Rajneeshpuram

Whats the ENDGAME of spirituality?

32 posts in this topic

I've read about how some enlightened gurus and christian mystics died, and they died from illnesses like most human beings.

There are stories or legends about indian and buddhist gurus who in their latest stages of his spiritual development they retire alone into the woods or in a cave meditating all day and night to the point of eating only a handful of rice till they became mummified or petrified, and their body didnt rot ( low temperatures, low fluids, no eating).

I reach to the conclusion, is physical death the ultimate stage of enlightenment? It may be a consequence of the ego death, which is the survival mechanism to make the body alive.

Is it a suicide by disatention of bodily needs?

I'ts clear that everybody that meditates with determination and /or takes psychedellics may experiment glimpses of temporary enlightenment.

But achieving permanent enlightenment implies the body's death as a consequence, and this from nature's perspective doesnt make sense. I heard once Leo saying something like if you achieve enlightenment and become the great mind your physical body would disappear and melt into the absolute, which in this material tridimensional world we live is impossible.

So to find a more integrative approach of spirituality, should we just attain little moments of enlightenment while living the best we can in this world integrating what we know from our enlightened experiences? ( living in the matrix knowing that its all false, but still playing its game?)

I dont know the psychological consequences of living in congnitive dissonace ( knowing its and illusion and living pretending its not).

The third approach I find is to live away from a sick society, for example hermit mode, hippie community, spiritual community. This makes things easier, and you dont have to fake acting like a bluepilled human to fit in the society.

 

-Please, let me know your thoughts about your vision of how it looks like reaching the final stage of enlightenment.

 

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Posted (edited)

when you find out please tell mexDxDxD

Edited by blackchair

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I think ascension is the endgame. In the past ascension meant that the physical body died and the spiritual body and consciousness went into a higher dimension and continued its evolution there. Now there is also the possibility of ascending with the physical body and continuing to live on earth as an enlightened being and not age, no need for food or water, always perfect health and energy, powers, freedom etc.

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, Rajneeshpuram said:

I've read about how some enlightened gurus and christian mystics died, and they died from illnesses like most human beings.

...

I reach to the conclusion, is physical death the ultimate stage of enlightenment?...

Is it a suicide by disatention of bodily needs?

...

So to find a more integrative approach of spirituality, should we just attain little moments of enlightenment while living the best we can in this world integrating what we know from our enlightened experiences? ( living in the matrix knowing that its all false, but still playing its game?)

I dont know the psychological consequences of living in congnitive dissonace ( knowing its and illusion and living pretending its not).

The third approach I find is to live away from a sick society, for example hermit mode, hippie community, spiritual community. This makes things easier, and you dont have to fake acting like a bluepilled human to fit in the society.

-Please, let me know your thoughts about your vision of how it looks like reaching the final stage of enlightenment.

 

I've not yet realized anything that leads me to the conclusion that there is a "final stage" of enlightenment.

The fact is, if One completely dissolves the ego and can just sit free of all action and attachment, including to things like food, water, and shelter, One can indeed embrace bodily death in blissful peace, but doing so is a selfish cop out and a disappointing failure of the test of Life. Living all your days in some isolated hippie and/or spiritual community or as a solo hermit is typically little better.

An enlightened human Being is an empowered human Being that can make meaning any way they choose, but hiding or dying is a pathetic worldly waste when serving Creation and walking the world as a force of Nature is an option.

Bodily death will come in time even if life is relatively long and healthy. There is no need to rush it. Authenticity and integrity are very important. Embrace and embody what you know YourSelf to be. Integrate everything; pretend nothing. The Universe does not awaken to hide or die or pretend to yet slumber. The Universe awakens to lovingly lift itself up and then harshly shake and slap itself more fully awake. 

Here's another option for you. Become a Holy-man, a God-man, and not the sort that just talks the talk, but walk the walk. There is no demand to dress or speak oddly or to openly go around proclaiming yourself a guru or seeking a following or establishing a community. There is a demand, a deep God-realized demand, to be Goodness incarnate, to lift Creation up, and when needed to embrace the privilege and the duty to shake and slap it awake.

Edited by Ryan R
Edited for small spelling and grammatical errors, as usual, lol.

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Posted (edited)

Sadhguru has the term "ultimate well being". It seems to imply there is an ultimate state, or truth or realization. Not sure how it is possible if the universe keeps existing or rebirthing. Maybe once you reach the ultimate realization the cycle begins once again fresh. Because can there really be a still ultimate state that wouldn't devolve because of boredom ? If so why is there anything in the first place, the self splited in those trillions souls for a reason. Of course if you can maintain the ecstasy of existence at all time then it doesn't matter, maybe it is what he calls ultimate well being.

Edited by Tetcher

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To become a beautiful human being. To become a beautiful soul that is "worth" being saved from the grip of death.

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There is no physical death. Think about it, if you were to "physically die", where would you go? You'd be in the same place you've always been at but you just end your dream that you created for yourself. Enlightenment is the recognition that you don't need to die to die. Because there LITERALLY is no death. 

The ultimate goal is always to merge closer to god. More honestly, more truthfully, more lovingly. 

Once you recognize yourself as god and trace all the steps back to the beginning of the universe, you realize you imagined it all to keep yourself stuck in the illusion. You go so far that existence literally ceases to exist, just pure nothingness, pure god, pure love. Yet it's an infinite existence so it will keep dreaming for eternity, and there you have an infinite endless game of reality. So in a sense, there is no endgame other than to know god. 

