cause me to believe in delusional love and light stuff, then being busted back down to depression sadness when I try to make contact with the world. I am kinda surprised that all these years of trauma recovery and study of spiritual practice and the human psyche have not really afforded me any confidence in the relative world. I'm not really sure how to project my intentions into the world or into the future. I was kinda curious what you consciousness explorers make of the concept of faith, if you're coming from a specifically NON-religious paradigm. I'm kinda thinking this whole nonduality trip was just a cul-de-sac of spiritual masturbation designed to turn an agnostic into a believer, and when I'm filled up with gratitude or samadi, I feel hopeful. But the hunk of meat that makes up my human mind is fucking disgusted and sad, I guess I'd always hoped that the ultimate real truth was something completely different from just... "magical irrational God just arbitrarily fucking with me by teaching me bullshit 'lessons.'" Even after all this meditation I'm struggling to place my faith in that. I guess I was deluding myself with nonduality that maybe I, the little me, was really "it," but it's becoming clear that I'm not. It's not that I thought I was that great, I guess I just thought if I lived in a cold, uncaring universe at least that meant that it really was all my fault, and I could do something about it with my merit, and instead it seems there's forces beyond my control after all, and it makes me feel sad and powerless.

It's what he knows, he never got into the psychedelics and nonduality stuff. So for him God is his people and offering value to them and he doesn't see issue from learning from the deep wisdom of the bible while still having a more hedonistic sex life. Which I agree with. Also I double checked the watch appreciation on Gemini, if he has a Patek it'll probably double in value over the next 10 years. There aren't many investments that make more sense as both a networking tool and appreciating asset. Depending on the market you're buying in, it's a better asset than a house.

Yes. Infinity is literally unknowable. It is too profound to be known. If it could be known, it would be finite, which by definition it isn't. That's why mysticism is technically true. If it could be known then it wouldn't be mystical. All explanations are conceptual and finite. You need duality for explanation to exist. So nonduality cannot have an explanation. That's why the sage sits in silence. Stunned silence is the final answer.

Nonduality is obviously correct, but it shouldn't ignore the Divine Attributes discovered by western mysticism. also @Azrael deeply understood psychedelics and how to use them in service of real liberation . The GOAT.

Hey, ya'll, I need your help! I want to create a comprehensive list of video examples of prototypical stage Turquoise thinking. This is meant to be an educational tool for people learning about Spiral Dynamics. So towards that end, scour Youtube and find all the videos you can which exhibit stage Turquoise thinking. Try to find videos which are short and sweet. The more diversity we can display here, the better. Try to find examples from various cultures. We will create a mega-thread like this for every stage in the Spiral, from Red to Turquoise. But here, let's just focus on Turquoise. Each week I will start a new mega-thread topic for the next stage. Do not start a political debate in this thread! It is not our goal here to defend our personal political positions or to judge any stage, but simply to compile examples. Thanks for your help! I'm excited to see what kind of juicy stuff you dig up. Try to be selective with your choices. This can turn into a really cool list. Stage Turquoise Values: Consciousness Elevating mankind’s consciousness Truth Deep metaphysical insight Wisdom, the wisdom of nature Mysticism, spirituality, nonduality God, divinity Holism, integration, synthesis vs analysis Integrating all religions & science Left & right brain synthesis Honesty, transparency, authenticity Being vs knowing, doing, having Simplicity, flowing with nature Minimalist sustainable living Collaborative synergy Human wellness Healing at all levels: physical, emotional, spiritual Exploring altered states of consciousness Intuition Channeling: direct downloads from infinite intelligence Supernatural creativity Spiritual purification Awakening, transcendence, liberation Unconditional love, compassion for all Emotional mastery Presence, mindfulness Paradox Esoteric teachings Gratitude Unity Deeper & deeper levels of interconnectedness Selfless living Sacrifice self for greater consciousness Meditation, yoga, contemplation, self-inquiry Not-knowing Humility Spontaneity, playfulness, self-amusement The really big picture Stage Turquoise Examples: Sadhguru, Shunyamurti, Thomas Campbell, Yoda, David Hawkins, Ken Wilber, Shinzen Young, Deepak Chopra, Stan Grof, Osho, Mooji, Ramaji, Rupert Spira, Eckhart Tolle’s A New Earth, Yogananda, Martin Ball, Terence McKenna, Carl Jung, Sri Aurobindo, Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, Ervin Laszlo, David Loy, Alan Watts, Wim Hof, Matt Kahn, Dalai Lama, Sasha Shulgin, yoga, holotropic breathwork, The Holographic Universe, Akashic Records, noosphere, opening the 3rd eye, pineal gland, out of body experiences, samadhi experiences, siddhis, paranormal abilities, clairvoyants, channels, mediums, Bashar, Aleister Crowley, Rudolf Steiner, alternative healing systems, Maya, psychedelics, 5-MeO-DMT, StarTrek: The Q, Rupert Sheldrake’s morphogenetic fields, Dean Radin’s paranormal research, Gandhi’s ideas of pluralistic harmony, Gaia, biocentrism, Monroe Institute, Esalen Institute, transpersonal psychology, Jung’s collective unconscious, quantum field theory, sacred geometry, reincarnation, opening chakras, saints, sages, mystics, prophets, etc.

