Losing My Faith in The Existence Of God

[Thought Art]

1 hour ago, SQAAD said:

@Leo Gura 

I don't get it.. Why doesn't Reality serve us? 

If i am God, can't i create whatever paradise i want? 

Reality doesn’t serve, but it provides opportunity 

[Vladimir]

13 hours ago, SQAAD said:

@Leo Gura 

I don't get it.. Why doesn't Reality serve us? 

If i am God, can't i create whatever paradise i want? 

Eternal Paradise of Pure Life, Love and Joy is inevitable, that is the masterpiece that God has been working on the entire time with absolutely everything. 

The entire reality serves God. 

You're not God, you're a human, you're a servant of God. 

Have faith.

[inFlow]

@SQAAD 

Edited March 26 by inFlow
edits

[bambi]

22 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It's common for religious fundamentalists to lose faith in God when they experience deep suffering or loss. That's because they misunderstand what God is. God is not a personal force who cares about you like mother. God is the fabric of reality itself. God isn't a human, with human needs and concerns.

When a lion tears apart a baby gazelle, that's God. Humans do not appreciate this. It doesn't serve human needs. What ever human wants is God to serve them, to make things soft, easy, and pleasant.

You can't beat the game of life by getting everything you want. In the end you will have to surrender to God's Will. That's what spirituality is really about. Not obtaining superpowers.

What does it mean to surrender to Gods Will when your antecedent is God will is everything lol and there is no personal Gods Will...

[Razard86]

On 3/23/2024 at 3:59 PM, SQAAD said:

For five years, I've been on a journey exploring spirituality. I used to not believe in anything beyond what science could explain, but then I found Leo & he talked about some really interesting ideas, like how there is not a 'self' controlling everything inside us. He also talked about using psychedelics to explore the mind and Reality.

Trying mushrooms changed everything for me. It made me realize there's more to reality than just what materialism teaches..

I started meditating & tripping and having these amazing Enlightnment experiences, even connecting deeply with God a couple of times.

But when I'm not in a spiritual state, I'm not sure if what i experience is God. I believe it's God but i can't know for sure in this current state.

Lately, I've been through some really hellish, horrible & nonsensical experiences that have made me question whether God even exists. It feels like suffering has no reason at all & it's completely senseless & d*mb, and it's hard to see any purpose in it. Why would a wise, all-knowing God let that happen?

Why would God let people suffer enormously (rape, torture, crappy situations, health-problems, suicide) for no apparent reason at all?

It's not my problem that God allows suffering. My problem is that God allows senseless, Nonsensical suffering that seems to serve no purpose whatsoever. Sort of the suffering you would expect a d*mn mechanical Universe to generate. Suffering that doesn't stop & makes you wanna tear everything to pieces & end your life.

It also bothers me that most people (not to mention all the other animals) never get to experience or understand God. And it's not great at all that I only feel close to God when I'm on drugs &  i am always confined in this very limited, stupid state.

All this seems very depressing and has made feel disillusioned with Leo's work. Nothing makes sense anymore.

 

 

In one sense God doesn't exist, because God is nothing. God has not qualia, so God can't be identified as Something in particular. From that viewpoint God doesn't exist. But because God is nothing, it is simultaneously everything because Something has borders, size, scale, etc, so it exists within nothing. So this is why God is so hard to discover in your baseline. You need to focus on the subtle. One of the best ways is when you wake up, stop and meditate immediately. You are your most subtle as soon as you wake up from sleep. Also God is love, you are trying to turn God into a something which is what the ego mind does.

Everything experiences God because everything IS GOD. Your goal in the work is to realize the mundane is the divine. Stop looking for peak experiences all the time and raise your baseline to the peak. Whenever you trip, aim to raise your baseline to that experience. Whenever I trip I don't come down dramatically unless I will myself to come down. I'm able to keep majority of that peak for as long as I want. You need to raise your alertness to what is happening within peak experiences, pay attention to what differentiates it from your normal baseline and you will be able to normalize it.

The first step is to stop identifying it as a peak experience and consider that experience normal. But beware, you might not be able to live an ordinary life from that state.

[SQAAD]

@Thought Art

15 hours ago, Thought Art said:

Reality doesn’t serve, but it provides opportunity 

Why doesn't it serve? I don't understand the reason why. Also opportunity for what?

