Javfly33

The past really existed

25 posts in this topic

The past is truth.

I Dont agree with Leo saying "you are imagining there was a past" or "you are imagining you went to School".

Of course i did. Other thing is that the School building, my childhood Friends, and my parents Cars were imagined by me. But they really existed (i did imagined them).

Of course they existed in the NOW, But they did existed. So the past is truth.

This is a different story from the "does the city exist when you are at your home mountain retreat? No because the present moment is all that exists. The present moment is God and IS me. If right now Im seeing a chair and a mountain, thats all that The universe is right now. There is no city right now existing anywhere.

But on the other Hand there was at one point a city. Because the past existed.

 


A thought can´t ever tell you how you feel.

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The you which agree’s or not is imaged as the imagining there is that which you agrees or not, with. An image taken to be real, on the back of the subtle believing of, two. There is never that which thoughts point to. Just a hijacking of your own efforts, again, and again, and again. 


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There is no such thing as anything. You are literally imagining there was something in the past. What Leo is pointing to is not your interpretation of what Leo is pointing to. 

If we look at a rock, we think “there’s an enduring, consistent, static object there.” Actually though, when we train our minds to examine direct experience at microscopic resolutions of time, ie moment by moment arising and passing at the smallest possible scale, we can directly observe that there is no such thing as an object called a “rock.” The “rock” is expanding and contracting out of reality moment by moment, the form of this apparent object is going through a rapid death rebirth process which gives the illusion of continuity, consistency, and static objectivity. Truly, there is only a rapid flux of anicca, impermanence, happening at literally un-imaginable speeds. There was never such a thing as a rock, only the mind projecting the illusion of objectivity, consistency, and continuity over this dancing,  effervescent, morphing coagulation of form through the existential assumptions of time and space as well as the super imposition of memory on-top of perceptive experience. In fact, even creating the distinction within perception “rock” is attention creating an illusory separation from the whole of our direct experience. There is and only ever was one unified field. The rock is imaginary on ALL accounts. 

Like the rock, so to is this past. It is a complex matrix of mind imposing itself into and onto direct experience, which then shapes our present experience of life and the many beliefs, behaviors, and emotions we unconsciously create. The past is no more real than a child’s imagination. The past, future, life, death, self are all pure imagination in action. Tapping into this imaginative quality begins to open one up to the intrinsically beautiful and magical qualities of reality. 

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we cannot see the past except for within our minds. There is no physical past or future that we can touch and/or interact with so it doesn't exist. In the present, be it silently or consciously consider all 3. It is a way we make a picture of the world. They exist as reflections of the present as the past is what composed the present. The present can only be in existence with this contradictory thing that is the past. I call it contradictory, as it is not physically there, yet it is the only way the present can exist. So this thing that used to exist is the past. This means that the past is the present, only that the present is the manifestation of the combination of 'pasts' which each in and of themselves are in the billions upon trillions upon quadrillions of frames in each millisecond. We could go into how anything can move in a moment at all though I would rather not.

The future is the present since the future is composed of the present. We live in what forms it and also, the future is undetermined by the human mind. It is determined to happen by a preset number of causes, but we do not know exactly what will happen. Nonetheless, despite it being unknown, the future doesn't exist. It will exist, although it doesn't, as it has yet to occur. This means that it can only exist in the present as a figment of our imagination. 


I live my life in a dream; the constant threat of a rude awakening keeps me on my toes.
-Mettley Zimmer

 

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the past is a construction of your mind, since .... the present is another construction of your mind, unless you are in a mindless state, pure empty consciousness, then it will not be past since it will be all the same. To remember something, you have to give it meaning, and that is what the mind does. it shapes, limits, encapsulates the present moment, and thus can be classified in memory. and so you create the world. the whole world is a mental creation

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2 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

If right now Im seeing a chair and a mountain, thats all that The universe is right now.

that is exacly the point of saying "past is emagined", meaning that the "past" is simply a present experience thought to have happened in a "before".

I have the feeling that you enjoy too much getting lost in mental masturbation, bewere.
 

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@Javfly33 The past is truth, but what we know of it comes only through artifacts that exist in the present. Our view on the past is continuously updated and revised, as new knowledge about the past is revealed. But ultimately it is looking at clues in the here and now which tell us. The past is not a certainty, it is just a shadow. 


“Nowhere is it writ that anthropoid apes should understand reality.” - Terence McKenna

 

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Posted (edited)

Funny thread, the past is not.

The past was.

The word "was" indicates an existent property in something which itself can not contain nor be contained in.

