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Everything Leo speaks in this video in regards to awakening and god i have personally encountered, the difference is I don't call it God or Love or Consciousness. And I stopped giving them importances. Awakening is the most extraordinary thing one can imagine yes it is absolutely mind blowing, so infinite that there is no more mind. No more levels consciousness. No more form or emptiness. Even Awakenings and Realizations and even enlightenment itself are perceived to be the stuff of the dream. Of course all these "experiences" will make you shit in your pants, physically dying, being so blown away you're no longer human, and they are all encountered on the Path. But eventually they are all absorbed and transcended. The more ordinary the more Divine. The better way to put IT is that it transcends even the notion of extraordinary vs. ordinary. On no Self being a "minor" Realization: Temporary experience of no Self on meditation or psychedelic is not the same as Realization of no Self. Realization is deeper than a transcendental experience and both are "minor" sure. But the permanent dropping away of self/Self is on another dimension altogether. After self/Self drops away there is nothing but God and Infinity 24 7. There is a quantum difference between a self perceiving God in the center vs. permanently dropping away of any center or vintage point, and there's only Godhead Comprehending and Creating Itself ad Infinite. Now I can only speak from personal experience but before self/Self permanently drops, even the most mind blowing experiences still comes from a self. If you had a Realization or an "experience", then you find yourself shifting back to separated state then it's a temporary experience of a self and not a Realization, let along the permanent dropping away of center, which is beyond any teachings of contemporary Neo Advida or most mainstream or new age spirituality teachings. In fact it's beyond spirituality altogether. There's absolutely no reference point to the "experience" of permanently dropping away of self/Self. There is no words to describe it. It robs everything away from you, even Consciousness itself and all of your previous Realization. There is no perceiver, no agency, no center at all times. The enlightened self sitting on his throne of Nirvana is the final layer of the dream. edit: Buddha didn't teach Absolute Self. He taught no-self AND No-Self, which is the middle way, the merging and transcendence of Being/Non-Being, Absolute Infinity and Absolute Nothingness. But No Self IS True Self, so let's not get bogged down to terminologies. But I see way too many people on the Path getting stuck in the identification to an Absolute Self. Cessation is 0 consciousness. Complete black out. Which makes this Insight extremely valuable because non existence is in a totally different order than existence. No consciousness is in a totally different order than levels of consciousness. YET they're also exactly the same because 2 sides of the extremes eventually cancel each other out and become 0 when they meet as death is Love/life. But I'm still on the fence whether it's necessary for awakening. In my direct experience it's the ultimate no experience that truly truly re-wires the brain permanently. It takes 5 to 10 years of meditation to get your first cessation. After awakening you can get 10 cessations in 30 mins of sitting. (What I'm more interested in is permanent shifts. It doesn't matter how many awakenings one's had, but if moment to moment perception isn't permanently altered, say shifting from 720 to 1080 to 4K 360 and 8k 360 or the self dissolving from solidity to liquid to air, then there is no Realization). Enlightenment is not a state of consciousness. It's 0 if you want to put a number on the dial, which also makes it Infinite and in-quantifiable. All "levels of consciousness" belongs to the dream and are the by products of "peeling away of separation/conditions". Enlightenment is deeper than consciousness or even awareness. As krishnamurti said "The moment you are aware of Awareness, you are not aware of Awareness" It's deeper than total unity and Oneness. As Adyshanti said, you eventually "wake up out of Oneness". You could say it's the _______ prior to unity and all states of consciousness. Prior to and it's what manifest the dial on the awakening scale. Shinzen young describes the path as going from surface level consciousness to Source. And many people on the Path got diverted from going directly to Source to sidetracking themselves to the content/manifestation of Source mid path (although Source is Appearance. Content IS context. But this cannot be Realized unless one's abiding in Source as Source). But what happens AFTER Source is Realized? Sure one can continue to explore. There is no end to the Infinitude of Reality. But as I've emphasized many times, there is a event horizon you cross before and after enlightenment. Ramana Maharishi and many other sages on that level all point to the fact that enlightenment itself has no levels. You're either there or you're not. And it's not a process happening anywhere. The question of whether or not it's a brain/mind State becomes completely irrelevant.

