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@VeganAwake The whole notion that the ego is “a thing which can self-destroy” isn’t well grounded. The “ego” is an abstract way to talk about what the mind is doing when it constructs a conditional model of self and identifies with it. There’s no “ego as a thing”, let alone an ego which can commit suicide. To make a noun out of ‘ego’ doesn’t mean that there’s really some entity inside you which must die, these are just metaphors. Similarly, “enlightenment” is not some state that one achieves when the ego dies. More weirdo mythology there… that kind of talk just confuses the issue.

The 'blaming suicide on the leader' kind of behaviour is kind of silly in my opinion, but i get where those people are coming from. But they would never ever apply the same standards to a psychologist or to a psychiatrist.

Have just watched the first episode of the doc. Seems quite well done in terms of filming, and was quite inspired by parts of it. I found her response to her student voicing the possibility of disagreement to be boundary violating, unhealthy and innapropriate. However, apart from that it all seemed pretty great stuff. The stuff surrounding the episodes end about the dangers of her teaching seemed misguided. Strawmanning her idea of the suicide as a reset button by implying she was encouraging suicide was off the mark, I've seen that video and understand she isn't encouraging it, at least to my mind. The folks blaming her partly for their daughter's suicide can't really be said either way. It could well be the case that the parents are deflecting blame from themselves, or that teal's teaching actually did cause suicide. Further, stuff surrounding her not being licensed, while I get the view point its coming from, is more of a paradigmatic issue. She's into alternative healing, and also a form of healing she herself has devised, so certification and licensing is a lot less likely. Also, critiques of the actual content of her healing are standard sorts of things than all forms of therapies really get critiqued with. For example, psychodynamic therapy may be critiqued as dangerous for not first exploring nonverbal forms of therapeutic release before engaging in talk therapy. Plus, there were some points where she was simply being assertive. I.e. who gets to live with her. Thing is things like that will no doubt rub people up the wrong way, as assertiveness is often something vilified by people in society, even though its healthy. Overall, aside from the one incident, I actually was quite fond and inspired by portrayed Teal.

I am prone to making random noises. They are typically in response to thoughts which would be embarrassing or stupid if said to other people. Sometimes my mind gets stuck on one word and then starts to all of a sudden repeat it out loud. My typical reaction is "I need to hide." I don't want other people to see what I am like because I could easily be hurt. I don't think many people go through this sort of thing. I probably need to talk to someone. Other thoughts include "I'm a monster." This kind of behavior made me fear that I was going insane. I know these thoughts are not really true and suicide is not a problem. I have an abnormal brain development with autism, but I seem to have a hard time taking embarrassment. I plan on talking with a professional about this.

@ZenAlex I think all of those things could be mentioned, when we are talking about actualized.org if you want to interpret things in a bad faith way. This can be interpreted about actualized.org too, when we say that people actually don't understand what Leo is talking about and what Leo is teaching about . But you can get around this ,if you actually show a high level of understanding of the teachings and then lay out why they are dangerous or bad or anything that you have a problem with . You have to show a high level of understanding first, and then after you proved yourself to that community, they will be more open to your criticisms. This can be said about actualized.org too, if you want to interpret things that way. For instance, there are some people , who say that people on actualized.org committed suicide, because of Leo and because of his teachings . Of course, if any of the actualized.org members will disagree with that or if Leo will disagree with that, they can always say "Of course they disagree, because they are a cult". You need to justify positions like that in a different way, to be more compelling. There are some claims that are hard to justify, but if your claims hold any validity at all, then you should be able to show some evidence to justify them. Teal Swan's group is not new at all, if you can't show any video or any picture or any audio about her doing some shady shit (after all these years), then it will be hard to justify your positions only using some of her members claims. Just think about it, if there is really some shady shit going on, wouldn't you have more evidence than just a few ex members saying things about her without evidence (or maybe they actually have some evidence, but it is your job to lay those out). So far your argument is not compelling imo, because of these reasons: You are laying out your opinions on her that are up for debate. The reason why your opinions about her are up for debate, because you didn't provide any tangible evidence to back them up. The only countable "evidence" you showed so far is the claim, that her ex members are fucked up and they feel they are fucked up because of Teal Swan. But even that is weak, because those are just claims without backing them up with anything. (I could myself say some shit about some group without showing any evidence, and i wouldn't be suprised, if people would disagree with me) [ Now, of course the more ex members are coming up with claims like that, the stronger you position get, but after a while there has to be something that can actually back their claims up ] So without any compelling evidence, i don't think you will be able to convince anyone here, who disagrees with you. You need to make it so that your claims are not up for interpretation.

