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Formless does not equal nothingness. Nothingness by it's very nature does not exist. As far as I can see it cannot equal awareness

How does awareness=nothingness

@Meta-Man I'm not enlightened, but I somewhat superficially make sense of it. The issue isn't that I fear death or life, my experience of self is pretty neutral. But based on your words, I'm really profoundly afraid of infinity and eternity. I guess that concern is a dualistic mindset as well. When we communicate the idea of "Nothingness", what are we talking about exactly? Is it the absence of every dual state? Being one with the whole? I understand. If there is a lack, there is already awareness. It's not really a satisfying answer though. Can awareness not be?

@Javfly33 That which you are calling form is you. You are being that. That, appears, to you. This screen for example. It is you. If the conditions are released, reality is seen as it is. You. Infinite being is not experiencing anyone. Whatever could be referenced, is itself, you, infinite being. A word you created for that which appears to you, is relative, relativity. Relativity is you - relativity is absolute. By calling it “relativity” - you are creating - the experience of - “relativity”. You, infinite nothingness, infinite unconditional love, are what is. All apparent matter, is actually, you. Nothing (you) “matters” (oscillates / vibrates / appears as “reality”). “Nothing Matters”. Short of this self recognition, “nothing matters” is saying, “I don’t matter”. When you say there are points of view, you create the experience, there are points of view.

I understand what you mean illusions within Illusions dreams within dreams. This is why I talk about nothing mattering ? Recently been studying into Ajata Sunyata... or the recognition that there's nothing from the start. Here's a little piece of it: "Advaita tells us that reality is “not two”. Ajata tells us that it is “not even one". Ajata translates as “no creation”. This means to say that nowhere has anything ever come into being. Therefore, the entire universe (or universes) — and everything therein — has no reality. In other words, the ultimate condition is nothing, or nothingness. Advaita is to ajata, as milk is to cream. In Advaita, we come to realize that “all that is, is That,” or the Absolute. Ajata is where we subsequently come to realize that there is not even That (or the Absolute). Technically, from the standpoint of ajata, even nothingness is non-existent" -- Robert Wolfe I'm really not sure if this is even what you're describing but sounded similar ? I'm not sure why anything would be a disservice though because there isn't an 'I'

1 What is enlightenment? 2 Awakening to the truth? 1 What is truth in one word? 2 Non-dual. 1 Is non-dual one word or two? 2 They are a two words that form one word. 1Is-this-one-word? 2 No. 1 Why not? 2 That's a sentence. 1 Why? 2 Because it has more than one word that conveys a message. 1 What is the truth in only one word? 2 Consciousness. 1 What is consciousness? 2 Nothing. 1 What is nothing? 2 Lack. 1 No. 2 Emptiness? 1 No. 2 Nothingness. 1 That's a redundancy. 2 Me. The answer is me. 1 Who are you? 2 What do you mean? 1 Answer the question. 2 I'm just myself. 1 What's that? 2 Whats what? 1 You. That which you are. 2 I'm still figuring myself out. 1 How? 2 I experiment try to see what feels right. 1 Examples? 2 My whole life I've been trying to find life conditions that feel right. 1 Based on what? 2 Survival. 1 Who's survival? 2 You're waiting for me to say "me" 1 Who am I? 2 Why are you asking me that? 1 Who am I? 2 Actually who are you? 1 Why are you actually? 2 What game is this? 1 Who said we are playing a game? 2 Pfft... Whatever. 1 You're losing focus. Who are you what am I and what is truth? 2 I don't know to be honest, I just create ways to try to gain an understanding of it. Science, material analasys. So forth 1 Do you conduct existence science? 2 What that? 1 When you try to create ways to grasp the truth. 2 Yeah..That's called spirituality, when you try to get enlightened. 1 What is enlightenment? 2 Only Enlightened people know. 1 Who is a people? 2 Us. 1 Who's us? 2 You and me? 1 Is US a sentence or just a word? 2 It's a word. 1 Us references a you and a me united as an us. 2 Lol that last part of what you texted me sounds like anus. 1 Pfft! 2 Hahahahaa 1 Lol. What did you first say truth was? 2 Non-dual. 1 No. 2 Why? 1 Because it's not me thats playing the game you're playing yourself! 2 Ummm. So are you like an atheist? 1 No, I believe there is just the infinate play of form we are all unique and we are all part of the non-dual nature of reality. It's like a movie but we are in the movie. An IRL movie that never ends. God goddesses any ways to describe nothingness. Doesn't do nothingness justice. I'd like to say nothing is everything and everything is nothing. It's the same. Consciousnesses is the universe, the universe itself is the play of form. Always changing. So consciousness is like the synthesis. Form the thesis and void the antithesis. If I we're to describe it in the Hegelian dialectic. I think therefore I exist is a reflection of the I- the created and personality void plays as a role as each of us in our own bodies. Is created by the thought. The mind is like the Internet bringing form out of void. An early stage, the seed or mental image. Everybody has a web domain and an IP address. Everyone has a corner of the internet to personalize. As Jesus said, what you reap, you sow. So reap good stuff to see good stuff happen. The mental content you create you add to a larger structure that is a mental prison that causes suffering in it's need to cling to it out of fear. Fear comes from lack of understanding. I do believe radical and mystical feelings of being one with everything as a whole is possible. Through mental expansion of understanding. Do your science. Life is the science of life. You are YOUR world. The flower. The mental is the seed. What is truth? 2 Us. 1 Are we non dual? 2 Yes. 1 Yes!❤

