Leo Gura

The 5-MeO-DMT Mega-Thread

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Is this a fact or a madness? The most important feature about the God molecule is the body pose!??

 

"If you, the reader, were to take away only one piece of advice from this entire book, it would be this: Bilateral symmetry is the key. It is the most important feature of nondual energetic therapy with psychedelics, 5-MeO-DMT or otherwise. If you are not working with bilateral symmetry, then you are not doing the actual work. It is just that simple. Anything other than bilateral symmetry is ego. This is a universal and consistent truth – no matter how big, how powerful, or how meaningful you take your experience to be – if you’re not in symmetry, you’re doing something other than the real work of nondual activation, and you are guaranteed that your ego is involved and running the show." ~ Martin Ball

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Recently discovered that a good breathing technic during the peak of a 5 meo trip takes me much much deeper instantly, find it very interesting.

Almost like to go from a middle deep trip into a very deep one (and back again if you want) just by regulate your breathing.

 

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10 minutes ago, Goodpeace said:

Is this a fact or a madness? The most important feature about the God molecule is the body pose!??

 

"If you, the reader, were to take away only one piece of advice from this entire book, it would be this: Bilateral symmetry is the key. It is the most important feature of nondual energetic therapy with psychedelics, 5-MeO-DMT or otherwise. If you are not working with bilateral symmetry, then you are not doing the actual work. It is just that simple. Anything other than bilateral symmetry is ego. This is a universal and consistent truth – no matter how big, how powerful, or how meaningful you take your experience to be – if you’re not in symmetry, you’re doing something other than the real work of nondual activation, and you are guaranteed that your ego is involved and running the show." ~ Martin Ball

There's definitely something to it. It's something that many people on here have noted, and I have to admit that my deepest psychedelic experiences have been while I was in symmetrical body positions. I do believe it's all in your head though, and that it should be possible to have deep experiences out of symmetry. For example, does it make sense that an amputee will never be able to experience deep kensho? Perhaps the key is an internal symmetry, which is easier to achieve when the body is physically symmetrical.


How to get to infinity? Divide by zero.

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2 hours ago, Goodpeace said:

Is this a fact or a madness? The most important feature about the God molecule is the body pose!??

 

"If you, the reader, were to take away only one piece of advice from this entire book, it would be this: Bilateral symmetry is the key. It is the most important feature of nondual energetic therapy with psychedelics, 5-MeO-DMT or otherwise. If you are not working with bilateral symmetry, then you are not doing the actual work. It is just that simple. Anything other than bilateral symmetry is ego. This is a universal and consistent truth – no matter how big, how powerful, or how meaningful you take your experience to be – if you’re not in symmetry, you’re doing something other than the real work of nondual activation, and you are guaranteed that your ego is involved and running the show." ~ Martin Ball

In my experience the symmetry is not relevant much.

Sure, you don't want to be all twisted up, but requiring some symmetry to realize God is ego itself.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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44 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

but requiring some symmetry to realize God is ego itself.

Or... maybe that’s just your experience with 5-MeO and other substances. Maybe many people who encounter these substances didn’t have your own purification process or maybe you just didn’t need your own process. I find bilateral symmetry to be pretty much essential because of the amount of energy, trauma, inauthenticity, etc. all locked up and that process helps me and seemingly many others as well.

Bilateral symmetry is really just a similar process to Wilhelm Reich process and his concept of orgone energy and releasing and letting out all that neuroticism, fairness, inauthenticity, lies, holding patterns, etc. Or yogic purification practices. Different looking methods. Same process. Same goal. 

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@Goodpeace In my experience symmetry is important. My deepest experiences where always in symmetry. Even some Buddhist are saying that perfect energetic body is symmetrical. 


Equanimity, Stillness, Non-Reactivity, Cessation, Emptiness, Void, Disenchantment, Nothingness

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Love, Joy, Infinite Goodness, Intelligence, Consciousness, Beauty, God, The Absolute, Divine Nature, Grace

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@Enlightenment My deepest experiences with 5-meo have come while laying down or sitting. I suppose it was symmetrical. Yet I did have one deep experience on 25mg doing yoga, which I suppose is asymmetrical.

@kieranperez The key word is *requiring*

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9 minutes ago, kieranperez said:

I don’t follow.

Requiring that symmetry is necessary to realize God is an egoic idea. Realizing God may or may not involve symmetry. It is not a requirement.

It’s like saying running 30+ miles per week is a requirement to run a marathon. It’s pretty good advice for most people, yet certainty not a requirement. A low mileage plan with lots of cross training is often sufficient. 

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3 minutes ago, Serotoninluv said:

It’s like saying running 30+ miles per week is a requirement to run a marathon. It’s pretty good advice for most people, yet certainty not a requirement. A low mileage plan with lots of cross training is often sufficient. 

Lol I’m so happy someone here speaks my language. 

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2 hours ago, kieranperez said:

Or... maybe that’s just your experience with 5-MeO and other substances. Maybe many people who encounter these substances didn’t have your own purification process or maybe you just didn’t need your own process. I find bilateral symmetry to be pretty much essential because of the amount of energy, trauma, inauthenticity, etc. all locked up and that process helps me and seemingly many others as well.

