Why is Russia being held to a higher standard than the US

[Breakingthewall]

9 minutes ago, Daniel Balan said:

As I told you earlier, having your people demand accountability from the government after those Russian dick riders betrayed their public is nothing illegal. Hell, if Trump would become WOKE and stated to side with the liberals the Maga fanatics would literally kill him. And that won't be a KGB coup. Just a normal reaction of the people when you fool them with fake promises and then you do the exact opposite

Fortunately, Trump would never do something as crazy as break a promise; it would be terrifying. Americans would unanimously lynch him.

[Daniel Balan]

2 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Fortunately, Trump would never do something as crazy as break a promise; it would be terrifying. Americans would unanimously lynch him.

Ah, so it wouldn't be a KGB coup d'etat then hmm? Have a nice day and goodbye!

[Breakingthewall]

Just now, Daniel Balan said:

Ah, so it wouldn't be a KGB coup d'etat then hmm? Have a nice day and goodbye!

Yanukovich was pro Russian by origins. He tried to balance relationship with Russia and Europe. In 2013 Europe asked him austerity and Russia offered credit. Then he turns to Russia. Is that a crime?

Zekensky started with the promise of normalization of the relationship with Russia and fighting the corruption. Then he did the opposite.

[BlueOak]

5 hours ago, Ajay0 said:

The Chinese and Russians were not interested in exporting their governance models to the west. They were interested mainly in building up their economies

They do at every opportunity. Especially the Russians.

They've successfully done so to America but failed in Europe. Mostly because Europe is used to them trying over centuries, and America just goes whichever way they are paid. (Sadly for BRICS the EU has more money than them, so they can never pocket America outright, like Israel vs Iran can.)

I have to say though. The fact you haven't been able to see this over centuries shows a clear lack of understanding of the region in question, especially right now with the repeated attempts to do so by Russia in the recent elections, highlighted and contested or banned outright.

Edited 20 hours ago by BlueOak

[Breakingthewall]

20 minutes ago, BlueOak said:

especially right now with the repeated attempts to do so by Russia in the recent elections, highlighted and contested or banned outright.

Then, If the population of countries like Romania, Germany, or the Czech Republic vote for parties that promote rapprochement with Russia, it is assumed that they have done so because they were convinced by Russian propaganda, which is evil, and those elections are annulled or mysterious deaths occur among members of that party.

In other words, democracy is democracy if you vote for whoever i want, if not it is malicious Russian propaganda and the results are banned 

 

[Daniel Balan]

14 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

Then, If the population of countries like Romania, Germany, or the Czech Republic vote for parties that promote rapprochement with Russia, it is assumed that they have done so because they were convinced by Russian propaganda, which is evil, and those elections are annulled or mysterious deaths occur among members of that party.

In other words, democracy is democracy if you vote for whoever i want, if not it is malicious Russian propaganda and the results are banned 

 

Brah, if everytime someone opens social media sees an endless stream of videos and comments that are aimed to tarnish the pro democracy parties and in the same time they call the "Patriots" the saviours of the nation.... It is obviously that the pro russian patriots would win. I mean if the pro democracy parties had the same propaganda machine they'd have 90% of the votes. How come that the patriots didn't even get to the 5% of the votes required to enter parliament before 2020, but since the war in Ukraine their score is now at 40%? While other pro eu reformist parties that hadn't governed before drop from 16% in 2016 to 10 % in 2025? 

Is that fair play that one party benefits from the fact that all the social media and all the phones of the people in that country are flooded non stop with pro russian propaganda? While the other parties propaganda is downgraded by the tiktok algorithm? Is it a democracy when the entire informational ecosystem has been hijacked completely by the russian propaganda machine coupled with the complicity of the Chinese social media company and of the META American company? 

Are you for real? 

I said I will no longer respond to you but you drive me insane.

 

Edited 20 hours ago by Daniel Balan

[Daniel Balan]

@Breakingthewall I wonder what would Putin do if all the phones in Russia would display non stop pro western propaganda coupled with anti Russian propaganda also coupled with endless streams of fake accounts that leave nasty comments against the Russian regime.

Oh wait...

The Russians don't have access to World Wide Web, YouTube, Facebook or other social media besides Telegram. 🤦🤦🤦🤦🤣

[BlueOak]

1 minute ago, Breakingthewall said:

Then, If the population of countries like Romania, Germany, or the Czech Republic vote for parties that promote rapprochement with Russia, it is assumed that they have done so because they were convinced by Russian propaganda, which is evil, and those elections are annulled or mysterious deaths occur among members of that party.

