RawJudah

How to stop being the ‘nice guy’?

15 posts in this topic

Hi all,

Ok, so recently I have been researching attraction and how it works. My aim is to get better with women. So many people have said that being a ‘nice guy’ repels women, and it hasn’t worked for me either. I’ve been a nice guy all my life and I do enjoy being nice to people, but it isn’t getting me laid (being honest). Like so many other guys out there, you would think that women would want you to be nice to them, but it’s only recently hit me like a train that this just isn’t the case (with attraction particularly). I know I have to work on this part of my life because to me it’s all about how to become a more confident man. I have to stop being a nice guy, I see so many guys that aren’t so nice that get so far ahead in life, and here’s me thinking ‘why isn’t being nice working for me?’ It’s like they have something about them that really makes women like them...

So I’m asking, what practical steps are there to stop being a ‘nice guy’? 

Replies from any women and former nice guys would be incredible. 

 

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From what I read, being "nice guy" is really just trying to appear (very important word) nice in order to cause a good impression on the girl and trying her to like you. Notice that the self decepcion is so strong that you probably are not even aware of it and you probably think you really are angel and not a devil.

If you are being "nice" as an strategy to mate, it won't work for women since they are pretty smart to call out this fake behaviour. 

The reason why in other common social situations you can get away with it is since the implications are usually not so heavy. In mating the woman has much more at stake so it takes serious your devilry and notices it quickly.

Here's what I mean, you just said "becoming a confident man" it's what you think it would be the key to your success. Well I agree, too. It's not 100% but it's definitely one of the most important parts.

When you approach a woman, why you are not 100% confident? Surely because you are trying to hide some aspects about yourself to her. Surely with this attitude you need "an strategy" in order to show her some aspects of yourself but not others. Do you call this being "nice guy"? Or you can consider you are maybe lying to yourself?

Some questions to make you think before anything.

Note that most of this information I took it from a famous pick up book and part of my own experience, but I could be biased in some aspects. Take what you think it could be true and put it into the real world to see if it's true for you.

 


A thought can´t ever tell you how you feel.

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Tell a woman that she's allowed to talk to everyone except one person, she will reject everyone and chase that one person. Be that person, that's step one, have something special and take care of your looks and reputation.

Now that you got the outside taken care of, time to work on your inner self. Confidence, detachment, passion, virtue, having a purpose, humour, positivity, leadership, etc... the more the better of course.

All of the above is the infrastructure you need to have for successful approaching, but don't make this a limiting belief, you don't need to have all of them perfected. You certainly have some good things already, you might need to develop them a little bit more. Some of them may only develop from rejection, so you might need to allow yourself to get rejected repeatedly.

Now for the approach, you need to apply the law of attraction, with a little twist. I mean that you need to approach from a place of abundance. Don't ever show neediness. Be comfortable in your own skin, be detached from her opinion. And then talk anything and the conversation will run itself.

Easier said than done though.

Edited by Lento

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Being nice and not meaning it is just being fake. People pick up on that, women in particular, who swat away fake nice guys on a daily basis. 

Chris Rock did an excellent piece on how most guys being nice to women is basically just an offer of sex.

Cliché yes, but be yourself, don't fake it. Whether you're honest nice or honest asshole, both will work, because you're projecting genuine, confident energy.

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I'm a recovering nice guy. I used to never get girls or get laid. I tried many things to try and attract women, including trying to be tough, cool, a dick, etc. I became quite successful but realized that it was all a front and wasn't sustainable to uphold a false appearance. So I started being myself (I know it sounds cliche). What I learned is that you can be kind and still attract women. The key is honest, direct expression and non-neediness. Women are attracted to honesty and guys who live with integrity and authenticity. This book is a great place to start on an authentic journey to improving skills with women: Models

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Just be authentic and very honest. That way she is never insecure with you. But always let her know that she is your top priority. 

Being a nice guy doesn't help if you are manipulating her. 

Any woman will respect honesty above else. 

A very useful tip to have and keep a woman - don't be an asshole or jerk. Never works 

 

 

 

Men want a woman who is genuinely committed to them and very loyal. If they see a woman being nice to all men and being flirty with every guy she sees, it's a huge turn off for most men. Because she begins to look like public property. No guy wants that. 

Same way women look at nice guys. Because they are going to be nice to all women. It shows desperation and lack of genuineness. Like a front or fakery 

In real life most nice guys are just fakes. No man likes a woman with a fake smile. No woman likes a man who takes a passing interest in her and offers her help just to get her attention and then gives up when the shit tests come up. 

