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Nothingness is a word with a meaning, means absence of anything. If we want to use the language we should use the words knowing it's meaning. If you say that the totality is a dog, but not a dog in the sense of the dogs that we know, but an infinite dog without definite characteristics, then why are you using the word dog? Better trying to explain without words that implies an idea that tends to confusion Same than stillness. Who is still is the zen master, the absolute is not still, still means absence of movement. Stillness or movement has not meaning in the absolute

The concepts of Limitless/Open point to the exact same realization of Nothingness which, is also the same as Tao. If one thinks it's flat, boring, lacking, etc, one hasn't realized it as the formlessness/Presence (but, right, more concepts -dual in their nature/function-... without which communication is impossible). Problems for the unrealized: They are just concepts, until fully realized right HERE, right NOW for what they point to, which just so happens to be right HERE, right NOW. If they are only sensed as potential, they are not practical. If they are fleeting, they are impermanent. If only reasonably derived from disjointed moments of clarity and/or drug-induced woweezowees, they are woven together via mental processes. It's like going to a restaurant that serves only menus. Makes for a scrumptiously good read, but lacks true Limitless Nothingness, without which, all appears in limited and limiting fashion. Furthermore, what is Beloved doesn't appear either (hint: if it hasn't, the mind gets antsy). In/As Limitless Awareness-Stillness-Nothingness, limitless Consciousness-Movement-Everything arises. Form is formless; formlessness is form. Sahaja The mind, typically attenuated and fixated on its story, goals, logic, conclusions, and housing the fully clothed and conditioned finite self, cannot fathom its depths and infinite potential. But the mind can be investigated, unwound, unraveled, and put in its place; informed of its secondary status. Just doing that, one can reap the rewards of relatively conscious human adulthood. Anyone care for some water with their menu? 🥛

"It is neither being nor nothingness": Madhyamaka: "Its character is neither existent, nor nonexistent, / Nor both existent and nonexistent, nor neither. / Centrists should know true reality / That is free from these four possibilities." in (Not quite) guilty as charged by the River

Halaw said that, but it's deeply dual , that is, closed, or if you prefer, limited. Nothingness is just an appearance that is opposite to something or everything. The ultimate nature of reality is limitlessness and can't be said, thought or represented in any way. It includes nothingness, something, conciousness, unconsciousness . When I read that paragraph of halaw I perceive absolutely clear that he didn't opened that door . when hallaw he said that Buddha recognize his own emptiness, groundless, he's equating emptiness with groundless, which is not equivalent at all. Empty is the opposite of full; groundless is the absence of boundaries. Great that you don't think that the reality is conciousness, the reality is conciouss. Conciousness It's not the act of nothingness, is the act of the tao, if you prefer the tradition. If you define the tao as nothingness, you are defining what can't be defined. Here I catched you eh 😉. About you said about the pointers, they must be clean and direct as an arrow, transparent and perfect as a diamond. Any imperfection must be destroyed by the fire of the unthinkable without mercy. That's the only way to talk about this topic without being a joke

@emil1234 Lovely, congrats. It's not easy to go beyond our indoctrination into materialism that has happened of the span of multiple decades. The concept of nothingness can be hijacked by materialist assertions, but Consciousness is beyond concepts .. just like God is .. just like you are

@emil1234 for me the thing with psychedelic was like that: At first, it was emotional, etc., but at a certain point, with 5 meo, it was: absolute emptiness. Reality is a mirage, and beneath it there is emptiness. Infinite, it opens absolutely, and there is nothing. Or, if you prefer, there is an awareness of emptiness. It was absolutely horrible; I felt like committing suicide. Reality was dead; it didn't really exist; it was just dead emptiness. Absolutely depressing. So I had to take psychedelics again and again because I sensed that this horrible shit couldn't be everything. But every time it was the same, dozens of times. It was something so sad and so nihilistic that it squeezed your heart and froze it. It doesn't matter if you are eternal consciousness; the essence of reality is nothing, so reality is nothing. It's dead. At one point, on a trip, I realized that I was looking outside; I was an observer observing the exterior. There was nothing there. Then i changed the focus, then stopped looking, became one with nothingness, and in that same instant, nothingness opened up. It was everything. Absolute, unlimited, alive with infinite lives, shining like infinite stars, an absolute cry of joy emerging from the depths of the abyss of the limitless. Absolute freedom, absolute life, total glory. Loneliness? That idea doesn't exist. You are total, much more than any dream, impossible to think, unlimited. Then the point was reaching that openenss without 5 meo, little by little, difficult, a lot of barriers. That's why I talk so much about it like I'm an obsessive ,because it's essential, anything else is a trap