Hey everyone, so from time to time I can fall into depression, hopelessness, and suicidal thoughts. So I thought I would write a list of the tools I’ve learned to get out of this head space. 1. Get enough sleep. When we aren’t sleeping well our brains don’t function and getting depressed or losing control of our emotions becomes very easy. 2. Call someone. Call a friend, family member or suicide/ mental health hotline. You’d be surprised how good you feel right away. Socialize. 3. Check your diet. When your diet is poor it affects your mental health. Eat healthy foods. 4. Take action! Instead of feeling hopeless and trapped take action on what you know you need or want to do. Just doing it, even when you initially don’t feel like it makes a huge difference. 5. Vent in a forum or journal. 6. Read books about cognitive behaviour and remind yourself of your values. 7. Journal, write lists, to do’s, your values, and affirmations. 8. Move your body! Exercise. Walk, run, lift weights or do yoga or Qigong. 9. Meditate, body scan, feel present. Smile into your body. 10. Let go, surrender and accept what is. Stop smoking. Damaged lungs = chronic anxiety.

@Someone here Of course you don't recommend someone of your fellow specie to committ suicide, that would endanger your specie. How animalic of you. Pretty much the only two things you are right about is that two people would get sad if I would committ suicide. And that emotions are changing. But the negative emotions outweigh the positive ones for me.

@Blackhawk bro..death is no joke . You don't know what you're getting yourself into. Seek professional help ASAP. You MUST visit a psychiatrist and be put under antidepressants . Be careful what thoughts you put in your mind . You attract what you think about .if you keep ruminating about death you will eventually end up actually committing suicide. That's the last place you want to be into .Trust me . I was suicidal and depressed for the majority of my life .but with taking antidepressants and working on my life purpose I got out of that dull state. You can too. I believe in you.

True. But people only stay Orange if they're happy in Orange, in which case there's no problem. If someone achieves what they want in Orange, and has a midlife crisis or whatever, then they'll automatically start transitioning / looking for something different. Stress will build until they do something, be it rediscover religion, spirituality, drugs, or suicide.

I don't want to scare people. But quite frequently I get intrusive thoughts and intrusive desires both about homicide and suicide. Is this an impure mind? I do recall Leo in a video stating that cravings for suicide were the results of an impure mind. I do notice that with meditation and shamanic breathing make these impurities go away.

How are you feeling today bro? If you've got suicidal thoughts like this then please forget internet forums and get straight on the phone to your local emergency suicide helpline. Best wishes man. Assuming you are feeling ok today ... "This is my belief". Are you saying this from personal experience or is it just a belief? If it's from experience then you're saying that you have experienced being most happy. In which case yes life is full of ups and downs and by that logic the time to be free from worry is when you're most unhappy because things will be on the way up. Why should that be a cause of feeling suicidal? It reminds me of the Buddhist talk about impermanence. "Every conditioned phenomenon is impermanent". Including happiness and also unhappiness. There was a time in my life years ago when I was kind of drifting and unsure what to do. But I was into Buddhism and used to see monks and visit monasteries. I was even toying with the idea of becoming a monk myself. I was talking to this monk and he was explaining how, before he ordained, he experienced emotional highs and lows, how it was a cause of disturbance and suffering. Now, after being a monk for some years practising intense meditation & mindfulness the highs & lows had subsided and he was more on an even keel, in the middle without getting involved in any dramas going on around him. He was happy like that. I thought about that a lot afterwards and decided I didn't want that kind of life, without the ups and downs, having flat emotions all day long. I wanted to find some passion even if it meant the emotional crashes too. So I didn't become a monk, and carried on looking for my passion which I did eventually find in loving a woman, having a family and a career. As well as continuing my spiritual practice. But can't say I got as enlightened as that monk though ha ha! Maybe my story is no help for you but there are choices to make around whether to jump into the river of life to find your passion or whether to try and protect yourself from the emotional volatility and avoid the drama. No judgement either way, whatever works for your happiness.

