Leo's video on Gödel was assigned in University to be critiqued

[fortifyacacia3]

I found someone sharing Leo's video on Gödel in Vaush's discord and I messaged him to discuss his criticisms. Imagine a classroom sitting around critiquing it from an academic perspective.. That's so amusing to me lmao! Anyone have any questions they want me to ask regarding it?

[aurum]

8 minutes ago, fortifyacacia3 said:

Anyone have any questions they want me to ask regarding it?

Ask them: what is God?

Notice the quality of their response.

[thepixelmonk]

27 minutes ago, fortifyacacia3 said:

Anyone have any questions they want me to ask regarding it?

I mean what were the critiques exactly

[Osaid]

That's pretty cool. What are the critiques then?

[Leo Gura]

The common dogma within academia is that Godel's incompleteness theorems have no metaphysical, epistemic, nor spiritual consequences. They love to claim that the theorem is merely technical logic and nothing more.

If someone attempts to extrapolate from the theorems into a broader application about metaphysics they consider it pseudo-science because no such conclusions are part of the theorem's logic.

A similar thing happens if you try to tell a physicist that quantum mechanics means that no material reality exists. Academics will call that pseudo-science.

Understanding the implications of Godel's incompleteness theorems requires serious original intellectual effort, it is not something you just read in a logic textbook. My work on understanding the theorem is quite original, so don't expect some academic to approve of it.

The academics who defend the theorem from "pseudo-science" do not have sufficient metaphysical nor epistemic depth to understand what is being said.

It's important to note that the claims I make are original claims, I am not claiming that Godel made my claim. I take Godel's work beyond what Godel himself understood.

It would be like if took Einstein's General Relativity and extended it even further beyond what Einstein understood. My claim is not that I am presenting Einstein's theory. I am presenting something beyond it. So of course an academic would love to object to that because they are in the business of just teaching the classic theory as it is commonly known. They are not interest in going beyond it because that ia considered arrogant and impossible.

If you want to understand my Godel video, you gotta actually think for yourself, not make appeals to academic authority.

No academic understands what Truth is. That's the fundamental problem. This is a quation about the nature of Truth.

You can see me trying to explain this to Kurt on his TOE podcast. Kurt didn't understand me because he is stuck in that dense academic mindset. It is ironic that the more logical a person is the more they struggle to grasp the significance or Godel's theorem. In his personal writing and journals, Godel himself criticized such academics as idiots.

In the end it's very simple: you cannot symbolize truth because truth is always Infinite. If you understand this then all of science is revealed to be a shell game. Which is why no academic is interested in understanding it. The idea that you can symobilze truth is one of the fundamental dogmas and errors of science.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Leo Gura

[flowboy]

So what were the criticisms actually?

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, fortifyacacia3 said:

Imagine a classroom sitting around critiquing it from an academic perspective

You can imagine that with all of my work.

If you presented my work in academia, they would have a heart attack: this guy claims to have reached immortality? And you want me to take him seriously?

Lol

Well, there's only one of two options: either I didn't achieve immortality, or science is very dumb. Which do you think it is?

People just do not understand the depth of what we're dealing with when we talk about Truth. Did you really think you were gonna find God in a university?

No profressor can help you find God, because you are it.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Eternal Unity]

@fortifyacacia3 Alright! Finally, things are starting to move!

[fortifyacacia3]

Lol, Leo is right. The guy only showed me his notes, which seemed to exclusively focus on the intros doubts of academia and particularly of rationalism. Things any one of us could poke holes in They seem to be the predictable run of the mill hang-ups. He did clarify that he doesn't think the mathematical discoveries extend to reality/consciousness/the universe. I thought I read quotes from Gödel in the past where he himself found many philosophical implications.

As a side note I read today that one of Douglas Hofstadter's books was the first book ever sold on Amazon. I found that cool and interesting 

[axiom]

@Leo Gura I thought your take on Godel was brilliant, although Godel himself did think along similar lines.

It’s the same with the originators of quantum theory - they were all over the metaphysical implications, but for a very long time the profundity of the discoveries were extremely downplayed by academia (suggesting that quantum effects only occur at the quantum level, for example) 

But the landscape is changing.

[Gesundheit2]

Here's what ChatGPT has to say about the implications of Gödel's incompleteness theorem:

Quote

Gödel's incompleteness theorem has implications for the philosophy of mathematics, metaphysics, and even life. One implication is that any system of thought, no matter how consistent, will always be incomplete, and there will always be truths that cannot be proven within that system. This means that there will always be mysteries that cannot be solved and that we must accept the limits of our understanding. It also implies that in order to understand the universe, we must look beyond the boundaries of any single system of thought.

 

[Osaid]

53 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

Here's what ChatGPT has to say about the implications of Gödel's incompleteness theorem:

Quote

Gödel's incompleteness theorem has implications for the philosophy of mathematics, metaphysics, and even life. One implication is that any system of thought, no matter how consistent, will always be incomplete, and there will always be truths that cannot be proven within that system. This means that there will always be mysteries that cannot be solved and that we must accept the limits of our understanding. It also implies that in order to understand the universe, we must look beyond the boundaries of any single system of thought.

 

Nice to see that ChatGPT has been keeping up with Leo's videos.

It's pretty wild when ChatGPT has a more holistic understanding than a professor dedicated to teaching that thing at a university.

 

 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, Osaid said:

Nice to see that ChatGPT has been keeping up with Leo's videos.

It's pretty wild when ChatGPT has a more holistic understanding than a professor dedicated to teaching that thing at a university.

That is simply because ChatGPT has no survival bias.

You have no idea yet how much survival skews your persecption of reality.

Edited January 16, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Osaid]

21 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

That is simply because ChatGPT has no survival bias.

That open-mindedness is so refreshing to see, even if it's just from a robot.

I would prefer talking with ChatGPT than some humans.

[Thought Art]

“The Tao that can be spoken is not the eternal Tao” Lao Tzu

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Osaid said:

That open-mindedness is so refreshing to see, even if it's just from a robot.

I would prefer talking with ChatGPT than some humans.

Indeed.

Ego is an ugly bitch

Edited January 16, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Superfluo]

@Leo Gura The funny thing is that in Godel completeness theorem, Godel used logic to prove that logic cannot escape outside of itself (roughly speaking), and if you try, you find a paradox. And that proof was made by using logic. Strange loopy 

[MarkKol]

Robots… are selfless?