Therefore the word does not satisfy itself, and is ultimately ideal.

If you think it satisfy itself for there can be no other thing satisfying it and some entity MUST do it then you think it is real.

 

Both are absurd, and amounts to the very silly assumptions our minds are not 'meant' to surpass, as belief in the one can only be negated by the other and only as such followed by the other whereby the first once more can be believed meaning you will only truly grasp one at present though believing you synthesized them by holding both at independent times.

If there were a pandemic going on in certain circles, well that would be it. The only thing there is is now, does not mean the past weren't neither does it mean the past were. Uncertainty, deal with it. 

The idea is that there is a higher truth, a metaphysics which accounts for the past. You can not know there is such a thing, you can believe in "it".

 

I would suggest focusing on what can be known and what can be inferred from there by faculties concerning necessity as opposed to conclusions on assumed premises. It is actually possible to tear away most if not all of these assumptions, detoxication. Focus on stripping yourself of what is harmful before you listen to content after content reflecting NOTHING MORE then what you assume to be valuable.

edit: And don't assume this either, if the maxim is not immediately present or contingent on necessity alone, it is assumed.

Edited by Reciprocality

“Reason is, and ought only to be the slave of the passions.”
― David Hume

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I am sitting on my bed and whatever that exist infront of me now is real. all other thing is imagination. 5 mins later I am in my kitchen whatever that exist infront of me is real everything else is imagined from this now, that includes all things i saw when i was on bed 5 mins ago.


I will be waiting here, For your silence to break, For your soul to shake,              For your love to wake! Rumi

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Believing the past is real could build us a time machine. Just a random thought. 

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To the ones who believe the past never existed, how do you know if the process of imagination doesn't include imagination of the past?

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Posted (edited)

20 hours ago, Javfly33 said:

The past is truth.

I Dont agree with Leo saying "you are imagining there was a past" or "you are imagining you went to School".

Of course i did. Other thing is that the School building, my childhood Friends, and my parents Cars were imagined by me. But they really existed (i did imagined them).

Of course they existed in the NOW, But they did existed. So the past is truth.

This is a different story from the "does the city exist when you are at your home mountain retreat? No because the present moment is all that exists. The present moment is God and IS me. If right now Im seeing a chair and a mountain, thats all that The universe is right now. There is no city right now existing anywhere.

But on the other Hand there was at one point a city. Because the past existed.

There's no such thing as a past or a future. When you read a book, do you assume the prior pages cease to exist or that the future ones do not yet exist? See, all time is, is the experiencing of an already-written book in linear fashion.

Past pages is only a reality from the point of view of the reader going through the book linearly. If all pages are superimposed on top of each other into one single page, there's no such thing.

See going to school isn't something that existeD, it's something that existS. NOW. It is right now. It is the finite mind that sees it as a past etc because the finite mind is localized inside spacetime.

Edited by RMQualtrough

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@RMQualtrough  That's just being pedantic. From our perspective, everything exists "now", but when we say the past existed, we are implying that there is a holon somewhere that might experience whatever is written in the history book.

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@nuwu It's not pedantry. The past is only a thing from the perspective of the finite self. If you are talking about the Absolute, there is no such thing as linear time from that PoV, which is what Leo means.

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Posted (edited)

@Javfly33 'real' and 'imagined' are the same thing.   The past 'really exists' now, because it imaginarily exists now. 

real/imaginary is a duality that can be transcended to Real, with a capital R.  (or Imaginary, with a capital I, but it's the same as Real) 

Is this forum 'real' or 'imaginary'?   This is like asking if you want 6 donuts, or half a dozen.  

Edited by Mason Riggle

"I could be the walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off people."

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Posted (edited)

@Javfly33

It's all just patterns (all in all though this is of course just me biting on the bait hard here, what can I say, I have a soft spot for creating comments of art). You see a pattern which you verify through various means, if you don't know those means you're a doctor with a medical degree that doesn't try alternative medicine (i.e. me), instead you say "hey I have a degree that taught me that we shouldn't/should act this way in this procedure" even though medicine has moved on from the past and developed something better, perhaps because its learned about and incorporated some alternative medicine to boot. I am your alternative medicine right now. Inject me. I am like the rush one gets from snorting cocaine though sometimes so I warn you.