In my opinion, suicidal contemplation is entirely human. Suicide is fundamentally the deepest human conflict. And I believe most of us, if not all, contemplate this idea at some point in our lives. However, is it the answer or solution? No. Not at all. Depression or suicidal thoughts only appear "crazy" on the outside to those who lack empathy or true understanding for what are actually ancient/universal human emotions. In other words, they are normal to experience or come across in life. It starts to become an issue when these ideas or thoughts become more constant or begin to consume your entire mind or dominate your worldview. But even then, I wouldn't label you as "crazy". If anything, life is pretty crazy if you ask me! Personally, one of the things that's helped me in the past, is to create a safety-toolkit list of all the things which helps you find comfort, peace, and solace. I would focus on the simple, little things. For example, sipping on a hot cup of tea or coffee is something I find much relief and appreciation for whenever I am having a hard time. Taking warm showers or bubble baths is another great one. Listening to calming music, reading something that gives you joy, I have the Tao Te Ching that I often return to when I am feeling low and it always brings me to tears of joy and lifts my spirit back up; it literally gives me life. So if I'm having a rough day and I feel like the life is washed out of me, I will return to the things I know which feed me love & life. ❤️

Show me your last 5 years of profits and losses. Tell me which silver or gold or oil company is going to 2x in the next year, or what's currently the next Tesla. These statements are straight up delusional and dangerous dude. People who went to Stanford and Harvard who work at billion dollar hedge funds can't make 15% a year consistently. You're telling people that they're going to double their money every year DURING A RECESSION with a few hours of research? Get the fuck out of here. (I made an additional 33% of my work income from crypto both last year and the year before. But if I did it this year I'd be down 50%+ looool. I'm under no illusions that my crypto money is basically gambling. I put money in a silver stock around the time of GME stuff and made like 30% in a week. Then I sold and put it all in a psychedelics ETF and its down like 75% since then lollllllllll. And I did it in a tax free account so I can't even use it for capital losses LOLLLLLL. Getting a steady 5-7% per year is way better for most people than risking suicide-inducing swings in your net worth.)

Interesting. Maybe the "okay with suicide" and "okay with living" is the same shit. Because maybe you can't escape life. Search this on YouTube: "Quantum immortality".

@Carl-Richard listen to what Pete Davidson has to say Most BPD cannot come up with the courage to kill themselves. He said that They are suicidal most of the time Their suicidal threats should not be discarded as drama because some of them actually end up doing that under enough pressure. The fact that they give a suicide threat, might look like drama in the moment, but they are actually having the ideation and some day might act upon it. It's a cry for help. 80% of bpd sufferers feel suicidal from time to time, don't feel the courage to do it. But they are distressed. That's why the threat. 10% actually end up committing suicide. It's not a good idea to take their suicide threats lightly or call it drama or attention seeking or dismiss it. It's still a cry for help deep down although it doesn't appear that way.

to me fear is, how much of this am i willing to risk if someone says to me during today's meditation there is 50% chance you will die and 50% chance you will awaken, i will say let's do it i feel privileged in that i have nothing to live for, in this life i don't need anything, i am playing no role, no one relies on me, i have done what i want to do to die today is okay f-eel e-verything a- r-isk perhaps i am too immature to know of dark nights and beast's bellies (please don't misunderstand the above, i take huge delight in life and live to the utmost max and am not a suicide idealist)

Get rid of all the guns. Every major Modern Country got rid of all guns and only allow hunting rifles. The hunting rifle permit is expensive and the weapon came only be used in approved areas. The average human is not competent to handle hand guns, people can barely handle cars and we think they can handle guns? Guns are weapons of mass destruction. I can walk into a neighborhood with a handgun and take out several people before someone could shoot me dead. But currently at this time the NRA has too much political power, many people are stuck on their Amendment Rights, so America is going to have to watch mass school shootings for at least 2 to 3 more decades before anything meaningful will be done. This shows collectively where America is on gun ownership. Americans in general do not like mass shootings. But they are not ready yet collectively to get rid of their guns. It is what it is. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2021/09/13/key-facts-about-americans-and-guns/ Look how the other countries dealt with gun violence. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/05/25/world/europe/gun-laws-australia-britain.html There are tons of studies that have been done. The verdict is out. Giving a human being access to a gun is way too much power. I have the ability to end someone's life at a whim. Don't get me started how there isn't even a requirement for people to go to gun ranges and learn how to aim either. We have driving tests for cars, but no certification on aiming and gun maintenance either? So some people have no aiming ability and when they feel threatened they kill innocent bystanders. Some people have bought their guns and never fired it. So they have no idea how to handle it and misfires can happen. Then there is the issue with it being too easy for suicidal people to get guns and off themselves and in some rare cases....commit murder suicide. But hey its fine eventually America will learn. We just need some more time...and some more bodies.

Nice drawing. Can you ask her these questions: 1. Why each year around 800.000 of people suicide, does she think those people might be new souls or how is suicide related to soul progression? 2. What's her opinion on God and what does she think about her existence like where she came from? 3. What is the most important thing to her besides you?