[SQAAD]

@Leo Gura

On 24/3/2024 at 4:57 PM, Leo Gura said:

It's common for religious fundamentalists to lose faith in God when they experience deep suffering or loss. That's because they misunderstand what God is. God is not a personal force who cares about you like mother. God is the fabric of reality itself. God isn't a human, with human needs and concerns.

When a lion tears apart a baby gazelle, that's God. Humans do not appreciate this. It doesn't serve human needs. What ever human wants is God to serve them, to make things soft, easy, and pleasant.

You can't beat the game of life by getting everything you want. In the end you will have to surrender to God's Will. That's what spirituality is really about. Not obtaining superpowers.

You've said in other videos that the Universe/God can have feelings & etc. Doesn't that make it personal?

You don't explain why God has to be that way. Why God has to construct such an animalistic and vicious Universe where ''he'' doesn't give a fk what happens to you?

If God can do whatever, he could create a world where he can incarnate and not need to kill other beings to survive.

Also How would you feel living through the lives of the terrorists below?  Talk about Living Hell ...

 

Edited March 25 by SQAAD

[SQAAD]

@Razard86

32 minutes ago, Razard86 said:

In one sense God doesn't exist, because God is nothing. God has not qualia, so God can't be identified as Something in particular. From that viewpoint God doesn't exist. But because God is nothing, it is simultaneously everything because Something has borders, size, scale, etc, so it exists within nothing. So this is why God is so hard to discover in your baseline. You need to focus on the subtle. One of the best ways is when you wake up, stop and meditate immediately. You are your most subtle as soon as you wake up from sleep. Also God is love, you are trying to turn God into a something which is what the ego mind does.

Everything experiences God because everything IS GOD. Your goal in the work is to realize the mundane is the divine. Stop looking for peak experiences all the time and raise your baseline to the peak. Whenever you trip, aim to raise your baseline to that experience. Whenever I trip I don't come down dramatically unless I will myself to come down. I'm able to keep majority of that peak for as long as I want. You need to raise your alertness to what is happening within peak experiences, pay attention to what differentiates it from your normal baseline and you will be able to normalize it.

The first step is to stop identifying it as a peak experience and consider that experience normal. But beware, you might not be able to live an ordinary life from that state.

What do you mean God is Love? Do you mean that God accepts whatever arises within it?

[Javfly33]

On 23/03/2024 at 8:59 PM, SQAAD said:

But when I'm not in a spiritual state, I'm not sure if what i experience is God. I believe it's God but i can't know for sure in this current state.

There´s nothing to be sure about. You can just accept Truth of what you are or not.

Is necessary that Thoughts that provide contraction and belief are not belief/generated anymore.

For that I would recommend a good solid daily practice. 

Is necessary you break the illusion that your current 'sober' experience is a 'state' different than one of a psychedelic. 

Quote

i am always confined in this very limited, stupid state.

'This' is not a state. Is Truth. But thoughts of this being a 'state' are veiling what is already obvious.

'This' is the same as psychedelic experience. You are just telling yourself is not.

Quote

Why would God let people suffer enormously (rape, torture, crappy situations, health-problems, suicide) for no apparent reason at all

God does not let anything because God is not a being. Is non-being empty Energy.

The energy is literally consciousness though, so the more conscious it becomes the less suffering (anti-life) it create, and more Love (Life) will create.

You are God literally, so you must take all the responsibility and create what YOU WANT is worth to exist in this dream. 

Is it going to be love or is it going to be sadness?

Is it going to be joy and connection or is it going to be separation and contraction?

You decide. You are the Creator. There is nothing outside of you choosing anything.

[SQAAD]

@Breakingthewall

17 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

You call reality god, the intelligence that flows, but I don't see it as totally accurate, maybe I'm missing something. The intelligence that flows seems to be limited by itself, since it must be synchronic with other infinite bubbles of reality. It is not omnipotent, since it cannot not be or not manifest or not be perfect, it is a natural phenomenon that occurs due to the absence of limits and that self-organizes as total perfection. It cannot not be perfect, everything that exists is because ultimately it is infinite, and infinity must be perfect, since it is synchronized infinitely. God is an infinite fractal of infinite perfectly synchronized bubbles, a kaleidoscope that fluctuates in endless cycles. It can't choose, it just is. so it doesn't look like a god

 

So you mean that God has no Will ultimately?

[Javfly33]

23 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

It's common for religious fundamentalists to lose faith in God when they experience deep suffering or loss. That's because they misunderstand what God is. God is not a personal force who cares about you like mother. God is the fabric of reality itself. God isn't a human, with human needs and concerns.

