I Asked Peter Ralston About Psychedelics, Here Is His Response...

[Javfly33]

19 minutes ago, Water by the River said:

 

Honestly, if there ever has been one big warning sign dangling on top of all of that proclaimed "highest Awakeninsg n+1", it is what described in the paragraph above. Suffering continues. And Reality will make you suffer until you get that.

 

@Water by the River You forget that in this forum a lot of people are too cool for this selfish normie motivation of avoiding suffering/going towards freedom.

They already said they don't mind suffering, they are so above of us normies just wanting to be blissed out with our mind totally empty.

God! How we dare...choosing as the high goal to be just a simple peace of life as long as everything within is completely 'set up' and at ease.

We would sell our brains with all the data and information for just the Empty Bliss. Such a traition to God.

How simple we are...how spiritually inferior developed we are for having such selfish simple priority....

Edited August 5, 2023 by Javfly33

[MAHAVATAR_-_BABAJI]

20 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

The genetic freak started doing yoga with 12 years old from a guru of his town

What was I doing with 12 years old? I don't know about you but I was just starting frying my brains out with videogames, porn, and next years drinking and smoking as any of my peers on school.

See, there is no question that some people by luck get born in certain ambience that makes them favourable for spiritual purposes, but also, if one does not do the right things, you can't neither expect to get the results. 

I am not saying that Sahdguru was not born in a privileged ambience, but saying that it is a genetic freak assumes he has something in their brain that you do not have. This is deeply hurtful and damaging for anyone that wants to do anything of value in this work.

And the word doesn't even make sense. The skill that influences your state of consciousness or Awakening doesn't have anything to do with genes lmao

We getting to a preposterous level of creating and projecting differences on our minds, we starting to attribute memory (genes) to consciousness? Really? 

Sure, location has an effect on your willingness to do sadhana. If sadhguru had a cellphone in his early days maybe he'd be cock-rubbing also. 

Nobody knows whether or weather not they are a genetic freak. My assumption is we all are. Understanding is king. We understand and execute certain things to various degrees. Ramanujan was average at math but has profound insights in his sleep. You could do the same(lucid dreaming), the degree to which may differ. 

Genes are determiners. In a certain sense they are the physical version of karma haha.

I try not chill with 12 years Olds. ? 

Edited August 5, 2023 by MAHAVATAR_-_BABAJI

[Leo Gura]

6 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

You forget that in this forum a lot of people are too cool for this selfish normie motivation of avoiding suffering/going towards freedom.

They already said they don't mind suffering, they are so above of us normies just wanting to be blissed out with our mind totally empty.

The end of suffering or bliss is not the same thing as CONSCIOUSNESS.

Pursue whatever spiritual goals you want, it just doesn't mean you're deeply Conscious. It means you're very well trained. And maybe that's enough for you. That's up to you. But it's not the only game in town.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Water by the River]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

1) insane levels of consciousness which you will never ever naturally reach, 2) and insight.

And "insane levels of consciousness" or "insigh" into what? Appearance/Form/Arisings IN Absolute Reality. N+1, evermore, forever. You never "arrive" somewhere (IT is infinite and Infinity).

And while doing that and not being fully enlightened (or BEING Ones True Nature, Absolute Reality): Suffering in cycles.

"I have never claimed that psychedelics result in the lack of suffering."
But at least I got the message that the end of psychological suffering (or Full Enlightenment) was declared impossible, or at least as lower in value or priority (like in "spiritual summom bonum, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summum_bonum) to ever new and higher Awakenings. Please correct me if I got the wrong impression.

Look, exploring Reality with ever new Awakenings: Wonderful, I am all for it! It is the future of Humanity, and you are a pioneer. There are literally endless dimensions to be explored. By the way, do you know the work of Jurgen Ziewe (longtime Out of body explorer, with legit Enlightenment experiences)? (http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Model_of_the_Multidimensional_Universe.html ; http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Higher_Mental_Planes_or_Heaven_Worlds.html ; http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Life_after_death_-_a_description_of_the_afterlife.html ) for example.  I am sure you would love it.

