Suicide

[at_anchor]

If what comes after suicide is even more suffering and could be even worse, all the people in the world who commit suicide daily have to read this post in order not to commit it. It seems kind of unfair to me. I'm here enjoying the benefits of your wisdom, while they are there suffering and thinking they will get away from it by commiting suicide. Then they get an even worse life, while I, the lucky one, who read this and did not commit suicide, get a better afterlife. Doesn't make any sense. Spirits are either all the same or there is just one Spirit. At least God should be fair and just.

[Someone here]

5 minutes ago, at_anchor said:

If what comes after suicide is even more suffering and could be even worse, all the people in the world who commit suicide daily have to read this post in order not to commit it. It seems kind of unfair to me. I'm here enjoying the benefits of your wisdom, while they are there suffering and thinking they will get away from it by commiting suicide. Then they get an even worse life, while I, the lucky one, who read this and did not commit suicide, get a better afterlife. Doesn't make any sense. Spirits are either all the same or there is just one Spirit. At least God should be fair and just.

Who said God "should " be fair and just ? Maybe God is the biggest asshole you ever imagined and he punishes those who commit suicide with eternal suffering?  I mean how would you know? You see,you gotta admit that you don't actually know crap about God,death, and the after life . 

Here's some reasons to NOT commit suicide:

1-One day, you will die anyway. What's the hurry, stay awhile.

2-Death is uncertain. You dont know whats on the other side.

3-life keeps changing. It is full of possiblities.

4- If you are a virgin : how can you end it , without even having sex.

[Thought Art]

Why would God care how you die when he doesn’t care how you live? 
 

Look at all the fucked up shit in reality. He clearly loves it all.

[Galyna]

1 hour ago, at_anchor said:

If what comes after suicide is even more suffering and could be even worse, all the people in the world who commit suicide daily have to read this post in order not to commit it. It seems kind of unfair to me. I'm here enjoying the benefits of your wisdom, while they are there suffering and thinking they will get away from it by commiting suicide. Then they get an even worse life, while I, the lucky one, who read this and did not commit suicide, get a better afterlife. Doesn't make any sense. Spirits are either all the same or there is just one Spirit. At least God should be fair and just.

There are no other people. With all my respect. But for you, right at this second is just a story. Admit you don’t truly know. It is a second order knowledge, who is primal then? YOU.

Edited October 21, 2022 by Galyna

[Bobby_2021]

6 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

God doesn't punish you, God is just lost in dreams. Some of those dreams are nightmares. That is all. Don't make it personal.

Is suffering inevitable in finiteness?

So just by God deciding to become finite, he accepted suffering and all dreams are essentially nightmares.

Can you be in a finite dream and not suffer. Is this possible? 

[Thought Art]

@Bobby_2021 as long as you are human anyway

[Someone here]

20 minutes ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

What if you have terminal cancer and you are facing a slow and painful death? Wouldn't it make sense to take a short cut and spare yourself needless suffering that will eventually lead to the same result?

Of course, one might argue that life itself is a slow but steady physical deteriation process that invariably ends with death... it's an interesting conundrum.

I am not completely qualified to answer this because I have never been diagnosed with a terminal disease but I think I can share something that might be relevant.

Also, this is purely personal and so may not generalize.

There is this thing called passive suicidality, where you don't actually plan a suicide attempt but have thoughts along the lines of, “It's be so great if I that truck over there would hit me.” For me, every time I have something wrong with me and need to go to see the doctor, I sincerely hope that it's something fatal. If I have a stomach ache, I really hope that it's a cancer or that both of my kidneys have stopped working. If I have a headache, I really hope it's a brain tumor. When the results come in, I get really disappointed when it's something minor.

So, if I get diagnosed with a terminal illness, I would be incredibly happy. Except I would really want to die without much suffering. So, in fact, it would make me more likely to do something about it since now it will be somewhat easier for my loved ones to deal with my death.

[Thought Art]

“There’s safety in the end” - Bon Iver (Heavenly Father)

[Gabith]

@Loba Thank you, I'm not ready to face death I think the first thing I need to do is to respect myself, stop trying pleasing people or thinking I owe them something 

very touching video.. 