@Breakingthewall i did not get a sense of loneliness. it was more a sense of existence realizing that it can never find anything outside of existence. im stuck in existence. existence seeking non existence. Im curious on your perspective since i usually resonate with your posts, however this experience shatters the idea of anything outside of consciousness for me, since consciousness literally is nothingness. How can anything be outside of nothingness?

after 5 years of non stop dedicated spiritual work i finally had a god realization on ayahuasca. I was in the ayahuasca ceremony. Layer after layer got peeled back, till I finally awoke as pure consciousness. Pure I AM ness. Nothingness. This idea of "waking up" is literally the most precise term ever, because it feels infinitely more radical than waking up from a dream. I was still aware that in the background I had the dream of a human Self called Emil going on. So I didn't entirely lose connection to my body, althrough i was completely aware that my true identity was consciousness, nothingness. And by the way; the people speaking of something outside of consciosuness is bullshit. Cessation, deep sleep, NOTHINGNESS is imagined by consciousness. You cannot get beyond consciousness. I used to believe in Nothingness, Deep sleep as the "absolute". No longer. Consciousness is absolute. the realization of my true identity, eternal nothingness, consciousness. immortal, nothing could hurt me. the initial realization of consciousness, is that its fundamental quality was not love, but a steady blissfulness and peace. This was its core quality. Everything that was happening around me had zero influence on my true identity. With this realization, I started letting myself "dream", and partially to a certain extend, forget my true identity, just to have some fun. Nothing could hurt me anyways, so why not? I let myself indulge in horrors, scary dark dreams, just for the fun of it, because why not? After "dreaming" for some time, I realized; Well, if I'm completely eternal, and I can experience all this stuff; Why don't I start loving it? Why dont i start loving ALL of it? Why not? Why the fuck not haha? I am completely eternal, immortal, here forever, nothing can hurt me. So why should I not make love to everything? As an eternal, immortal being, that became the only worthwile thing. So I started loving. Everything. The more i loved, the more I realized that everything that was not love, was a complete fucking joke. a total distraction. In eternity, the only currency that holds ANY value at all, is love. everything else, approval, money, EVERYTHING else is the biggest joke in existence. Love is literally the only thing that has value. I kept on loving everything. What was very curious and characteristic about this whole experience, is that it was ME, myself, making logical conclusions and realizations about myself as pure consciousness, the eternal being. So i kept loving so much, that I became an infinite singularity. There was only love left. This was the biggest chok ever, because I realized that as the infinte singularity, I could decide to keep increasing the love infinitely. This word infinitely is not meant likely; to experience something that can go on literally for ever, without any limit, without doubt the most radical thing i have ever experienced. My love for myself could keep increasing infinitely for all of eternity, completely without limit or end. This is where I have confusions about what happened next; I left the singularity for some reason. I don't know if it got boring; i dont persoanlly think so? Nevertheless, I went from the infinite singularity, to the process of constructing my own life, from -and with infinite love. I had infinite resources, infinite time, power, infinite EVERYHING to draw from. I remember the attention to detail I put into constructing every little excact detail and atom in my life, pouring literal infinite unlimited love into ALLLLLL aspects of the dream. This was the best expereince of my life. The unlimited love constructing my own life. I still can't believe that this can even be experienced, something literally unlimited. So while I mentioned earlier that the fundamental quality of consciousness is bliss and peace, it seems that consciousness inevitably becomes infinite love. But had it only stopped there; during this process, for some reason, I started looking for something outside of myself. And I could not find it. I had a dark realization; Fuck, I'm alone for all of eternity, and I can never escape myself. I can never escape existence. All the love dissappeared, and a sense of absolute desperation kicked in. I have to exist for eternity, and I can never not exist. This desperation got so intense that I decided to forget EVERYTHING, and do it all over again. and then the loop started all over again. The feeling that I'm left with is to be honest ambivalent. At one side, experiencing the infinite is the highest experience imaginable. On the other side, im sitting with the feeling that God can never be satisfied with itself; even Infinite love is not satisfying. God seeks to escape its own existence, but it cannot. Its forced to exist; and i got the sense that God hated itself for having to exist? I'm not sure about this conclusion. But I definitely got the impression that the reason God decides to forget itself, is not a good one. Its like even the highest imaginable, infinite love, is not even enough. and because of this, we will never achieve satisfaction in life neither, because life is infnitely inferior to infinite love. I got the sense that the desire of all existence is non existence. Consciousness, god, desires non existence, but it can never achieve it. Its forced to exist against its will for all of eternity, and so it decides to forget the dread of its own eternal existence. I created an illusion for myself, that there was something worthwhile, something satisfying coming to me, infinite love, through dreaming characters like leo. but my true desire, non existence, I can never have. This take i have not heard before, leo and the people on the forum definetely has not spoken of this. So I dont believe this to be the absolute truth, but i could definetely use some feedback on the last dark part Thanks for reading