Nothing from the start... Nothing is everything... 0 is Infinite... Emptiness is fullness(pregnant nothingness)... Knowing is a trap... Unknowing is freedom... When you stamp something as known you just limited yourself... When you say I don't know you free yourself... Belief is a prison sentence... Of course the only complete freedom is that which never could be free or bound... Pure Void!!

?? Presenting to you, nothingness ?

There is no answer because there is no one here to ask a question. Question and answer = complete emptiness It's coming from nothingness and arriving at nothingness

If fear is an illusion as ACIM says, then what is illusion? Let's define illusion: Definition: Illusion is nothingness. And the definition of definition is nothingness. Isn't that circular reasoning? Not in certainty logic. In certainty logic such statement is valid. Why is there something rather than nothing? The answer is because nothingness is sameness and something is difference. This is getting pretty mind twisting. An example might be in order: Take for example the statement "2 = 2". Does this statement equal sameness? No it doesn't. Because the two numbers "2" are at different locations in space. So the belief that the statement represents sameness is an illusion. Circular reasoning is always nothingness. When we try to say that 2 equals 2 then that's circular reasoning. Hmm... The example maybe made the logic even more mind twisting, lol. Well, the idea is something like that. I will ponder it a bit more.

An Empty Answer You want me to “say more” about nothingness. Could anything be more paradoxical for the reader than to try to understand “nothing”? Why? Because most people start from the conviction that there is something which does exist; if nothing more, at least “me”. So, you will not likely appreciate nothingness unless you have come to realization through advaita. At least we will, then, begin without the assumption that a “me” really exists. But even for the realized advatin, there will almost certainly be a presumption that “something” exists in the realm of reality. Even “reality”. Advaita points to ajata, and ajata is about nothingness, or emptiness. The Diamond Sutra of Buddhism, points exclusively to it. Hui Neng, the Sixth Chinese Patriarch, declares flatly: ‘There is nothing from the start.” These sources, among others, set your foot on the path, but recognize that most people are then going to immediately be lost. I have written clearly about advaita, and several have understood what I’ve said. I have spoken, to some of these, about what lies beyond the “Absolute,” and a couple have understood. So I will try to explain it, as best I can. The “ultimate condition” (if any) is nothingness, the complete “absence” of anything—no thing, of any possible description. The (approximate) comprehension of this would be to conceive of “emptiness”, as the emptiness of which not anything could be emptied; pure unassociated emptiness, and not even an emptiness which is within some imagined boundaries. The word “void” could be applied; but this “actuality” is not void of something—in any positive sense. So the nothingness of which we speak is totally empty, free of any subtlety which could even be envisioned. Hence there is not anything “within” it that can be subject to any kind of movement, or even change. Not anything can “come from” nothingness, nor “return” to it. It is not the “origin” of anything. In fact, it could not be applicable to say that it exists, or does not exist. Thus we can’t say that this is the “beginning” condition or the “ending” condition. At best, we could say that (if it were “existent”) it would be the ever-present condition. Yet, it is not an abstraction: its presence is “eternal”. “In” its presence are supposed creatures, and the world and universe they seem to inhabit. But all of these supposed things are “in” nothingness. They have not appeared from nothingness, or out of nothingness, or because of nothingness. In fact, they have not actually “appeared”, except as nothingness. The creatures take their reality, their “existence”, for granted; and thus also the reality or existence of the world and its universe—not knowing that they are nothing. The assumption is: ‘There was a time when I didn’t exist, a time when I existed, and a time when I will no longer exist”. But there are no such times. Not anything has ever “existed”, from the standpoint of nothingness. In nothingness, there is no “time”. What makes this so difficult to understand, is that because we say that “I have existed”, we conclude that there is some thing. And indeed we look around and say there are other things, such as a world or a universe. But the presumption that there was a time when I did not exist (or do; or will not exist) is false: no arising, abiding or decaying exists in nothingness. In other words, not anything “happens” in nothingness. “We” are nothing, the “world” is nothing, the “universe” is nothing. In nothingness, there is neither existence nor nonexistence. There is only nothing. From the standpoint of nothingness, no questions can arise. We can not ask for, nor expect, an explanation: not anything ever happens, in nothingness. The value of this understanding is that not anything really matters. Even understanding this does not matter. All is emptiness. That is the “empty” answer. The scriptures speak of one who is in sahaja samadhi as having “no mind” or an “empty mind”. It is this appreciation of nothingness that is referred to.