[Thought Art]

8 hours ago, Galyna said:

But a statement that you can kill your ego is wrong. There is nothing there to kill in the first place. You think you have an ego and it is some kind autonomous entity.

Look around your room right now, everything is information in your current visual field. You are the whole entire field, everything, absolutely EVERYTHING you are perceiving right at this second.

But to create an illusion of the separate self, there are thoughts (mental sensual images, auditory labels) on top of what you are perceiving right at this second.

Thoughts are needed for a purpose of the explanation and orientation in this visual field, you call “reality”. Otherwise, you would go insane and can not orient yourself, even could not locate or understand what you are.

Now, you are the whole entire picture. What you call ego is the perception (sounds, feelings, smells, tactile sensations and visual images + plus thoughts) that come and go and form the idea of the separate subjective experience.

Who are you going to kill there? If you mean “the voice” inside of your head, then sure, give it a try, it is impossible to kill it, however. @Gabith

 

1. How would you define ego?

2. Yes, that is a good point that I am everything in my experience. However, am I not still relating to the perceived “external world” and even my “internal world” through my egoic filter while in a normal sober state? 
 

3. Yes, there is an illusion or filter that I am placing on everything around me. That’s an aspect of ego in my mind. It’s an illusion, but isn’t it an illusion that exists? And there are substances and practices that alter and lower this illusion correct?

4. Yes, I agree that these thoughts keep me from being insane and act as survival function. 
 

5. ive never heard anyone including raw sensory data (smell, sounds, touch) etc as ego. Why would raw sensory experience be ego? 

[Breakingthewall]

suicide seems like a bad thing because you, as an existence, as the void that you are, aka god, have chosen to live this experience. with all its nuances, all its content. so, when things get ugly, even horrible, with maximum suffering, als, terminal cancer, whatever....you have chosen that. then, you, the avatar that you really are, should give your all, and endure your ordeal. you want to experience that. you want to be crucified. if you escape... I don't know if it's a punishment, but seems a disappointment.

 

[at_anchor]

3 minutes ago, Breakingthewall said:

suicide seems like a bad thing because you, as an existence, as the void that you are, aka god, have chosen to live this experience. with all its nuances, all its content. so, when things get ugly, even horrible, with maximum suffering, als, terminal cancer, whatever....you have chosen that. then, you, the avatar that you really are, should give your all, and endure your ordeal. you want to experience that. you want to be crucified. if you escape... I don't know if it's a punishment, but seems a disappointment.

 

Thumbs up 

[Galyna]

3 hours ago, Thought Art said:

1. How would you define ego?

2. Yes, that is a good point that I am everything in my experience. However, am I not still relating to the perceived “external world” and even my “internal world” through my egoic filter while in a normal sober state? 
 

3. Yes, there is an illusion or filter that I am placing on everything around me. That’s an aspect of ego in my mind. It’s an illusion, but isn’t it an illusion that exists? And there are substances and practices that alter and lower this illusion correct?

4. Yes, I agree that these thoughts keep me from being insane and act as survival function. 
 

5. ive never heard anyone including raw sensory data (smell, sounds, touch) etc as ego. Why would raw sensory experience be ego? 

Remember 0 is nothing; 1 is everything! 
 

01010101

Everything around you is information which is represented by: 

shapes

colors 

sounds

And also information is represented by the internal feelings, thoughts and sensations.

Thoughts, feelings and sensations don’t belong to anybody. There is no agent behind who can claim this phenomenon. However your mind(a mind is a bundle: information plus memory) binds them together ( internal and external information) and creates the illusion of so called separated entity. However everything that you are perceiving, swims on it’s own in the ocean of encoded information. As soon as this information is captured and converged onto body, it is recognized and being claimed. That is how your ego is being born every single second. Everything that is claimed as “yours” belongs to your ego mind mechanism. In fact everything is ego, bc there is no objective reality. Now ego is necessary because if the information is unclaimed, it can not be KNOWN! You need a projector and the screen.
So yeah, raw sensory data can be claimed as ego, without ego they wouldn’t be recognized and claimed and perceived. Someone has to perceive to make them “alive”. 

