AncestorOfAisle6

The Controversial Guru Who Wants to 'Upgrade Civilization'

63 posts in this topic

This just came in my feed and I thought it was very interesting because of leo's cult video's.

Here's a guy that seems to have had genuine enlightenment experiences, but I would guess is orange/green on the spiral. 
I think he comes of as a mix of Ruper spira/Adyashanti mixed with a fratboy and a little Alex Jones there too. 

What do you guys think, Osho in the making?

 

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wow that reminds me of osho so much

I hope they can sort the wheat (genuinely good teachings) from the chaff (what made rajneeshes go bad)

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@AncestorOfAisle6 Yes, we know of him. He seems quite culty (although also genuinely enlightened). Not much new under the sun.

Pathological enlightenment is much more common than people assume.

Like I said, watch out for young gurus especially. They are prone to be Zen Devils.

Upgrading society is good. The problem is, it's much harder to do than almost anyone realizes. Good intentions, pleasant words, and even enlightenment is not enough. It takes conscious leadership and a degree of self-mastery which very few people have.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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It's ok to want to help things, but make sure that is coming from a very pure place.  The Ego-Mind can chase saving the world too in order to aggrandize itself, which defeats your Enlightenment Work and your happiness.  The truth is, nothing you do in the world matters more than the quality of your being right now.  You shouldn't need to do anything more than being.  If you do need more, that should be examined as a deficiency need.  The Ego-Mind takes Enlightenment and turns it on its ear to make it something for the Ego -- when in fact what Enlightenment allows is a cease to that kind of seeking, that kind of feeling that more is needed to make your life palatable to you.  See, that's the issue.  Enlightenment should be making you ok with simply being -- you should feel complete without all the seeking, all the striving, all the aggrandizing of your Ego over other Egos.  That all comes from deficiency needs.  You can feel someone is Enlightened when they feel complete just with being.  They don't have a neurotic need to do anything like saving the world or whatnot.  Now they may in fact do that, but it doesn't have that same kind of urgent, desperate energy about it.  There's a humble, secure energy there because no deficiency needs are creating that feeling of lack in the moment.  When you don't need anything, that is noticeable by others.  There you're coming from a place of abundance, of effortless and easy contribution, not a need to fill a void within your own Ego-Mind.

Edited by Joseph Maynor

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4 hours ago, AncestorOfAisle6 said:

This just came in my feed and I thought it was very interesting because of leo's cult video's.

Here's a guy that seems to have had genuine enlightenment experiences, but I would guess is orange/green on the spiral. 
I think he comes of as a mix of Ruper spira/Adyashanti mixed with a fratboy and a little Alex Jones there too. 

What do you guys think, Osho in the making?

 

I watched several of his enlightenment course video and I get the sense he has had Turquoise-level awakening experiences and insights. Yet I also get the sense he is still maturing. Turquoise can be expressed differently through different mind-bodies. Especially if there is some orange/green residue mixed in. Lately, I've been getting in tune with Turquoise devilry. There is much more going on in Turquoise than I imagined. It's a whole nother world where few humans reside. Yet those that do and walk the earth have different forms.

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@Joseph Maynor Is it not a good idea to befriend your ego? You can utilize your egoic tendencies to your advantages.

Your ego is not going to die anytime soon. It's better to have it on your side.

Edited by CreamCat

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18 minutes ago, CreamCat said:

@Joseph Maynor Is it not a good idea to befriend your ego? You can utilize your egoic tendencies to your advantages.

Your ego is not going to die anytime soon. It's better to have it on your side.

It is tricky.  Yes, I agree that demonizing your Ego-Mind is no good on the Path.  But at the same time, the problem with the Ego is it creates all these deficiency needs that get you chasing for happiness in some other place than simply being.  So, it's a bit nuanced.  The Ego-Mind can thwart your happiness if you let it.  And while it's doing that, you can be deluded into thinking you're doing a great thing, only to be left with a hollow victory at the end of the process, if you get a victory at all.  But at the same time, to demonize and deny the Ego-Mind just pushes it more underground which makes it harder to manage and harder to see frankly.  This is why there are so many Spiritual Egos on the Enlightenment Path.  These people deny and demonize their own Ego-Mind which is still there.  I hate to use this example, but it's sort of like being gay and trying to deny that out of yourself.  You don't wanna do that, that will just make your problem worse.  You're better off allowing yourself to be gay, even if you're not happy about that, because at least then your gayness isn't sent underground where it will still survive but be forced to manifest in all kinds of under the table ways.  Ditto for Ego.  It's best to acknowledge and accept Ego than to try to deny it out of existence, because it doesn't go anywhere.  It's best to deal with things above the table rather than below the table, even if they're unsavory.  So, I am a fan of loving and accepting the Ego-Mind, but I also realize the danger and traps that the Ego-Mind presents and try to avoid those too.

Edited by Joseph Maynor

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29 minutes ago, CreamCat said:

@Serotoninluv How much psychedelics have you been taking to experience Turquoise-level awakening experiences?

I can’t remember the last time I tripped. Maybe two months ago? 

My baseline level is now close enough to Turquoise that I’m in striking distance without psyches. 

 

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5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Upgrading society is good. The problem is, it's much harder to do than almost anyone realizes. Good intentions, pleasant words, and even enlightenment is not enough. It takes conscious leadership and a degree of self-mastery which very few people have.

But in general perspective  he'll contribute to increase ppls awarness in this all field which will lead to upgrade the society with further self-awareness.

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6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It takes conscious leadership and a degree of self-mastery which very few people have.

"Self-mastery".  That's a hell of a word.  I'm still waiting to find someone who has exhibited "self-mastery".  Then maybe I will feel more comfortable using that term myself.

Edited by Joseph Maynor

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So then what are examples of highly conscious and developed humans throughout history who have started a movement?

So we have someone to model.  

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@joeyi99 Well, all the great sages and prophets. Moses, Jesus, Buddha, Mahavira, Muhammad, etc.

It's no accident that such people are revered as gods among men. And serve a role models for millions. Because to truly pull off such a thing requires you become god-like.

In practice no leader is perfect. Many of them have secret hidden shadow sides which you don't see in public.

For example Gandhi was an amazing leader but not without some personal shadow issues. Same with Martin Luther King Jr.

Also take note how many of these leaders were killed by the ignorant hoards. That should tell you something.

Personally I find Gandhi very inspiring. He gave up his whole life for his mission.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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51 minutes ago, tedens said:

But in general perspective  he'll contribute to increase ppls awarness in this all field which will lead to upgrade the society with further self-awareness.

Or he builds a cult which goes off the rails and drives many people into delusion.

What you have to take into account about every organization is how it plays out after the leader is dead. How much evil will it spread? If the leader enlightens 1000 people in his lifetime but leaves an organization which enslaves and brainwashes 100,000, it's not longer clear that it was a net positive.

Is the Catholic church a net positive or net negative? Hard to say. The math is very complex in that equation. Jesus might be rolling in his grave.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Also take note how many of these leaders were killed by the ignorant hoards. That should tell you something.

I don't understand what is told by the fact that they were killed by ignorant mobs.

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@CreamCat Going against the grain results in a lot of resistance.

Going too hard and too radical against the grain leads the "grain" to want to eradicate and get rid of that which goes against it. 

In other words: the ego simply can't handle too much change all at once. If it knows, deep down, that its death (or at least radical change) is immanent without its consent, it will most certainly lean itself up against that attempt to throw it overboard. 

Edited by DocHoliday
Reason for edit: typos and stuff

If mental gymnastics were an olympic discipline, you'd be the undisputed champion. 🏆

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