New War In Israel / Gaza

[Danioover9000]

@StarStruck

1 hour ago, StarStruck said:

Boy is doing his thang

https://x.com/cobratate/status/1710941438526017858?s=46&t=_b_ryXoCsOXMmPUcexEK7w

 

   Maybe his redemption ark?

[PurpleTree]

2 minutes ago, HMD said:

@PurpleTree That’s a good thing imo. The rot leaks out under pressure and the systems are purified. 

Yea it‘s like some dark night of the soul bringing the unconscious to consciousness

[Roy 441]

On 07/10/2023 at 11:41 PM, DieFree said:

 

 

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, zurew said:

 

 

2 hours ago, zurew said:

Its also wild seeing the lack of acknowledgement how fucked life has been in Palestine for a long while now.

life in gaza is bad compared to life in israel. If Israel did not exist, the Palestinians would live worse, less food, worse buildings, more poverty, but without others to compare with, they would not have that hatred. It's simple envy. If they had forgotten the religious issue and integrated themselves with the Jews, they would live better than any other Arab.  

Jews are hated now for the same reason they have been hated in Europe: envy.

[PurpleTree]

Yes girls fight fight fight

 

jk

[randmonzzin]

Quote

Allah's Messenger said, "Help your brother, whether he is an oppressor or he is an oppressed one. People asked, "O Allah's Messenger ! It is all right to help him if he is oppressed, but how should we help him if he is an oppressor?" The Prophet said, "By preventing him from oppressing others."

If you're born in Gaza , you're born dead already. The amount of oppressions that Israel commits is just inhuman. They put thresholds on Water they consume , they even control the foods by "calories"  they eat. 

I've met with some Morrocan Jewish and I asked if they like it there? Almost all of them they regret leaving Morocco to Israel. Some of them said they were tricked to go there. ITS OBVIOUS , They're people like us and Evil Politicians control them. 

I want you to see testimonials of former soldiers and their experiences : 

Bottom line , I beleive there will more violence and extreme injustice in the futur toward muslims and that doesn't bother me according to Our Prophet :

Quote

“….For verily ahead of you are such (difficult) days, staying steadfast on Din will be like holding onto burning cinders. Those that do good deeds in those days will receive the reward of fifty people who carry out deeds like you"

 

[PurpleTree]

6 minutes ago, ramosthe5 said:

If you're born in Gaza , you're born dead already. The amount of oppressions that Israel commits is just inhuman. They put thresholds on Water they consume , they even control the foods by "calories"  they eat. 

I've met with some Morrocan Jewish and I asked if they like it there? Almost all of them they regret leaving Morocco to Israel. Some of them said they were tricked to go there. ITS OBVIOUS , They're people like us and Evil Politicians control them. 

I want you to see testimonials of former soldiers and their experiences : 

Bottom line , I beleive there will more violence and extreme injustice in the futur toward muslims and that doesn't bother me according to Our Prophet :

 

How is this your first post? 
How did you even find this forum?

[zazen]

38 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

 

life in gaza is bad compared to life in israel. If Israel did not exist, the Palestinians would live worse, less food, worse buildings, more poverty, but without others to compare with, they would not have that hatred. It's simple envy. If they had forgotten the religious issue and integrated themselves with the Jews, they would live better than any other Arab.  

Jews are hated now for the same reason they have been hated in Europe: envy.

Israel makes the living conditions of Gaza un-livable. Yet people have the nerve and blindeness to claim Israel has a much better living standard in comparison and implying that Palestinians would be better off there.

[Juressic]

19 minutes ago, ramosthe5 said:

If you're born in Gaza , you're born dead already. The amount of oppressions that Israel commits is just inhuman.

What else can you expect nowadays. As we see Hamas is killing civilians intentionally and randomly, they have the support of Iran and Russia, and they are operating from civilian buildings.

Nowadays oppression is understandable because there is great fear of Hamas terrorism, they are 100% terrorists. I don't see the difference between them and the Islamic State.

Although they may had an unfair history 80 years ago, because Israel came to overtake their ancient land as the bible says, there is much more peace and sanity on Israel's side today.
 

[zurew]

42 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

If Israel did not exist, the Palestinians would live worse, less food, worse buildings, more poverty, but without others to compare with, they would not have that hatred.

You don't know for sure how they would live if Israel didn't exist. But even if I buy into the premise that they would live worse , thats that still won't justify the bad things Israel did against Palestine. If doing some kind of unintentional or intentional good to someone or to a group of people would give sufficient justification to do bad  things against them, then we could basically justify any horrible actions that was done historically almost against any group of people , so basically its obviously a kind of reasoning that we should never use.

The "they just envy" is not a good steelman or analysis, because if only envy would be the case or the main reason, then Hamas wouldn't have applied their envy selectively mostly on Israel.

[Scholar]

8 hours ago, abundance said:

This is just cruel and inhumane.

Israel has a right to protect itself but this is just collective punishment, plain and simple.

 

This isn't true, the IDF has clarified it is aware that it will take multiple days for this to occur.

[DocWatts]

The amount of black and white thinking on his topic from both sides is dispiriting to see. Two things can be true at once: that the Israeli state is commiting a genocide against its occupied Palestinian population, and that Hamas is an Islamo-fascist organization that would be just as brutal if they were in a comparable position of power to the Israeli state. So what we have is a monstrous apartheid regime in conflict with a brutal terrorist organization of their own making (as the Israeli state created the inhumane social conditions that were wipe for desperate Palestinians to turn to Hamas), with innocent civilians on both sides suffering as a result.

