Leo Gura

Getting My Covid Vaccine

301 posts in this topic

11 minutes ago, Cocolove said:

Hard to sort through anti-vax concerns, most of it is nonsense, but obviously there is some (probably low and less than covid itself) risk. 

So, are you not concerned that these pharmaceutical companies are not liable for any negative effects while they have a past of knowingly not stopping drugs that do have negative effects for money?

https://edition.cnn.com/2009/BUSINESS/09/02/Pfizer.fine/index.html

 

Yea, pharmaceuticals are a mixture of bad and good. It can be difficult to sort out. 

Developing drugs that people take daily is very different than developing a vaccine. There is very little profit motive in vaccine development. The federal government has already paid and continues to pay the pharmaceutical companies. Currently, biotch is in a great position. They are making huge profits, with virtually no risk. This is very different than if stockholders were investing into the development of new heart medication.

As well, biotech is under a social microscope. If they are caught doing shabby or unethical work, there would be a big price to pay. Covid vaccine development is a case in which competition can be a good thing. 

As well, there is always inherent risk. Even if pharmaceuticals are 100% altruistic, there will still be some negative side effects. If we expect a pharmaceutical to develop a 100% perfect vaccine, it will never happen. It would be like demanding a doctor be 100% perfect are they are liable. If that is the standard, say goodbye to doctors - even the best doctors that are 100% altruistic doing their best job.

The question is what is our threshold of negligence and malpractice? For the case of covid, I would say the threshold would be gross negligence / unethical behavior of pharmaceuticals. For example, if a biotech got caught hiding data about negative effects of the vaccine, they should be held accountable for that. 

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@Forestluv Very well said 

 

Also, I have very bad seasonal allergies, which makes me worry about anything to do with meddling with my immune system. From my research I don't see any way the covid vaccine could cause harm to my tree and ragweed pollen allergies. Leo is getting it while having hashimotos, he also seems not worried about this.

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Had to cancel my appointment. Was not feeling well for other reasons. I will reschedule it once my SIBO is more healed.

I decided it is not a good idea to introduce extra variables into my healing experiments right now.

I will let you know when I get it.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

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@Leo Gura @Leo Gura good decision.  

I hope the covid situation is not too bad whichever city you're living. 

 

 


INTP loner..... Live a Roman.  Die a Roman...... Nothing else but to enjoy  the rest of my dream. Love it. (I'm more Roman than you'll ever be ) only guys with zero ego and zero passive aggressive can talk to me, rest need not bother 

Preety preety

 

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I received my second Moderna shot yesterday. I haven't experienced any side effects from either shot.

@Fishmonk When considering extreme side effects, also consider frequency. I could post an image of someone having a severe anaphylaxis response to a bee sting. Yet it would be a distortion to present it as common. Only about 1 in 1 million people would have a response. If people believed it was common, they would have an irrational fear of bees and run away from bees. Similarly, only about 1 in 1 million people have a severe reaction to the vaccine. So in a large city of 10 million people, only about 10 people would have a severe response. Yet if we posted pictures of those 10 people as representative of the vaccine, it will create irrational fear. 

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@Fishmonk What you do is called fearmongering. There are individual cases where the various vaccines have led to rather serious health issues but most people are fine. We don't really have any other option here. Either you cooperate and take the vaccine or you don't (which is also fine if you have good reasons), but if you decide to do the latter, at least do it without spreading overly generalized, incidental, flashy news which scare people into not getting the shot. 


"Love is all that I can give to you ❤ Love is more than just a game for two!"

 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JErVP6xLZwg 

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18 minutes ago, Fishmonk said:

@Tim R @Forestluv  

I'm here to present alternative sources of information, if people take the vaccine without considering alternative sources - that is ignorance, not fear mongering.

The fear mongering is not the information, it is how the information is presented.

Imagine someone considering medication and the doctor shows them gruesome photos of side effect and then says "This is what happens when someone takes the medication". It is implicit that this is a common reaction. Leaving out the part that only 1 in 1 million people have this reaction is fear mongering. It is not "presenting alternative sources of information".

The J and J issue was about 1 in 1 million people have serious side effects. That is extremely rare. It is important to have that information. Otherwise, it is fear mongering. 

Yes, there are serious side effects. Yet 1 in 1 million means that the medication is safe. A 1 in 1 million chance is MUCH lower than being in an airplane crash. 

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26 minutes ago, Fishmonk said:

@Forestluv

I will say it again, I have spoken and listened to doctors in regards of this specific COVID-19 vaccine. It takes an average of 10 years to develop a vaccine in the industry. It took 10 months to develop this.

Yes the vaccine development was accelerated, yet that doesn't mean it's less safe than other vaccines. mRNA vaccines could be SAFER than traditional vaccines. Or it could be about the same or less safe. 

The data so far indicate the incidence of serious short-term side effects is very small. About 1 in 1 million people. That is a safe vaccine. How safe do you want? A 1 in 1 million risk is extremely low. It is MUCH lower than the risk of driving, having sex, eating etc. More people get serious side effects from eating than the vaccine! I could post lots of photos of people that got seriously ill from food poisoning and say "Look!! Eating food is dangerous!!". Yet that is a distortion because very few people get food poisoning in developed countries. 

Speculation about long-term negative effects is speculation. There is no reason to believe there will be long-term side effects. 

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3 minutes ago, Fishmonk said:

@Forestluv Where do you get this data 1 in 1 million from? Exactly. 

Rough estimate. For example in the U.S., over 6 million doses of J and J vaccine was given and 6 people had serious side effects. 6 million people is a huge sample size. 

Yet it’s true that vaccines alter immune system activity and there a small percentage of people in grey areas of immune disorders that have a bad reaction. Someone could be on the edge of a autoimmune disorder and not even know it. The vaccine could push them over the edge and cause problems. Yet it’s important to note that these are rare occurrences. 

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More deaths were caused by halting the J & J vaccine than caused by the vaccine itself. It's ridiculous

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1 minute ago, Frylock said:

More deaths were caused by halting the J & J vaccine than caused by the vaccine itself. It's ridiculous

It was a PR disaster. 1 in a million people got blood clots, they pull it and the public freaks out it was dangerous. 

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@Fishmonk I’m not denying that there can be serious side effects. I’m saying they are RARE. You haven’t shown any data that serious side effects are common. Show me data that more than 1 in 10,000 people have serious side effects. Even then, that would mean the vaccine is 99.99% safe. How safe do you want it? Nothing in life is 100% safe.

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@Fishmonk Please don’t spread stuff like becoming vegan will eradicate the coronavirus. That the virus is punishment for eating meat. That type of thing is against forum guidelines.

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