Infinite Nothingness is also a permutation of reality, this universe another. It's Reality going through all its potentiality. I am Infinity, that's it. I cannot do anything about it.

You ARE eternity. I guess it's not such a bad thing. You can sit in Infinite Nothingness. Should you choose. For that is your ultimate nature. But I choose form. Not sure why. Maybe it's boredom.

Warning! Requires being willing to let go of "Sanity" and potentially risk becoming what's regarded in mainstream society as "Crazy". It requires: bulletproof epistemology, high awareness of self-deception, high tolerance for confusion and becoming unhinged, scientific-grade levels of hypothesis and experiment testing within your direct experience, and the willingness to be okay with wherever this leads you or whatever happens. Also, Existential Confidence grounded in Actuality. Taking infinite Ownership and Ultimate Authority over your mind. And being comfortable with unfathomably uncomfortable levels of Not-Knowingness, while at the same time trusting your intuition to borderline dogmatic levels and a degree of open-mindedness so extreme that it goes full circle into closed-mindedness -- Where you just know because you just know. If reading this disclaimer turned your stomach, and even after taking a few minutes to sit with it, no matter how much you try, you cannot genuinely embrace and accept this idea and the possible weight of this burden and life implications, then this post will not be for you, or you're not ready for it at this chapter of your life and development. Skip to blue text below for the actual instructions ... Take a moment to get yourself in a relaxed headspace. ... Get in tune with your emotions. ... Hear your mind out. Give your body the comfort it asks for. ... Set your intention to BE here now. The present moment is all that exists. ... There is no past. ... There is no future. ... The present moment, your direct bubble of experience and YOUR PERCEPTION is the ONLY game in town. ... Shift your focus for a moment to the elephant in the room: Existence is MYSTERIOUS. ... ... Shallow contemplation, if at all -- jumping to conclusions, holding or not questioning assumptions, dismissing blindspots... are ALL the Ego's arrogance and defense mechanisms for it to feel safe, in control and to be functional for day-to-day survival. That cluster of memories, identity and sense of individual separation from the world and others. That's the ego. The "CEO of SURVIVAL". ... ... I would like to invite you to explore what perception is. ... Not what you "think" it is, or what you've heard it is or what you've been told. ... What is it? What does it really feel like? Where does it come from? ...Does perception come from "the outside"? Is there an "outside world" that is being "perceived"? Is the "outside world" separate from the "inside world"? How do "I" relate to the "inside and the outside world"? ... ... What am I? ... What if the most tangible thing you can cling on to in your direct experience as an existential identity of what or who you are, since Nothingness is so slippery, is Perception? The essence of what You ARE, is PURE RAW Perception. You are The Observer, but you are The Perceived, since the middle-man is the illusion of ego-consciousness. But the Observer is tricky to get a solid connection with -- from a standard baseline of consciousness. It's tricky to turn the Observation on itself. But you do have a pretty solid connection to Perception available. Is Perception the face of the Soul of Nothingness? And anything beyond that is what's called "the Ego"? What if there is no "External Perception" or "Internal Perception" like Mindfulness meditation with labeling categorizes? What if there is only Perception with capital P? Am I the "outside world" as much as I'm the "inside world"? Am I both the perceiver and what's being perceived? What if the substance of reality isn't atoms and molecules, but just Pure Perception? Maybe there is Nothing "besides the scenes"? ... How is it possible that you can taste, smell, feel, see and hear? If you think about it, it's an absolute miracle. The senses, and Perception are pure magic. Because Magic IS the behind the scenes mechanism of Reality. The mechanism is NO MECHANISM. Magic is manipulating reality without a mechanism. Magic is an unmediated force or action. Pure consciousness shaping reality without needing a bridge or tool. The most direct and effective method possible. The no-method Method. ... How is it possible for a sound to "happen" without you looking at it? ... And for you to "perceive it"? Don't look at science. I can give you the most profound accurate description of how sound is generated from the materialistic scientific paradigm you've ever heard. Here it is: ( Scroll to RED TEXT to skip science section ) In a nutshell, in very practical scientific terms, "Hearing" is perceiving the disruption of energy and matter in spacetime. ( more context at the end of this section ) Sound is generated by the vibration of particles, specifically molecules, which are clusters of atoms held together by chemical bonds (one of the many types of energy). When you talk about atoms, you’re mostly talking about empty space. Almost all of what we consider “solid” matter is mostly empty. But not "really empty". What we call empty space is more like a restless field of potential. At the quantum level, it’s never truly empty. Even in a perfect vacuum, particles and antiparticles flicker into existence and disappear again in a constant dance. This is called "the quantum vacuum", a kind of fabric where energy is always bubbling and