Do all vegans have deficiencies? vitamins and minerals

[remember]

what is shocking for me sometimes is, when i travel but also at home, how much of healthy food is thrown away or more so trashed by peeling grains. by peeling grains we throw away almost all vitamins, minerals and a lot of proteins which are the most valuable of the grain. and we also throw away a lot of the volume of food that would make us healthy, nourished but the opposite of fat. sometimes i wonder why people don’t wonder about why grain was so important for so many high cultures, even pseudo grain was (the pseudo about it is not the nutrition factor but only the fact that it’s botanically not a grain).

what makes bread unhealthy is basically the peeling of it and not the gluten, the gluten becomes only unhealthy because it’s consumed in an unhealthy way.

you could then call it sponge bread - it’s so empty it sucks.

Edited January 20, 2020 by remember

[Cocolove]

@Shiva That, plus permaculture in either case is way better. The environmental impact of any plant could be bad if it isn't from a sustainable technique. Monoculture is gross.

[doom]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

@Shiva I don't want to litigate the ethical issues of meat-eating here.

It should be pretty obvious that factory farming is problematic from a consciousness perspective and we should minimize it as much as possible. It should also be equally obvious why a complete elimination will not happen any time soon.

Obviously because I am selfish and engaged in survival.

To put it another way, if you and I were in a boat together in the middle of the sea, I would eat you and not feel too guilty about it, since that is life If you don't like it, you can file a complaint with God in the afterlife.

 

screenshotted

[Annoynymous]

@Shiva even if we do not keep cows in the farm, would they be just cease to exist?

If they don't,  they would eat plants anyway because they would also want to survive like human.

[Farnaby]

I've been a vegetarian for 3 1/2 years, but recently quit and started eating fish and meat again.

For me, the reason I went back to eating animals was mostly selfish lol. I just felt like I was repressing myself too much, especially after some years of being vegetarian. Every time someone would cook some shrimps, or a tasty looking meal which included meat or fish, I was fighting my urge to eat it. I wanted to eat it but was convincing myself not to do it.

Maybe I was being more ethical then and I often feel a little guilty about eating animals again, but I think this life is too short to be too restrictive with myself. 

On a health level, I actually have a better gut health now than when I was a vegetarian. Not saying that meat is healthier because I tend to have digestive problems regardless and those problems may very well be unrelated to specific food, but experientally I definitely feel a difference. 

 

[JalenS23]

On 1/19/2020 at 3:58 PM, Leo Gura said:

I think what everyone overlooks is the simple fact that people have different nutritional needs. There is no one best diet in the abstract. The question is always: What is the best diet FOR ME? And that you can only discover through trial and error.

There are many factors at play: your genetics, geography, climate, your budget, your health conditions, your level of development, etc.

I have found that vegetarian does not work well for me. It doesn't give me the energy that I need to function well. But it would be a mistake to apply my conclusion to all other people. My conclusion is for me.

Maybe not in an objective sense, but whats if its possible for each species to have a species specific diet. A diet that our bodies and all human bodies are physiologically designed to eat, and one that we can eat in its raw natural state without the need of processing like cooking. In the same way that cows eat grass, birds eat grains, lions eat meat, squirrels eat nuts, a diet that fits their digestion system seemingly perfect and one they can eat in its raw natural state. What if that diet for humans is a raw vegan diet. A diet consisting of mostly fruit, leafy greens, maybe some veggies, and a small amount of nuts and seeds (preferably soaked imo). From my experience and research, a fruit based raw vegan diet, or at least a high raw vegan diet (mostly fresh raw plant foods with fruit being the staple, little to no cooked food, 0 animal products except maybe some honey, I know some raw vegans that consume honey and other bee byproducts ) seems to be the most optimal diet for humans when it comes to digestion, energy levels, spiritual connection, healing dis-ease, etc. Leo, I truly think this way of eating has the power to transform the masses to a MUCH more conscious society possibly more directly than any other method (Except maybe 5meo and other psychedelics ?), I think this diet has the power to change somebody dramatically on every single level with their level of consciousness being one of the biggest. Its amazing. I would love to see you experiment with a fully raw vegan diet for 30-90 days. Getting most of your calories from fresh fruit and keeping it low fat. Excluding all animal products, and excluding all cooked foods for the duration of the experiment. Being sure you’re consuming enough calories a day. 2000-3000 calories I’d personally recommend for a male. I would highly recommend reading the book “The 801010 diet” by Douglas Graham. Its basically the blueprint foundation for transitioning to eating a fruit based, high carb, raw vegan diet and making it a part of your lifestyle. 