Make no mistake though, though both sides in this conflict are awful, Israeli has virtually all of the power in this situation. If they agreed to the two state solution compromise this conflict would effectively be over.

Edited October 13, 2023 by DocWatts

[Scholar]

Attidues of Gazans on the conflict in general:

https://www.washingtoninstitute.org/policy-analysis/twi-interactive-polling-platform

 

 

[Scholar]

2 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

The amount of black and white thinking on his topic from both sides is dispiriting to see. Two things can be true at once: that the Israeli state is commiting a genocide against its occupied Palestinian population, and that Hamas is an Islamo-fascist organization that would be just as brutal as the Israeli occupiers if they were in a position of power. So what we have is a monstrous apartheid regime in conflict with a brutal terrorist organization of their own making (as the Israeli state created the inhumane social conditions that were wipe for desperate Palestinians to turn to Hamas), with innocent civilians on both sides suffering as a result.

Make no mistake though, though both sides in this conflict are awful, Israeli has virtually all of the power in this situation. If they agreed to the two state solution compromise this conflict would effectively be over.

See the polling data. Hamas, nor palestinian, view a two state solution as acceptable. If a two state solution did occur, they would fight until all of palestine was freed, and all original land returned to them.

This is what happens when you radicalize an entire generation for your holy war, which is precisely what happened under Hamas.

 

This  type of lack of understanding of human nature actually leads to more death and war, not less. If Israel did accept a two state solution right now (Hamas would most likely reject it anyways), it would most likely lead to a far more involved war in the future.

Edited October 13, 2023 by Scholar

[PurpleTree]

2 minutes ago, DocWatts said:

If they agreed to the two state solution compromise this conflict would effectively be over.

That also we don’t know for sure

[An young being]

1 minute ago, Scholar said:

See the polling data. Hamas, nor palestinian, view a two state solution as acceptable. If a two state solution did occur, they would fight until all of palestine was freed, and all original land returned to them.

This is what happens when you radicalize an entire generation for your holy war, which is precisely what happened under Hamas.

Congrats! You are the 1111th post.

[Danioover9000]

@PurpleTree

1 hour ago, PurpleTree said:

Yes girls fight fight fight

 

jk

   Not a joke, this is seriously disappointing. The levels of misinformation. Yes, go and condemn HAMAs, meanwhile sweep under the rug what makes up HAMAs: disenfranchised, oppressed, poor, desperate Palestinians that have no choice but to fight Israel, which makes them open to more radicalization.

[Scholar]

There is a simple mistake in thinking that is occuring here, and leftists have a tendency to fall for this trap:

It is the assumption that once you remove the cause for a dynamic, the dynamic will disappear as well. This is true to some degree, but what is being missed here is that usually what occurs is that the dynamic develops a self-perpetuating mechanism. You can see this all over nature in general, and in relation to social dynamics, we can see this manifesting as cultural attitudes and ideologies.

 

In this case, there is a false assumption that if we remove the conditions which caused frustration and hatred in the gazans/palestinians, that they then will also lose the attitude that are a result of that frustration. But this is far from guaranteed, because at some point the frustration manifests as a cultural attitude that is self-perpetuating. At that point, you can remove the initial causative condition and yet see no change in attitudes as well, in fact it might lead to the opposite, a bolstering of those attitudes. You see this in practice with how stage green interacts with stage red in the US, through naive empathy and solidarity actually harming the victmized person as a result of not understanding their state of being. This can encourage destructive behaviour, rather than actually help mitigate it.

 

The "Free Palestine" movement is precisely this type of harmful dynamic. It encourages self-righteousness and blind hatred in the victims, causing them to act in ways that will bring more harm to them. There is a version of this that could have been helpful, but the movement is so infested with blind hatred and rage that all this will do is cause more blind hatred and rage.

This is a huge blindspot for stage green.

Edited October 13, 2023 by Scholar

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, ramosthe5 said:

you're born in Gaza , you're born dead already. The amount of oppressions that Israel commits is just inhuman.

Yes, for sure, a tough circumstance. In Cuba, for example, they also have power outages and a blockade for decades, but they dance, they make movies, they write poetry, they fuck a lot, they study, they are doctors, musicians, and they don't hate anyone. neither to the Americans, nor to their dictatorship, nor to life in general.  They see the positive in life, but it seems that Muslims need to be victims to justify their failure as a civilization, always crying and hating others.

What Muslims should do is celebrate a day of thanksgiving to the West, and say: thank you West, without you we would not have cars, airplanes, telephones, electricity, medicine... we thank you for those gifts and we are going to push hard for the evolution and freedom of humanity

[DocWatts]

23 minutes ago, PurpleTree said:

That also we don’t know for sure

True. So let me rephrase that: we have very good evidence to believe that given the options that are available, it would offer the best avenue for massively de-escalating the conflict, and in the long run would offer the best chance at lasting peace for both sides in this conflict.

Creating tolerable and humane living conditions for Palestinians, and giving them the possibility of a hopeful future, is the most reliable way of undercutting the appeal of death-cult organizations like Hamas. Under the status quo there's zero reason for a Palestinian suffering under Israeli apartheid to be hopeful for a better future. Hardly surprising that these social conditions fuel extremism.

Edited October 13, 2023 by DocWatts