Is Dating Really Harder for Men Today — Or Just in Certain Environments?

[Hardkill]

A lot of guys online say it’s gotten much harder to get women in developed countries today. But when you look closely, maybe it seems more complicated.

Why People Say It’s Harder Now

• Apps concentrate attention on a small % of men.
• Marriage is delayed, so men compete longer in the casual dating scene.
• Women aren’t pressured to settle for survival, so they can be choosier.

This makes wealthy, urban dating feel cutthroat.

But now that I think more about it the environment still matters, yeah?

• Working-class / poorer areas: People settle faster into LTRs. Stability matters more than endless choice, so it can actually be easier to find a partner.
• Wealthier / urban areas: More hookups, later commitment, higher selectivity.
• Geography: The same man might struggle in LA but easily find an LTR in a small town.

Therefore, perhaps it’s not simply “harder” or “easier.” It depends on:

• Where you live
• Your background (education, class, culture)
• Your personal attributes (looks, charisma, ambition, etc.)

 

So, is the so-called “dating crisis” mostly an upper-middle-class urban problem?

Are men in poorer or smaller communities actually better off at locking down LTRs?

Should men adapt their dating strategies to their environment?

Edited August 25 by Hardkill

[Leo Gura]

It is harder in that too many people live online and don't know how to socialize. That is a real obstacle.

But if you are out socializing it is not harder. The things that attract women have not changed and will not change.

Edited August 25 by Leo Gura

[Hardkill]

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

It is harder in that too many people live online and don't know how to socialize. That is a real obstacle.

But if you are out socializing it is not harder. The things that attract women have not changed and will not change.

Right, I get that the fundamentals of attraction don’t change, and yes, the fact that too many people, especially too many younger men today, live online and don't know how to socialize clearly has now become like an epidemic situation that's been going for many years now.

But doesn't the environment matter too?

It seems like in poorer areas, people can’t afford to be as selective because survival pressures push them to settle down faster. In wealthier areas, people delay commitment, have more options, and can afford to be extremely picky — which makes the dating market feel harsher for the average guy.

So maybe the timeless fundamentals work everywhere, but the environment shapes how picky people are and how fast they commit. Wouldn’t you say those two layers — timeless attraction + market context — both matter?

Edited August 25 by Hardkill

[Leo Gura]

42 minutes ago, Hardkill said:

It seems like in poorer areas, people can’t afford to be as selective because survival pressures push them to settle down faster.

Humans have been poor since the dawn of time. Nothing new about that. Poverty has deceased over the last century.

[Princess Arabia]

1 hour ago, Hardkill said:

In wealthier areas, people delay commitment

This is so not true; if anything it's the opposite. You have narrowed down dating, commitment, companionship and relationships down to being financial and seem to not realize people seek genuine companionship too and the wealthy are even more inclined to want a more stable relationship status. It's very rare you find people in the wealthy category single.

[Hardkill]

36 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Humans have been poor since the dawn of time. Nothing new about that. Poverty has deceased over the last century.

No, I know, but:

On 7/22/2025 at 11:10 PM, Leo Gura said:

That is true because in the past people were less spoiled and less demanding for personal gratification. People would settle for the first person they slept with.

Today it is impossible to be happy because everyone is looking to maximize personal happiness and there are endless options and much more freedom.

It's easy to be married when life has a gun to your head.

Blaming this on feminism is a sucker's move. The improvement of material survival conditions of society as a whole leads to freedom and also spoilage. Men today are very spoiled playing video games all day instead of socializing.

[Leo Gura]

@Hardkill That relates to marriage.

People are still as horny as ever and looking for sex and companionship.

As far as life-long commitment goes, of course that has dropped due to having more wealth and more freedom.

[Hardkill]

6 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Hardkill That relates to marriage.

People are still as horny as ever and looking for sex and companionship.

As far as life-long commitment goes, of course that has dropped due to having more wealth and more freedom.

Oh, so just to clarify, are you saying that hooking up and dating haven’t necessarily become harder or easier today in any part of a developed society like America — it’s mainly that marriage and life-long commitment rates have changed due to more wealth and freedom?

[Leo Gura]

2 hours ago, Hardkill said:

Oh, so just to clarify, are you saying that hooking up and dating haven’t necessarily become harder or easier today in any part of a developed society like America — it’s mainly that marriage and life-long commitment rates have changed due to more wealth and freedom?

Logically, if marriages last less then dating opportunities are higher.

About half the women I dated were divorced. Which means that if their marriages were the life-long kind of the good ol days, then I would not have been able to date them.

Men who complain that dating is harder don't realize that dating is actually easier today than it used to be thanks to the deterioration of life-long marriages. Less marriage means more dating.

Edited August 26 by Leo Gura

[Hardkill]

6 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Logically, if marriages last less then dating opportunities are higher.

About half the women I dated were divorced. Which means that if their marriages were the life-long kind of the good ol days, then I would not have been able to date them.

Men who complain that dating is harder don't realizing that dating is actually easier today than it used to be thanks to the deterioration of life-long marriages. Less marriage means more dating.

You know, that’s an interesting perspective and I see your point. Fewer life-long marriages = more people re-entering the dating pool, which technically expands opportunities.

I was able to get with my ex-gf even though she was in her early 40s in part because she was divorced when I first met her.

 At the same time, couldn’t that cut both ways? On the one hand, yes, there are more single/divorced women to date. But on the other hand, it also means more people are cycling through relationships, raising standards, and becoming pickier since they know they can always leave.