To me it seems desperate, but not crazy. I just can't imagine being in so much mental or physical pain that I'd rather die than live. Death is so scary and permanent. The only way I could see myself considering suicide is if I had chronic excruciating back pain or similar. I get depressed semi-regularly but even at my lowest it never seems like a viable option. I'd rather live a bad life than no life at all unless things were truly hopeless or I was getting tortured every day or something.

It's actually the opposite. Those shorties that leo throw are often misinterpreted by people. When the subject requires further explanation..he just give you one liners like "death is Imaginary ".and the likes . And this shouldn't be tolerated because it can be dangerous when newbies hear this they might do something dangerous. We have two cases of suicide in this forum for God's sake . I didn't want to bring that up but come on. Leo should definitely work on how he communicates in the forum.

October 2018 One day in October I discovered his texts to another girl.. And I was furious. Her name was Mosar (name changed).. She was a huge problem in the relationship I quickly grew very insecure because he wouldn't stop talking about her. I discovered a lot of flirty texts between him and her So I confronted Joseph on this. He was nervous and starting to get really violent with me. I was livid with anger. Joseph said that what if she wanted him. He also said to me that he found her hotter than me. I was completely furious. This was no longer just him flirting her casually, this was much more, Joseph was fantasizing being with her. I was very angry. I blurted out..... "go f*ck her".... I was in sudden panic. My chest was pounding. I wanted to be done with Joseph right that minute. The feeling of knowing that he wanted to cheat on me was very traumatizing. My first boyfriend was also into stuff like that. Men like that can never be trusted. They eventually cheat on their girlfriends.. Such men are never authentic. They are just players. I was ready to forgive everything but not cheating. It's just female nature. Something about cheating was very triggering to me.. Maybe because my very first relationship, the guy who I thought I was going to marry, SHT had cheated on me.. The pain of cheating was very hard to deal with. Anyone who has been truly in love knows that cheating can completely desecrate you. It is one sin you should never commit in a relationship. Of course there are exceptions to the cardinal rule. If you are unhappy with your partner and are going to be leaving him/her anyway, but even in such a case, it's best to first break up and then start your new romance. That day was a dark day in October. I slashed my wrist when I was home. I told Joseph about it. That was my last suicide attempt.

My third boyfriend Joseph I think the greatest source of my trauma bonding with Joseph came from his childhood. I'm emotional as I write this. Joseph's Dad Gene had abandoned him since Joseph was just 2 years old This traumatized me heavily. I really wanted to confront Joseph's Dad one day and tell him what a bastard he was to do this to his son In my mind, I could not believe a father could do this. My dad was the biggest person in my life. He had raised me with such great love I had attempted suicide 2 months after my father's death. I had missed my dad forever. I never got over his loss And here was Joseph whose father never spoke to him, never called him, never wanted to know how his son was doing. How could a father do that to his child? Joseph wanted to find and kill his dad when he was 13 years old.. I understood his anger. I had similar kind of anger towards my mom for abusing my dad. Joseph's mom Cindy was cruel and narcissistic. Joseph had Norwegian dad and Italian mom. Joseph's mom threw Joseph out when he was barely 18. Joseph was drinking heavily and doing cocaine. Joseph was sent to a religious catholic cult in Florida. They nearly abducted Joseph and took him to France where they confiscated his passport. And his life in France under the religious cult was extremely brutal. He would be made to sit out in the cold and left without food and made to work till he broke his back working for them. Their abuse, torture, bullying heavily traumatized Joseph. When Joseph was 21, he made an escape plan with his friend and they somehow came back to US. His mom wouldn't have him back. So he flew to Canada. Where he had his first gf. He was deported from Canada because his visa had expired. Back in the US, he found Rebecca in Colorado and moved in with her. He basically cheated on his Canadian girlfriend Crystal with Rebecca. Crystal was very upset. He basically slept with Rebecca and then told Crystal to fuck off. (he would later tell me that he would never cheat on me but cheating he did) He married Rebecca and had a son but during the first year of his marriage he suffered a heart attack. Rebecca divorced him post his heart attack. He had held a lot of resentment against Rebecca for leaving him post his medical condition. Rebecca had put a restraining order against him because Joseph had been violent with her on several occasions during the marriage and he had been arrested once for domestic violence when Rebecca was pregnant with their son. (Joseph would tell me that he was falsely arrested for violence and that Rebecca had cooked up a story). Hindsight Joseph had lied to me about his violent past with Rebecca. This became clear when he began to give me death threats during every argument we would have in the relationship.

