Wealth & Consciousness Are Compatible?

[How to be wise]

57 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

 if you are creative and hardworking.

But aren't these traits coming from the ego. The ego creates the illusory world 'Maya' and wants you to get lost in it.

[Carl-Richard]

16 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

But aren't these traits coming from the ego. The ego creates the illusory world 'Maya' and wants you to get lost in it.

Identifying with those traits is ego. Ego identification is ego. The illusory world exists, the ego makes you believe it is real and not an illusion. Enlightenment is breaking the belief in the illusion as real, removing identification, not removing the world. Enlightened people can be highly wordly, highly driven, highly successful, highly achievement-oriented, or they can not be. It fundamentally does not reflect their enlightenment because their enlightenment is beyond the world.

It's true that if you are identified, focusing more on worldy things instead of enlightenment could make you more egoic. But if you are enlightened, or if you do enlightenment work, that doesn't have to be the case.

Edited 9 hours ago by Carl-Richard

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, How to be wise said:

But aren't these traits coming from the ego. The ego creates the illusory world 'Maya' and wants you to get lost in it.

If you want to be a bum there is no normative argument against it.

However, survival requires work no matter what. By choosing to be a bum you will suffer the consequences of that and so will society at large.

Being creative and hard working is necessary to live in a beautiful world. Otherwise you live like a bum in a shithole. If you want to live in a shithole house, city, society -- okay, go ahead. But I will not be joining you.

Having wealth means you are not a burden on others and you have the means to help others better their situations.

A bum inevitably becomes a leech on others around him, leeching off their labor. So it is not an integrous way to live.

I had a choice. I could have been a bum, or I could be creative and hard working and create Actualized.org. If I chose to be a bum then none of this would exist. Instead of helping people self-actualize I would have been a leech on others.

It all comes down to the question if: How do you want to live?

There are no objectively right or wrong answers to that question. But however you chose to live, there will be serious consequences.

Edited 6 hours ago by Leo Gura

[Eskilon]

18 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

they can not be

So its just a genetic trait? In other words, karma? It's the reason why Buddha wasnt material and success oriented and Leo is?

[Vibes]

What does Member P3 mean?

 

Edited 8 hours ago by Vibes

[NewKidOnTheBlock]

Vegas is a bum city

[How to be wise]

@Vibes I was banned from the politics subforum a year ago

@Leo Gura Please be kind and end my long exile 

 

Edited 7 hours ago by How to be wise

[UnbornTao]

Quote

"How many Rolls-Royces are enough?"

- Osho

 

---

Disclaimer: not an actual quote from him (as far as I know).

[Schizophonia]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

If you want to be a bum there is no normative argument against it.

However, survival requires work no matter what. By choosing to be a bum you will suffer the consequences of that and so will society at large.

Being creative and hard working is necessary to live in a beautiful world. Otherwise you live like a bum in a shithole. If you want to live in a shithole house, city, society -- okay, go ahead. But I will not be joining you.

Having wealth means you are not a budren on others and you have the means to help others better their situations.

A bum inevitably becomes a leech on others around him, leeching off their labor. So it is not an integrous way to live.

I had a choice. I could have been a bum, or I could be creative and hard working and create Actualized.org. If I chose to be a bum then none of this would exist. Instead of helping people self-actualize I would have been a leech on others.

It all comes down to the question if: How do you want to live?

There are no objectively right or wrong answers to that question. But however you chose to live, there will be serious consequences.

A person with a positive belief system will automatically be creative and vice versa.

Edited 7 hours ago by Schizophonia

[Carl-Richard]

1 hour ago, Eskilon said:

So its just a genetic trait? In other words, karma? It's the reason why Buddha wasnt material and success oriented and Leo is?

Not just genetic. Leo have to stop presenting his brown-pilled view of genetics. Nothing is "just genetic" except e.g. Huntington's disease or eye color (but that is also highly simplified). Karma, yes. Karma is just another word for "it is what it is" or Newton's third law or physics. But Leo is not akin to Buddha. He's more akin to Plato, or Newton, or Leonardo da Vinci.

Edited 7 hours ago by Carl-Richard

[Vibes]

2 hours ago, How to be wise said:

@Vibes I was banned from the politics subforum a year ago

@Leo Gura Please be kind and end my long exile 

 

Ah... It used to show Member Apolitical, I guess that's too deprecating haha

Edited 4 hours ago by Vibes

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Nothing is "just genetic"

I never said it was.

Most things are 50/50.

When in doubt, assume a thing is 50% genetic and 50% environment.

[Peo]

16 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

When in doubt, assume a thing is 50% genetic and 50% environment.

You heard about something called Epigenetics? Epigenetics is study into how environment can affect and change our genetics. 

[Leo Gura]

10 minutes ago, Peo said:

You heard about something called Epigenetics? Epigenetics is study into how environment can affect and change our genetics. 

I've heard it all.

Yawn...

