"Leo, but what if you're deluded?"

[Arnold666]

@Joseph Maynor Yepp. Seems like every time I formulate a proposition it will imediately be deconstructed and be pointed out the things that seemed that i left out. Like everytime i try to help somebody i have to formulate a text that is bulletproof with every other counter point, taking every possibility in mind and already irefute it before somebody else will, like a dam without no leaks. Like when i try to give a tip i should write a whole book to the rest of the readers and future comenters who will storm like dragons rapidly pointing out what i didn't take in consideration. I don't understand how people think how tools need to be applied. People really expect an advice that is universal ? It's always specific and limited. 

Oh no, I got one. Here is my comment on this specific and every other issue:

Everything. All. Infinity. 

There you have it. An advise that encompass it all.

I'm just a shadow here on the forum. Just read, take what it's useful and leave the rest. As @Yonkon said, it is pontless. At least online, face to face, live is a different matter.

[Yonkon]

@Arnold666

Amen

[cetus]

@DnoReally haha yea there would always be your "Wilson" to help distract you.

[Aeris]

11 minutes ago, cetus56 said:

@DnoReally haha yea there would always be your "Wilson" to help distract you.

don't you think you can create deep connection ? maybe you didn't experience it, like so few people experience a "dysney love", rare things cannot be believed, doesn't make someone deluded to believe that wilson is there for real

[cetus]

3 minutes ago, Aeris said:

rare things cannot be believed, doesn't make someone deluded to believe that wilson is there for real

@Aeris We are all each others Wilson in a way.

[Shaun]

His teachings are pretty terrifying. Think about it, once you have lived through every possible life or reached enlightenment, you just get bored and start again. That means that inevitably, you will all experience being tortured, suffocated to death in a coal mine collapse and every other horror you can and can't imagine. Nonduality brought me peace to begin with but now I fear for what future incarnations hold.

 

How can you all live in peace knowing this?

Edited May 22, 2019 by Shaun

[arlin]

I think criticizm is key to grow. And i love this kind of topics, where there is a lot of doubt involved.

But i think leo has got some things that can't be easily understood. I think some things are impossible to not misinterpret.

This is because he is so ahead of you all. He is experiencing all of this. You are just watching and criticizing from your limited perspective. He is ahead.

Yes, i still think that we should not take his words for absolute truth, this is why he motivates us to experience certain things for ourselves. Thats what he meant with the phrase "Try it for youself". So i don't really understand why such a debate.

3 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

and then when you fail to prove that what you suggest is true

Remember existence is prior to proof.

He can't really prove to you something that can't be grasped with concepts and ideas.

 

3 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

Are you aware that this explanation is just your beliefs and that you're projecting them onto everyone else? Because if you're not, then I'll be even more disappointed.

If you want to know if they are all beliefs and not real facts, go ahead and experience for yourself.

Have you ever had an enlightenment experience? How many mystical experiences have you had?

When you will have the same direct experiences as leo has had, then you can talk  

Edited May 22, 2019 by arlin

[Aeris]

1 minute ago, arlin said:

I think criticizm is key to grow. And i love this kind of topics, where there is a lot of doubt involved.

But i think leo has got some things that can't be easily understood. I think some things are impossible to not misinterpret.

This is because he is so ahead of you all. He is experiencing all of this. You are just watching and criticizing from your limited perspective. He is ahead.

Yes, i still think that we should not take his words for absolute truth, this is why he motivates us to experience certain things for ourselves. Thats what he meant with the phrase "Try it for youself". So i don't really understand why such a debate.

Remember existence is prior to proof.

He can't really prove to you something that can't be grasped with concepts and ideas.

 

If you want to know if they are all beliefs and not real facts, go ahead and experience for yourself.

Have you ever had an enlightenment experience? How many mystical experiences have you had?

When you will have the same direct experiences as leo has had, then you can talk.

you are a zblerb zblerg splech

[bejapuskas]

@Truth Addict  Not everything that one says is answerable. Watch your projections.

[Joseph Maynor]

57 minutes ago, cetus56 said:

@Aeris We are all each others Wilson in a way.

This is a great insight.

[tsuki]

2 hours ago, Truth Addict said:

Leo believes that he can't convince stage Blue closed-minded people of spirituality (as he stated many times here on the forum). I don't think he's targeting them, but perhaps he's targeting Orange. His livelihood is not entirely dependent on YouTube, I don't think YT constitutes more than 20-30% of his income. My point was that Why is he afraid of saying that his teachings are his thoughts and beliefs? Why does he confirm all the time that they're the absolute truth? I think he can admit that, and still keep his audience.