Trauma bonding with Joseph At first Yogjif had promised Joseph that he would help him in every possible way. Now Yogjif began to deviate from his promises. There were arguments in these months. My time with Joseph wasn't good during this period. I remember sending him lots of gifts.. This time was very brutal for both Joseph and I. Joseph tried to calling Rebecca and called her a bit*ch and she blocked him. Now he couldn't talk to his son. Yogjif was constantly humiliating Joseph. Once Joseph was in the play area where the men were playing pool at the table.. Yogjif came, there was a scuffle and someone called 911. Yogjif was a big liar and he wanted Joseph out because someone was ready to pay higher rent. Yogjif told the cop who arrived there that Joseph had threatened to kill someone. Joseph was tensed and furious. I had called him on his phone and he informed me not to call him for the rest of the day He later explained me that he told the Cop everything that it was all okay. I was totally confused and I just decided to forget it all. The next week Joseph told me that he needs to move out because he has been served an eviction notice by Yogjif By now Joseph had been served evictions three or four times. I had lost count of how many times he was evicted in 2018. I was scared that he might never be able to have a home that he could call home. His chronic homelessness was wearing heavily on our relationship.. Whenever he was in problems he would take out all his anger and aggressions on me and my job was always to calm him down and give him support. By then it had become a routine for me. I loved doing things for him but of course there was no appreciation, plus I was being called a bi*tch on a daily basis. The name calling during this time was extreme He would call me bit*ch and who*re and even racist things.. He would say that he would kill me When I attempted suicide and told him about it. He told me "go die" and he said "I will put you out of your misery you suicidal maniac" Joseph had a total of 3 prior arrests. A domestic violence case for violence against Rebecca. Another arrest when Rebecca was at a restaurant with him in 2016 March when a black man attacked Joseph and the cops were called and the black man lied to the cops and Joseph was arrested.. This was shortly before the divorce . Joseph was in jail at the time when Rebecca came and served him divorce papers. The last arrest was when he was with Rebecca, married to her and a neighborhood woman had called the cops on him while he was fixing the roof of his house and threw some of the material on the floor and that lady had an issue with that. Most of the times Joseph was arrested falsely. I knew it. I believed it.. The divorce was also heavily against Joseph. Rebecca completely cleared Joseph's entire bank account, took his car, took his house and transferred it on her name, took his therapy dog and gave it to someone else, and took his son and left. Joseph was traumatized and left for the dead after the divorce. He had lost his home and everything in the divorce. Rebecca drove Joseph to a psych ward and dropped him off. When Joseph tried to return, she told him that he cannot come home again and that if he tried she will call the cops on him. That's when he became homeless for the first time.. After living in homeless shelter for a month, Joseph finally found a place at Kev's.. Which of course he was evicted in early February 2018. The divorce had given Joseph PTSD. For this same reason, I loved Joseph to death Him and I shared the same journey of struggle with PTSD with our past traumas. We trauma bonded.

This is actually not true: there was a Japanese practice throughout the Middle Ages known as harakiri where a noble would commit suicide if they had sufficiently tarnished their reputation and standing in society. In many ancient societies, a woman was even expected to commit suicide if her husband died before her (see, for example, the Hindu practice of sati). Buddhism and Stoicism both allowed for suicide but only in very special certain circumstances. For example Cicero is quoted as saying: “To leave the place that one is assigned in life is not permitted without an order from the leader, who is God.” And Seneca even says this: “Wherever you do not want to fight, it is always possible to retreat. You have been given nothing easier than death.” In a certain way, you could even say that the Christian martyrs committed suicide; there is a very famous story in the Old Testament in which Samson kills himself along with all the Philistines by pulling down their temple. HOWEVER, a suicide that was motivated by personal and passionate concerns of any kind was totally condemned, not only because it was understood as being a violence committed against one’s own nature and even against society, but also because it was known to be simply ineffective. After all, if you are still identified with your karma, the mere fact that your body is dead will not sever this attachment, and severe punishments will likely be incurred for having inflicted such a violence upon life. Therefore - in almost all cases, unless one is absolutely sure that there is nothing left to be fulfilled in this life - suicide is a great mistake and should definitely not be done. None of the above is intended in any way as an advocation of suicide - don’t kill yourself! If you know someone who has unfortunately committed suicide, you can at least know that they might not be rotting in hell for all eternity. Finally, a koan-style joke from the Romanian philosopher Emil Cioran: it’s not worth it to kill yourself because you always do it too late!

It should be legal but made extremely hard to access (ie, for terminally ill/irreparable conditions that cause ongoing sufferring, maybe room for exceptions as well). The reason is that most people who think about/plans suicide do want to live, they just feel hopeless about their life and the situation they found themselves. So the first priority is to find a way to give people a floor to stand on and the help/connection they need. Unfortunately that's a tall order in most places still, which makes suicide more appealing..