In other words, democracy is democracy if you vote for whoever i want, if not it is malicious Russian propaganda and the results are banned 

 

• My View.
• Hypocrisy Point
• Chat GPT's evidence of Russian meddling in European elections.

My own view: Stop all Russian influence at the border. They use it as an excuse to either invade, destabalise, export their ideology to us, extend their reach or meddle in our domestic affairs at a point in time where we are in a cold, almost hot war with them.

Anything defensive in Europe goes for that aim. I don't have this facade where I am better than a Russian. If you are meddling in the European backyard for Putin or on his payroll, you're cooked. If you are still trading with Russia 3+ years on and they want your assets, you are long past cooked. If you are still buying energy from them, not only are you 4 years too late to change but also cooked.

As a side note to deflate some of this national ego: Its amusing that a pro Russian is talking about the lack of political transparency or mysterious deaths when that's a daily thing Russians do! Never walk near a window when in Russia, especially if you are a billionaire.

Chat GPT's sourcing of Russian meddling in EU Elections
 

Cross-EU / multi-country

EU sanctions “Voice of Europe” & Russian state outlets (2024)
“Council … decided to suspend the broadcasting activities… Voice of Europe, RIA Novosti, Izvestia, Rossiyskaya Gazeta.”
https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2024/05/17/russia-s-war-of-aggression-against-ukraine-council-bans-broadcasting-activities-in-the-european-union-of-four-more-russia-associated-media-outlets/

Czech Gov: Medvedchuk used ‘Voice of Europe’ to run a Russia influence op (2024)
“Medvedchuk … runs a Russian influence operation … through Voice of Europe s.r.o. and Artem Marchevskyi.”
https://mzv.gov.cz/jnp/en/issues_and_press/press_releases/the_czech_government_approves_listings.html

Belgian probe into Russian payments/propaganda via VoE (2024)
“Belgian prosecutors are looking into possible Russian interference in the upcoming European Parliament election…”
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/belgium-probing-alleged-russian-interference-eu-election-campaign-2024-04-12/

EU Parliament resolution on new allegations of Russian interference (Apr 25, 2024)
https://www.europarl.europa.eu/doceo/document/TA-9-2024-0380_EN.html

“Doppelgänger” Russian media-cloning operation (background + updates)
EU DisinfoLab explainer & resources hub: https://www.disinfo.eu/doppelganger-operation/
Cost-effectiveness study (May 24, 2024): “Despite … sanctions … the Doppelgänger infrastructure remains resilient.”
https://www.disinfo.eu/publications/assessing-cost-effectiveness-responses-to-the-doppelganger-operation/

US DoJ: seizure of 32 domains used in Russian state-directed “Doppelgänger” influence op (Sep 4, 2024)
“The Justice Department … seizing 32 internet domains … used by the Russian government … to interfere in … elections.”
https://www.justice.gov/archives/opa/pr/justice-department-disrupts-covert-russian-government-sponsored-foreign-malign-influence
Affidavit (details): https://www.justice.gov/d9/2024-09/doppelganger_affidavit_9.4.24.pdf

EU institutional briefs on foreign interference around elections (2024–2025)
EPRS “Combating foreign interference in elections” (Mar 2024): https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/ATAG/2024/759612/EPRS_ATA(2024)759612_EN.pdf
EEAS FIMI threat report (Mar 2025 – election context in 2024): https://www.eeas.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/2025/EEAS-3nd-ThreatReport-March-2025-05-Digital-HD.pdf
Parliament press note before EU elections (Jun 5, 2024): https://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/press-room/20240603IPR21804/european-elections-eu-institutions-prepared-to-counter-disinformation

United Kingdom

UK Gov (Dec 7, 2023): Russia attempted to interfere in UK politics
“The UK and allies … exposed a series of attempts by the Russian Intelligence Services … to interfere in UK politics and democratic processes.”
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/uk-exposes-attempted-russian-cyber-interference-in-politics-and-democratic-processes

UK NCSC advisory (Dec 7, 2023): attempted political interference
https://www.ncsc.gov.uk/news/uk-and-allies-expose-cyber-campaign-attempted-political-interference

