Enlightened people who acts a bit unethical. Why is that?

[Monkey-man]

So the question is Why there are enlightened people with decades of enlightened life behind who still acts a bit unethical, such as committing things which are considered as wrongdoings or forbidden from religious/God perspective. In other words, people who sees reality in its actuality, with awakened eyes, soul, consciousness, heart, divine nature, who are full of bliss, love and interested in self-development, knowledge, growth, eternity, but who still neglect idea that you have to believe in existence of absolute yet very simple categories of forbidden and allowed, things which you shouldn't do and which you must do. Belief in existence of sins, misbehaviour, disobedience? Such as you shouldn't swear (use bad language). How does awakened nature allows them to do that?

In video below enlightened master uses bad word (even though only one time during interview). And I am not judging him or anything or playing moralism. And I don't want to gossip about him, or to say that I am better than such actions (I am not), I am simply trying to make sense of the case above using this video as one example. Nothing against the person per se. Even he does it only once here and its not a big deal, but isn't he is so full of compassion and wisdom and righteousness? So how does it make possible for this to happen?

In other words, what is the reason for highly awakened sage kind of people to do things that are normally considered as unjust or wrong? 

OR, why we as adults are tempted into thinking that there are no absolute categories of wrongdoing/forbidden? Meanwhile only such categories bring meaning and justification, justice to reality. Otherwise, its all one, and it doesn't matter what you do. You have animal body and corrupt mind and unjust world around you, so why you should believe in simple ideals that you once used to have as a little naive kid before you started to see corruption of higher authorities such as your parents and hence neglect absolute categories?

I just want to have some understanding regarding these questions. Understanding regarding

1) why enlightened people with total clarity of perception and big conscious hearts can act unethically. and

2) what make us not to desire to believe that God forbids you to behave in certain ways. Coz clearly we don't want to believe that let's say you shouldn't do this and you shouldn't do that. We simply don't want that. What exactly makes us rebellious? Its not a question of good and evil, because they are relative and only God knows about them, but it is the question of believing in existence of categories such as legal and illegal or just and unjust or forbidden and allowed which are defined by highest authority hence absolute and not relative (while good and evil are defined by ourselves).

Let's not discuss ethics, morals, good and evil per se, but lets discuss reasons of why things are these way.

Thank you

Edited March 4, 2019 by Monkey-man

[Dumb Enlightened]

I'll give you a quote and I suggest you to read the whole book, you have a wrong idea about what is enlightenment
"In terms of enlightenment it doesn't matter much if she meditates or not, or whether she eats meat or not, or whether she gives to charities or steals from them" SPIRITUAL ENLIGHTENMENT The Damnedest Thing - Jed McKenna

[AstralProjection]

The reason why is that enlightenment doesn't mean you are inherently good or inherently bad. Enlightened people still have to learn from the external world through trial and error. The Buddha didn't know the scientific method upon enlightenment but he did come close to it. People that are enlightened can be delusional for somethings. That is why they must ground their mind in the science of the external world too for optimal results. There is an internal subjective science of meditation and an external science of the psychical world. Meditation is the tool of the subjective science, and the microscope and telescope are the tools of the objective science. Both serve their own purposes and both have pros and cons.

Edited March 4, 2019 by AstralProjection

[EvilAngel]

I would just ignore Peter Ralston. I don't like his moustache, his stupid false teeth, false smile, or the way he moves. I don't think he's enlightened I think he's a charlatan.

[Highest]

Only God is, only God is the doer. Who is this ‘’me’’ that does wrong and right, good and bad? How can God judge you when it knows ‘’You’’ don’t exist, when it knows it is you and everything, and does every act?

[Tony 845]

@Monkey-man I’ve heard there different levels to enlightenment, from what I’ve heard it’s a deep rabbit hole, not a one shot deal. People have different backgrounds & cultures also that could play into this. 

[Shin]

You just become aware of what reality is.

If anything, it could make you even more of an ass, because you usually awaken on the level of the mind first.

So there is the sense of being in a dream without the divine love of the awakening of the heart.

From what I read, most people stay stuck there, so they become zen devil, especially if they never took the purification process seriously before.

Even if you awaken fully, there is still cultural baggage, and what is seen as normal in one country, can be seen as evil in the one next to it.

[Joseph Maynor]

Anybody can get triggered into the unenlightened Ego-Mind under the right circumstances.  That's why we need to be forgiving (within reason).

Edited March 5, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[tsuki]

10 hours ago, Monkey-man said:

In other words, what is the reason for highly awakened sage kind of people to do things that are normally considered as unjust or wrong? 

Reasons lie within the realm of ego. When you talk about highly awakened people, you may refer to:

• Ones that abide in eternal ego death. Blank mind.
  Those 'people' have no reasons whatsoever and interpreting their actions through this lens is nonsensical in my opinion.
• Ones that developed the ability to see through the egoic mind while retaining it.
  This ability can be used to put your self-refinement on overdrive, but it also means that you are still egoic and prone to errors. 

I have a hunch that Peter Ralston is in the second category.

[AlwaysBeNice]

Well one reason could be that developed enlightened people could be quite good at guiding people through a mental breakdown, that they may think is helpful, so they might trigger it on purpose. But that's risky I think for anyone at any time.

But enlightenment is beyond the personal realm ultimately I belief, who decides what is wrong and right, it's ultimately not real is it? But enlightened people should be beyond 'hate' or judgement, as real, it may arise for a bit, but it doesn't really make sense, or is really real.

But as long as we have our own preferences and relate to others, we should act the best possible, surely applied understanding and compassion is very powerful, helpful and good, it's the highest happiness. 

Edited March 5, 2019 by AlwaysBeNice

[Aaron p]

It's all fun sure isint it. Who knows why those guys don't live strict moral lifes. At the end of the day, enlightenment doesn't change anything. At the start I thought spirituality was going to help my mind, I don't think that is the case anymore. However I do think that enlightenment will kill me, so that god can rise from these bones. I'm ok with that. Moral or not, God's presence reigns eternally.

[Hellspeed]

Morality and Ethics are just human conventions that change over time. Awakening is beyond that. Let's not confuse conventions with Enlightenment, even the extreme of taking a life is still justified in the natural plane, that does not mean you should do it, simply means reality does not care, is not lower vibration, in fact is the highest. So the conventions kicks in human minds, not because they are born that way, is because society was like that long time ago, now you choose to be hunted down or not, intelligence comes in place now, rather than morality and ethics. 

The purely moral and ethical human being will never Awakened, because he is afraid of even thinking of doing evil things, and if he does he goes to repression mode. 

[Markus]

@Monkey-man Being in a non-dual state doesn't mean much. You can experience or "be conscious of" nothingness, unity, god, whatever. However. Your mind is conditioned. You have plenty of karma. Even people who've had the changes in perception that get called enlightenment can have plenty of psychological issues. You may say everything is one, or see it to some extent, but your behaviour can still be self-serving in many ways. Purification doesn't just happen with an enlightenment experience, or spending time in a non-dual state. It is a long process requiring a certain drive and openness. You can reach a non-dual state and close off, pretend everything is perfect and that you have no flaws, and that there's nothing more to do, remaining stuck like that indefinitely.

[mandyjw]

Why does it bother you? Not just being smart, just interested in the answer. 

[FoxFoxFox]

Quote

Enlightened people who acts a bit unethical. Why is that?

Because God's not judgmental.