I decided I am going to keep a journal of each of the "personalities" within me. I am doing this to keep track of the needs, desires, fears, and level of consciousness of each so I can release them. I will release each cluster of thought patterns until I eradicate myself back to nothingness. Leaving myself everything. 11: This dominating part of me doesn't want to be responsible for anything. The part of me just wants to go from experience to experience, worry-free and unattached. This part wants to be completely detached from everything and everyone. The only thing this part wants anything to do with is nothing. Nothing but whatever comes up and then leaves. No attachments. Not to anything, not to anyone. Not even to itself. This part just wants constant change, growth, realization, and then new ones. This part doesn't even want to be a part. It just wants to live. 22: This part has seen past the nonsense, the chaos. This part recognizes patterns and wants to 'level up' out of these patterns so as to create positive change. This part of me agrees with 11 in wanting new and better experiences. But how can you level up your experience if you are mindlessly engaging in the same behavioral patterns/loops/cycles? 22 wants creation. Crow: This part represents change and transformation. So, like 11, this part wants change and doesn't want to be committed to anything. Except, it does want to be committed to itself. That is what makes this part different from 11. 11's non-attachment goes so deep it doesn't even want to be attached to itself. But Crow wants to track progress. And in order to track anything, it needs to develop a solid and separate sense of self. Crow wants individuality. Because of this, it cares about where it perceives itself in life and outside of life. It considers all angles. Cleopatra: This part is dangerous. It's a dominating aspect that does not consider what's outside of her desires– probably because she doesn't recognize it. This part scares the other parts because it is untamed, ruthless, thoughtless, and action-based. She comes off as a dictator but doesn't mean to be that way even though she is. She is not evil she is unconscious. If you get close to this part, she will sexually blind you, distort your reality, and fulfill your needs unless they interfere with her own. She will do this naturally as she sexually blinds and distorts herself, fulfilling all of her own needs. She's addicted to the sense of oneness but is trapped in her separation. She's controlling. Eva: This part is Cleopatra's opposite. She doesn't want to control she wants to be controlled. The idea of being controlled releases stress for Eva. She actually interprets it as love. It's sick and fucked up and she causes a lot of tension for 11 and Crow who despise controlling environments. Things being handled and done for Eva is something she dreams about. She has a deep-seated belief that she has to do everything herself in life. Unlike the other parts, she does not get off on this belief. She gets off on the idea of someone completely taking over and controlling her. Completely surrendering to life and letting go of everything including herself. She doesn't care what happens to her, she fancies it. She doesn't believe anything comes easily in life. She doesn't believe in other people. She is suffering; she is in a constant state of pain. She's a child. She deserves her needs to be met but cannot meet them on her own.

@Someone here What makes you so sure that time exists? I know you've heard this over and over so I'm not going to repeat any of it here. Past, present, future - all these exist in your mind and nowhere else. Yes, even present. Even "Now" is a thought. And me talking about infinity and nothingness, all that is also just thought. "What is?" Wrong question, it can't be answered. Think of it, with what would you answer it? Obviously just with more of what is. It's a bottomless, infinite mystery. So my question to you is; What makes you think that there is such a thing as "now"? What if it's something like "up" or "left" or "tall" ? An abstraction? A projection? A thought? Maybe "it" is just that and nothing more?

There is a difference between; "Why is there something instead of nothing ?" and "Why is there not nothing ?" The latter being the more important one. The fact something exists is irrelevant because it does. What's more intriguing is why nothingness isn't the standard. All else being equal, it is more efficient and logical for nothing (time, space, matter, energy) to exist.

@Holygrail Oh but the realization of nothingness can go deeper. You've just begun to get in touch with Emptiness and so far, your understanding is almost exclusively on an intellectual level. You still believe in "somethingness" if you're honest with yourself. Only because you have seen through a belief intellectually, doesn't mean that you feel it. But you can. You can feel yourself as nothing and the world as nothing, or both. You will lose your sense of weight. The world may appear like a dream or a hologram. It can be a bit frightening at first, but even that is only because you still think the world is supposed to be something?

thats what i thought, though i believe there's a deeper experience to be had on nothingness than my realization

@wildflower LOL metaphysical claim, his nothingness is no further then GOD. buddhism which is famous for atheism speaks about GOD and claim nothingness is beyond, dont you see the irony in that? It is atheistic and materialism in a religion form. He has no clue at all about GOD obviously. A life denying teaching is what that is.

Everything I talk about is Nothingness.

Fair. The only person in the world for me that speaks different then this, that seems to encapsulate these other teachings but transcends them is Ajahn Brahm, he talks more about nothingness then anyone else. He also is probably one of the meditation masters in the world. I wonder what your thoughts are on the way he describes it, I've timestamped it, it takes 3 minutes, he talks about different states of conciousness, ifninite conciousness, but in the end there is more beyond, I recommend the whole video:

You cant capture infinity and Reality and say oh it is this way but no that way, in the beginning NETI NETI is a great thing but one should see that even if Frank and Leo talks about differences, it is still A MIND who is doing the interpreting, like Frank, he is doing metaphysical claims all the time and he pisses at Leo for doing it too, lol it is unavoidable.. Infinity includes and transcends it all, it is impermanent/permanent, it is everything and nothing. In his stages with GOD / NOTHINGNESS / CESSATIONS etc, that is pure MIND who puts its "experiences" on top of others, making a claim that this "experience" is more important then another, YEAH for him perhaps, likewise LEO has another, i dont doubt the wokeness of any of them, they certainly are.