[SgtPepper]

On 1/18/2020 at 8:44 PM, Cocolove said:

Idk man, I Bobby is a little better that sv3rige but I don't think those people are valid sources of wisdom or just info.

There are other sources too:

Aajonous Vonderplanitz

Dr. Natasha Campbell-Mcbride- look at her GAPS diet.

Weston Price and his foundation.

The German Nutrition Society is also hesitant of the diet (https://www.npr.org/sections/thesalt/2016/09/12/492433069/can-a-vegan-diet-give-you-all-you-need-german-nutritionists-say-nein)

Not to mention, there is scientific evidence that Fish is healthy. Meat is healthy because it has nutrients like creatine, zinc, iron, and b12. Organs like chicken liver have real vitamin A.

In addition, there was many people who went vegan who did not go raw and it still did not work for them. People who went vegan for 7 years! tried everything, it still did not work for them. 

 

[Sri McDonald Trump Maharaj]

 

[pluto]

The people who have deficiencies are people who..

1. Eat only or mostly cooked foods. No Enzymes = little absorption body has to work several times harder thus you require more rest/sleep.

2. Overly cook their foods = Further destroy nutrition, destroy phytochemicals, antioxidants, chlorophyll and other important things in food which are required for optimal health and bodily functions.

3. Eat a lot of processed and junk foods/drinks = Chemically destroying the body and disrupting its functions and hormonal balance.

4. Do not consume enough Raw Living Foods = Structured Water and Enzymes are the key elements here.

Its rarely a deficiency issue, its a absorption issue.

The body is extremely intelligent, it can create nutrients from other nutrients if needed and use the bodies natural reserves.

When you consume mostly raw living food in its natural state, you gradually restore the gut flora and the whole system starts functioning again.

When you are healthy you will notice you will probably only need 1/3rd of what you used to eat to get by and yet have more energy than before.

Supplements become obsolete vegan or not when your system is healthy.

Omnivores and people who eat meat/diary are just as deficient as vegans who eat processed food.

Be Health Conscious, A tablespoon of bee pollen has more bio-available amino acids than a whole steak.

Less = More

Every time you eat cooked food or have a meal you should take digestive enzymes with probotics before and after the meal.

Notice the difference!

HTH

 

 

 

[Leo Gura]

Humans are more diverse than a single other species because we adapted to live all over the world.

Humans who survived in Alaska didn't do it on fruit.

[Hatfort]

Three months vegan and not going back. Belly fat gone, enegy level awesome and better mood, conscience and will power.

I bought those B12 vitamin pills, started taking a bit ago, but apparently omnivores get deficient as much when tested. Heard it is found in water lentils, but have not seen them anywhere, so going with the pills. They are so cheap, a whole year supply less than 10€. I'm actually enjoying discovering new healthy foods. The other day I was buying food in the supermarket and felt like I increased the difficulty of an RPG video game, didn't see it as bad, but an enjoyable challenge.