[Lyubov]

5 hours ago, How to be wise said:

But aren't these traits coming from the ego. The ego creates the illusory world 'Maya' and wants you to get lost in it.

You're lost in it (Maya) now saying this my friend. You need to seriously examine what you believe, and why you believe it. With this mindset you are going to end up a broke new ager and there will be a day of reckoning for you. You are responsible for your life. I've met new age people who went broke just like this and it is not pretty. You will be flipping burgers, living in abject poverty (maybe on a couch if you're lucky to have parents that put up with this), your health will deteriorate, you will retreat into dark nihilistic mysticism, cut off from your heart (psychedelics will make you psychotic and out of touch if you take them at this time) and you will eventually end up on the street or resorting to some miserable stage blue belief system that puts some constraints on your lunatic new age beliefs and brings some order to your life. I say this a bit harsh because I really don't think a gentle phrasing here of this will make it through to you. I don't know your financial or living situation, I wish you the best, you need to get to work and start taking life more seriously. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Lyubov

[Lyubov]

I also don't believe in putting much weight into genetics, it's incidental. Everyone can walk the path the best they can and live an aligned life and I believe up to their true potential aligning with god and living in Wu Wei, this will look different for everyone. You aren't going to become a world class athlete through spirituality but there will be something unique for you. I'm not saying ignore genetics, it's just not something which should really weigh on your mind so much. You can make health choices and still honor all the natural and physical laws around them, this is subtle because of course there are physical considerations to give to our bodies, but you gotta be VERY careful not to scapegoat them accidentally blame your genetics for something or use them in any way to un align yourself from spirit. 

Edited 3 hours ago by Lyubov

[How to be wise]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

If you want to be a bum there is no normative argument against it.

However, survival requires work no matter what. By choosing to be a bum you will suffer the consequences of that and so will society at large.

Being creative and hard working is necessary to live in a beautiful world. Otherwise you live like a bum in a shithole. If you want to live in a shithole house, city, society -- okay, go ahead. But I will not be joining you.

Having wealth means you are not a burden on others and you have the means to help others better their situations.

A bum inevitably becomes a leech on others around him, leeching off their labor. So it is not an integrous way to live.

I had a choice. I could have been a bum, or I could be creative and hard working and create Actualized.org. If I chose to be a bum then none of this would exist. Instead of helping people self-actualize I would have been a leech on others.

It all comes down to the question if: How do you want to live?

There are no objectively right or wrong answers to that question. But however you chose to live, there will be serious consequences.

I'm not disagreeing with the above. It's just that your answer is within Maya and I am asking why we should get even more sucked into Maya. The reality is if we focus on the illusory world we will lose awareness of the actual Reality. It is extremely difficult to strive in this world and at the same time have awareness that this world is pure illusion. It really is one or the other it seems. If Eckhart Tolle was running a multi million dollar business, would he really have the same consciousness of his ego that he has today?

[How to be wise]

45 minutes ago, Lyubov said:

You're lost in it (Maya) now saying this my friend. You need to seriously examine what you believe, and why you believe it. With this mindset you are going to end up a broke new ager and there will be a day of reckoning for you. You are responsible for your life. I've met new age people who went broke just like this and it is not pretty. You will be flipping burgers, living in abject poverty (maybe on a couch if you're lucky to have parents that put up with this), your health will deteriorate, you will retreat into dark nihilistic mysticism, cut off from your heart (psychedelics will make you psychotic and out of touch if you take them at this time) and you will eventually end up on the street or resorting to some miserable stage blue belief system that puts some constraints on your lunatic new age beliefs and brings some order to your life. I say this a bit harsh because I really don't think a gentle phrasing here of this will make it through to you. I don't know your financial or living situation, I wish you the best, you need to get to work and start taking life more seriously. 

Again I fully understand your argument and it makes sense but there's no denying that if we focus on the illusiory world we will not be aware of its state of illusion. I haven't figured out how to live fully in the world and at the same time be aware that it is pure illusion and it is not real at all.

[Natasha Tori Maru]

27 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

I'm not disagreeing with the above. It's just that your answer is within Maya and I am asking why we should get even more sucked into Maya. The reality is if we focus on the illusory world we will lose awareness of the actual Reality. It is extremely difficult to strive in this world and at the same time have awareness that this world is pure illusion. It really is one or the other it seems. If Eckhart Tolle was running a multi million dollar business, would he really have the same consciousness of his ego that he has today?

What else have you got to do????

[Leo Gura]

36 minutes ago, How to be wise said:

If Eckhart Tolle was running a multi million dollar business, would he really have the same consciousness of his ego that he has today?

Ekhart Tolle DOES run multi-million dollar business! Why do you think you even know his name? Only thanks to massive corporate marketing.

Tolle has a net worth over $30 million dollars, meanwhile you plan to live like a rat, hunting for crumbs.

Ekhart Tolle is sitting in his beach-side luxury mega-mansion drinking champagne right now as you read this.

Edited 2 hours ago by Leo Gura