beastcookie

Will enlightenment eradicate addiction? (Ibogaine)

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From studying the 12 step program and IFS therapy I think addiction is related to a subconscious existential dread and the creation of a false self. So enlightenment could theoretically end that by unwiring a false self and eliminating the existential dread because you'd lose your fear of death. But you could get addicted for other reasons, like simply just the pleasure.

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3 minutes ago, Raze said:

From studying the 12 step program and IFS therapy I think addiction is related to a subconscious existential dread and the creation of a false self. So enlightenment could theoretically end that by unwiring a false self and eliminating the existential dread because you'd lose your fear of death. But you could get addicted for other reasons, like simply just the pleasure.

So, addiction is always there, only the things we get addicted to changes?

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1 hour ago, An young being said:

Your addiction is necessary because it helps you to maintain your body in a good condition. Anything not necessary for survival, it can be neglected, right? ( If it is a hindrance to joy, of course)

Heroine isn't a hindrance to joy I'd say. I bet it's the opposite=D

My addictions isn't necessary. Breathing and eating food isn't necessary. Nothing is ultimately necessary. 

If I want to continue living in this avatar of waveintheocean, sure, breathing is necessary. 

Do I want to continue living? Yes.

As a matter of fact, it often even doesn't feel like I have a choice or like it is something I do.

Just like breathing.


Can you bite your own teeth?  --  “What a caterpillar calls the end of the world we call a butterfly.

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@LfcCharlie4 I think you're making very good points here. Even when the I-thought is literally absent, there can be a tendency which will still happen. So these things need to be adressed. 

But there is also another point, which is very subtle but important: When we talk about what we're doing here, it's not really only awakening. Most of us (I hope) don't see an end point. We are embarking on the endless journey of maturation as a Godly being, whatever that means. There is naturally also personal transformation that is necessary. We are even a personal vessel for God, even though we are not identified with it. And that will have to be worked through. Awakening(s) are very specific insights into the nature of reality. They don't magically erase everything else. 

So when some speak about awakening, they mean the whole thing: maturation, fulfilling our full purpose. Others really only mean enlightenment. Looking at teachers, I see a clear correspondence between this complete view of the work and how the teacher is embodying it.

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From my point of view, when ur basic biological needs are met and connectedness with your inner self the less impulsive behaviors occur. For example, a few years ago I had a goal to loss fat.. I was on a very strict diet and sometimes in the night I was magnetized to the refrigerator and binge eating. I wasn’t in control it was harder than me. I thought that it was an addiction and in one eyes it could look like but after overcoming it I can say that something was just missing..Self Love. 

Hope it helps❤️

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@peanutspathtotruth I agree, to me overcoming addictions is simply part of integration which I class as 'part of the process' as you say, there is no end point, it is a forever deepening and maturation exploration. 

I would certainly say there is an end to seeking, but in terms of deepening that never ends, how could it? 

I couldn't agree more with what you have said, awakening is simply like being reborn, not the end of the path. :)

@Nahm So, say an addict comes to you, would you recommend them deal with their addictions pre or post awakening, or as part of the awakening process? 


'One is always in the absolute state, knowingly or unknowingly for that is all there is.' Francis Lucille. 

'Peace and Happiness are inherent in Consciousness.' Rupert Spira 

“Your own Self-Realization is the greatest service you can render the world.” Ramana Maharshi

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Yes it will. Anything less than that is not enlightenment. Realizing the present moment is not enlightenment. If it was, we would not have a difficult time trying to become enlightened. This modern advaita version of enlightenment mixed with shadow work ideas is not the real deal. Enlightenment is a state of consciousness that is achieved by working towards it. A lot of people think that they are enlightened when they're not. They only have realized the present moment, if even that. But that's called no-mind and it's not it. It's just one minor step towards the real thing. The mind must eventually be integrated into one's life in order to become enlightened.


If you have no confidence in yourself, you are twice defeated in the race of life. But with confidence you have won, even before you start.” -- Marcus Garvey

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@beastcookie I drink one cup of self-made cappuccino per day and not going to give it up any time soon, that's the same practice for me as meditation, Wim Hof breathing or cold shower. I feel amazing when I cook and drink my big cup of cappuchino.

It's not about what you do, it's about how you feel about it.

If drinking alcohol is your thing and you feel amazing about it, no enlightenment will help you to drop it and why? If you feel amazing :D 

It's all related to NEED vs WANT.

If you're doing it out of WANT, out of gratitude to the current moment, with understanding that you're every thing - it's All good





NOW.

 

Edited by dimitri

What a dream, what a joke, love it   :x

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I think it's rather the other way around, the less addictions you have the closer you are to enlightenment. 

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Honestly, I'm not sure myself -- I don't have enough of a medical research background to give an authoritative answer.   The subject is too complicated.  My sense is that if you really want to kick a habit, you can do it, but not everyone wants to, and some people are stuck with the genetic predispositions to certain things that easily tip them in that direction. Nicotine appears to be especially hard for some people, even after ibogaine. After LOC 1000 you can heal certain underlying emotional issues that can cause compulsions, so at least theoretically you can drop some habits if you want to.  I'll let you know in 3-4 years. :)

Edited by Haumea2018

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On 7/6/2020 at 8:13 PM, Raptorsin7 said:

@LfcCharlie4 Would you say it's easier to deal with addictions and stuff like that post awakening?

100%.

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6 hours ago, Haumea2018 said:

Honestly, I'm not sure myself -- I don't have enough of a medical research background to give an authoritative answer.   The subject is too complicated.  My sense is that if you really want to kick a habit, you can do it, but not everyone wants to, and some people are stuck with the genetic predispositions to certain things that easily tip them in that direction. Nicotine appears to be especially hard for some people, even after ibogaine. After LOC 1000 you can heal certain underlying emotional issues that can cause compulsions, so at least theoretically you can drop some habits if you want to.  I'll let you know in 3-4 years. :)


This is it I think, I feel habits can last long after the realisation unless the particular behaviour issue and causes are addressed, and many may not want to give up coffee/ food/ nicotine etc, and may not see it as detrimental so that’s always another factor! 
 

Nisgardatta Maharaj is the obvious example, he chain smoked like a chimney. 


'One is always in the absolute state, knowingly or unknowingly for that is all there is.' Francis Lucille. 

'Peace and Happiness are inherent in Consciousness.' Rupert Spira 

“Your own Self-Realization is the greatest service you can render the world.” Ramana Maharshi

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The loop of addiction is the lesson as well, it's there to notice it. When you understand this loop you will be able to solve it, or maybe realize there is nothing to solve :) Addictions are a lot to learn from, like if you overdose anything it has long term consequences, but it becomes medicine in the right dosage, only poison in the wrong. I mean for endless cases the thing hooking us up is literally too good so we overuse it.

Edited by Litaken

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Addiction has physical components and psychological components. Enlightenment will get rid of the psychological components because they're self created within the mind. Enlightenment gives you freedom from anything that is self created by the mind, anything that is only real within the mind. The physical components remain. But I will say this, when the psychological components are gone, handling the physical components becomes trivial. Like retraining a dog who's 100% ready to be retrained.

Edited by LovingYou

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