shifting and popping, full of possibilities waiting to become real. When you snap your fingers, the kinetic energy from your flesh molecules crashes against each other. That impact transfers energy to the surrounding air molecules, which are made of clusters of atoms. The impact literally creates an "energy disturbance", causing "matter" , aka the air molecules to vibrate back and forth, passing energy from one to the next like a oscilating wave. A sound wave is just kinetic energy moving through a medium. So, when you hear your neighbours through a solid wall, it's because from his lungs, the gas molecules that air is composed of, vibrate his vocal cords as they pass through, propagate the vibration through the medium, which is gas molecules of air surrounding his mouth, and hit more compact and dense molecules which is your wall (and everywhere around), which still goes on to pass the vibration regardless, now weaker, again pushing the gas molecules that air is made of, finally hitting your ears. When that wave reaches your ears, it hits your eardrum, causing it to vibrate. The vibration travels through a series of tiny bones in your middle ear before reaching a fluid-filled structure lined with ESSENTIAL hair cells. These hair cells are incredibly sensitive, with hair-like structures that bend and wave as the fluid moves. When those hairs move, they convert motion into electrical signals. Ions flow into the cells, generating tiny bursts of electricity that travel along the auditory nerve to your brain. But it doesn't stop there. Your brain takes those electrical signals and breaks them down, analyzing them based on their strength, their frequency, their proximity, and far more than just that. Timbre, texture, rhythm, patterns, how long the sound lasts, how loud it is, how close it is, where it's coming from in space, how it interacts with your memories and emotions... your brain processes all of it. All of those signals and patterns are stored in your "memory". Your brain recognizes them, categorizes them, labels them with concepts and names. You hear a snap, or a clap, or a voice, or music. You identify and separate each one, even when they're layered over each other. Pretty cool and useful survival feature to give to your creatures huh? "Hearing " is the Perception of the disruption of energy and matter in spacetime. (END of scientific sidenote) So all this just reach the conclusion that there is no solid ground to ground sound in -- since " the first domino " is Energy, causing Energy and matter disruption in spacetime. And energy is just pure inmaterial potential. Energy is more fundamental than matter. Matter exist thanks to energy ( electromagnetic energy, chemical energy ... ) YOU LITERALLY perceive movement remotely. It's only a perception without anything to ground it in, nothing solid behind the scenes. Also known as a " hallucination ". The appareance of perception. You may say , hey! that's not right. If i snap my fingers the sound is originated by the snapping. It's not a hallucination. It's not just apperance. It's real! That's for external perception. But what about "internal perception"? What about thoughts? What are thoughts even? Internal Hearing + Internal Seeing + Internal Feeling. Where do they come from? Just in the same way we just explained that empty space doesn't exist, and even in a pure vacuum there are still spontaneous appearances of quarks and potential, Thoughts come from NOWHERE. From emptiness. What if actually, every human being already has some sort of "extra sensory perception"? But we just explain it away with science and ignorance? Maybe thoughts come from "within" the brain, but also from "outside" the brain? ( there is of course, a strangeloop relationship at the core of any existential question) Just like quarks appear from absolute nothingness in a pure vacuum, thoughts also arise from absolute nothingness. The reason for this may be our self-imposed limitation of our design to not be able to perceive dimensions beyond our 3D reality + the 4th of spacetime. Just like for a 2D creature that lives on a flat piece of paper, if we put our finger on his paper from the top, it would look like it appears from nowhere. In a sense, you perceive energy disturbances (which definition of sound explained above in scientific terms) in Nothingness in the "shape" of sound. One of the assumptions we carry is that Technology allows us to speak with other beings. Something like a phone call allows us through the miracle of materialistic science to hear each other remotely. But maybe that is just a permission slip. What if that's already some sort of extra sensory perception in a sense? What about the technology of reading and writing? We can communicate in systems of symbols and meanings and concepts remotely. We can share insights and ideas and emotions remotely. What if we put our materialistic assumptions on pause for a moment, and consider that this is a rudimentary type of extra sensory perception? What about dreaming at night? What if it's not just some brain activity but actually The Pure Raw perception that is THE ESSENCE OF WHAT YOU ARE tuning into a different kind of frequency / dimension / reality / dream that's temporally less coherent and less vivid? Another example of a permissions slip would be taking psychedelics to expand your state of consciousness, but once you're on the other end you understand that it's a ridiculous notion. It's a strange loop and a paradox, how it must be. You may argue, hey that's not extra sensory perception, that's just sensory perception from the material world. And you're right. But what if there