It's true we are omnivores, meaning we can eat a diverse diet, but some things are healthier than others. Well balanced plant based is much better long term and short term there's nothing wrong either. I'll get a bit into biology, we humans can't hunt as lions, tigers, leopards or wolves do. We can't compete with preys in speed and strength and our teeth and claws are no way enough to kill them, we can only do it with weapons or farming them. Our digestive system is not optimal to eat raw animals either, we need to process them with fire or other methods to avoid deadly bacterial infections. So it would be interesting to know how and when our diet came to be as it is and how we evolved as a species in relation, but we don't have a time machine unfortunatelly. Monkeys just don't prey on other big animals, that should be taken into consideration too, because they are our closest cousins. They mostly eat plants, fruits and insects and it is thought their big teeth can be to compete with other males for the females and maybe to defend themselves from dangerours predators too.

The thing about the eyes in front or sides does not always apply to predator or prey, as many omnivores like to point as a prove we should eat meat. From totally plant eater monkeys with their eyes in front, to sharks in the top of the chain in the sea or totally carnivore dinosaurs, that have them in the sides, like the rex or the raptors, to mention the popular ones.

[JalenS23]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Humans are more diverse than a single other species because we adapted to live all over the world.

Humans who survived in Alaska didn't do it on fruit.

True, but I don’t think that takes away that humans could have originated in the tropics and that tropical environments are where humans are best suited for. I wouldn’t even say humans are truly adapted to live in Alaska and colder climates even though we can, in order for us to do so we have to use modern technologies. If we were to walk around naked in Alaska, we’d freeze or be very uncomfortable. And of course, that’s not an ideal environment to grow fresh produce. Fresh tropical fruits and veggies. So I’d say yes, it’d be hard to eat an optimal diet (imo, fruit based raw vegan) in an environment that humans are not suited for. But that doesn’t take away that the optimal diet for humans still might be a fully raw, fruit based diet and that its best equipped in tropical environments. With that being said, I follow people from all around the world that still manage to eat a fruitarian, raw vegan diet in colder climates. Still, I would love to see you experiment with this diet for 30-90 days more from the personal development/spirituality perspective. You might also experience a new level of health, vitality, and even complete healing of certain ailments like adrenal fatigue and thyroid issues that i’ve think i’ve heard you mention.
If you want to check out some people on YouTube that eat this way and teach the lifestyle I’d recommend checking out Loren Lockman, RawHealingMastery, Raw Intuition, Raw Food Romance, RawVeganRising, Ted Carr, TannyRaw, RawTropicalLiving, Sweet Natural Living, RawNattyN8, John Rose. I feel like most of the raw vegan/fruitarians that I’ve seen online seem to be on the upwards trajectory of spiral dynamic development and are ultimately light workers. I would just love to see this lifestyle integrated with Actualized.org and your teachings (which is my self bias, but I think if you experienced the transformative power and potential of this lifestyle you might see why) 

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, JalenS23 said:

humans could have originated in the tropics and that tropical environments are where humans are best suited for. I wouldn’t even say humans are truly adapted to live in Alaska and colder climates even though we can, in order for us to do so we have to use modern technologies.

This just doesn't square with the facts.

Humans have successfully adapted to cold environs for 100,000s of years. In fact, cold climates are more ideal for the growth of civilization, which is why the most developed countries are from the north, generally speaking.

Eskimos are well adpated to living in Alaska and Nepalese have specially adapted lungs for living in the high altitudes. They can climb Mt Everest without oxygen tanks when most white people need to use oxygen tanks.

And of course our skin colors have fully adapted to the climate we hail from.

Evolution adapts fast. It's always adapting, even today.

Humans and technology go hand in hand. These two cannot be treated seperately. Technology is a huge part of our evolution. We have adapted to cooked meat, fire, clothing, etc. long ago.

Don't forget, we lived through the ice age and ate all the mammoths (probably). If you hail from Europe, eating mammoths is in your DNA.