A very important question you can ask yourself if you are buying a woman a drink is "am I liking this woman just because she is an attractive female or because I like her because I only like her and no one else" 

... Women like exclusivity just like men. They don't want a man who likes all women because that creates insecurity. Often times a nice guy always gives this impression that he is going to be nice to every lady for her attention. This looks like a male model or akin to a male escort. That looks cheap like a sell out guy. That's why nice men don't get women just like women who get with all sorts of men don't end up getting a real man. 

Also women judge men a lot on the basis of past relationships. If they were with a nice guy before who was nice only for a few days, they will be inclined to think that nice guys are "time pass" and not husband material or serious relationship material. 

How to bypass this problem 

Be very persuasive of the woman you want. Make your choice clear. Show loyalty. Don't flirt with everyone you see, you are sending the wrong message. 

Be ready for shit tests 

Show your nice guy behavior even 3 months into the relationship and not just for the first 2 weeks. 

Be open about what you are looking for. Don't make her feel she is an object for your desires. Your heart will show no matter how much ever you hide. If you are fake it will show. Treat her with respect. If she treats you bad in return, she is not worth it. Be an honorable guy and if she is a lady, she will admire you for that. 

 

Edited by Preety_India

 INTP loner... .shy girl.. The devil loves me a bit too much. 

Quick access to journal entries

 

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My mothers new "boyfriend" is the pinnacle of nice.  On the one hand, he is constantly late (and disrespectful timewise) and on the other tries to buy our approval by buying candy or offering compliments, constantly.

I find his company awful and try to avoid him like the plague. Why? Because it feels so incredibly dishonest and manipulative, furthermore I have no respect for him.  I, on the other hand, have only given him a single compliment for the last 6 months and I haven't bought him anything. The only reason I show him respect is for my mother's sake.

Now, why does he do this? Is he malicious and tries to take from us? No, he just wants what everyone wants, to be approved and be liked by others.

However, he makes a crucial mistake in how to achieve this. He believes that the way to get the others approval is to be nice to them and some degree this works, however only with children.  Let a kid use your shovel in the sandbox and they'll like you.

As adults, we don't want to be friends with people who are just nice to us. We might want to keep them around for free stuff or because we are desperate.

Now you might say, well I am honestly nice and don't do it to make people like me. While that's probably an honest belief but notice how we are taught to be nice to others at a young age. It becomes a subconscious behaviour that we internalize to maintain social success from an early age.

So how to change in practice? Don't be nice to people for no apparent reason, someones in big trouble, sure help them out. People want to you carry their bag for you when they could just carry it themself, don't. You see a pretty girl, don't tell her she is pretty, she has heard that a million times before. You meet a new person, don't ask for things you don't care about like their name. You get the picture. Apply this to new people you meet.

Edited by Spiral

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It's not being nice that puts them off,
It's the subconscious feeling they have that you would do anything they want just because they have boobs and a vagina.

What they want is a man that is not attached to them, grounded and independant, and focused on his own goal(s) in life,
It has nothing to do with being nice or not really.

Of course guys that are dicks are by default attractive, because when you're a dick, it directly communicates you don't give a shit about what the woman wants,
But a mature and conscious woman (that is worthy to spend time with) won't give a damn about an asshole that is selfish, mentally and/or physically violent.

There is generally a deep seated belief in you that put women on a pedestal, because deep down you think you need one to be happy in life.
That's the default paradigm in our culture, to think that you need a partner to be happy, that you will be happier in your life with someone else, you've been brainwashed with this.

Now you subconsciously believe that, and unless you do deep conscious work, it's not gonna go away like this.
You see guys that are 50 still thinking this way, so the number of women you have relationships with isn't gonna do anything,
Unless you are conscious and know the concepts when you enter a relationship, then you can learn when the pain of the breakup happens.


Spirituality is not the renunciation of life

It is the art of living fully

 

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There is a difference between being nice, and being a people pleaser. People pleaser act out of a place of desperation to avoid confrontation. This is what most 'nice guys' do, and quite frankly they are incredibly boring. 

When you lack the courage to be yourself and say what you think out of fear of upsetting others, you basically become a nobody. A forgettable guy who holds no opinion and has no distinguishing personality. 

So how do you stop being a nice guy? First of all, stop being fake and agreeing with everyone, start saying what you think and doing what you want. If what you say and think is rubbish, then you have some work to do on yourself. 

Secondly, start working on yourself, so what you authenticity say and think is socially acceptable and attractive. When you think of an attractive and high quality guy, what types of things does he do? Now just pick 1 or 2 things that resonate with you and work on that. Try doing things outside the house that you are interested in, so that you start to develop some character. 