this is how the first blog post is coming so far. not quite sure where to go next but it's close I'm open to feedback , just please be kind lol : How I Used Spirituality to Avoid Development, and an Unconventional Take on Spiritual Bypassing There’s a difference between believing something profound and experiencing something profound. And there’s an even bigger difference between experiencing something profound and becoming someone profound. I began engaging with spiritual ideas at a young age. It began in Catholic school, I would go to church and feel moved, sometimes to tears. I felt as if I was making contact with something beyond myself, maybe God, or maybe just an indescribable something which transcended my material life and was simultaneously full of love. When I was 15, a friend of mine who was older and cooler than me introduced me to his new religion, called Wicca. He told me about magick (as opposed to magic) as a ritualistic method of advancing ones life by harnessing universal forces. He also introduced me to the power of psychedelic drugs, and astral projection, which is the ability to consciously eject the perceiving self from the physical body. This was simply the coolest thing I ever heard of. I didn’t join his religion but I began reading, and watching videos. I tried, and failed, to astral project until I got sick of trying. I learned about nonduality, the idea that the self (the ego) is an illusion and that transcending it leads to liberation, the end of suffering. While I was learning, I was also developing a not-so-subtle feeling of superiority. I was in high school and later college, and I believed that the people around me, even my friends, were ever so slightly lesser than me, that I was wiser and more enlightened than them because I had the secret knowledge and they did not. Underneath this was, ironically, a profound sense of inferiority. I had high-achieving friends with tangible, physical plans for their lives. They wanted to be lawyers, doctors, engineers and knew the steps to accomplish their goals. And something else was developing. This was an all-consuming need to discover the ultimate answers to life, the universe and everything with rigorous research, logic and debate. This was actually the beginning of my obsessive-compulsive disorder (OCD), but that wasn’t separate from an authentic spiritual desire. Some days I would spend up to 8 or even 10 to 12 hours locked into an internal quest for certainty regarding my new spiritual knowledge. If I found someone on the internet who disagreed, often on YouTube, I would post take-downs in the comment section. When I got a notification that someone had responded to my comment, I felt terror. Had they proven me wrong and thus undermined my entire ikigai? Hours upon hours of philosophy, and a handful of weird experiences along the way led to, not enlightenment or truth, but anxiety and many, many sleepless nights. Something needed to change, not for some hypothetical goal called “enlightenment” but simply for a decent, non-neurotic relationship with life and my own mind. Before I go into the specifics of how I began to change, I want to address spiritual bypassing as a phenomenon. This is, as the title suggests, an unconventional take on spiritual bypassing. Most people who spiritually bypass don’t have Existential OCD, they aren’t spending 12 hours a day in YouTube metaphysics debates. But the core thread, of using spirituality to avoid real growth, is quite common. There are as many examples of spiritual bypassing as there are spiritual seekers, and almost every seeker does it or did it along their journey. Some other examples include the person in an unhappy relationship who uses positive psychology to gaslight themself into believing their relationship is actually helping them, or the psychedelic user who trips faster than integration can keep up, taking ever-higher doses in the hope of finally “arriving.” Surrender, Courage, Discipline, Compassion. For me, bypassing was about creating a sophisticated artifice of spiritual knowledge to avoid the discomfort of uncertainty, and with uncertainty, tangible action and development. For others it could be quite the opposite, using spiritual ideas or experiences to avoid the uncomfortable certainty life sometimes gives us. Either way there is an avoidance of reality going on, and being avoidant towards reality stalls personal development. This leads to the first virtue which has been changing my life: Surrender.

