I am absolutely amazed by this couple

[Gesundheit2]

I don't know, seems completely staged. The vibe is off, like it's forced and unnatural.

Also, a bit too slimy?! Apparently, there's so much psychological trauma in there.

Edited June 13, 2022 by Gesundheit2

[Proserpina]

4 hours ago, Proserpina said:

I agree. 

Ultra masculine is not stage blue. It is high positive (not low compassion and low politeness) masculine traits in the big 5, creating strong attraction.  

In a way ultra masculine (positive traits) = high consciousness masculine. Attraction is a by-product of higher consciousness.   

Of course if the masculine has high negative masculine traits then that will also be attractive but less so to the feminine that is high consciousness.  

Edited June 13, 2022 by Proserpina

[soos_mite_ah]

17 minutes ago, Raze said:

Logic and reason are in the head, emotion is more in the body. 

Then how do you justify the presance of irrational thoughts? 

18 minutes ago, Raze said:

there are also biological explanations for women’s higher neuroticism.

You know a lot of the notions around rationality historically have roots in discrediting women and people of color when they do speak about their pain and injustices right? People have used "biology" as a way to justify all types of messed up biases. Not exactly the strongest argument. 

[Proserpina]

1 hour ago, soos_mite_ah said:

Wouldn't someone being low in neuroticism make them more likely to be comfortable with expressing and regulating emotions rather than supressing them? 

I think so.

Emotional regulation can be thought of as stable and grounded. The feminine adds the 'spark' (at least ime). Both are rational in different ways. 

Attraction through high consciousness and opposites integrate both sides naturally and influence interaction.  

Edited June 13, 2022 by Proserpina

[soos_mite_ah]

9 minutes ago, Proserpina said:

Emotional regulation can be thought of as stable and grounded. The feminine adds the 'spark' (atleast ime). Both are rational in different ways. 

I agree. I mean the overall point that I'm trying to make is that rationality and emotions aren't opposites (and certainly not gendered). Having and acting on emotions can be perfectly rational. At the same time, things that are devoid of emotion can be incredibly irrational. The opposite or rationality, is irrationality and the opposite of emotions is simply an absense of emotions. 

Edited June 13, 2022 by soos_mite_ah

[Raze]

3 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

Then how do you justify the presance of irrational thoughts? 

 

I am not saying all thought is rational. Logical and rational people tend to be more in their head, prone to overanalysis, and more rigid. Illogical and irrational people tend to be more flowing, fun, wild etc.
 

3 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

You know a lot of the notions around rationality historically have roots in discrediting women and people of color when they do speak about their pain and injustices right? People have used "biology" as a way to justify all types of messed up biases. Not exactly the strongest argument. 

There is plenty of evidence neuroticism is genetic for men and women. I don’t see how that is discrediting women.

Edited June 13, 2022 by Raze

[soos_mite_ah]

@Raze A lot of it has to do with claiming that women are crazy and shrill, over emotional, or sensitive whenever they do bring up their concerns or injustices they deal with 

[Leo Gura]

Feminine women are emotional and chaotic. This is not a bad thing per se. It has its pros and cons.

[Proserpina]

Developed feminine is sweet, cheerful and calm. Masculine further balances out the calmness of the feminine.  That's the ideal, developed relationship.   She has to work on her calmness, just as the masculine has to work on his heart. 

I can pull this off like half the time and if I'm medicated. 

[Leo Gura]

56 minutes ago, Proserpina said:

I can pull this off like half the time and if I'm medicated. 

So half-crazy when everything is going according to plan, haha

[Gesundheit2]

3 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Feminine women are emotional and chaotic.

@Carl-Richard What would Mr. Big 5 say about this?

[ValiantSalvatore]

@somegirl Without going in-depth. I saw their wedding video as well as bought a relationship course from them. I did the online dating course from him and it seemed kinda tier 2. It kinda worked online though, yet it has close to nothing spiritual so it's not really at the upper end of tier 2 IMO.