The only problem I see is giving that higher exploration of ever higher Awakenings n+1 more value/priority over stabilzing in ones True Being (Full Enlightenment). Because it will lead to more suffering for many, including you. That is as far as I can see that is pretty much the only point where we have different perspectives.

And please take care that you dont take some demons/angels (sorry old fashioned wording from a few centuries ago) Aliens of the not so well meaning kind (Jaques Valle, Passport to Magonia: From Folklore to Flying Saucers; Charles Upton, The Alien Disclosure Deception; Graham Hancock, Supernatural) back home from the exploration, and go really insane and not just a bit alien insane. And that is meant not ironically, but well meaning and respectfully. Hic sunt dracones.

All the best for your future journey, and same for all forum participants. Really.

Water by the River

[Leo Gura]

20 minutes ago, Water by the River said:

And "insane levels of consciousness" or "insigh" into what? Appearance/Form/Arisings IN Absolute Reality. N+1, evermore, forever. You never "arrive" somewhere (IT is infinite and Infinity).

No! Into Absolute Consciousness.

You DO NOT comprehend what Consciousness is. No matter how well trained for bliss you are. You are blissing out but not comprehending consciousness seriously. Because you don't need to comprehend anything to bliss out. All you gotta do is shut off your mind and sit still.

Quote

And while doing that and not being fully enlightened (or BEING Ones True Nature, Absolute Reality): Suffering in cycles.

Again, that's just irrelevant to Consciousness. Consciousness does not care what the quality of your life is. These are human concerns and Consciousness is not limited to the human.

Quote

"I have never claimed that psychedelics result in the lack of suffering."
But at least I got the message that the end of psychological suffering (or Full Enlightenment) was declared impossible, or at least as lower in value or priority (like in "spiritual summom bonum, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summum_bonum) to ever new and higher Awakenings. Please correct me if I got the wrong impression.

I've never said you need to hold my priorities. Have whatever priorities you want. And I have mine.

Different priorities get you to different places. There are trade-offs.

The point is not to confuse the end of suffering (enlightenment as you call it) with Consciousness.

Quote

The only problem I see is giving that higher exploration of ever higher Awakenings n+1 more value/priority over stabilzing in ones True Being (Full Enlightenment). Because it will lead to more suffering for many, including you. That is as far as I can see that is pretty much the only point where we have different perspectives.

Yes it may lead to more suffering.

But also, nothing prevents me from also pursuing the end of suffering via traditional means.

P.S. I don't believe anyone who says he has ended suffering. It is much more likely that these people are deluding themselves.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Water by the River]

16 minutes ago, Javfly33 said:

@Water by the River You forget that in this forum a lot of people are too cool for this selfish normie motivation of avoiding suffering/going towards freedom.

They already said they don't mind suffering, they are so above of us normies just wanting to be blissed out with our mind totally empty.

God! How we dare...choosing as the high goal to be just a simple peace of life as long as everything within is completely 'set up' and at ease.

We would sell our brains with all the data and information for just the Empty Bliss. Such a traition to God.

How simple we are...how spiritually inferior developed we are for having such selfish simple priority....

Yes. Javfly33, every being ends up with that insight after having been beaten enough by INFINITELY large and Infinitely Intelligent Reality.

Every being suffers as long as all these mindsets of doing something else than trying to finding permanent bliss persist. And even in doing or prefering something else they just do something that brings bliss or peace or good emotions, even when searching ever new Awakenings n+1, or getting maximum conscious, whatever that means in the individual case).

So, its just the question of 

a) learning by suffering by trying the 1000+1 games separate-selfs play, and seeing that they all fail in bringing permanent happiness. Takes a longer time, but is the nature of this game/lila/universe and its Raison d'Être (the Lila-Show) or

b) learning by insight and going straight to the finish line, or back home to ones True Being: Full Enlightenment. The Deep Identity Shift to being the Infinite Reality itself, the one without a second, or Infinite Impersonal Consciousness.