When a lion tears apart a baby gazelle, that's God. Humans do not appreciate this. It doesn't serve human needs. What ever human wants is God to serve them, to make things soft, easy, and pleasant.

You can't beat the game of life by getting everything you want. In the end you will have to surrender to God's Will. That's what spirituality is really about. Not obtaining superpowers.

On one hand I agree, on another, you are literally God. Is not like there is a human and then there is God. You are just creating unconsciously. If you are creating a lion with no thinking or much emotion then no problem. But when is a human there is no excuse for you to create a pleasant human. 

The fabric of reality has intelligence after all. Sure, is not a personal force but it created the personal force that does crave pleasantness and easiness. 

Can we get there for once or are you guys going to keep dreaming in outside forces? 

---

 

The OP the same. He thinks God is something different than him. LoL.

Edited March 25 by Javfly33

[Breakingthewall]

20 minutes ago, SQAAD said:

@Breakingthewall

So you mean that God has no Will ultimately?

It seems that reality has the will to be and to create, but I don't know if this will is free, that is, is there a choice? I would say that no, the reality due it's absence of limitations is perpetual movement, and it cannot be otherwise 

Edited March 25 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

@SQAAD but the thing is that it is irrelevant, we can realize the glory that existence is under the layer of the form. Understanding the reality is secondary, realizing the essence of reality is the goal

[Javfly33]

51 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

It seems that reality has the will to be and to create, but I don't know if this will is free, that is, is there a choice?

I see it exactly as a lucid dream. 

When there is just dreaming unconsciously you can have a nightmare after the other.

But when you realize is a dream suddenly there is conscious creation. You can will yourself to fly within the dream if you want. Or at least you will not create a monster. 

IMO whole of reality is one infinite empty boundless energy that can create consciously or unconscious. 

I think is truly possible that there can be an 'evolution' of the intelligence of the field itself @Breakingthewall In the same way when one takes 5-MeO-DMT what Is happening? The field is evolving from unconsciousness to consciousness.

So the field of energy is in a process of evolution. From deeper unconscious creation to conscious creation. 

[Razard86]

On 3/24/2024 at 6:52 AM, Leo Gura said:

Yes, exactly. Reality/truth doesn't serve you. And accepting that is the whole crux of life.

Reality Truth does serve you, it just serves you by need, not want. I have tested this in my own life and I always get what I need, not what I want. The ego is more focused on want, and confuses want with need. Pragmatic people actually think that good decisions are the reason they are successful. This is an illusion. Success is actually not determined by good decisions, success is determined by what is alignment with God. God determines all success and failure.

Only when you are poor and don't have two nickels to squeeze together will you discover why Jesus said "Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith?" 

^^^This is why religion exists and has lasted the test of time, because when people make dumb ass decisions God bails them out. I tested this out in the last years by giving away majority of my money and quitting my job with no plan. And miracles kept happening. People were walking up and giving me things without me even asking. Just when it looked like things wouldn't work out at the last second something happened FOR ME.

So God serves all of its creation, because God cares ABSOLUTELY. God knows what you can handle and what you cannot handle. God knows exactly what you need. Life is about MATURITY. God is not here to baby you, but to grow you and yes part of Growth is pain. God makes you selfish, and then grows you toward Selflessness and that is all that is going on here.

[gettoefl]

2 hours ago, SQAAD said:

 

You don't explain why God has to be that way. Why God has to construct such an animalistic and vicious Universe where ''he'' doesn't give a fk what happens to you?

If God can do whatever, he could create a world where he can incarnate and not need to kill other beings to survive.

 

you are the one who screwed up the blissful perfection and, look around you, messed up this whole joint

you continue to insist your delusions are true and god has given you perfect sovereignty to do exactly so

your only goal in this dream is to feather your own nest and not care who has to pay the price for you to have one more day

looks at yourself seriously ... god is awaiting you lovingly with open arms if only you will snap out of your megalomania 

or on the other hand enjoy another 10k go-rounds like you have already

no matter you will go back home one day

Edited March 25 by gettoefl

[Bandman]

On 24-3-2024 at 3:57 PM, Leo Gura said:

God is not a personal force who cares about you like mother. God is the fabric of reality itself. God isn't a human, with human needs and concerns.

Isn't God more than just the fabric of reality though? It sounds like you're giving more of a Buddhist view here of God just being the ground of reality. 