Just very functional and lean ways on how to handle a relationships, communication and let's say stuff that relates more to EQ skills. Like humour, descalating a situation etc. I would love if more people would be like this that would make dating more pleasent. It's enormously difficult to find people interested in co-creation. So many stuck in Green/orange and Orange/green. Just from dating it's unfortunate to witness that as well as how frustrating it is how many dont even integrate base desires, instead just chase them. I liked their wedding video that definitely showed me how a serious commitment looks like. As well as co-creation as far I know they are also business partners no? They have some company that mainly uses Facebook currently for marketing purposes they have a channel there about relationships or communication IIRC, I had the impression they saw a business opportunity there because of the streaming/vod/video/family oriented market w/e.

Anyway humans are far off from developing that level of integrity/passion alone. I saw maybe one couple so far besides them that sort of looks like this. I do think it takes a dedicated couple and leadership from the man to go into this direction that it fails will be inevitable to find a women like this is like finding 1 in a million. Imagine people doing what they did in the video in public.

If people are not consistently developing these fields and are concerned by them it's not going to grow, I never saw a single friend of mine work on a relationship even buying a book on the subject matter. Most just learn from ther peer group and stay stuck in their ways of attracting /dating etc. Which says a lot about development imo. 

I tried a Tier 2 relationship course just by how much conceptual work that is and close and how many exercises it had. I don't think a lot of people would do the course even if it is highly enjoyable, because it creates so much clarity. It takes also a lot of time and communication it would fine tune and go into deeper detail than what the video showed. What the video showed was a Tier 3 relationship from David Deida's Model... 

• Tier 1: Macho jerk Guy, Housewife - Dependence
• Tier 2: Business relationship you meet my needs I need yours deal? - Independence
• Tier 3: Mentioning unacknowledged resentments, feelings etc. Finding space to express every thought, be present with the other partner, feel what the other partner feels, don't interrupt etc. Do the same - Interdependence.

SD Tier's and how David Deida explains relationship Tiers or Levels is different. It's like an independent line of development. Tier 3 is truely Tier 2 in that sense for relationships as it's so ground breaking. 

Many are just hardcore stuck in their orange desires as the desire of achieving and presenting that achievement is as latent as every before. With social media how many couples truely enjoy their relationship as deeply as they seem to on pictures on insta etc? Most happy couples I see are elderly how accept their partner 100% and their flaws and quirks, also and learn to love them. 

Also just finishing half the course gave me more insights into my dates. Especially also as a guy how much energy and leadership abillity it costs to handle a relationship at Tier 2 when I dated I had a lot of knowledge to go by in order to see the signs of how the relationship could unfold as well as problem areas etc. As well as how difficult each Tier would be to handle for me + inclinations etc. 

Btw I also lost all literally all friend becoming Tier 2. Now they are back. It's odd. I'd love to see and hear more example of Tier 2 relationships just to learn visually lol. 

I dunno like some stuff is a bit wild what one or even two Tier 2 coaches of relationships and sex teach about porn. For e.g saying they never see this in a fully loving relationship. I can see why in the sense of when you love each other that much why even need it etc? Yet there is so much stuff needs in a relationship differ from couple to couple I presume.

I like to think deeper about this topic or even to explore the practicalities as I knew already some of it. I do think for guys just going through the courses attraction and getting laid is more important. This sort of Tier 2 vision you really need to have the time/space and energy to do it also luck with another person. Just becoming better socially I do think is more important than just jumping straight into relationships as they seem to cause so much pain and frustration to people. I do think it's worth the risk I'd rather try to create something like that than the shallow waters of how society runs relationships currently jumping from one hedonic means to the next. To become the ultimate "Horndog". 

Who pleasures me the most?

I dunno I find it weird I took a lot of time offline to develop myself in the area SD growth and had to deal with various backlashes as I still am. Just from having the blueprint most relationships are stuck in an Orange and/or Green reality. Some might have a sliver of yellow cognition, yet the entire process of how attraction works. Starting even from genetics and how your parents raised you affects what you are attracted to and loved by and how relationships are done. Is not explained so I miss the wholeism in their approach to understand dating. Yet, many don't know how and or why especially for their specific case !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! As nobody really talks about this.

The guy has a YouTube Channel as far as I knew the stuff is outdated, some of the material synchronizes with the newer material that was posted here, at best just take a look again this is mostly for guys. 

