"High"&"Low" is bullshit

[mandyjw]

6 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

What is the difference between a high consciousness person and a low consciousness person?

Is the sky above Australia high or low? Perspective.

What's the similarity between a high consciousness person and a low consciousness person, what do they share? Consciousness. 

Person is appearance of consciousness TO consciousness, hence, perspective.

Edited January 15 by mandyjw

[Moksha]

4 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

What is the difference between a high consciousness person and a low consciousness person?

Lucid dreaming vs. somnolence.

[Gesundheit]

7 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

What is the difference between a high consciousness person and a low consciousness person?

Understanding.

[mmKay]

@Tim R you kind of are overlooking relativity and piling everything together through a more "absolute" lense.

Relativity is real in a sense , and a very useful way for us to comunicate and make distinctions.

If you want to go that route, then you your name isn't real, and things dont really actually have names either, we just have socially agreed that we make these sounds to refer such objects / emotions / qualities, etc.

It would be saying that banging your head against the wall is as good or as bad as drinking water or reading books, which in the absolute sense may be true, but in the more egoic and dualistic world that we live in is just absurd.

Obviously, in the world of relativity, a person is taller than another, one has more money that another, one has a dick and another one has two boobs, etc.

Yes, in the end everything is " MU " , but that would be a small non-duallity. Actual non-duallity is so non-dual that it includes duallity and non-duallity.

Learning = making distinctions, don't throw everything in the same bag

[Nahm]

@Moksha

 

I agree, I think we’re already on the same page. I see knowledge like any other thought, in that I’m just renting it really. It’s all ours / no one’s. Personally, I found the thought attachment, the claiming of the knowledge and identifying with it to be the suffering relative to the body mind. The knowledge in and of itself so to speak, of and in this world, is most beneficial for us and this world.  

And what an articulate quote!  I think musicians are generally living in a certain surrendered recognition of these things from living / working in vibration, truth. They always seem to have that ‘inside scoop’ to what’s in the news. 

White Americans, what, nothin' better to do?
Why don't you kick yourself out - you're an immigrant too!
Who's usin' who, what should we do?
Well you can't be a pimp and a prostitute too!

(Jack White of The White Stripes)

[Moksha]

6 minutes ago, mmKay said:

Actual non-duallity is so non-dual that it includes duallity and non-duallity.

Some people don't get this. Reality is everything, and everynothing.

[LastThursday]

Is judgement itself "high" or "low" consciousness? Should we stop doing it?

Maybe call it what it is: "good" and "bad" actions. Actions which cause suffering or actions which cause happiness or neutral actions. Phew!

[andyjohnsonman]

5 hours ago, Tim R said:

There is nothing "high" or "low"

Yea i agree. Many people fall into this same trap here when talking about spiral dynamics. It's not higher or lower they are earlier and later stages of development as Susanne Cook-Greuter so beautifully emphasises. If you always see the stages as higher or lower you aint ever gonna be integral as you will be endlessly seeing some better than others.

[Moksha]

4 minutes ago, Nahm said:

Personally, I found the thought attachment, the claiming of the knowledge and identifying with it to be the suffering.

Exactly. Knowledge is suffering. Being is peace. Isn't it funny that evolution not only created forms capable of thought, but most profoundly, capable of realizing the futility of thought?

Agree 100% on the resonance of music and truth. Consciousness creates, and artists are closer to Self-realization/expression than many of us, because of this. They channel themselves.

[Nahm]

@Moksha

Very, very funny indeed. 

[Tim R]

25 minutes ago, mmKay said:

@Tim R you kind of are overlooking relativity and piling everything together through a more "absolute" lense.

Relativity is real in a sense , and a very useful way for us to comunicate and make distinctions.

If you want to go that route, then you your name isn't real, and things dont really actually have names either, we just have socially agreed that we make these sounds to refer such objects / emotions / qualities, etc.

It would be saying that banging your head against the wall is as good or as bad as drinking water or reading books, which in the absolute sense may be true, but in the more egoic and dualistic world that we live in is just absurd.

Obviously, in the world of relativity, a person is taller than another, one has more money that another, one has a dick and another one has two boobs, etc.

Yes, in the end everything is " MU " , but that would be a small non-duallity. Actual non-duallity is so non-dual that it includes duallity and non-duallity.

Learning = making distinctions, don't throw everything in the same bag

@mmKay As I already said, this isn't about bashing relativism or denying distinctions. This is about being careful to not get stuck on the idea of "high" or "low" consciousness.