You've just read a string of patterns that performed together to generate meaning in your mind who's underlying mechanics that you take for granted so much that you've created a stance of absoluteness in relation to them as opposed to fluidity because you see the inherent strengths and weaknesses. Reality is here between every blink but is our projection on that reality from before blink to blink, slide to slide the same or are we merely doing a dance with some thoughts about that reality that exists? Take a look around the physical space you presently inhabit, inspect everything, now was that there before you inspected it? Most likely. But you didn't notice it until now so how can you verify that it was there? You've made a prediction about your environment that you can verify through various means, but its a prediction that you test its not some thought you logically create an absolute about. The absoluteness is logically bound itself. That's where you've got to unstick yourself, otherwise you'll be stuck driving around that same formula 1 race track of reality in a golf buggy being outperformed by Mr. Bean driving backwards after he stole the three wheeler that he always physically disses.

You don't exist, you repeatedly exist (aka read back about what I said regarding patterns). But if I ask you to look around at your awareness with your awareness just like I asked you to look around your present physical space, you'll notice different aspects of yourself, parts of you that probably felt it was a waste of time to even pose a statement on this site, parts that are thoughts contained by various identity functions that you're barely cognisant of let alone gaming to the point that you're constantly evolving through the immensity of understanding and awareness you have through that understanding (something that I'm actively in the pursuit of by the way). So what part of you posed the question? What do you like about that part/s and what do you not like about it? What do you like/dislike about the parts that formed the answers to the previous question? See there's various levels of awareness that we barely allow ourselves to become conscious of because we never stopped to realise just how far society is when it comes to self awareness and therefore the degrees of self evolution we need to make here : and I haven't even spoken about intuition here: Haha John Edward speaking to my dead grandfather where are you when I need you?

All in all, our whole conceptualisation of time requires unification. You're just running on outdated software, think of it as an outdated anti-virus system to navigate the complexities of reality. To be practical, go for it, to be nuanced, allow your consciousness to entertain other explorations without the need for an immediate answer. Donald Trump never built the wall, remember that. Our brain says a lot of things that aren't always true even though we want them to be, we have to learn to slice things up and create our own incrementally more sophisticated answers so we're questioning our own estimations of reality rather than wondering about what other people think, let them make their mistakes and guide them where you can, you don't have to argue with their gospel though.

Now do you remember how I started this comment or do you need to go back and read what I said? Does the past exist? Well, you probably just forgot at least half a chunk of what you just read. This is all memory, memory rearrangement, generation and rehearsal tied to a deeper reality some of us are still working to understand the greater nature of. Think of it like Tupac never died. We can be so wrong about things. Verify for yourself, verify for yourself, don't try to argue for the collective when you don't have any self derived comprehension of reality otherwise I'm just watching in the form of reading some SNL episode of Sarah Palin; a press conference on whether the past exists... Oh boy this will be good. This is where I need Michael Jackson to do the moonwalk for me.

 

R.I.P Michael Jackson.

 

Otherwise here's a list of rapper deaths and how most of them were murdered:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_murdered_hip_hop_musicians

 

My guess is that most of the murderers were left brained thinkers:

giphy.gif

 

 

Edited by ll Ontology ll

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On 7/13/2021 at 5:57 AM, Javfly33 said:

The past is truth.

I Dont agree with Leo saying "you are imagining there was a past" or "you are imagining you went to School".

Of course i did. Other thing is that the School building, my childhood Friends, and my parents Cars were imagined by me. But they really existed (i did imagined them).

Of course they existed in the NOW, But they did existed. So the past is truth.

This is a different story from the "does the city exist when you are at your home mountain retreat? No because the present moment is all that exists. The present moment is God and IS me. If right now Im seeing a chair and a mountain, thats all that The universe is right now. There is no city right now existing anywhere.

But on the other Hand there was at one point a city. Because the past existed.

 

Right. 

Existence is a semantically tricky word. Everyone here just want's to make sure you see it from their point of view... Because they have it totally figured out and decided themselves qualified to teach. 

But the fact is, their point of view means nothing and is nothing. It's just a point that is viewing something and wanting to be seen. An incomplete summation. Every post here is from the past. Even this one. Traveling through time to meet you... Even if that illusory word is only a construct... It's how we communicate certain phenomenon. Even when they use absolute statements to protect their gentle psychosis, they can't escape what is. 

Life exists in identity as well as without. Distinction was created with a purpose. Try as they may, they won't explain away what you're saying. Maybe they just want to protect you from the attachments that come with the past. 

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Try think of it this way. For there to have been a past. There also needed to be the now prior to that past event in where it all took place. If the past is the picture you remembered. The now was the and is the canvas onto where the past exist.


The absolute truth of thought dwells in it's own absence.

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3 hours ago, Nahm said:

If existence existed, what’s existence?

@Nahm 🤔🤯


A thought can´t ever tell you how you feel.

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