Eating meat is Perfect. Consider not doing it.

[Arthogaan]

I wanted to comment some old post and got the notification to post a new thread instead. It is just my opinion. 

The fact that everything is perfect, and that all is imaginary and that there is only consciousness does not mean that we can't imrove the harmony within that dream. We can strive to decrease suffering just for the sake of it being beautiful. Of course there is no need to.

I was on a Keto diet for 4 years (mainly meat, fish, eggs). So I am the last one to judge anyone. But then I watched Yurofsky speech :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5hGQDLprA8&ab_channel=GaryYourofsky
and movie Dominion (Highly recommended).

And I just cried. Even though I already knew at that point that there ultimately is no suffering. That all of death and life is just a beautiful dance. That there is no good vs bad. But still with that in mind it made me shed some tears. And I stopped eating meat and went vegan the next day. Now I am vegetarian because it is so much easier to start a day with some scrambled eggs for me and I totally know that I ignore the pain of those beings just to be a little more comfortable for breakfast. Maybe I could be considered more evil than average meat-eater, because of being totally conscious of the pain but still eating my eggs. Everyone has their ignorance bar at some level and I am no different. 

It is not even about killing and eating. It is about the tortures that these poor souls go through in these farms. The legs of chickens are breaking because they can not withstand the fast growth. The mother cows cry for their children ( they have a very strong matternal instinct/love). They do not ever see sun. They have the same emotions that cats and dogs have. Cows and pigs for sure.

Yes. Plants are also living being. Also can feel pain of some sorts. But if you care for plants too you should stop eating meat. The 80% of plant production is just for meat production. 26% of global water consumption is wasted on meat. Only 4% of calories that we feed animals is then consumed by us in the form of meat. We lose 96% of calories we would have had from plants. It is extremelly inefficient process. Kurzgesagt video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxvQPzrg2Wg&ab_channel=Kurzgesagt–InaNutshell

So if you think that plants are living beings that also should be respected then you should have even more motivation to resign from meat.
Or if you just care about environment.

So if you are one of those lucky people like me, that do not need meat to feel good, to be healthy - because totally for some it is needed (for example Bentinho Massaro tried to be vegan but it quickly deteriorated his health and he said it was a really powerful catalyst for him to understand the dance of life) - if you are one of those lucky ones please consider decreasing you consumption. Love ya.

 

[PurpleTree]

often want to buy meat (like today about an hour ago)

today i wanted to buy bacon

then i look at the meat at the store and can't bring myself to buy it

 

 

i do eat meat though and feel better if i do sometimes

[jimwell]

Cows are delicious. But they also have intelligence and emotions, similar to humans. This inner conflict punctures my soul. 

[Juan]

I am vegan since 2018, it took sometime to transition because since the hurricane Maria on 2017, Puerto Rico was very limited on resource/food so I was eating for quite some time canned foods. I became first pescatarian, eating lots of canned tuna back then and bread (chef boyardee also but rarely, I had to improvise), when things started to get better I added Salmon and later on that year I told myself “well I’m here now, I think this is the time to change my diet for good”, and became vegetarian for 7 months till I became completely vegan.

My intentions was mostly for myself, it made me feel lighter and less heavy compared after eating lots of meat. Nowadays sure, I have more reasons like helping the enviroment. I suggest two strong and good documentaries which make you understand the impact of climate change by supporting the consumption of cow products, meat and fish (I’m ok if is local and pasteurized/grassfeed but still by how climate change is looking, I will stay vegan):

 

If I’m traveling and I have to improvise with eating some animal products (which had happened with eggs and cheese and I was starving af), sure no problem, I get back on track.

Do your best is what counts for me.????

Edited March 15, 2022 by Juan

[Lyubov]

I’m careful about my meat consumption. Not eating it is out of the question. It’s quite difficult when you’re traveling to rely on a vegetarian diet to get all your nutrients. It’s sure as hell easier than vegan but I still need to have a meat based meal once a day or so for protein and nutrients. I don’t feel good if I avoid meat entirely. I tried vegetarianism before and it wasn’t for me. 