Just by skimming the video for 5 sec or so, this is stuff I've done now like this mindfulness techniques lol I've done for years and is also included in courses. This is good content imo. I just don't see it properly reflected imagine the exercises above being done current average Green. How much dogma and believe could enter into the process of just being mindful of emotions. Also how much energy that costs at the beginning it's not easy. 

https://www.youtube.com/c/DoubleYourDatingDD/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/EbenPaganMedia/videos

Both channels have videos from him. The one below is for businesses. I did not finish the Tier 2 course completely as I noticed I do need another partner and attraction/dating is more important at the beginning. Anyway. Just saying it takes more effort than it might look like especially the maintenance part of the relationship at that level. I am pretty sure it will oscilatte pretty heavily, especially at the beginning. After the 6 months test period. Hope this does not sound to cold hearted! Was not my intention. This sort of has been my experience and I had high quality dates that are better from what I can perceive from this forum. A couple of them. Unfortunately I was not all to interested as I did not want to deal with the logistics and some just did not work out from their end. Can't also really apply the material in this region etc. Not enough people.

There are multiple scenarios I can run a lot of it depend on development in all quadrants. I can't really adress the topic without including what I find whole in it. 
----

What I currently hate personally about dating?

• Narccism and self-centeredness
• Focus on achievments and results and caretaker qualities, instead of character qualities and looking for character not even personality which is more an image, yet what is embeeded beneath the image
• To many image problems with who am I associated with what is Person X in the world.
• Flaking 
• Lack of open-mindedness
• Lack of responsibillity
• Ghosting
• Shitty role models
• Lack of being direct and honest, a lot of agendas. 
• Orange/Blue I laugh everytime how painfully real it is for some people and for me also.
• Hedonism and pleasure oriented

I dunno there are some parts I don't like and these patterns are becoming more obvious, the more I get experienced with the topic. For example going out and being a ressource provider and just having that potential alone is as valueable as having the ressources. I attract a lot of women who are into strength for example a super blue/red masculine trait. Etc. perspective matters so much. I am just leaving this here. 

As I don't really care anymore a I am already integrating it at my speed. So yeah hope this two ressources might add a little more consciouness to the dating/business section. 

In short IMO: Most people want to survive in relationships and not even thrive like the couple in the video, even less want to strive/thrive and transcend. 

Edited June 13, 2022 by ValiantSalvatore

[somegirl]

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Of course guys are emotional and often irrational. But you girls have cornered the market on that

Sure, fair.

Though it's also interesting for me to watch you guys react to football match when someone scores a goal  A bit too emotional maybe? ? 

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Yes, being overly emotional does make a man less masculine.

Isn't this counter intuitive? When a guy embodies their feminine side, it makes them more masculine (because they are so confident in their masculinity that they can afford being emotional/dressing in pink shirts etc). It doesn't threaten their masculinity. Only insecure guys feels wearing pink threatens their masculinity.

12 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

This doesn't mean the man cannot be emotional at times, in extreme situations. But overall a man should be icy and not give a fuck. Bus ran over your dog? Tough, let's move on to more important things. This is how a strong man must operate to get shit done in the world. You may not like it, but you also crave the results it delivers and the containment it confers.

You're simply not going to be attracted to a man who's more emotional and whiny than you are because such a man is a liability to your survival and the survival of your tribe.

Well... I guess we as girls have our own struggles in this life, just like you guys. I get that these things are very restricting to you, but I guess we also have stuff that makes our life on this earth a tad bit harder (like periods, child birth, hormonal stuff, pressures to look good and young forever, fear of being kidnapped at night). So in the end, it balances itself out.

[integral]

Femininity makes decisions based on how it feels in the moment. This is the nature of it. it has its pros and cons depending on circumstance.

The woman in the video has excellent development and worked on herself, yet she is VERY FRAGILE. her state of mind is sitting in the palm of his hand where he has the responsibility to carefully guide and hold her, walking on egg shells. 

These are some of the most developed people on the planet and hes walking on egg shells. She would storm out of the stage if he had said the wrong thing. Not that he would of said something irrational, but that she was not receptive to it. 

Men have this responsibility in every relationship, woman do not. Woman vent and unload how they feel and the man better be able to take it and care for it. 