If it helps you good. But it is not required for all people as Martin likes to declare.

My point is that people have different requirements in their awakening process. It all depends on how your mind works.

If something works for you, great. But be careful declaring that it will work for everyone or have importance for everyone or be necessary for everyone or is "the one and only true way."


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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26 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

If it helps you good. But it is not required for all people as Martin likes to declare.

My point is that people have different requirements in their awakening process. It all depends on how your mind works.

If something works for you, great. But be careful declaring that it will work for everyone or have importance for everyone or be necessary for everyone or is "the one and only true way."

Yeah I guess I missed you when you critiqued the part about where he says it’s “required”. 

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@Leo Gura As a preparation for 5-meo-DMT should we explore high doses of LSD and shrooms or just take multiple medium doses and try to go deeper and deeper within that dose until we feel ready for 5-meo?

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@Rodrigo SIlva You can do a lot of work with LSD and mushrooms even without 5-MeO. Don't underestimate them.

When you want to transition to 5-MeO is all up to you. There is no rush. But be careful with high doses of LSD and mushrooms. They can get really hairy. I would stick to medium doses at most.

It's very important that you don't spook yourself off with one bad trip. A lot of newbies get spooked off because their doses are too high and they are unable to deal with the truths which are shown them. So they end up sweeping the entire field of psychedelics away under the rug. It's a form of denial.

The wisest course of action is to proceed slowly, moderately, carefully, patiently, yet persistently and methodicly. Tortoise wins the race in the end. Aim for 50 to 100 trips before you start to get the hang of psychedelics. Anything less than that is noob-land.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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Just now, Leo Gura said:

@Rodrigo SIlva You can do a lot of work with LSD and mushrooms even without 5-MeO. Don't underestimate them.

Do you think we should take high doses to really advance or can we go just as deep taking multiple 150mcg of LSD or 3g to 4g of mushrooms the proper way?

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@Rodrigo SIlva Tolerance varies from person to person.

Assuming normal tolerance, I would stay under 4g of mushrooms and under 300ug of LSD. Even those doses can be very intense and challenging on the psyche to integrate.

If I do mushrooms or LSD, I keep it at 2g and 150ug. But I'm probably unusually sensitive. Many folks would probably need to double or triple that to experience what I experience.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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20 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Rodrigo SIlva Tolerance varies from person to person.

Assuming normal tolerance, I would stay under 4g of mushrooms and under 300ug of LSD. Even those doses can be very intense and challenging on the psyche to integrate.

If I do mushrooms or LSD, I keep it at 2g and 150ug. But I'm probably unusually sensitive. Many folks would probably need to double or triple that to experience what I experience.

Yeah those doses seem pretty intense from the trip reports I read. I was thinking of getting some benzos in case of an emergency to kill the trip if I thought the experience would traumatize me and put me off psychedelics. Would this be counterproductive? What’s your take on this?

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, Rodrigo SIlva said:

Yeah those doses seem pretty intense from the trip reports I read. I was thinking of getting some benzos in case of an emergency to kill the trip if I thought the experience would traumatize me and put me off psychedelics. Would this be counterproductive? What’s your take on this?

1) Start with low doses. That's a no brainer.

2) Unless you're doing something very wrong, like suddently taking 10g of shrooms on your first trip, the "complicatedness" in the experience is always due to your own psyche, aka the substance pulls out all the dark shit in your subconscious. This is also highly dependent on your current setting. Set is slightly different because yes you wanna feel good but feeling good with several pandora's boxes in your backyard is not gonna do much overall xD Chip at it slowly and learn bit by bit.

Someone mentionned on shroomery  that the idea of using something to run away was actually in itself something that one had to learn to face within himself. That might be a great lesson to just sit down and take it because it's you realizning what's happening inside yourself.

Edited by Lynnel

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Maybe when in total absence of ego distortions the body becomes like this sand of symmetry forms of that amazing occurrence in the video. When the invisible becomes visible...

 

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15 hours ago, Rodrigo SIlva said:

 I was thinking of getting some benzos in case of an emergency to kill the trip if I thought the experience would traumatize me and put me off psychedelics. Would this be counterproductive? What’s your take on this?

I think it's a lot better to work your way up slowly like Leo said, and make sure you're comfortable with your doses as you proceed. If you're unsure if you're going to be able to handle the dose, halve it. That way you never get in over your head. Eventually you become experienced enough that you are comfortable with going further and further out. Once in a while you'll take too much, but you'll be mature enough as a psychonaut that you know how to ride it out.

Personally, I think that having benzos on hand is too easy a cop-out. If you always have the back door there waiting for you, it's too easy to run when things get hairy and you have to face something intense. 

I know a lot of people do choose to have benzos on hand, and I'm not judging that - I know that different things work for different people. Just speaking from my own experience, I'm glad to have never had an exit door because I like to commit 100% to the trip.


How to get to infinity? Divide by zero.

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