For example, in your video about the purpose of life, you said that the purpose of life is Consciousness/God experiencing itself in all its forms and manifestations to explore itself. By this statement it seems God is more than just the fabric of reality.

I'm not asking for some answers to dogmatically believe, I'm just interested in you talking about God lol. I'm on my own path of finding truth and gnosis. 

Reality just confuses the fuck out of me since I've had my awakening experience a few years back. My ego wants to cling on to various belief systems about reality and God. Fear of hell / tormental incarnations does also play a role here. I'm working on cleansing this from my system.

However I'm not even sure if answers exist to the existential questions I have. Is it even possible to gain understanding and answers to all questions? You've said that you've gained infinite understanding of all of reality. But you've also said that you don't know the answers to many questions and that there are some things you can't know. This apparent contradition in your rhetoric confuses me.

[Bandman]

@Leo Gura Forgive me for bothering you about this again, I'm just a human with fears and questions.

My worst fear is being irredeemably irrevocably damned forever. There is absolutely no rational or empirical ground for this, it is just the idea itself that scares me. Of course abrahamic religions try to use this idea to make them join their religion. The idea that free thought might damn you forever is truly a criminal act by those religions. But it still scares me. The fact that IRL i'm surrounded by muslims also doesn't help, since it probably has an effect on me, just knowing that those people believe in eternal hell and are afraid of it, makes the idea more real for me, like Plato's cave where all are living in a shared delusion.

I've learned that to accept this fear and get over it I have to accept the potential outcome. Quite hard to accept that you might never come back from torment, that your consciousness will be imprisoned and tortured forever. But i'm still going to accept this potential outcome. 

On the other hand, I want to find out whether this is even possible for consciousness, to be in a certain state forever. Again, I don't even believe it can, since every state and object of consciousness is impermanent, except consciousness itself. So heaven and hell can't be permanent. 

Also, murphy's law would mean that if any such state could exist, we would already be in it, since time has being going on forever. The fact that I'm not in a permanent state right now, would prove that such a state cannot exist.

But I want to verify this statement myself instead of rationally thinking about it. I do realize for example that the words I'm typing now are absolute truth, because consciousness is simply undeniable. I'm not a complete noob at truth-seeking, but I'm also not advanced. 

Is there any psychedelic you might recommend for this? Shrooms was way too loopy and increased mental imagination instead of decreasing it. Do you recommend 5-MEO-DMT or 5-MEO-MALT for this? I'm a bit afraid of LSD since many people report bad trips on it and it lasts so long. NN-DMT i'm also not sure about, I've heard about people gaining knowledge from DMT entities but that would still imply a duality. I have to verify it myself by being the Monad. Although I'm afraid of such a God-Realization and the collapse of duality and I do realize that a true God-Realization will be extremely shocking(how else could it be) but I still want to face it.

It confuses me that after all your insights and you haven't come to the conclusion whether particular states of consciousness can be permanent or not. 

I want to be fearless about death. I want to face my metaphysical fears. If I can overcome those, any challenge and calamity in life can be overcome, that is my hypothesis.

When I was in LA last year, deeply contemplating metaphysical questions, I came across this quote on a church:

“Make up a story... For our sake and yours forget your name in the street; tell us what the world has been to you in the dark places and in the light. Don't tell us what to believe, what to fear. Show us belief's wide skirt and the stitch that unravels fear's caul.”

-Toni Morrison 

I feel like this quote somehow holds the answer about us humans. But I don't know, maybe I'm just a hopeless romantic.

You've said that truth doesn't serve you. How can it not though? I realize truth won't grow your dick or shit like that. But knowing the truth is liberation by itself right? liberation from insecurity? at least in the grand scheme. 


 

Edited March 25 by Bandman

[SQAAD]

@Razard86

2 hours ago, Razard86 said:

So God serves all of its creation, because God cares ABSOLUTELY. God knows what you can handle and what you cannot handle. God knows exactly what you need. Life is about MATURITY. God is not here to baby you, but to grow you and yes part of Growth is pain. God makes you selfish, and then grows you toward Selflessness and that is all that is going on here.

I also believe that God cares. It doesn't make sense to be Infinitely Intelligent & create all this stuff without giving a damn about what happens to your creation. 

 

 

[Jodistrict]

We know from the four noble truths that suffering exists and that there is an end to suffering.   That an end to suffering is possible is all you need to know.  Talk of “God” is mostly conceptual in nature.   Focus on your practice.