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Spirituality is nothing more than learning to dream lucidly. It is realizing the true nature of God, within the creation of God. It is the rediscovery of ultimate love. Consciousness creates each soul, and sends it on a journey, which ultimately resolves back into itself. Even during the dream, Consciousness is here, telling the story, and being the story. It is all the same Consciousness, in different states, but always ultimately the same.

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13 minutes ago, The0Self said:

The end is the beginning.

True, in relative reality. Ultimately, there is no end, and no beginning. Changelessness, apparently, enjoys the dream of change.

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for me to reach the emptiness of the mind, to transcend the false, because it is false and it is necessary to leave it behind, and settle in the true, which is silence. for what? because something drives me to do it, a cosmic engine that we call suffering. the human being is constructed in this way, like a dog in a laboratory, punishment and reward. escaping from punishment is the only logical thing to do. I know that it is I myself who has imposed the conditions, I bow to my genius but sometimes my harshness surprises me

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15 minutes ago, Moksha said:

True, in relative reality. Ultimately, there is no end, and no beginning. Changelessness, apparently, enjoys the dream of change.

Beautifully put.

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18 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

for me to reach the emptiness of the mind, to transcend the false, because it is false and it is necessary to leave it behind, and settle in the true, which is silence. for what? because something drives me to do it, a cosmic engine that we call suffering. the human being is constructed in this way, like a dog in a laboratory, punishment and reward. escaping from punishment is the only logical thing to do. I know that it is I myself who has imposed the conditions, I bow to my genius but sometimes my harshness surprises me

That, my friend, is the blessing and the curse of duality. Reward and punishment are two ends of the same stick. Pick it up, or don't, but neither is possible without the other.

That is the beauty of being. Beyond platitudes, it is true all the same. Serenity and love are not bound in this way. They are nondual, and are our inherent nature. We are a being circle, and our creation is a non-being stick.

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@Moksha i mean that punishment is separation, and rewards union. the more separation, the more suffering. but as humans we have mechanisms that lead us to the illusion of separation, almost impossible to avoid. to consider ourselves an individual entity that struggles and suffers, and this suffering, for those who can see it, prompts us to return to the union, a kind of curve that occurs. The goal i finish the curve, end the illusion of separation, so the suffering

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@Breakingthewall I get you, and agree. The illusion of separation is the source of suffering. Isn't that what love actually is? The realization that we are all the same? We fall into the trap of "we", and chase the satiation of separation, without realizing that there is only "I", which is already infinitely abundant. 9_9 The hero and the villain make a great story, I guess.

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39 minutes ago, Moksha said:

True, in relative reality. Ultimately, there is no end, and no beginning. Changelessness, apparently, enjoys the dream of change.

Although we are one, there are individual souls that get reincarnated again and again to learn new lessons according the samsara wheel. Shouldnt "breaking the reincarnation cycle" the ultimate purpose of spirituality?

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1 minute ago, Rajneeshpuram said:

Although we are one, there are individual souls that get reincarnated again and again to learn new lessons according the samsara wheel. Shouldnt "breaking the reincarnation cycle" the ultimate purpose of spirituality?

Samsara is the game that Consciousness, as changelessness, plays to experience the illusion of change. Ultimately, the "purpose of spirituality" is nothing more than a game that we, as Consciousness, create for ourselves. It's like "Choose Your Own Adventure". Without a story, with all its risks and rewards, what is the point? Changelessness is so....changeless.

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11 hours ago, Rajneeshpuram said:

I've read about how some enlightened gurus and christian mystics died, and they died from illnesses like most human beings.

There are stories or legends about indian and buddhist gurus who in their latest stages of his spiritual development they retire alone into the woods or in a cave meditating all day and night to the point of eating only a handful of rice till they became mummified or petrified, and their body didnt rot ( low temperatures, low fluids, no eating).

I reach to the conclusion, is physical death the ultimate stage of enlightenment? It may be a consequence of the ego death, which is the survival mechanism to make the body alive.

Is it a suicide by disatention of bodily needs?

I'ts clear that everybody that meditates with determination and /or takes psychedellics may experiment glimpses of temporary enlightenment.

But achieving permanent enlightenment implies the body's death as a consequence, and this from nature's perspective doesnt make sense. I heard once Leo saying something like if you achieve enlightenment and become the great mind your physical body would disappear and melt into the absolute, which in this material tridimensional world we live is impossible.

So to find a more integrative approach of spirituality, should we just attain little moments of enlightenment while living the best we can in this world integrating what we know from our enlightened experiences? ( living in the matrix knowing that its all false, but still playing its game?)

I dont know the psychological consequences of living in congnitive dissonace ( knowing its and illusion and living pretending its not).

The third approach I find is to live away from a sick society, for example hermit mode, hippie community, spiritual community. This makes things easier, and you dont have to fake acting like a bluepilled human to fit in the society.

 

-Please, let me know your thoughts about your vision of how it looks like reaching the final stage of enlightenment.

 

Realization of birth, universe, life or life has never happened, rather than thought process not even, and you are already what you are and where you are as always been. 

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I don't think there is a end.


"Namaste. F**k this sh*t!"

— Jeff Foster

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