All I am trying to do is highlighting this little dynamic how the Absolute "throws" itself out into manifestation, form, the many, separate-self, and PULLS itself back home either by suffering or insight. And valueing a) higher as b), or a) being somehow spiritual superior to b).

In a certain way, I am spoiling the game/Lila of a). But just look at the reactions, I am very sure I won't spoil it for too many...  

Water by the River 

[Leo Gura]

I should clarify something for you guys so you don't fool yourselves: psychedelics will not produce a permanent high state of consciousness nor a permanent blissed out state. If that's something you expect or want, look for other means. You cannot use psychedelics to magically avoid training for those things which require training. For example, being a kind, gentle human being requires training. You can't get that behavior without training.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Water by the River]

25 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Because you don't need to comprehend anything to bliss out. All you gotta do is shut off your mind and sit still.

You would be the first one for whom that bliss-out has worked permanently without the comprehension or Realization of Full Enlightenment by just shutting off the mind and sitting still.

25 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

You DO NOT comprehend what Consciousness is

I see. If you mean the manifestations/appearances/Awakenings n+1 that Consciousness can produce WITHIN it and become aware of it, awaken to it ever more: It is endless. In that way, you also don't comprehend it. And never finally will or can. Its God business exploring what it/God can do, its potential, forever. We are the instruments of the Reality/God doing that.  It will never stop, never run out of new Awakeninsg. An Infinity of Infinties, as already Cantor has shown.

But I do comprehend the Absolute, or my True Nature, and the nature of the dream. And with that all possible dreams. And that ends the separate-self, and the psychological suffering.

25 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes it may lead to more suffering.

But also, nothing prevents me from also pursuing the end of suffering via traditional means.

And with that, we align. And I am, and will remain, a big fan of your explorations and Awakenings.

Just have some mercy on your followers: Many of them don't have the potential you have of exploring the Multiverse/Consciousness, and just suffer more if they don't pursue the classic path to the end of suffering, the end of the separate-self contraction, or Full Enlightenment, and go instead for exploring the Infinite Infinities of Reality. Most of them will probably not reach Full Enlightenment in this life, but it is not the only life they have. It is growth over a long cycle of lifes (see for example Jürgen Ziewe, http://www.multidimensionalman.com/Multidimensional-Man/Life_after_death_-_a_description_of_the_afterlife.html ). Maybe they have to learn their individual package in this life? Setting these up for the path of the (fascinating and important) exploration of the Infinity of Dimensions of Reality and ever higher Awakenings into Consciousness (your Karma) will lead to additional suffering on their side.

Maybe there is balance possible that honours the respect, beauty and splendour of Gods creations, ever higher Awakenings and becoming more consciousness (that I don't denie at all), and the path each soul is traveling towards its True Being? To minimize suffering for all possible beings?

Water by the River

Edited August 5, 2023 by Water by the River

[Water by the River]

7 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

I should clarify something for you guys so you don't fool yourselves: psychedelics will not produce a permanent high state of consciousness nor a permanent blissed out state. If that's something you expect or want, look for other means. You cannot use psychedelics to magically avoid training for those things which require training. For example, being a kind, gentle human being requires training. You can't get that behavior without training.

Namaste! That is beautiful. Thank you. 

Water by the River

[Leo Gura]

33 minutes ago, Water by the River said:

You would be the first one for whom that bliss-out has worked permanently without the comprehension or Realization of Full Enlightenment by just shutting off the mind and sitting still.

I've heard of guys who just sit around and bliss out.

But your "comprehension or realization of full enlightenment" will come from sitting still and shutting off your mind. So I don't see contradiction here. You're basically talking about insane amounts of meditation.

Quote

I see. If you mean the manifestations/appearances/Awakenings n+1

This is a very reductionistic and misleading way to put it.

Quote

But I do comprehend the Absolute, or my True Nature, and the nature of the dream.

Well, I beg to differ.