@Truth Addict Alright, I watched the video.
The quest of metaphysics is enlightenment through modeling. You create such a complete model of reality that you lose your mind, your ability to verbalize it. The models are only meaningful when they are imperfect, relative. The absolute truth has no mouth to speak and no ears to hear it.
There is no point of explaining the perfect model to anybody because there is nobody to hear it, everyone is already 'it'. That is how perfect the model is. The Leo you are seeing on the screen, the one you can talk to, will never be enlightened. He will only speak imperfect models because they are imperfect, because there is someone that does not understand them. It's a peculiar position to be an enlightened metaphysics teacher. That is why the highest teaching is silence and nobody knows the true enlightened masters.

So, is it a belief? No, it's his best shot at explaining nonduality, but the fact that something follows out of it, a point of life, should tell you that it's incomplete and personal. Nothing follows from nonduality, there is no everything is one and therefore something. Absolute truth when spoken always curls back on itself and leaves you dumbfounded.

Edited May 22, 2019 by tsuki

[Joseph Maynor]

After walking around in Dehli today I've come to the conclusion that we're all deluded and think we know everything.  But of course once you realize this what'ya gonna do -- keep yer mouth shut?  Not a chance!  Nobody can do that because we're know-it-all apes.  Our Egos are scared of death, we're competing for resources, and put simply we just need some damn entertainment so we yak yak yak yak at the mouth pretending our own shit don't stink.  There's no true humility among the human primate, don't bullshit yourself.  Everybody wants to have a bead on things if they're alive, it's just part of the trip.  We have a dog in the fight in this whether we have the cajones to admit it or not.  Some of us try to be slick and deny it, but you're only fooling the less intelligent monkeys among us including yourself.  So, stop pretending to be fair, you're not.  If you're alive you're one selfish, arrogant sonofagun.  So, let people have their delusions and let people argue.  Stop pretending you're superior by turning over the chess table instead of playing the game.  You are playing the game as passive aggressive and covert about it that you want to pretend to be -- YOU are playing the game and YOU want to be right.  Yes YOU.  We all wanna be the one right monkey among the troop of monkeys.

Edited May 22, 2019 by Joseph Maynor

[Aeris]

Just now, Joseph Maynor said:

After walking around in Dehli today I've come to the conclusion that we're all deluded and think we know everything.  

no no, that's what most people operate from.

there is really a place of "not knowing" as they say, I didn't embody always this tools, we tend to quickly accustom to everything that seams to make sense to upgrade the filter.

you need to subconsciouly become aware of your filter 

[arlin]

44 minutes ago, Aeris said:

you are a zblerb zblerg splech

what is this?

[Aeris]

7 minutes ago, arlin said:

what is this?

sound like an onion, but instead it start with a "m"

[Joseph Maynor]

13 minutes ago, Aeris said:

no no, that's what most people operate from.

there is really a place of "not knowing" as they say, I didn't embody always this tools, we tend to quickly accustom to everything that seams to make sense to upgrade the filter.

you need to subconsciouly become aware of your filter 

Yeah there's a place of not knowing -- it's called being in a coffin 6 feet in the ground.

[tedens]

Every video should contain a warning something in this way:

Never take my word for sure,                        use your awareness.

[Joseph Maynor]

5 minutes ago, tedens said:

Every video should contain a warning something in this way:

Never take my word for sure,                        use your awareness.

Leo sounds so sure of himself in his video though, kind of like a devout religious person.  It's got that energy to it.

[tedens]

It's all really too radical to be understood by words from someone else. That's why I recommend using your consciousness for verification.

[tsuki]

26 minutes ago, tedens said:

Every video should contain a warning something in this way:

Never take my word for sure,                        use your awareness.

Actually, this video had a sentence like that.

19 minutes ago, Joseph Maynor said:

Leo sounds so sure of himself in his video though, kind of like a devout religious person.  It's got that energy to it.

What's wrong with religion? The quest of spirituality is to relieve us from suffering that science failed to solve.
To get your own spiritual insight you have to do a damn lot of work and most people can't afford that. The second best that comes right after is comforting stories that you can wrap your head around, that make sense.

The problem with today's religions is the fact that the last prophets we had died thousands of years ago. Their legacy is dead, outdated, misunderstood, highly contextual to their time period. The organizations that are supposed to take care of it have no spirit left and force people to abandon their minds and believe something that makes no goddamn sense.

Edited May 22, 2019 by tsuki