[BlueOak]

A spiritual reason if you go in this direction is you ingest the animals suffering. You take that into you. On all levels from the meat to the soul. So if an animal has been kept in a cage all its life in squalid conditions that is becoming part of you. An animal in the wild, has lived a long life free of imprisonment, its the moment of death mostly that is its suffering, the rest of life is not based on disfigurement of body/spirit that often accompany animals living in a cage.

And of course you are the animal, so treat it as you would want to be treated. That tends to be what happens with people, how they interpret the world is how they react to their interpretations, and so what they experience or create in their life.

*Expanding this meaning: Part of you. Being party of society, part of life, how you react to the world, relate to it, what we create etc.

Edited March 15, 2022 by BlueOak

[SriSriJustinBieber]

I don't have anything specific to share on this particular subject but I would like to say that perfection means that there is no lack, not that there is no growth. If there was no growth, life would be stuck in a form and there would therefore be a lack of freedom, which would make things less than perfect

[vizual]

I do believe the transition to a plant based diet will go gradually. Meat will become more expensive, environmentalism will become a bigger topic in the future, higher awareness of animal suffering, people will become more health conscious etc.

Just like we will gradually phase out our reliance on oil and probably go toward nuclear energy. Because of a plethora of reasons.

[Sucuk Ekmek]

I notice veganism becoming more and more mainstream. I don't think it has something to do with consciousness. It's just the resources becoming more and more scarce for meat industury plus in future resources will be harder to obtain via dollar or euro(or their digital version), Russia is about to make a shift in trade system. For example Germany is  not banning gas cars for grenny reason, they simply don't have the oil. One last thing, I also think it's easier to exploit and manupilate someone who is  herbivore than someone omnivore. 

[mojsterr]

Meat will come in the form of insects

[kamwalker]

If one says they are conscious that suffering is imaginary and so it doesn't actually matter if one eats meat or not then they should also ask themselves why they selectively choose to not induce suffering in other aspects of life. Just acknowledge you have an egoic bias towards eating meat. 

[mojsterr]

4 hours ago, kamwalker said:

If one says they are conscious that suffering is imaginary and so it doesn't actually matter if one eats meat or not then they should also ask themselves why they selectively choose to not induce suffering in other aspects of life. Just acknowledge you have an egoic bias towards eating meat. 

Evolution requests of us to eat meat. We need to survive too.

Edited March 16, 2022 by mojsterr

[Cathal]

people just backwards rationalize to avoid feeling guilty for doing something they know is wrong - they just can't give up the comfort of eating meat for the suffering of those beings because they just don't give a shit and that's all, if you brought any of them to a slaughterhouse they would burst into a catharsis but hey it just is what it is, for sure the world is going in the right direction though in that sense

[Lyubov]

I think starting with cutting out mammals is a good first step. Stick to birds and fish in moderation. 

[Manusia]

Land of Hope and Glory (UK 'Earthlings' Documentary)

Dare to watch? Hell on earth

Why god allowed such painful experience to occur? I wonder this.

Edited March 16, 2022 by Manusia

[mojsterr]

2 hours ago, catcat69123 said:

people just backwards rationalize to avoid feeling guilty for doing something they know is wrong - they just can't give up the comfort of eating meat for the suffering of those beings because they just don't give a shit and that's all, if you brought any of them to a slaughterhouse they would burst into a catharsis but hey it just is what it is, for sure the world is going in the right direction though in that sense

Are you against farmed meat or against all meat?

For example, if a cow had a life on the pastures and no stress.

[Cathal]

@mojsterr man i can already see where this conversation is going, i have seen what you wrote and you are just emotionally attached to an opinion. it's pointless

all i would say is if you actually cared about human beings you would stop eating meat, either way that shit is going to become as socially unaccepted as slavery so whether you want to slow down or progress humanity is your choice

[DocWatts]

I take a Harm Reduction approach myself. In that my approach has been to adopt a diet that's something like %98 vegetarian and %75 vegan.