Quote

Just have some mercy on your followers: Many of them don't have the potential you have of exploring the Multiverse/Consciousness, and just suffer more if they don't pursue the classic path

You make a good point.

However from the point of view of teaching, the classic path you suggest boils down to sitting for months on end in silence doing nothing. So I have nothing to teach on that matter. Anyone who is hardcore enough to undertake that path is welcome to do so. Realistically extremely few people will ever do this. And talking about it endlessly is not going to help people do it. I would say, either decide to do it or stop talking about it.

From what I can see you basically got two ways to achieve this:

1) Insane amounts of full-time meditation. This requires you quit your job, drop your relationships, and meditate full-time for months.

2) Do years of pretty hardcore Kriya yoga. With no real guarantees. I'm not sure what kind of promises Kriya makes about the end of suffering. Doesn't seem realistic.

What other way is there?

The reason I don't talk much about these paths is because they are so hardcore I don't think anyone will do them. Those people who would do them are basically taking the path of the full-time monk.

And if you're just going to meditate an hour or two per day, I would consider the end of suffering a pipe dream.

There is a good reason why I've never talked much about this whole "end of suffering" business. And that is because this is such a near-impossible feat that only the hardest of the hardcore will achieve it. And even those who claim to achieve it, I have my doubt how true it is.

So I say back to you, have mercy on my followers and don't fill their heads with pipe dreams. Many of them don't have the potential to end all suffering. And once you fill their heads with this expectation, you will multiply their suffering many fold.

The reason I talk about psychedelics is because they are effective for ordinary people in one weekend. But of course this cannot produce the positive benefits from years of a full-time monk lifestyle.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Hello from Russia]

11 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

And if you're just going to meditate an hour or two per day

What if perhaps with modern technology and smart optimization around you environment it's actually possible to achieve in faster pace?

I get a sense that most ascetics in india and so forth were living in such shitty conditions (in slums and so forth) it might as well have hindered their speed by a lot? Imagine their diets also... and many other things of that nature

[Leo Gura]

3 minutes ago, Hello from Russia said:

What if perhaps with modern technology and smart optimization around you environment it's actually possible to achieve in faster pace?

I get a sense that most ascetics in india and so forth were living in such shitty conditions (in slums and so forth) it might as well have hindered their speed by a lot? Imagine their diets also... and many other things of that nature

I think it's exactly the opposite. In India it is easy, but with modern technology is it virtually impossible. You need to quit all your technology to get the results Water By The River is selling.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Water by the River]

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Well, I beg to differ.

And that is ok.

8 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

However from the point of view of teaching, the classic path you suggest boils down to sitting for months on end in silence doing nothing. So I have nothing to teach on that matter. Anyone who is hardcore enough to undertake that path is welcome to do so. Realistically extremely few people will ever do this. And talking about it endlessly is not going to help people do it. I would say, either decide to do it or stop talking about it.

 

 

17 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

What other way is there?

I didn't do too much sitting meditation (still 100s of hours/maybe in the lower 1000s, but not excessive Zen/Theravada-style 10.000s of hours monk fulltime stuff), but walked the path of Mahamudra/Dzogchen (with 1000s of hours of meditation, but in daily life over 15 years+), with taking the meditation early into daily life (and not just mindfulness, but high-speed thought-cut-off Trekchö), and that got pleasant quite early on. 

Here is a summary of that step:

On 28.5.2023 at 3:44 PM, Water by the River said:

Actually, one normally needs to take the meditation off the meditation pillow into daily life, staying fully awake while the mindstream is doing its thing and is still on in daily life.

Only this way, off the pillow and in daily life, one gets the momentum of 1000s of hours of  meditation of transcending ones separate self (at least for normies and other not so gifted people, like yours truly) to make it to awakened nondual states. And these 1000s of hours when taken off the pillow into daily life are then really nice, no chore.