I cry at the beauty of the feminine nature, its impossibly beautiful to me, its impossible how it even exists because of how foreign it is to how my mind works. But in a different circumstance very frustrating because of its inflexibility to be practical. Woman that get things done learn masculine thinking patterns and flip flop between the 2, not balance the 2, and in the process loss that raw feminine intuition. 

Edited June 13, 2022 by integral

[somegirl]

10 minutes ago, integral said:

These are some of the most developed people on the planet and hes walking on egg shells.

Why do you think he was walking on egg shells? I didn't get that impression.

And also, I don't think she was more fragile than the avergae girl or even average human being. These are all the thoughts and emotions we have every day, we just do not express them consciously and in detail like her.

[Proserpina]

19 minutes ago, integral said:

Femininity makes decisions based on how it feels in the moment. This is the nature of it. it has its pros and cons depending on circumstance.

The woman in the video has excellent development and worked on herself, yet she is VERY FRAGILE. her state of mind is sitting in the palm of his hand where he has the responsibility to carefully guide and hold her, walking on egg shells. 

These are some of the most developed people on the planet and hes walking on egg shells. She would storm out of the stage if he had said the wrong thing. Not that he would of said something irrational, but that she was not receptive to it. 

Men have this responsibility in every relationship, woman do not. Woman vent and unload how they feel and the man better be able to take it and care for it. 

I cry at the beauty of the feminine nature, its impossibly beautiful to me, its impossible how it even exists because of how foreign it is to how my mind works. But in a different circumstance very frustrating because of its inflexibility to be practical. Woman that get things done learn masculine thinking patterns and flip flop between the 2, not balance the 2, and in the process loss that raw feminine intuition. 

Love this ❤️

 

[integral]

@somegirl I agree she is not more fragile, the majority of woman are like this.

She rated her emotional state in the 7-8 range, he's emotional range was at most a 3. She nearly cried when he said "your sadness is beautiful". There is a difference between there stability. If he pushed the wrong button, that 8 goes to a 10. 

The wrong button is very easy to press. Everything said will be twisted to how she feels about it and not at all representing what hes actually saying or intending or trying to communicate. because shes at a 8-10! So unintentionally its easy to say the wrong thing. 

I dont believe its a good idea to have a analytical conversation when people are at that 8-10 range.  

Edited June 13, 2022 by integral

[somegirl]

49 minutes ago, integral said:

The wrong button is very easy to press. Everything said will be twisted to how she feels about it and not at all representing what hes actually saying or intending or trying to communicate. because shes at a 8-10! So unintentionally its easy to say the wrong thing. 

I dont believe its a good idea to have a analytical conversation when people are at that 8-10 range.  

Ohh yeah, you're right.

1 hour ago, integral said:

I cry at the beauty of the feminine nature, its impossibly beautiful to me, its impossible how it even exists because of how foreign it is to how my mind works. But in a different circumstance very frustrating because of its inflexibility to be practical.

This is beautiful btw ❤️? 

That's the point. We should admire each other differences (men and women) and find beauty in how differently we operate.

[Leo Gura]

1 hour ago, somegirl said:

Though it's also interesting for me to watch you guys react to football match when someone scores a goal  A bit too emotional maybe? ? 

But a football match is something important, unlike your feelings

Quote

Isn't this counter intuitive? When a guy embodies their feminine side, it makes them more masculine (because they are so confident in their masculinity that they can afford being emotional/dressing in pink shirts etc). It doesn't threaten their masculinity. Only insecure guys feels wearing pink threatens their masculinity.

Part of the reason why is because masculinity is defined by confidence and lack of insecurity. So it gets strange-loopy. It takes confidence for a guy to look girly.

Quote

Well... I guess we as girls have our own struggles in this life, just like you guys. I get that these things are very restricting to you, but I guess we also have stuff that makes our life on this earth a tad bit harder (like periods, child birth, hormonal stuff, pressures to look good and young forever, fear of being kidnapped at night). So in the end, it balances itself out.

Yup, it's a complex balancing equation. Lots of trade-offs in both directions.

[somegirl]

9 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

But a football match is something important, unlike your feelings

Ahahahahah

Ouch.

This is a declaration of war!