Basically I don't buy animal products when I purchase groceries and will always order vegetarian or vegan when I'm at a restaurant if that's an option (vegetarian meals are almost always an option, vegan options tend to be more limited).

That said, most of my social relationships are with friends and family who aren't vegetarian or vegan, so rather than ask for special preparations on my account or decline to attend I will occasionally eat meat if I'm in a social situation where a meal is being served.

 

Edited March 16, 2022 by DocWatts

[mojsterr]

1 hour ago, catcat69123 said:

@mojsterr man i can already see where this conversation is going, i have seen what you wrote and you are just emotionally attached to an opinion. it's pointless

all i would say is if you actually cared about human beings you would stop eating meat, either way that shit is going to become as socially unaccepted as slavery so whether you want to slow down or progress humanity is your choice

I was in your place before. I was vegan too. But the more I contemplated it, the less sense it made. Until I just stopped. I also saw the toll it makes on long term vegans. You can see the body doesn't react properly and starts showing all kinds of problems.

So in nature everything kills each other. This is how life is set up. How it was always set up. We have just become too detached with ourselves and with it and with our nature and we are trying to go against it. Because we have become soft.

If you look at the animal kingdom and how one animal dies for another, you see it's fucking terrifying. They are being eaten alive and dying slowly in agonizing pain. The animals that dye quickly and painlessly are rare. This is how it is meant to be, unfortunatelly, me liking it or not. So who am I to say I know better than life. It was created in this way and no other. I guess for a reason.

So I've come to tearms wth myself and if I really want to accept life as a whole, I have to accept the dark side, aswell as good side. Which is difficult.

So I think meat is absolutely neccessary for humans to live healthy. This is how nature made us. No point in denying that.

 

The only thing I agree with would be the nature in how the animals live, while in cages and everything concerning the meat industry. It could be done better.

 

 

Edit: I've posted this interview two times now, I'll do it one last time. Because this was my final tipping point. Everything I've contemplated, she affirmed, and explained it really well. She's been a vegan for 20 years, before having to change back to meat, because her body couldn't handle it anymore. So that's why I'm not very confident that any person can survive just on vegan diet alone.

If you're not affraid of your views being challenged, I urge you to watch it. I'd like to see your opinion.

https://www.sacredcow.info/lierre-keith?fbclid=IwAR2Q3XCB7obwMBA7CMI2SkiLcoAWjSUI8M1dT_iBWA4iGSgZBnv18Q8NjtQ

Edited March 16, 2022 by mojsterr

[Scholar]

7 minutes ago, mojsterr said:

I was in your place before. I was vegan too. But the more I contemplated it, the less sense it made. Everything kills each other. This is how life is made. We have just become too detached with ourselves and with our nature and are trying to go against it.

If you look at the animal kingdom and how an animal dies for another, you see it's fucking terrifying. They are being eaten alive and dying slowly in agonizing pain. The animals that dye quickly and painlessly are rare. So who am I to say I know better than life. It was created in this way and no other. I guess for a reason.

So I've come to tearms wth myself and if I really want to accept life as a whole, I have to accept the dark side, aswell as good side.

So I think meat is absolutely neccessary for humans to live healthy. This is how nature made us. No point in denying that.

 

The only thing I agree with would be the nature in how the animals live, while in cages and everything concerning the meat industry. It could be done better.

I don't think you actually accept the dark sides of life. You accept the dark sides of life if they serve you. For example, if you want to eat meat, you accept the dark sides of life. If someone rapes you and cuts your limbs off, you'll call for the institutions to protect you real quick.

In the end I think you will not apply your logic to humans and yourself because it wouldn't be self serving, and in my opinion all of this "contemplation" is about serving yourself rather than actually accepting anything. It's easy to accept suffering when it's not your suffering, and it's easy to accept death when it is not yours.

 

That's just more devilry in my book.