So my GF has never been big on perusing enlightenment or spirituality in general, but she's always had a keen sense for it. She's been going to school and working and her time has been so preoccupied that one day she experienced nothingness. True absolute nothingness. It was a beautiful experience at first but then the next day she said she saw all of time; past present and future in a sort of "donut" shape that infinitely collapsed in on itself like a strange loop. She knows I understand what she means but she feels like she's going crazy and can't turn off seeing infinity. I've helped her a bit by explaining some of what this means, but also telling her how to ground and be present. She wants to get into meditation but it's never been a big thing for her. I have a feeling that will change soon. Leo's video on The Many Facets of Awakening has been exceptionally relevant for this. I'm very proud of her, but I also understand that this is very scary for her as well as exciting. She's been crying a lot and losing sleep because she keeps slipping into the infinite. I haven't seen her in a week and tomorrow I finally get to be with her again, but if anyone has advice or words of wisdom to help her through this rude and involuntary awakening that would be great. <3

Stumbled upon this gem of a man, it seems he has some very clear nondual insight, in the spirit of the hardcore Christian mystics. Here he speaks on the point of God as Nothingness.

Yes, well I have an other example. I had never meditated or anything and had a full blown awakening, while eating. Eternity, nothingness, no self, no external world, this is a dream. I needed 6 months to "make sense of it" and what happened was I ended up saying. It was a change in perception that made me FEEL LIKE I was in a dream and FELT LIKE it was more true than anything else. The external world SEEMED like it didn't exist and SEEMED like a dream. Basically I integrated a real intense awakening into the materialist paradigm. Fortunately now I know that materiakism is just ONE paradigm, and not the best one for changes in perception/awakenings. Intuitive knowledge doesn't need paradigms I guess.

@Thought Art As far as most mindfullness teachers explain it: it's about the awareness of the absolute 0. Its recognising where everything comes from and where everything goes to. Shinzen Young said: It happens to everyone thousands of times a day, the difference is being conscious of it happening or not. Cessation, dissolution (bhanga) nothingness. It's all about that "0". I don't believe that what you mentioned (beliefs intentions etc.) play a role at all, because it happens through every culture with some people never having heard of spiritual practice, and it's a natural process. Apparently there's a correlation between no-self and age. That's why old people tend to enjoy having children in their presence because, post-egoic and pre-egoic stages are more about love than egoic people who are "serious" and "worried" all the time. Sorry I went on a tangent.

You cannot experience Absolute Nothingness! Your Ego mind can imagine Nothingness from its microscopic limited bubble of reality, but the higher Mind that you are, is consciously creating you from moment to moment, it maintains all your thoughts, ideas, images, beliefs, and emotions. It maintains all the Atoms, molecules, organs, and electromagnetic field of energy that you are. You exist beyond your limited Ego awareness. Consciousness = Thoughts in Action! Thoughts = Energy in Action Energy can never be destroyed. Once a Thought, Idea, image, belief, and Emotion is manifested, it will continue to exist in Absolute Consciousness for eternity. Just sharing a few thoughts, ideas, and beliefs!

"spacious" is a better word, as opposed to the forms appearing within it. See for yourself; "nothingness" isn't as bad as it sounds.

@Goldzilla yeah absolutely. Nothingness is not what you think nothingness is in actuality. This is nothingness, the question is just how conscious are you of what nothing is.

@Strangeloop Hahaha, I like how you shifted gears real quick from "yeah, a bunch of demons entered of demons" to "focus on material development". It's not meditation in particular which lead me to this today, or what lead me to my experience 2 days ago of focus on nothingness. What it was, was that a conversation with a friend of mine where I talked about my feelings revealed something to me I had been ignoring/denying to trying to forget. At the age of about 13, I had some crisis of faith about Islam ( the religion I grew up). I went on a rollercoaster of belief and disbelief. I would stare at the ceiling at night and be in terror, contemplating the prospect of living forever in Heaven. When in belief, I felt very mystically high and in bliss. But I eventually realised Islam was false, logically and morally, and went into a depression about it. That crisis of faith and meaning, it's remained unresolved. "It left a massive hole in me ontologically". One year ago I had a random seeing of Absolute Nothingness, but I ran away. My entire life, I've spent it distracting myself from this "hole". I've spent it distracting myself from this nihilism and nothingness, despite those things being so palpable in experience. That I exist at all! That is insanity inducing enough! Stark, raving mad. Don't you feel it too? But I denied and ignored that feeling, trying to make myself forget. The only bigger insanity than that though is the pretending I'm not insane. And so, it was the realisation that I run away from myself that induced all this, not meditation. A psychological breakdown, I have no sanity left, although I can give the appearance of it to others somehow. I think it's maybe because I simply don't wish to talk to anyone, that would be self defeating if I'm trying to reclaim all authority to myself and be an adult, and stop projecting. I'm on a journey from absolutely nowhere to no thing; life is pointless. Urinate on everything sacred. Enlightenment is a myth, everything is false. Even if it's futile, I'll keep going, because it's the same either way

There is no way of no thoughts in the present moment. You are alive because you continue thinking, even tho you want to experience nothingness that is only another focus on other things than thought. But believe me, you can't stop the thoughts processes without losing your life. You can only switch focus on breath per example and let thoughts come and go. The total dissapearance of thought is a blatant lie of society.