So while the quantity of dating opportunities may be higher today, the quality/stability of those opportunities might feel lower compared to the past. Would you say that’s a fair distinction?

[Hojo]

You have to be more entertaining than a phone. Before we could be boring. Now no one will engage unless its entertaining to them.

[Twentyfirst]

It's harder for the bottom percentage of men who used to rely on social norms to get the job done. For the top percentage of men it's easier because they can have 20 girlfriends at a time, string them along and stall them about commitment, and walk away scott free to the next batch. When women see giving away tons of sex for free as a good thing then that benefits men  

Edited August 30 by Twentyfirst

[Emerald]

It's more difficult now-a-days (for men and women too) because the world is more atomized and we don't socialize face-to-face as often.

So, for most people in the past, there would be more opportunities to socialize... and for attractions and relationships to emerge organically.

But now, a person has to either use dating apps or go approach people. Or they may have to do extra legwork to build their own social circle.

So, in the past, when people were socializing more... it was like fishing with a big net.

But now, it's like having to use a fishing spear instead, where you have to actively attempt to catch a potential partner.

Of course, if you socialize and create a social circle... you're then fishing with the same net as people have always used. And it will be easier for attractions to emerge organically.

But if you are on dating apps... or trying to do cold approach... it's not going to be as easy to establish something deep or real.

[Raze]

It’s harder in small towns because there are far less options. In cities a lot of them actually have more young women than men so it can be easier, though its harder in its own way since there are so many high status men women share.

[Spiral]

Your biggest competitor is not other potential mates. It’s the person you are dating. 
 

If they are unkind to themselves, being a 4/10 in terms of how kind you are is still better than them being alone. A spiritually enlightened woman, is hard to attract as the requirements are astronomical. 
 

This applies to both men and women. Things like video games and other escapism sort of undermine the desire for partnership.

[Schizophonia]

14 hours ago, Emerald said:

It's more difficult now-a-days (for men and women too) because the world is more atomized and we don't socialize face-to-face as often.

So, for most people in the past, there would be more opportunities to socialize... and for attractions and relationships to emerge organically.

But now, a person has to either use dating apps or go approach people. Or they may have to do extra legwork to build their own social circle.

So, in the past, when people were socializing more... it was like fishing with a big net.

But now, it's like having to use a fishing spear instead, where you have to actively attempt to catch a potential partner.

Of course, if you socialize and create a social circle... you're then fishing with the same net as people have always used. And it will be easier for attractions to emerge organically.

But if you are on dating apps... or trying to do cold approach... it's not going to be as easy to establish something deep or real.

Spot on

[theleelajoker]

22 hours ago, Hojo said:

You have to be more entertaining than a phone. 

[LordFall]

Competition has just increased since social media. If you are a competitive male you're doing better than ever though. I recommend you guys work on this.

If all that happened to make dating worse is open up all the other males and all the sudden your dating life plummeted that's an example of a personal short coming. 

Earlier societies had enforced monogamy which heavily reduces the competition and mates up almost everybody but the decentralization of dating has made that less viable.

It's nothing to cry over individually and collectively as a species I believe we have many remedies to combat this. 

[aurum]

14 hours ago, Spiral said:

Your biggest competitor is not other potential mates. It’s the person you are dating. 

This is not correct.

Dating is literally a competition between potential mates, nothing more. Which is why all attempts to improve your dating life are about increasing your edge over the competition. 

[Emerald]

On 8/25/2025 at 8:51 PM, Leo Gura said:

@Hardkill That relates to marriage.

People are still as horny as ever and looking for sex and companionship.

As far as life-long commitment goes, of course that has dropped due to having more wealth and more freedom.

@Hardkill My experience of living with poor/working class people that I grew up with and then making the acquaintance of upper middle class/wealthy people when I went to college, I noticed different ways of relating to marriage and children... and life in general.

But I would say it's the culture of planning for the future versus not planning for the future that is the main difference.

Like, in my hometown, many of my friends had their first child by 18 (a few before that). But these friends didn't really have major plans for the future. They were just playing life by ear. So, they just followed their feelings and let the chips fall where they may... to mixed results.

Then, in college, most of my friends had a set plan for the future and a timeline for marriage and children... which were later in life. And there was more of a tendency to take a birds-eye view of relationship and family plans... also to mixed results.

And I was pregnant with my first child my last semester of my senior year of college (when I was 21), and I was seen as a crazy young to be having a child. I even recall a very passive aggressive girl who was in many of my studio classes making a derisive comment towards me about "teen pregnancy." Others were supportive, but I was definitely the only pregnant woman on campus. I had never encountered any others the entire time that I was there. So, it was treated as a strange anomaly... mostly with kindness.

But when I phoned home to tell my longtime friend Shanna (who's my age) that I was pregnant, she was like, "It's about time! Your parents aren't getting any younger." My parents were 50 and 54 at the time, and her parents were 41 and 42. And she was concerned about my parents being able to get to be grandparents at a young enough age to enjoy.

She already had 4 children at the time. And many of our friends already had a couple children.

So, it was just a very different culture. But the main difference was "letting life happen" and "planning out future milestones."

And planning for future milestones involves a kind of imagining of an ideal future. And it's easy to get pickier and less willing to "settle" and properly attach to a partner when you've already imagined some abstract ideal to match up to. Some people get stuck in "flipping through channels" mode who plan ahead too much.