Journal, mood: at peace meditation: none thoughts and feelings: 1) I awoke from my nap with my brain vibrating. I felt so holy. I then did a practice of appreciation and people started coming into my room. I focused on this and literal reality started to morph. It chapped before my eyes. I have never seen reality so perfect and still, yet not still. I knew at that moment this was what I was seeking my whole life. Don't get me wrong, I've been so at peace my mind stops and "this" is so so... so unexplainable. However, this was just on a whole new level. I've gone deeper down the rabbit hole. Edit: I remember watching everything perfectly fall into place. Anything someone said was so alive. A song came on "The house of the rising sun" from my moms phone and I just saw absolute perfection and alinement. This is what the seekers seek in their journey to nothingness. (I just felt like writing these words. I have no belief or attatment however the word just flowed out of me. It felt so "right" to type them. So perfect. So wonderful.) second edit: I realized why I had this knee jerk negative reaction to "this is what the seekers seek in their journey to nothingness" it felt like a pure arrogant statement even though I didn't have that intention. Dillusion, etc. I know nothing. I keep realizing that it goes deeeper and deeper.

This is right on. 100% agree/resonate with this. The thing you said with dimensions upon dimension and stuff in your post seems more to be possibilities inside of this, experiences one can have, or the natural progression of light. (I might have to read it over again). Awakening as I understand it doesn't have anything to do with the contents, it is waking up to the untouched nothingness in which the "contents" arises. Thoughts on this? There is a freshness to your insights that I really resonate with, keep them coming.

Without thoughts, ideas, imagination and beliefs there is no Universe and there is No God Consciousness. The Void means absolute Nothingness, that includes No God Consciousness as a creator creating the Everything, the All-That-Is. Is that what your really want? Is that what you really want to strive for? Is that what you want to focus your attention on for the rest of eternity? I have been given the Gift of thoughts, ideas, imaginations, beliefs, feelings and emotions, and I would rather focus my consciousness on Beingness, and Being in the moment on this wonderful creation called "life". There is no "Life" in the Void of Nothingness, just potentials, which requires, thoughts, ideas, imaginations etc., to give birth to those potentials. That is what consciouness becomes and is. Like my Father-In-Law always says… Do as you like, and live a day longer! A student sharing thoughts, ideas and beliefs!

This is a simple meditation technique that helps me to break away from sensation and thought. Set yourself up to meditate however you feel comfortable, this is not an active meditation so it is not recommended for when attention on other activities is required. Open with love and gratitude for all that is, when your mind has begun to settle start noticing all thoughts and sensations, do not go into each, just mentally accept and say "thank you" and move onto the next until you find very few objects in your mind. Eventually you will be able to say thank you to a thank you and it will propell you into deeper and deeper states until consciousness is very subtle. Stay in nothingness and rest there, if you find new mind objects arising return to thanking. Expect nothing, resist nothing. Just be. Insights can arise at this point which can be accepted gently in this delicate space. Love.

@Insightful27 Have you purchased Leo’s booklist? Read God is Nothingness and SantataGamana’s books for learning real yoga. Maybe start a blog, post whatever you’re interested in. Hope that’s useful.

No more dreaming here only Awakeness. The everything that is sought for is recognized within the nothingness that it is. Yes. Unconditional love for no one.

@Leo Gura See that there is no way of conciousness being more or less conscious of itself, when all there is is conciousness. It always knows only itself, either as a finite form or as its pure being of nothingness. God is always fully awake. It doesn't get created. If it would, there would have to be a thing like unconciousness. Unconciousness could by definition never become conscious. Conciousness is the absolut, non-dual There is no such thing like "more total levels". It's TOTAL! Yes! You cannot go deeper than the understanding that conciousness creates everything. There is nothing beyond the creation of everything, is there?

Unknowing is what was surrendered to here... There is no direction to go or not go... There is no path... you can't move towards or away from everything... There are no right or wrong's, should or should not, this over that... You can't go wrong when every option is everything... Staying put is the same as doing something... There isn't a higher power judging anything... There appears to be some kind of boundless pure potential energy but it's empty and void of any meaning or purpose... You could say this energy transcends meaning purpose value truth, but that would just be a projection of the Mind... Its THIS... and it can't be grasped by the human mind it can't be put in a box labeled and given a direction because it's everything and simultaneously an empty nothingness.. You simply can't go wrong because everything is IT!!!