@ivankiss very sure. reconciling with your past may seem impossible in many cases. From the case you mentioned about the child bullied at school, to or the girl sold to a brothel, to the Congolese boy forced to torture his mother, there is a whole range of difficulties. It's not fair, why to me? nothing strengthens the ego more. trying to realize god to forget all that, it never happened ... it doesn't work! first you have to make amends no matter how difficult it is. It is necessary to understand that what is is not subject to what it should be. It comes out of nothingness, and is, without judgment. If you take away his judgment, the trauma turns into a shining jewel. It's liberation from should be, and like you said, it takes courage

There is no "you." What we really are is consciousness (nothingness), which manifests into form (reality). Reality is consciousness. You are reality.

Thank you for the detailed response. I have to say that I struggle with the possibility of the second experience (life, fullness, joy...) being deeper than the first (nothingness, void). Please, don´t take this as a stupid verbal challenge. You were the one experiencing both, and the one who knows the flavour of those insights, but in my meditative experiences everything that has a taste of life, of light, of "somethingness", like in your second trip, is always a product of an aware space where that fullness happens, and this aware void is prior to any experience. So I ask you: if you felt that the Absolute was the fullness, shouldn´t it be also present in the first experience? Again, I am asking this with respect and with the desire to know better about what you experienced. I am fascinated with 5MeO experiences. It´s just that its insights not always coincide with mine, and I want to get to the bottom of it all.

I can speak based on what I experienced with LSD and what Leo said in his "What is death?" video. What you're saying is probably the most accurate outcome of life after death. Leo says it, forum users say it, other sources say it, and LSD showed me it. It's completely lights out. No mind, no thoughts, no feelings, no attachments, no memories of life on earth, no human senses, no self. You cease to exist. One thing you're missing here though is that, with non-existence there's this state of pure bliss. Leo mentions this in the video, and it happened in my LSD trip as well. This is probably the best thing that ever happened to me, it was so peaceful that I actually wanted it to last for eternity. This is probably where the concept of heaven came from. Another thing to add is that, in a way its similar to us as humans, being asleep. But when we're sleeping, we don't really know we're asleep. We sleep on our bed, have some dreams then a couple hours later we're awake in our human body. And so, from what I experienced in my trip, you have complete awareness, awareness of nothingness. As humans we're aware that we exist as humans, but through ego-death you're aware that you exist as nothing. I wouldn't know if this lasts for eternity when we literally physically die and if we reincarnate into another living being but I would say there's nothing to fear if our memory of our current life is completely gone. Of course we don't have our current thoughts and feelings after we die, so there's no regret or wishing that we came back to life after we die lol, those thoughts don't exist anymore. Nothing is permanent. People talk about being afraid of death because they have so much to live for but what does all that matter if the illusion of life just completely disappears as if it were just a human's dream? That's like a human in his dream saying he's afraid to wake up because he has so much left to do in his dream.

Laser focused on emptiness I am. Mind and body slow down, but within next 2-3 weeks I have work deadlines to do, and you spiritual sages can mock me for not just being dedicated on one or the other if you want. But there's the calling to laser focus on this being/nothingness and I don't ignore. Staying with it staying with it I will be. It changes me. Can I still function in the world? Must a retreat be the only way? What the fuck am I asking you guys for though is the real question maybe. This question makes absolutely no sense obviously and is meaningless. Wow I'm full of shit

Comments after 12 mg vaped: first, sorry for my nickname, you don't have to break, you have to make love with yourself. now I understand: when everything disappears, there is no mind, the void opens ... and suddenly everything, the experience, the reality, is a negation. This denial is not the nothing, it is me. Saying no, you don't go beyond here. The universe is one, and that one is a no ... ufff and I still do again and again, because i forget, i remember like void, the nothingness, but that void is closed. Today I have seen through the no, the door, the one that I myself close and do not open even with a breakthrough of 18 mg, the door that is me. I have seen unity, limitless, love. I have not become it, but I have been kind to myself. I ve seen me, what I am, what I'm doing. I am someone who at one point had to take serious control. Now is the time to let it go. It is not a thing to do 25 mg vaped, it would not work. It is to leave it, to let go. I'm around. 5 meo is magic, it's an invaluable tool