[remember]

@Leo Gura although they „survived“ their diet is not based on meat alone but also eat grains and roots, except for the inuit who ate fish and whales and so on but even with the strictly meat eaters they ate the whole of the animal not just the muscle peaces. and they are not the most populated people in the world. tibetans are an interesting case as their leaders and monks are actually not eating meat so spiritually the people you mention developed vegetarianism. 

the people of the andes survived because they had amaranth and maca. yes as time changed humans adapted, in the ice age and without other methods they had to live on meat. but if we would adapt today...it’s the contrary of ice age and we have other methods. surviving means surviving. changing diet to survive means also going down with meat consumption.

the high cultures all developed systems to survive - they developed higher because they had to prepare and plan and organize and store, not because they were eating meat.

Edited January 22, 2020 by remember

[JalenS23]

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

This just doesn't square with the facts.

Humans have successfully adapted to cold environs for 100,000s of years. In fact, cold climates are more ideal for the growth of civilization, which is why the most developed countries are from the north, generally speaking.

Eskimos are well adpated to living in Alaska and Nepalese have specially adapted lungs for living in the high altitudes. They can climb Mt Everest without oxygen tanks when most white people need to use oxygen tanks.

And of course our skin colors have fully adapted to the climate we hail from.

Evolution adapts fast. It's always adapting, even today.

Humans and technology go hand in hand. These two cannot be treated seperately. Technology is a huge part of our evolution. We have adapted to cooked meat, fire, clothing, etc. long ago.

Don't forget, we lived through the ice age and ate all the mammoths (probably). If you hail from Europe, eating mammoths is in your DNA.

Hmmm. I just feel like there’s still a difference between being able to adapt to withstand tough situations, like surviving in extremely cold environments and needing to eat meat purely for survival. Compared to living in an optimal environment that much better suits our needs. Sunlight, warm temperature, fresh water, fresh produce. Would you be physically comfortable living butt naked in a cold environment? Shouldn’t that say something? 
Past all of that, what about our digestive tract? From everything I’ve seen. Our digestive tract is most similar to our primate relatives. A frugivorous species. I think humans are frugivores. Fruit is really the main food that in its raw natural state is appealing to the senses, beautiful colors, aromas, tastes amazing on its own without seasonings or salt, we don’t need to cook or process it. We’re naturally attracted to it. When you see a cow, do you have any instinct to run up and take it down like a carnivore? To eat it raw with all of its blood and guts? Probably not haha but of course, cook it, add salt, disguise the unappealing taste of meat with plant seasonings and now it’s palatable. It seems clear to me that we aren’t designed to eat meat or any other animal products. Of course we have and we are able to, in a sense we have adapted to it due to necessity out of survival, but I don’t think that means that its optimal or necessary in today’s world for most people. (Unless you still live in tribal cultures or somewhere where eating meat is the only option for survival) I think our bodies are designed to and thrive when we get most of our calories from fresh raw, unprocessed plant foods. With the staple calories coming from ripe fruit. Of course, I wouldn’t say fully raw or fruitarian is necessary for everyone, it can be a tough transition to make to completely let go of cooked food. I’m also not advocating for a strictly fruit only diet. I think leafy greens can be very healthy, as well as moderate amounts of nuts and seeds, avocados, superfoods like Spirulina, maca, some veggies, etc. I also still recommend eating clean cooked plant foods especially when transitioning to a fully raw vegan diet, if thats what one desires, like sweet potatoes, squashes, steamed veggies, quiona, buckwheat, muclessless whole plant based cooked foods. Lastly, in terms of just going vegan. Clearly nowadays, if you have access to a grocery store. You have the choice to choose plant based options. The science is there that a fully plant based diet is suitable for health in all stages of life. So yeah, other than personal preference survival. I don’t believe eating meat from a grocery store when you have the option to buy fruits, veggies, beans, rice, sweet potatoes, etc, is a necessary survival that justifies supporting the direct killing of another animal. Something that I think is one of the most direct reasons of why there’s so much dysfunction and violence in the world. Most of the world is consuming literal death. Animal products, processed foods, lots of heavy cooked foods. Those foods breed animalistic consciousness imo. There’s a spectrum, some people are still able to develop their consciousness juristically like you imo, while continuing to eat animal products and lots of cooked foods. But on the other side of the spectrum I think is where we have the psychopaths, the murders, rapists, devils, etc. which is the effect of the foods that rot the body and the mind imo. I think the connection food has on behavior is mind-blowing. The root cause of the disconnect from pure consciousness and love imo. So much so that if the world magically changed their diet to a high raw or fully raw vegan diet overnight. (which I know isn’t practical) Most “evil” I believe would completely disintegrate, or at least a very large amount. And society would be much more consciousness, compassionate, and have little to no violence. The only way I think you’ll really understand what i’m saying is if you give a fully raw vegan diet a try for at least 30-90 days. 