2019 UK general election (official): almost certain Russian actors sought to interfere
UK Government response (July 2020): “Almost certain that Russian actors sought to interfere in the 2019 General Election…”
https://isc.independent.gov.uk/wp-content/uploads/2021/01/HMG_Russia_Response_web_accessible.pdf
NCSC Annual Review (p. refs & quote): https://www.ncsc.gov.uk/files/Annual-Review-2020.pdf
Reuters overview (Jul 16, 2020): https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-russia-raab/uk-says-russia-tried-to-meddle-in-election-by-leaking-us-trade-documents-idUSKCN24H1VT/
Source of leak (Reuters, Aug 3, 2020): https://www.reuters.com/world/uk/exclusive-papers-leaked-before-uk-election-in-suspected-russian-operation-were-idUSKBN24Z1UK/

Germany & Czechia

EU sanctions for the 2015 Bundestag hack (APT28/GRU)
https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2020/10/22/malicious-cyber-attacks-eu-sanctions-two-individuals-and-one-body-over-2015-bundestag-hack/

Germany attributes 2022–2023 attacks incl. SPD hack to APT28/GRU (May 3, 2024)
German Interior Ministry (EN): “Cyber attacks traced to Russian military intelligence agency … ahead of elections around the world.”
https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/kurzmeldungen/EN/2024/05/schutzmassnahmen-cyberangriffe-en.html
German Interior Ministry (DE press): https://www.bmi.bund.de/SharedDocs/pressemitteilungen/DE/2024/05/aktuelle-Cyberangriffe.html
German domestic intel (BfV) note on APT28 targeting SPD (May 3, 2024):
https://www.verfassungsschutz.de/SharedDocs/kurzmeldungen/DE/2024/2024-05-03-apt28.html
Coverage/quotes: Reuters (May 3, 2024): https://www.reuters.com/technology/cybersecurity/germany-warns-consequences-alleged-russian-cyber-attack-2024-05-03/

Czech intelligence (BIS) annual reports — hostile Russian activities incl. election-period threats
2023 report (EN): https://www.bis.cz/annual-reports/annual-report-of-the-security-information-service-for-2023-f0cd7859.html

France (2017 presidential election)

France (Apr 29, 2025): official attribution of “MacronLeaks” to GRU/APT28
Le Monde (ENG): “France … officially attributes hacking to GRU … including Macron 2017.”
https://www.lemonde.fr/en/international/article/2025/04/29/cyberattacks-france-officially-attributes-hacking-to-russia-for-the-first-time_6740745_4.html
AP recap with ANSSI details: https://apnews.com/article/07389699dff13b04aa09844e488ecb7d
Contemporaneous Reuters (May 6, 2017) on the leak: https://www.reuters.com/article/world/french-candidate-macron-claims-massive-hack-as-emails-leaked-idUSKBN1812B8/

Slovakia (illustrative, election-period disinfo)

AI deepfake audio dropped 2 days before the Sept 2023 vote
WIRED: “AI-manipulated audio … two days before Slovakia’s elections.”
https://www.wired.com/story/slovakias-election-deepfakes-show-ai-is-a-danger-to-democracy/

Quick reference — research/overviews

EEAS FIMI hub / EUvsDisinfo
https://www.eeas.europa.eu/eeas/information-integrity-and-countering-foreign-information-manipulation-interference-fimi_en

EPRS background notes (Mar–Jun 2024)
Foreign interference & EU preparedness (Mar 2024): https://www.europarl.europa.eu/RegData/etudes/ATAG/2024/760355/EPRS_ATA(2024)760355_EN.pdf
Backgrounder (Jun 5, 2024): https://www.europarl.europa.eu/resources/library/media/20240605RES21836/20240605RES21836.pdf

Notes:

There is official, on-the-record attribution by EU governments (UK, Germany, France) and EU institutions to Russian state-linked actors for hacks, hack-and-leak ops, covert influence networks, and coordinated disinformation around elections.

I could not find credible cases of EU elections being “annulled” because pro-rapprochement parties won; the documented response is attribution, sanctions, investigations, and platform takedowns of Russian interference assets.

[Husseinisdoingfine]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

And Belarus is aweful.