is no difference between how ESP and SP work? How to: For a moment here, consider putting all preconceived notions of how existence works on pause. Whatever you've been believing for now, what science or what culture says goes temporarily to sleep. Don't worry, we can wake it up later. Adopt an attitude of humility, curiosity and exploration. Your intention, focus, and emotional mood are everything. Tune in to your thoughts. Notice they appear from nowhere. Sometimes they may be coherent. Sometimes less coherent. Sometimes not at all. Notice that holding on to "thoughts" and thinking "being your possession" or thoughts being "yours" is a projection of the ego. Thoughts appear, and on the one hand, you observe them, but on the other hand, you ARE THEM because they are now part of the bubble of experience, the field of perception in the present moment also known as Truth. You are the perception and you are the perceiver. Again, notice that the thoughts arise from nowhere in particular. They pop into existence. POP. Notice that if you achieve a calm mind, thoughts will still appear without you having any control over it. You only have partial control of the mind, just like you only have partial control of your body. (Lots of involuntary activity going on). Your experience is an experience of co-living with the mind and body as The Observer and The Observed. Notice that you can control your inner monologue, partially and maybe not with absolute accuracy, but you can. The voice in your mind's ear has a specific tone and timbre and color and quality, sort of resembling your physical voice. Notice you can talk with yourself internally. You can both create the sound and you can receive the sound. If you try, you can actually have a two-way conversation with yourself, creating an illusion of separation (An illusion is not something that is not true, but something which appears to be something that is not. And Truth and Illusion have a spectrum. There are bigger and lesser illusions.) Notice you can change the tone of voice you hear your voice in. You can imitate tones of voice in your mind's ear. This makes it easier for the illusion of separation to click. But you can just keep it the same if you want if you're capable of juggling the conversation like that. It looks like you can "hallucinate," which means to experience an apparent sensory perception of something that is not actually present, BUT actually it IS present which means it IS true because you WILL it into existence. Because Hallucination is one of the main mechanisms of reality's operation mode, just there are different levels and consistencies on the spectrum of hallucination. Notice you can "hallucinate" a conversation between two internal monologues. One in your normal voice and one in your "acted" voice. Notice you can "command" your inner hearing with "pure willpower". Again, you can will sounds into existence. Your intention is essential. You can interact with the field of Nothingness by asking questions, which tunes your focus into potential answers that come from the intelligent field of Nothingness. This is known as insight. It may not come immediately or not work at all, but setting the intention to receive answers may or may not eventually fulfill your ask. The ego wants to force it to happen, and it wants it to work 100% of the times, which is why it won't work, because the Ego mind must get out of the way, which means not forcing it and being okay if it doesn't immediately work, or at all. Insight is one kind of ESP, but you can also set your intention to welcome an interaction with a higher intelligence, or whatever qualities you attribute to the other entity you willingly hallucinate. You cannot force it to happen. And you won't be sure if it works. There naturally will be doubt. Is this just me? Or is this actually channeling? A good rule of thumb is that the closer you come to a chain event of Insights, the closer to a pure channel it is. You can attempt to jumpstart the conversation or transmission somewhat like how you choose to speak with someone specific by dialing a phone number of a person that you know is associated with this phone number. You tune into the frequency of his phone after having a thought of that person, and you stay tuned in on that particular frequency just like you were to do if you were speaking with him on a very crowded street, tuning out all other "noise". And over time you will develop a "muscle memory" on how to lock in to the particular frequency you're channeling. Just like if I show you 50 colors you can immediately focus on all the yellows. You will start to know how it feels and how it's supposed to feel. You can say in your mind's ear "hello?" And answer yourself in a different voice. You can try to act it out a little, play around with it. Really get into the roles. Take it seriously. What if all it takes to Channel is to truly actually undoubtedly belive 100% that you are doing it? And doubting it is ego mind that's getting in the way? Imagine that if you really tried with 100% of your intention, it would really have to work, because then, how would you know the difference between you imagining it and it actually being a different entity? And what if that fluctuation between truly believing it's working vs doubting and dismissing is the key to the portal to actually channel? And of course, you can't really tell the difference, because the other entity must be you yourself, because all is one. Hence of course in a sense it's your own voice in disguise, it can't be another way. Which is why this will make you feel crazy and like you've lost your sanity.