[Tim R]

1 hour ago, Nahm said:

@Tim R 

In staying with the biblical reference...to judge is to eat from the tree of the knowledge of “good & evil”. Seems we are all free to do that, yet to do so is often to create emotions in discord with the true nature, or ‘substance’ of the body mind, and of creation at large. 

So God hung a flaming sword on that tree, pointing to the tree of life. The “flaming” is the burn of suffering. The “sword” is The Truth. It is in us, and it is always pointing the way of creation, which perpetuates via humans experiencing and exercising preferences. To loath in judgement, to dwell in unwanted, does not create anything but suffering.

To ‘go to the tree of life’, is to recognize what is, what is not wanted, or, not preferred, and in that recognition is found, intrinsically, what is wanted, what is preferred. Preference is realized. In that recognition, in that way of life our infinitude is alive and real, and we are filled with presence and Well Being as creators. 

We might say God has bestowed us with that which is not of this world, focus. The covenant is the recognition infinite can not know finite, and as such it is left to each of us in our freedom to experience creation, to focus in alignment with our source. This the greatest joy imo. This is what Joy is imo. Creator-creation-creating. Closing that “gap” of the covenant. 

Personally speaking, I abide in, or listen to the true nature of this message alive within me, and I do not dwell or loath. I experience pain, but I do not create suffering. Of course, this is effortless for me, because somehow, and don’t ask me to explain it, I yet again woke up this morning. This just seems to keep happening. I keep getting another day to align and share this nature some how. Very mysterious & magical. 

Your thread brought this oldie but goodie to mind...

”Oh life. It’s bigger, bigger than you, and you are not me. The lengths that I will go to, the distance in your eyes. Oh no, I’ve said too much. I set it up.” 

I often suspect this is all some kind of dream or lucid rem sleep too. 

Dunno. 

Always somewhere between “saying too much” and “haven’t said enough”. 

@Nahm Thanks for the reply. I'm gonna have to read it a few more times I guess

[Moksha]

@Nahm Was just "thinking" that when two woke people meet, all they can do is laugh 

[Guru Fat Bastard]

4 hours ago, Tim R said:

it's high time he does so

No such thing as "high time" or "low time".
In terms of high or low consciousness,the terms are based on action. How conscious are ones actions. Are they helpful,beneficial,unselfish,truthful,unhurtful actions etc., or, destructive,selfish,unhelpful,unbeneficial,dishonest actions etc.,?

Consciousness itself bears no qualities as such, but when identified as a conditioned,limited mind or "ego",the actions will reflect the quality of that particular conditioned mind and/or ego. This is the reason for"sadhana or practices, to "purify" the mind so that what's aleady there can reflect itself as it truly is.

[Nahm]

@Moksha

I’m dyin over here!!! 

[mmKay]

@Tim R  I understand, but it's a quality problem I'd say. Identifying what is " high conciousness " and move towards that, and what is " low consciousness " and mostly stay away from it . There are so much more worse traps. 

Edited January 15 by mmKay

[Tim R]

2 minutes ago, Moksha said:

@Nahm Was just "thinking" that when two woke people meet, all they can do is laugh 

@Moksha That's actually how I feel a lot of the time very true what you say!

[Moksha]

@Nahm @Tim R Reality is hilarious, when you don't think about it.  🙏

[Judi]

I agree that reducing everything to either "low" or "high consciousness" can become toxic.

But equally so, it can be very impractical to see Oneness all the time. After all, you can't do a lot with it;) 

Distinctions can be practical if you use them -excuse the terminology- consciously. 

What's left to decide is whether you use that distinction in order to construct an ideology and believe that a particular action will be what "conscious people" do. That's when you are only working on a superficial level, and it won't lead to inner fulfilment in the long run.

However, I truly believe that some people on here - clearly not all of them though, I am afraid- use this terminogy in order to navigate in the relative domain, and are asking for non-judgmental answers. Answers that are not overly focused on what you think or do, but with which intentions you do it. 

[Tim R]

14 minutes ago, Judi said:

But equally so, it can be very impractical to see Oneness all the time. 

Being aware of the oneness of existence isn't obstructing you in any way. After all, the world was also one before you saw it as one 

14 minutes ago, Judi said:

After all, you can't do a lot with it;) 

That's right! And to be more exact; you can't do anything whatsoever with "it".

Edited January 15 by Tim R