 

Ego is information that is captured by the mind, converted and claimed as yours. There is no such thing as external and internal world. Notice it. 

 

Illusion of the ego is a must, otherwise the world, as you know it, wouldn’t be possible!  
 

it is a big discovery I have recently made. I want to create a thread about it. 
 

So…why do you buy into idea that there is an objective and subjective world? Notice, there is only information and this information is the Mind! However, the way this information is represented is the most crucial. Because this representation creates the boundary and illusion of the internal and external reality. 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Galyna

[Blackhawk]

3 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

suicide seems like a bad thing because you, as an existence, as the void that you are, aka god, have chosen to live this experience. with all its nuances, all its content. so, when things get ugly, even horrible, with maximum suffering, als, terminal cancer, whatever....you have chosen that. then, you, the avatar that you really are, should give your all, and endure your ordeal. you want to experience that. you want to be crucified. if you escape... I don't know if it's a punishment, but seems a disappointment.

And if you choose suicide, then that's not a acceptable decision?

Everything except suicide are okay experiences?

Interesting..

 

There is no evidence that we have actively chosen this stuff. And no evidence for anything else in this thread..

You are just speculating.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Blackhawk

[Kuba Powiertowski]

 

[axiom]

5 hours ago, Galyna said:

Now ego is necessary because if the information is unclaimed, it can not be KNOWN!

Ego is necessary for the misapprehension of “knowing” to exist, seemingly.

But knowing (the notion of holding the infinite as finite, perceived, circumscribed) is just as illusory as the ego.

There is just stuff (“this”) that seems to be happening, and it includes what seems like “knowing”.

Knowing is just a particular texture, colour, another quale. It is not separate from anything else. It is not about perception. There is no perception.

 

Edited October 22, 2022 by axiom

[Breakingthewall]

6 hours ago, Blackhawk said:

You are just speculating.

Of course, it's just my impression. We could equally say that the act of committing suicide is precisely what you wanted to experience. And indeed, if you do, it's because you exist to do exactly that. 

In fact I think that in some circumstances, like terminal disease, it's a perfect way to go out, really brave and elegant 

Edited October 22, 2022 by Breakingthewall

[Thought Art]

21 hours ago, Bazooka Jesus said:

What if you have terminal cancer and you are facing a slow and painful death? Wouldn't it make sense to take a short cut and spare yourself needless suffering that will eventually lead to the same result?

Of course, one might argue that life itself is a slow but steady physical deteriation process that invariably ends with death... it's an interesting conundrum.

 

[at_anchor]

If you are being chased by a pack of wolves or foxes to the edge of a cliff and they already wounded you pretty badly, so you are hungry, thirsty, tired and hurt in some kind of a depressing situation you have only two options. Option one is to let them eat you alive, which could be a long and painful process to die. Option two is to jump off a cliff, fall down and die. Which would you choose? Fighting them is useless. You won't be able to hurt them back in that state and without anything to become a match for their strength and power.

Sometimes in life people can be like those foxes and wolves.

Edited October 23, 2022 by at_anchor

[Breakingthewall]

29 minutes ago, at_anchor said:

If you are being chased by a pack of wolves or foxes to the edge of a cliff and they already wounded you pretty badly, so you are hungry, thirsty, tired and hurt in some kind of a depressing situation you have only two options. Option one is to let them eat you alive, which could be a long and painful process to die. Option two is to jump off a cliff, fall down and die. Which would you choose? Fighting them is useless. You won't be able to hurt them back in that state and without anything to become a match for their strength and power.

Sometimes in life people can be like those foxes and wolves.

On 22/10/2022 at 5:35 AM, Blackhawk said:

 

In those circumstances I would try to fight. Who knows if help shows up at the last moment, or if I kill a wolf and the others get scared, or whatever. But if I'm old and have terminal cancer, and I've been feeling like it's the end for months, I'd kill myself. or at least I hope I have the courage to do it, and not pathetically continue receiving treatments and generating suffering around me without any hope of recovering