•  The really MAGIC POINT when you manage to take the mindfulness of staying "on top" of the mindstream, cutting it off if you want to, and off the meditation pillow into living daily life from that. From there on, its downhill, and gets better and better... bliss and love starts flowing.
  • To do that, one needs
    • the right system that can do that (taking meditation off the pillow). Not all (actually quite few, including Mahamudra) have efficient methods for doing that. If they have methods for doing that at all.
    • and a few 100 hours (I would guess in average) on the pillow to get to that point.

 

If somebody says one doesn't need these several 1000 hours (because he/she didn't need that), 

• that person could surely qualifies to coach others that also don't need these 1000s of hours... . And for sure, there are people that don't need these 1000s of hours. Although, probably not that many, considering how much is meditated, and few wake up...
• But how does one know how much transcendence/hours one needs to get the awakened states, before actually being there? And if a system that worked at less than 1000s hours necessary works on oneself? Right, one doesn't...
• Often most endearing are the folks that needed very little practice (or anything of practice at all) to wake up, or next to none meditation: Hey, won the lottery, great.
  • But how many win the lottery? Sure one got a lottery-winner canidate as coachee? Hey you, are you one, will ya?? The minor nuiances of life...
• Also awesome and funny are some Zen/Theravada-systems and the like, that teach "bone-breaking" methods of boring meditation that lead nowhere without really Uber-human-willpower of enduring ones monkey-mind, boredom, and failing meditation and lacking lovely states....
  • Like  in, Die on the pillow! Yes darling, but how about killing me softly with actually an efficient meditation system where I can see my progress, and actually start feeling better quite soon?
  • And where I don't get beaten with the Keisaku if I actually ask a technical question on my meditation method that makes sense?

 

And many other "Pointing out the Great Way" Propaganda-posts in my post-achieve, just check for "Pointing out the Great Way".

Here is a summary of the path, and my experience with that path:

The path of Mahamudra/Dzogchen (Tibetan Buddhism) described for example in Brown, Pointing out the Great Way (and the other books of Brown) is in my experience unique in efficiency. With Zen or Theravada meditation-system, I would have needed the 1000s-10.000s of hours and years of sitting meditation, with an unassured outcome. Of that I am sure.

Please feel invited to take a look at that system. Maybe it is the system you are looking for. I feel very similiar like you describe in your post when looking at most other meditation-systems I am aware of (and I read about pretty much all of the major ones, on some more, on some less), but not this one.

 

15 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

1) Insane amounts of full-time meditation. This requires you quit your job, drop your relationships, and meditate full-time for months.

I have a quite successful entrepreneurial and business career, and a happy marriage. And a hobby besides all this transcendence stuff.  It is possible.

19 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

There is a good reason why I've never talked much about this whole "end of suffering" business. And that is because this is such a near-impossible feat that only the hardest of the hardcore will achieve it. And even those who claim to achieve it, I have my doubt how true it is.

Well, lets see what life brings...

20 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

So I say back to you, have mercy on my followers and don't fill their heads with pipe dreams. Many of them don't have the potential to end all suffering. And once you fill their heads with this expectation, you will multiply all their suffering many fold.

Yes. Yet, all beings automatically karmically go from life to life, growing and wising up in the long run, orienting themselves to less suffering. With the classic methods of compassion and becoming more aware of the mindstream, normally not too much damage can be done, and suffering tends to get less. And then maybe some psychedelics from time to time to contact the eternal...

And yes, one should to good to oneself, and not multiply suffering with anything. Eternity will not run away...

Water by the River

[Leo Gura]

@Water by the River Thanks for the details.

You mentioned Mahamudra/Dzogchen daily practice. In brief, what does that entail?

I'm guessing Kriya yoga would be more effective than sitting meditation. Which is why I recommended it in the past. Personally I have found that sitting meditation is absurdly ineffective unless it's done for a week at a time like a non-stop retreat. If I meditate nonstop on a retreat for 7-10 days then some interesting shifts in consciousness start to become possible. But it's such a pain in the ass to do.

The problem I have with daily non-sitting meditation is that it interferes with intellectual/creative work. I don't understand how anyone does that and achieves any kind of work but manual labor. And frankly even that seems challenging.