Honestly, 'nice guy syndrome' is a whole can of worms and often requires an approach from multiple angles. Tackle one thing at a time and keep at it. Good luck :)

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46 minutes ago, Shin said:

That's the default paradigm in our culture, to think that you need a partner to be happy, that you will be happier in your life with someone else, you've been brainwashed with this.

True that. 

46 minutes ago, Knock said:

There is a difference between being nice, and being a people pleaser. People pleaser act out of a place of desperation to avoid confrontation. This is what most 'nice guys' do, and quite frankly they are incredibly boring. 

When you lack the courage to be yourself and say what you think out of fear of upsetting others, you basically become a nobody. A forgettable guy who holds no opinion and has no distinguishing personality. 

So how do you stop being a nice guy? First of all, stop being fake and agreeing with everyone, start saying what you think and doing what you want. If what you say and think is rubbish, then you have some work to do on yourself. 

Secondly, start working on yourself, so what you authenticity say and think is socially acceptable and attractive. When you think of an attractive and high quality guy, what types of things does he do? Now just pick 1 or 2 things that resonate with you and work on that. Try doing things outside the house that you are interested in, so that you start to develop some character. 

Honestly, 'nice guy syndrome' is a whole can of worms and often requires an approach from multiple angles. Tackle one thing at a time and keep at it. Good luck

Great suggestions. 


 INTP loner... .shy girl.. The devil loves me a bit too much. 

Quick access to journal entries

 

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"How to stop being the ‘nice guy’?"

Perhaps re-frame this question. . . . What is the underlying energy and motivation?. . . 

11 hours ago, RawJudah said:

My aim is to get better with women. So many people have said that being a ‘nice guy’ repels women, and it hasn’t worked for me either. I’ve been a nice guy all my life and I do enjoy being nice to people, but it isn’t getting me laid (being honest).

So the goal here is to get laid. 

To me, this doesn't sound like genuine nice. It sounds more like "Pretending to be nice so I can get laid isn't working for me. What other tricks are there that work better". If your aim is to get laid, it's best to take a look at your behavior from an objective view. For example, you may be acting nice in an effort to get a woman's attention in hopes of getting laid. This sets up expectations and a vibe to it. Thinking things like "I'm such a nice guy - I bought her lunch and she won't even return my text". If I buy her lunch with hope and expectation of sex, that isn't being "nice". Falling into nice guy syndrome is a trap. If the aim is to get sex, I think it's much better to say "I've tried acting nice to women to have sex and it isn't working". .  The underlying intention and desire is a big factor. There is an energetic dynamic at play. . . You aren't asking "Im such a nice guy, why don't fish like me?". 

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To bring clarity to your situation. The term "nice guy" can be misleading, what is actually meant is a man who acts submissively. This makes more sense, doesn't it? Of course women are repulsed by submissive men. The problem is not being "nice", it's that you are acting submissively around women.

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Be authentic, be yourself. When someone says something you don't agree with, don't automatically agree with them just to avoid confrontation, respectfully either not show approval or state your disagreement. 

If you are in a social situation, be respectful to people, but don't give an ear to ear smile and slap on a bubbly persona if thats not what you are feeling inside. If someone tells you a joke you didn't find funny, don't fake laugh. If you are feeling amazing for whatever reason and have the natural urge, be energetic and outgoing, thats authentic. If someone tells you a joke you think is hilarious (even if other people there didn't get the joke) start tearing up with laugher if you have the urge. Thats authentic. 

Tease women, in a tasteful way. But be prepared to make fun of yourself as well. Don't take anything personally. 


"Started from the bottom and I just realized I'm still there since the money and the fame is an illusion" -Drake doing self-inquiry

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Thank you for the replies, I have read them all. I won’t be replying to them individually because I am starting to see the flaws in my original post.

I should have said I’m a people pleaser, not really authentic, i fake smile a lot and fake laugh a lot. But it’s only now starting to hit me that this is stupid and it’s not attractive to ANYONE! I should have said guys too, I have lost respect from other men too just being a people pleaser and not saying how I really feel in situations. 
 

I know I need to change this and be more authentic and say how I really feel more. This is something that I’ve been trying lately and it’s really freeing to live like that. Leo’s video about Lying stood out to me too, because he says even a fake smile is you lying to yourself. Among a bunch of other things...

 

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I’ve walked away from sooooo many situations especially at work, where I’ve said something just so I don’t cause any conflict, thinking to myself afterwards ‘why did I say that, they would probably respect me more for saying something that CAUSES conflict’ 

This while running away type of thing is where I’m noticing myself suffering. With women too, maybe I’ve been putting them on a pedestal for too long? 

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