I've been there, and most of the roads are made out of dirt. The capital city is super clean, but other than that there's not much else. Really bizarre country and a lot of soviet nostalgia everywhere you go

[Daniel Balan]

30 minutes ago, Husseinisdoingfine said:

I've been there, and most of the roads are made out of dirt. The capital city is super clean, but other than that there's not much else. Really bizarre country and a lot of soviet nostalgia everywhere you go

That was the case for my country too up until 2021. After 14 years of EU integration I could finally have asphalt on the roads of my village instead of mud and swamps as roads every time it rained. 

The big cities in Russia and Belarus are nice because all the oligarchs that suck the country's resources dry are living there and it is common sense to live in a clean city. After all, why steal so much if you don't at least build a nice city to live in.

Edited 17 hours ago by Daniel Balan

[Ajay0]

18 hours ago, BlueOak said:

They do at every opportunity. Especially the Russians.

I think what you mean to say is that the Russians ended the dictatorships of Napoleon and Hitler and freed Europe of Nazi tyranny. As long as they were doing the heroic stuff , Russians were the golden boys with the rest of the europeans being enthusiastic cheer leaders. 

But after they get the job done, the rest of the europeans descend to complaining and nagging. 

Quote

 (Sadly for BRICS the EU has more money than them, so they can never pocket America outright, like Israel vs Iran can.)

The whole of EU gdp in 2024 is equivalent to the Chinese GDP alone itself, forget about the rest of the BRICS members. All the brics members are growing economically at a fast pace, especialy India and Brazil.

 

India itself is projected to have a GDP of  $34.2 trillion by 2038, which would make it the world's second-largest economy in terms of Purchasing Power Parity (PPP). This growth is expected to be driven by factors such as a young population, strong domestic demand, and ongoing structural reforms.  

Europe is ageing with low fertility rates, and its constant warmongering is the reason why european authorities are liberal with immigration from Asia and Africa in order  to replace the native manpower lost in ageing and low fertility, war and conflicts. This is also important to ensure the economy is not deralied by manpower shortages.

Quote

 

...so they can never pocket America outright, like Israel vs Iran can.)

 

You mean to say that EU and Israel due to money power can pocket America. But wouldn't this be an admission of plutocracy and bribery on their part itself which is contradictory to democratic principles ?

Edited 2 hours ago by Ajay0

[BlueOak]

2 hours ago, Ajay0 said:

I think what you mean to say is that the Russians ended the dictatorships of Napoleon and Hitler and freed Europe of Nazi tyranny. As long as they were doing the heroic stuff , Russians were the golden boys with the rest of the europeans being enthusiastic cheer leaders. 

But after they get the job done, the rest of the europeans descend to complaining and nagging. 

Yes and no. They were also remembered as the country that started WW2 alongside Germany when they invaded Poland, Finland etc. So they were mistrusted. There were naturally different ideologies and a lot of post-war fatigue, happiness that is was over (from just about everybody including Germany) but also wariness.

 

2 hours ago, Ajay0 said:

The whole of EU gdp in 2024 is equivalent to the Chinese GDP alone itself, forget about the rest of the BRICS members. All the brics members are growing economically at a fast pace, especialy India and Brazil.

True if they were dedicating enough of it for a singular cause, i.e buying out America, but its not just GDP its trade with America, the EU is the biggest trading partner. And part of the problem with the new world order is BRICS is not yet fully coalesced into a military alliance. Which it would need to do for increased world stability, the trouble with a multiple polar world is nobody know's whose enforcing old treaties or international laws. So there are none. The trouble with a two-pole world is a world war breakout, it's the perfect scenario for it to happen at any time.

Brazil for example, is more of an outlier due to its proximity to America. If China were in that proximity to Venezuela, it'd already be challenging the US. Thus there isn't really a clearly defined boundary; Brazil would have been better off joining NATO, given its geographical location.
 

2 hours ago, Ajay0 said:

You mean to say that EU and Israel due to money power can pocket America. But wouldn't this be an admission of plutocracy and bribery on their part itself which is contradictory to democratic principles ?

Really. Is this some kind of gotcha moment for me. Corruption in American politics, oooh you don't say? 

 

Edited 43 minutes ago by BlueOak

[kray]

23 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Putin wants to turn Ukraine into Belarus. That is the proper analogy. And Belarus is aweful.

Not that I support it, but having watched videos of people traveling to Belarus, it actually seems quite nice. A relatively cheap country to experience the nice things any other Europeans countries would offer for an arm and a leg.