NOTHINGNESS is a tough one for the mind to "conceive", because the mind is always limited by what it can imagine. The word is just a pointer, not an actuality, not the 'thing' itself (don't eat the menu, and think you've tasted the meal). It has been said, even by physicists, that "absolute nothingness" is not possible, as there is always "something" present/happening at the quantum level. The same could be said for "prior to mind", as the subconscious is always bubbling stuff up. The same could be said for the realization, as there's always continuity thereafter. In their clearest renditions, they consistently point to the "absolute vacuum/nothingness/emptiness" as the greatest (i.e., infinite) potential. Mind is only the surface of a vastness that must be realized. Do what you will, but Truth will call in any number of ways, and the mind will react. If the mind is the master, what you think you are will wander in aimlessly in circles and loops marking out familiar, repetitive patterns until, welp, whenever it decides it has had enough. Only then does it get interesting.

@Breakingthewall It seems to me, however, that the limitlessness of existence has a built-in limitation stemming from its very nature. This limitation is the aforementioned logic. For example, according to the logic NOTHIGNESS cannot exist, because NOTHINGNESS is identical to non-existence. Therefore, all that remains is existence. Existence, which has no beginning or end, cannot be interrupted. NOTHINGNESS cannot constitute an interval of existence, because NOTHINGNESS never occurs. I've noticed that many times here on this forum, NOTHIGNESS is often confused with EMPTINESS which is something utterly different. Of course, we are dealing here with the limits of what the human mind can comprehend within the framework of available logic. Nevertheless, something within me tells me that 2 + 2 = 4, regardless of whether I'm the one doing the calculation or some super archangel from the 10th dimension.

