Do Others POV not exist even when in Baseline State? - Drawing and Question

[Arthogaan]

Question for those God-Realized. I was struggling to put my problem into words, so I contemplated it and came up with a drawing. Sorry for yet another solipsism question and for my terrible drawing. I know words do no justice. But I would still appreciate some pointers.
 

So - let's say I was in Absolute Infinity Consciousness/God-State (G) thanks to a psychedelic. Clearly I saw, that I imagine lives of my character baseline (B) and of all other people (A). But then the psychedelic starts to wear off. And I am now not God-state. I am now in B-state, so the illusion of others is again convincing.

The question is when I shift from G-state to B-state is there A point of view? And G point of view at the same time? Then the first picture would ilustrate that. 

Or is it more radical that when I shift from G to B then only B-POV exists and other people (A) are imagined and God is not looking trough their eyes - so more like picture 2.

Because my direct experience suggest picture 2 is true. Only THIS exists. This perspective that I have now. And I can imagine being in a G state if I ingest a psychedelic. But I do not want to fall into deception. Thanks for help guys.

I will tag some people whose responses I like reading, sorry for bothering you. @Inliytened1 @GreenWoods @Kksd74628 @Leo Gura @justfortoday @BipolarGrowth @Breakingthewall
 

Edited April 15, 2022 by Arthogaan

[Arthogaan]

But can't God have two dreams at once? When I was in G-state on this drawing then it seemed that way that it is possible. Thats what confuses me. I know it is a dream. But is it the ONLY DREAM NOW.

[WokeBloke]

My past and future are happening simultaneously from my point of view. I am not a dream. I am a real being that is actually experiencing right now. Our nows are relative to each other. My now might be your past or future and likewise your now might be my past or future.

[RMQualtrough]

8 minutes ago, WokeBloke said:

My past and future are happening simultaneously from my point of view. I am not a dream. I am a real being that is actually experiencing right now. Our nows are relative to each other. My now might be your past or future and likewise your now might be my past or future.

Something like that, yeah.

[Arthogaan]

Its like everyone in my dream are not experiencing their point of VIEW but they are my future/past points of views. So on one hand  when I kick them in the face they do not feel pain but I will feel this pain in the future from their POV.

[machiavelli]

@Arthogaan  which future? You are living this dream. And you are dreaming every other character in your dream.

When will you experience their pain ? After you die?

[Inliytened1]

@Arthogaan they do not actually exist you are just imagining they do in that state and imagination is reality.  In that state you have made yourself finite and thus created the self/other duality. 

[Arthogaan]

1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

@Arthogaan they do not actually exist you are just imagining they do in that state and imagination is reality.

Yes, this is my direct experience now, but when in G-state on first picture it seems like both B and A have their perspective, like God is zoomed out so sees them at once, bet then God zooms in onto B-state and then A stops existing/being imagined. Is that right? 

 

5 minutes ago, machiavelli said:

which future? You are living this dream. And you are dreaming every other character in your dream.

When will you experience their pain ? After you die?

Yes, in future NOW after I die many times.

[Inliytened1]

15 minutes ago, Arthogaan said:

Yes, this is my direct experience now, but when in G-state on first picture it seems like both B and A have their perspective, like God is zoomed out so sees them at once, bet then God zooms in onto B-state and then A stops existing/being imagined. Is that right? 

 

 

Yea that is right.  But that is still a duality that may remain even after the highest awakenings.  That is because the self/other duality is so strong.

[machiavelli]

24 minutes ago, Arthogaan said:

Yes, this is my direct experience now, but when in G-state on first picture it seems like both B and A have their perspective, like God is zoomed out so sees them at once, bet then God zooms in onto B-state and then A stops existing/being imagined. Is that right? 

 

 

@Arthogaan How does solipsism hold in this view ?

[GreenWoods]

@Arthogaan Both pictures are quite dualistic. 

There is no formless God vs God in creation vs God's eye vs God's vessel,...

There is One Consciousness/God which shapeshifts into appearances of the present moment.

These appearances are then interpreted to mean that there is a body, a person, sensations experienced by that person, other people, POVs, ...

But there is just God/Consciousness pretending to be these appearances.

All of that isn't affected by your state of consciousness. Reality works that way, whether you are in God consciousness or human consciousness. Your state of consciousness just affects whether you are conscious of all that or not.

 

God is Consciousness and One/Singular, therefore there is nothing outside It/You (your present moment).

In that sense only your present moment exists, and the rest of Infinity doesn't exist (All of Infinity is shapeshifting/collapsing into the present moment).