Non negotiables: 1 blog post a week 1 YouTube video a week reach out to two potential practice clients a week IMO spiral dynamics post yellow breaks down . Yellow is the peak of SD imo . Because what it calls turquoise is simply nonduality / awakening ☯️😊

These are not mutually exclusive. They may preach it from a level where they can take a Mahasamadhi anytime they feel like it, but ultimate liberation is not a lived daily experience, by choice. Which then makes you wonder why would they hang around at this dirty limited place full of suffering; perhaps there's something more important than peace and bliss. 'Somewhere else' is a distinction. Primitive nonduality can easily be turned around on itself like that. Nirvana can be had here and now, as per Buddha. As if. Death is as much in your direct experience as Jupiter. What, it's certain because everyone who ever lived died, you see people in Iran die, your pets and your parents? Weak. In your current direct experience you exist, else you wouldn't be talking to me. Existence is the only foundation you get and the only one you need, death is more fantasy. But I'm not telling you what to pursue, since in your current incarnation you're so focused on liberation and ending suffering, transcending death is probably right for you. Then perhaps after a Nayuta more karmic cycles you'll move on to cooler things. Believe it or not, I never cared much about survival and death, and that's not only because of the very favorable material conditions. In fact someone with such a spoiled childhood should by all accounts have turned out completely dysfunctional and helpless after it was all stripped away. But I constantly go around putting myself in dangerous, challenging, and painful situations, as it naturally feels like a game. There's still stakes, death can get me from behind at any time, but that's what makes it fun. Don't assume all spiritual paths are equal, they're only equal by virtue of their ultimate trajectory. And there's way higher paths than mine, such as selfless service to reality (as in the real deal like Jesus, not the nonsense they teach at Vipassana retreats) and beyond. In a way that's true. All absolutes can be relativized and reduced (an inalienable function of Authority), which can either be done from a place of ignorance or through a process of attempting to verify them via deconstruction; done correctly any deconstruction only reinforces them, that's why they're absolutes. The most intense is not Truth or Love, it's Sanctity. Verbose as I am, I have no words for it, while I could talk about the others all day long. It's infinitely more visceral than death or any emotion. And yet, Sanctity is a quality of Truth all the same, as Love and the rest. They're not even qualities per se, they literally are it. The more facets you awaken to the more you realize that God is an infinite self-luminous fractal of absolute Truth; all the additional aspects are revealed to be gems in this Indra's Net.

The beauty of nonduality is that it's available to anyone who does the work, whether they raise their consciousness a lot or not. I hate it but most people won't be able to raise their baseline by more than a few percentage points, even if they're highly disciplined with practices. But I still think a few percentage points is amazing and worth pursuing. Psychedelics can give us a glimpse of what genetic lottery winners like Ramana Maharshi are able to experience on a daily basis. Most awakened people are not Ramana's, by the way, not even close. That's why they live relatively normal lives and get involved in scandals. Peter Ralston might be approaching but not at Ramana level, a random blogger I found named Amara* might be too, I can't think of very many others. ****** I haven't gone through any of her training btw, this isn't an ad. Also she seems to have taken down the blogs where she went in depth on her state of consciousness and siddhis. *https://amarastrand.com/about/

I was like 50% green (love and light , meaningless career, hippie bum, passive vibes) and 50% yellow (obsessive map making, deep intellectual understanding of nonduality, colored by existential ocd doing metaphysics all day every day). Both of those led me to... not accomplishing very much. Oh and there was also plenty of shadow orange which made it so I wasn't okay with that, i couldn't fully accept doing nothing with my life, so I was unhappy. Haven't smoked weed in 3 days. Clearly it makes my Green passivity and my Yellow philosophical obsession worse. It's produced some genuine insights but also a lot of crap.