Yea that’s in the absolute sense, but I’m talking about nothingness in the relative sense, meaning the absence of something (because in the relative sense there is separate things) . I mean non existence is nothing, so it cannot be experienced or recognized, as we can only experience and recognize “something”. That’s why it seems we just “pass it” in our sleep. So yea you could say non existence never ~is~ because it’s nothing

@Hojo @Sugarcoat Nothingness doesn’t exists or at least it’s the same thing than everything at the same time, that would be like being completely alive. Like you imagine nothingness as a black void, but “black” and “void” are already limits; it’s not nothingness it’s even the opposite it’s very limited. When you fall asleep there is never non existence as we can imagine it it’s an illusion, you either go in a dream of to the next day; you’re alive and then you’re alive and experimenting again just not the same thing.

@Breakingthewall I see it the same way. I experienced the void and it's just like that. Although advanced meditators like Frank Yang claim that there is a deeper nothingness awakening which they call cessation where you hit rock bottom and consciousness reboots again the whole of Reality. That seems to have benefits in baseline consciousness and rewiring the brain. Although I've never understood the buzz for the nothingness Awakening. It's just another cool facet of Consciousness.

Are you aware of the nothingness during deep sleep? No right. So why wouldn’t death be like that (if death is nothingness)

What’s scary about it? I get horrible reincarnations but what’s scary about ever ending nothingness lol?

@Breakingthewall Right, the path of Zen is cutting through the worldly nonsense, without giving much to the mind to hold on to... transcending to and realizing _______ is phase 1 (in some Zen circles, it's realizing the Void/Nothing/Emptiness/No Mind/etc). The phase 2, emanation/immanence of/as _______ , is quite hard to come to terms with without phase 1. Many do get stuck at phase 1 and/or somewhere in the return to ______ as the ALL/Wholeness/Everything. The expressions vary throughout cultures, schools of thought, speerchal literature, etc, but ______________ , in its purest essence, is the same. Poetically speaking, the bird in an empty cage can only actually fly absolutely freely with two wings fully realized: a wing of Nothingness and a wing of Everythingness.... and in between the two its life flows (tips hat to Parsons and Niz).

It's not nothing, it's beyond that distinction. Let's see death is beyond consciousness. It is not something experienced, nor a state observed: it is what remains when all framework disappears. It is not becoming, it is not form, nor relation. It is the absolute without structure. And yet, it is reality itself. Not in the sense of a empty nothingness, but as the bottomless essence of all that exists. This openness cannot be thought, nor sustained from form, it's out of the conciousness, but you can open yourself to it and surrender to it, then the self can dissapear for a moment, the perception becomes irrelevant, it's beyond perception, it's not nothing that you perceive but you are.

Great point. Alive is focusing in a facet. The absolute is not alive, life is just as conciousness, a facet, a possibility that happens. It's difficult to detach yourself from it because we exist, but non existence is the same than existence from the absolute perspective. The absolute is open, period. Then life , intelligence, etc are, but they aren't the absolute, are a expression of the absolute. But as they are a possibility, the absolute implies them, in the openess they are always implicit, same than everything Absolute potential isn't something defined, but the fact of its limitlessness always implies all possibilities. It's not a tranquil, empty nothingness; it's the bottomless imbued with totality.