Edited August 5, 2023 by Leo Gura

[Breakingthewall]

4 hours ago, Water by the River said:

If its Ultimate Reality or the Absolute, it HAS to be always here, and HAS to be always accessible once realized

14 hours ago, Anon212 said:

 

Let's see, absolute reality, as its name indicates, is reality, now. there is no other. obvious. what happens is that as humans we live a limited dual experience, which makes reality not seem absolute but relative. one thing in relation to another. and limited: with beginning and end. but that is not to say that it is not really absolute. Right now, having a coffee on a terrace, I am aware of the absolute that reality is, but aware to a certain point because I cannot get rid of the apparent limitation. if now i go up to my house, i do enough 5meo, there is absolutely nothing left of the relative. zero. reality expands to infinity, without bottom. and in the infinite I recognize myself as the unborn that is, total, infinitely abundant, without limit. it is an obvious and perfect realization. there is no more possible depth because what I am is, precisely, infinite depth. When you say that what I am explaining is missing something to be the true awakening, I think that what happens is that you do not understand it because you have only accessed States of bliss, but not truly infinite, since it is impossible without psychedelics. nobody can. You're a steel door, you can't understand it until you blast the door with dynamite. It is very easy, it only takes will and courage

Edited August 5, 2023 by Breakingthewall

[Breakingthewall]

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

should clarify something for you guys so you don't fool yourselves: psychedelics will not produce a permanent high state of consciousness nor a permanent blissed out state.

13 hours ago, Anon212 said:

 

psychedelics can't do that but they can greatly help you do it. Every time you break the appearance of limitation, it weakens, and insights arise on how to proceed to open yourself more and more to infinity. insights that include attitudes in your daily life. In addition, the dissolution of energy blockages that perpetuate harmful patterns is facilitated.

[Anon212]

45 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

@Water by the River Thanks for the details.

You mentioned Mahamudra/Dzogchen daily practice. In brief, what does that entail?

I'm guessing Kriya yoga would be more effective than sitting meditation. Which is why I recommended it in the past. Personally I have found that sitting meditation is absurdly ineffective unless it's done for a week at a time like a non-stop retreat. If I meditate nonstop on a retreat for 7-10 days then some interesting shifts in consciousness start to become possible. But it's such a pain in the ass to do.

The problem I have with daily non-sitting meditation is that it interferes with intellectual/creative work. I don't understand how anyone does that and achieves any kind of work but manual labor. And frankly even that seems challenging.

I tried sitting meditation for 2 year and it felt like the biggest waste of time

[Javfly33]

Normal sitting meditation is not effective/potent enough as Leo have said (at least it it won't be for most people IME), because it lacks an intensity/concentration/energetic raising aspect, that other spiritual tools such as Yoga or Kriyas can deliver.

 I agree with Leo in the topic about being in modern society makes almost impossible to 'abide' in an absolute state of consciousness. As much as I endorse and praise the practices I´ve learned this last year, I 98% suspect that it won't be until I go to a retreat/ashram that things will start to become really interesting.

20 minutes ago, Anon212 said:

I tried sitting meditation for 2 year and it felt like the biggest waste of time

I wouldn't call it a waste of time but yeah, most people habit of meditation does seem like a weak spiritual tool.

You have to take in mind that just because you close your eyes and sit does NOT MEAN you are meditating.

For meditation to happen a certain activation of your energies/consciousness must be there, while at the same time the body completely relaxed. This is why at least in the Yoga tools I´ve learned, meditation is only left at the end, intended to happen as a result  of the previous practices that have been done to raise/pump up energy system.

At that point when you close your eyes and hold a mudra, bum, is instantaneous. And once the energy system starts to go down you should get up the cushion and continue the day, don't keep pushing it because from that moment it will be a 'waste of time' as you have said.