But from a more practical perspective, God keeps shapeshifting forever, and therefore shapeshifts into the rest of Infinity too. Practically speaking, all of that happens at once. In that sense the other bubbles are just as real as your bubble/present moment.

[machiavelli]

@GreenWoods This contradict solipsism. 

 

[Inliytened1]

9 minutes ago, machiavelli said:

@GreenWoods This contradict solipsism. 

 

Careful.   Leo calls it Absolute Solipsism but you can't really put a label on reality   it just means Singular or Non-Duality.  

The reason the word Solipsism came about is to point out there are no other minds.

There is One Mind.  This is what @GreenWoods just said.  But that there are no other minds is already Incorporated into non-duality.  The problem is the mainstream  conceptual understanding of non-duality is NOT true non-duality because it still holds the self/other duality.   It still holds that there are other minds.  But this is not true non-duality. 

So Leo took the word Solipsism and called it Absolute Solipsism to help explain away the other minds.

Oneness is Oneness by definition. 

[machiavelli]

@Inliytened1 Have you watched Leos solipsism video? 

He is not saying one large mind containing all infinite finite mind which each having thoughts of their own and experiences.

Solipsism says " other mind donot exist outside your own".

In absolute solipsism only one mind  which is absolute is there which dream up every dream character . The dream character donot have their own pov. Nor experiences.

This is absolute solipsism.

What you trying to convey is like we all are part of some larger mind which contain infininite sub minds inside it. NO. this is not absolute solipsism.

[Inliytened1]

14 minutes ago, machiavelli said:

@Inliytened1 Have you watched Leos solipsism video? 

He is not saying one large mind containing all infinite finite mind which each having thoughts of their own and experiences.

Solipsism says " other mind donot exist outside your own".

In absolute solipsism only one mind  which is absolute is there which dream up every dream character . The dream character donot have their own pov. Nor experiences.

This is absolute solipsism.

What you trying to convey is like we all are part of some larger mind which contain infininite sub minds inside it. NO. this is not absolute solipsism.

Yes I listened to it. You are not understanding the video.   He is not talking about the ego mind he is talking about Gods Mind which is Your Mind.  And yes there is nothing outside of Your Mind as God.

[Vibes]

@Leo Gura @Inliytened1 Some people in this forum say that I will live every possible life, including Leo's & Inliytened1's lives. Because of Infinity.

I understand that this is something I'm imagining right now (that one day I will live every possible life), because the future is something I imagine now...

But I need some clarification about this. Why do some say that? In Infinity, isn't it just a potentiality that I CAN live every possible life, but that doesn't mean I will?

Do you know what I mean?

 

[Inliytened1]

6 minutes ago, Vibes said:

@Leo Gura @Inliytened1 Some people in this forum say that I will live every possible life, including Leo's & Inliytened1's lives. Because of Infinity.

I understand that this is something I'm imagining right now (that one day I will live every possible life), because the future is something I imagine now...

But I need some clarification about this. Why do some say that? In Infinity, isn't it just a potentiality that I CAN live every possible life, but that doesn't mean I will?

Do you know what I mean?

 

It's Infinity.  You are everything right now.  You are your parents and every other being right now.  The potential is the Actualized.  And the form is the formless.   You don't need to live out other lives.  

[Leo Gura]

3 hours ago, Arthogaan said:

But can't God have two dreams at once?

Ask yourself why it would need to when it can achieve exactly the same result with one dream.

In a sense you're assuming that if God dreamed two dreams at once this would somehow make your girlfriend more real than if you dreamed her up. But that difference is precisely something you can't take for granted, since all difference is itself imaginary.

If you think there is a difference between one dream and two dreams, that difference is itself a dream, see?

Dreaming is the creation and holding of differences.

"God is dreaming many dreams in parallel" << Is this not a dream?

[Carl-Richard]

Another misunderstanding solipsism thread. Here is an idea: instead of calling it "solipsism" (solus = alone, ipse = self), call it "unipsism" (unus = one, ipse = self), because there is only one self, and the misunderstanding comes from assuming there are multiple selves. There are no other selves to not be conscious. Everything is conscious-ness.

[WokeBloke]

23 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Ask yourself why it would need to when it can achieve exactly the same result with one dream.

In a sense you're assuming that if God dreamed two dreams at once this would somehow make your girlfriend more real than if you dreamed her up. But that difference is precisely something you can't take for granted, since all difference is itself imaginary.

If you think there is a difference between one dream and two dreams, that difference is itself a dream, see?

Dreaming is the creation and holding of differences.

"God is dreaming many dreams in parallel" << Is this not a dream?

When you are responding to me do you think you are talking to an imaginary being?