@Leo Gura I acheived this enlightenment and greater from cannabis and tobbaco combined. The combination is perfect. Jump up and down notice form going up as you go down and as you go down form goes up. We are not bodies we are invisibility and nothingness pretending to be a me and a you. There is no man and no woman. Remember NONDUALITY.

When it's recognized that even the apparent mind that creates illusion is also illusion.... emptiness no thing pregnant nothingness... Boundlessness... holyshitness When Even Silence is not it.... Its......................

INSIGHT #3 (today) 40 minutes session - half of it in a meditative pose, closed eyes - half of it laying on the bed, OPEN eyes, staring at the room It seems like SIGHT and INTERNAL TOUCH (bodily sensation) are completely disconnected. We actually THINK about their connection, thus creating a false sense of connection between "image of a leg" and "sensation of a leg". Also.... what is a leg? Is it the image? is it the touch sense? It cannot be both, because those senses seem to be disconnected. One is a cinema screen (sight) , the other seems to be.... very muddy, very MYSTERIOUS. What is touch? Oh my god... after my 40 mins session I've come to a partial conclusion that touch is actually a VERY MYSTERIOUS perception, which creates some kind of energy fluctuating IN THE VOID!!!! So.... to make it more dramatic and more shocking: You see your leg, but that's just a picture, a painting of a leg, and it has NO sensations, apart from the seeing sensation. But when you think that you "feel" the internal/external touch of your leg.... that seems to be a HUGELY MYSTERIOUS UNKNOWN SENSATION. It has no correlation with the actual depiction of the leg! So.... what happens is that you USE THOUGHT to create this picture-touch complex, which doesn't exist in experience. But thought creates this kind of ghost connection between "eyesight" and "skin-feeling/internal feeling". Still I can't grasp the nature of touch... it really seems to be a random energy fluctuating in the void of nothingness ---------------------------------------------- I'll keep you updated.

@fridjonk I want to separate his teachings from him because i dont know anything about him. His teaching's orientation is what makes it less integrative than Rupert's. His drive is to 'figure out' or contemplate deeply reality. Thats literally his teaching's focus(his teachings before i made this post because after making that post i stopped watching him). He has a very sharp, pointed focus on unravelling the 'how' consciousness works. And he unravels many fragmented aspects, from love, intelligence, bliss, Moo(nothingness), and there's a drive to figure it out. Its like this huge curiosity, single focus on 'figuring it out'. If you check out other teacher's teachings, they arent so limited, and subject themselves to just this single pointed focus of deep contemplation and 'figuring things out'. There's emphasis on how to live with what you've figured out in your day to day life: work, relationships, family problems. How to practice spirituality while living life. How to embody bliss, how to constantly Be peace(in contrast to what Leo does which is, fuck embodying peace, lets go figure out what the fuck Love is, quench ya curiosity). How to constantly be compassionate in times of covid. See the focus is much more on living with mystical insight in day to day life. And generally these sort of rupert spira teachings goes beyond Leo's drive to know more and more about consciousness, its either beyond it, or its just a different orientation. Just a different focus. Leo focuses on knowing more and more, others focus on living through all aspects of life: work, relationships, blissfully, from a different perspective. Could be wrong, but people like Charlie are conflating the 2. Leo has said in a blog post that he's not a zen master but an explorer, and he said on the forum he's passion is studying God, and he wants to do that for another million years. Its clearly a different focus. A lot of sadhguru's advice actually contradicts Leo's. Sadhguru constantly emphasises not taking the path too seriously, being to enthusiastic, and single pointed focus on the path, and taking the ideas of the path too seriously, and he always reminds his audience to treat both spirituality and mundane life equally. To live mundane life to the fullest. And forget spirituality for a while here and there. Leo's the exact opposite, constantly thrusting his audience into more and more hardcore spiritual practices. And he's getting more serious. This comes at a cost: a cost of forgetting to embody, forgetting spirituality is not special, and there's a beautiful life beyond psychedelics, contemplation and non dual ideas. To live a happy life, there needs to be at least some sort of satisfaction. You can't enjoy your life having a need to search deeper and deeper into the godhead. Thats why a balance between hard core Leo/Ralstone and softcore sadhguru is good. Like you've gotta ask why does Leo just want to know more and more and more? And aint ever satisfied? Because I've certainly been in states where i was completely satisfied and felt like just basking in it and living from that place. Because Leo's drive for more is in itself a particular state, not an absolute state.

Yes absolutely there's apparently Something Happening Here and it's completely empty... a pregnant nothingness happening for No One.. Nothing will die because nothing was born. Ultimate phenomenon.... best in town ?

Thanks for sharing. I like that analogy. I had an insight while reading it. Identifying as the blank awareness as viewing everything as external, if done completely, in theory, would be identical to identifying as everything or God. Also, identifying as consciousness is identical to identical to identifying as nothingness which is identical to Everything. It always comes full circle.