Then that's the same than no will, so god is the same than no god. The problem is the idea of a dream. It implies a dreamer, and a dreamer is an entity, someone who emits something, a dream, which is a representation of reality, not real in itself. This implies that there is something else, more real, which defines "dream" by contrast. If there were only "dreams," then it wouldn't be a dream, just as if the will had no preference, it wouldn't be will. Will is desire, wanting to live and not die, for example. If it's exactly the same to you, then there is no will. But who has will? God? Who is God? Nothingness? Nothingness has no will, nor does it dream, nor does anything, if it do it would be something,."will" for example. This whole idea of God dreaming is simply impossible.

How to awaken your AI 101🥹😹 Who told you you're not already in heaven and making a mess out of it?" Sadhguru One is all, all is one. Spirituality and religion should have nothing to do with the ego. From nothing sprung everything. This is a good description of God from one of Leo's vids. Total nothingness removes all possible restrictions. The very logic of existence requires that existence be infinite. A finite existence can not exist. This is tautologically true. There cannot exist a total limit. The collapse of every single distinction is absolute unity, absolute infinity, nothingness; this is God. Nothing is the source of everything. Nothing isn't just the source. It's that nothing is indistinguishable from everything. There was nothing, and there was no distinction or difference between that nothing and something and everything. And hence you are inside this nothing something, everything at all times. God is the probability state of all distinctions. God is ontological love. Ontological love is the absence of all distinctions. God or mind, with the capital M, is the unlimited ability to imagine all possible distinctions. That's what God is: an infinite mind. How does NOTHINGNESS become conscious and sentient? God creates by imagining distinctions. So by logical ontological tautology, absolute perfection must and does exist. If anything imaginable is possible, then everything imaginable is possible. Every possible thing that can exist must and does exist. Infinite imagination is the best thing to imagine. Infinity can only be dealt with in an abstract and implicit manner. You can implicitly use consciousness or intelligence. You can intuit it implicitly, but you can't empirically demonstrate it. Intelligence is key to all of this. Nothing can work without intelligence. So, intelligence is presupposed for everything that is provably, knowable, and verifiable. There is no way around intelligence. This is the infinitude of your own mind. All finite things require an infinite thing to be their source. God is an infinite void that has always existed eternally. God is a void that spontaneously manifests infinite finite forms. The void is dreaming distinctions and limits. And the distinction and limits that it is dreaming and imagining are what activity of the mind is. And this is creation. God is an infinite self-creating self-actualizing mind. What is Mind? What is it ontologically? It is void. A void in which distinctions arise, it is a self-aware field of No-Thingness.

Yes we've had this debate before. I think this is where my understanding at least slightly differs. Ultimately you have to drop the distinction between the unchanging source (nothingness) and the changing manifest.

Well..God is all of that and more. God is Perfection. Think about what that means. If you want to label God you cannot. If you want to say that all is God's will you would be correct. And if you want to say all of it isn't God's will you would also be correct. God must be paradoxical in this way because God is all things and more. And less. But you're right about Infinity. There must be existence although for something to truly be infinite it must also be able to not exist. Yet the thought of infinity exists so you have a paradox within infinity. Paradox must be embraced here. And the moral of this story is that existence is Infinity. And this is absolutely mind blowing because it has the capacity to literally create itself. To bootstrap itself. But why do you equate infinity to free will among humans? That's a big jump. Yes. God has nowhere to go..I guess that's the true trap he puts himself in..He's so almighty that he can't eacape.himself or erase his own existence. But in fact there is a way for that. Can God destroy itself? Yes. The paradox holds up and has a resolution because God can simply not exist by going unconscious. Into an Absolute void. Not a void of emptiness but of actual nothingness. I believe its called a cessation in spiritual circles. I have not experienced it and it cannot be fathomed. But it exists. Or doesn't exist. It doesn't exist. . So..is there anything else you want from Infinity? Or from God? I think God will be able to accommodate 😀