If there is no intensity there will be no awareness, just peaceful resting. (Peaceful resting is nice, but you can achieve that with a massage, no need to meditate lol )

Edited August 5, 2023 by Javfly33

[docs20]

16 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Don't get me wrong. I still regard Ralston as a genius teacher. His integrity and mastery is insane. He offers tons of value. However that does not mean he has the right view on every point. Especially regarding psychedelics and Love. Those are the two biggest flaws I found in his teachings. I still respect him a lot.

Let me be clear. Whenever I point out some deficiency with a spiritual teacher that does not mean I'm telling you not to study their work. Most spiritual teachers have a lot of value to offer regardless. Consider Teal Swan. I don't regard her as super woke but her videos offer a lot of helpful advice.

What do you still find genius about his work to this day?

[ValiantSalvatore]

I was not fortunate enough to study under many teachers, mostly two directly and I talked recently to a person who might have been serious about a rinzai-zen path which heavily involves thinking & contemplation, yet.... as a girl I don't know if this hardcore masculine path resonated with her, I experimented with the following:

• Mixture of 50 minutes shinzen young & kriya yoga meditations for 3 months approx. (it was okay but very exhausting the kriya yoga had immense effects on energetic qualities), more than the coarse mindfulness meditation approach without exclusively focusing on flow.
• Soto-Zen retreats it was very good to deal in a group with the energy of lethargy and it was pretty basic, after the 14 days I first noticed for the first time, fuck everything is so fast and streamlined in my consciouness while I am very slow, it helped immensely dealing with others and managing them, as they were stuck in their fast paced thinking & not deliberate depth
• Some stuff from Sadghuru online & once yin-yoga from the local yoga school, integral mindfulness, breath count meditation etc. 

There are different things, the thing that is the most unexplored region for me is yoga, especially the physical yoga, yet I am basically limited to do mostly seating type practices and some energetic type mix eventually like qi-gong etc. To boost my practice. The effects of weighlifting for retreats have also been good, for faster breakthroughs during retreats with a "brute force & chill attitude". 

The idea of the end of suffering, I never considered it real, yet I wished it to be true for many who suffer. The intensity of suffering I experience the more consciouness I gain is the most paradoxical thing. In that sense it hurts more and bothers me less. When I talked to one of the coaches of Shinzen, he told me you can get quick results mostly by doing retreats in the 3 months range. 

The most realistic thing s1 can do is to do weekend retreats, solo-retreats, psychdelic retreats and explore many different paths, and stick to one main path and adjust and stablize as much as possible imo, I am currently very keen to learn from adyashanti as just my life experience demands it sort of. I keep feeling the resonance. Kriya-Yoga I would love to do, as a retreat, yet you basically would need to have a family imo that is highly sustainable and offers you the freedom to practice this, while you still are able to provide. I also have some personal ressonance to some christian traditions, yet I would never explore them, yet the act of surrender gives me an immense depth & connection to god, so a love oriented practice generally helps. 

I also find it fascinating when I consider Daniel Ingram as a doctor he must have witnessed and gotten into an immense level of pain & suffering, and the paradox of not beign able to solve it and diving into hardcore practices. Anyway, what I'd like to say is the best thing s1 can do is to do sabbatical and deeply integrate the lessons like 1-2 year bootcamp/retreat. If the more hippy-meta-modern interest and acceptance rises, we might get more psychedelic infused retreats, that would facilitate depth immensely and get back deeper to stronger shamanic roots, which helps to deal with the twisted resonance of "animalistic&robotic" nature of society. Even though the streamlined soto-zen do-nothing path helped me the most, yet it's so fking important to focus on fullness to not starve from the excessive yang energy, imo I was not fortunate enough to meet a real chinese master in China, yet when I saw the temples some of them are deeply fking conscious it's scary af, walking through these temples & these coincidences don't feel random. 

I still have a rough idea, what would suit me, the more retreats and depth I gain the more I notice how deep it can get. The 20+ mico-retreats from Shinzen each micro-retreats opens my eyes to some level, the point is the level of stimulation is unreal, you basically need some level of sensory deprivation to recharge yourself etc. 

With all the science & psychdelic there will be more a anmalistic rebellion against the higher stuff etc. Anyway.