[Leo Gura]

Dalai Lama eats meat when he's traveling.

@JalenS23 Again, you underestimate how well adapted humans are to their technology. Cooking food is baked into our DNA. It's not something we just do nowadays. We've been doing it since before we were even homo sapiens. Likewise for things like wearing furs. Your body is bald precisely because it adapted to wearing clothing.

[Spiral Wizard]

11 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Likewise for things like wearing furs. Your body is bald precisely because it adapted to wearing clothing.

Wim Hof: Hold my beer 

[remember]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

Dalai Lama eats meat when he's traveling.

so you make the exception a rule? and use the dalai lama as spiritual reference to justify meat eating? how twisted is that?

maybe you could consider contemplating the difference between the rule and the exception...that’s one of my favorite lessons yet to come 

also if baking is in our dna...

some foods are better to be processed (peeled,cooked,baked) because of biochemical reasons, but we can also eat a lot of them as micro greens. or bake wholegrain at low temperature. (don’t have a raw diet - but i‘m sure it would be better - although there has to be something to work towards)

Edited January 22, 2020 by remember

[Esoteric]

2 hours ago, JalenS23 said:

Hmmm. I just feel like there’s still a difference between being able to adapt to withstand tough situations, like surviving in extremely cold environments and needing to eat meat purely for survival. Compared to living in an optimal environment that much better suits our needs. Sunlight, warm temperature, fresh water, fresh produce. Would you be physically comfortable living butt naked in a cold environment? Shouldn’t that say something? 
 

@JalenS23 Humans at harsh environments had to go beyond their capabilities and use their brains to the max to survive. Getting harshness thrown at you actually make you stronger and more capable if you endure it. Have you noticed that privileged kids who got everything served to them are not very pleasant to be around. Shouldn't that say something? 

[Hatfort]

It's true we adapt fast, in fact we do it while we are alive in some degree. But not so fast, If you take a black baby from Africa to live with a Inuit tribe, he is going to be fine, he will start wearing fur like the rest and eat the food available and survive in their culture and environment. Does it mean his ancestors and genes are adapted to wear fur and other variables in that climate? I don't think so. His skin will be darker for where they ancestors lived, not for himself, but he won't die for that. If you take an Inuit baby and bring it to an African tribe where they mostly eat plants, he is just going to dress like them and his skin is going to adapt while he is alive too, whatever his ancestors did for thousands of years. I don't want to separete humans using fire, weapons or shoes from the evolution, but there are still very intrinsic things in us that we haven't left behind. If we stop using footwear, our feet are going to be well. That would be for our digestive system too, we don't need meat, we are fine without it, but in some environments was all there was, we only needet it that context, not that we really do. We can survive very long and have children breathing the smoke of cars and other filth daily too, that doesn't make it ideal and maybe our bodies will start evolving to detoxify more efficiently in time, but I wouldn't wait for it.

In evolution, what mattered most was if we could surivive long enough to have children. So if we can live long enough for that with mostly fish and meat, like the Inuits, fine by evolution. It's still healthier for them to eat more plant based though, they will live longer. Same for mammoth eating Asians and Europeans, whatever they did in the Ice Age.