Raptorsin7

Question For Leo

74 posts in this topic

Some beings don't even have a body and they are enlightened in a the subtle body. Like Jesus for example.

If that doesn't debunk genetic theory, I don't know what will ? tho im not against the genetic theory. It makes some sense. But it doesn't answer the problem fully for my taste. 

Ramana Maharsi was able to enlightened a cow also. That's a nice debunk right there also.

Edited by Salvijus

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4 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

The thing is that this conversation does not penetrate deeper than "genetics" as a blanket term for things that you cannot control. There are really no specifics (at least so far), because that would require science, which is most likely non-existent on this issue.

Well, then. I would suggest looking at the conversation from a broader perspective.

Let's say that "genetics" is literally being used as a blanket term for things that we cannot control. How would you make use of that? For me, I would conclude that some people are simply not destined to be enlightened. So then they should stop chasing after God and maybe focus their attention and efforts on things that they're more likely to get. So it ties perfectly with purpose. To me, genetics basically mean: "Look, you're designed to do this, but not that. Know your purpose, and don't waste your time chasing ghosts."


Foolish until proven other-wise ;)

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@Salvijus How do you deal with avoidance and resistance?

11 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

Ramana Maharsi was able to enlightened a cow also. That's a nice debunk right there also.

Where did you hear this? Are there enlightened animals?

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3 minutes ago, Gesundheit2 said:

To me, genetics basically mean: "Look, you're designed to do this, but not that. Know your purpose, and don't waste your time chasing ghosts."

I guess I think all this talk about genetics and no mentioning of actually genes or alleles should be pointed out. In my ideal autistic world, you should use "biological inheritance" instead. It's of course not a big deal though ?


Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

 

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11 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Where did you hear this? Are there enlightened animals?

Makes little sense.


Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

 

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19 hours ago, Raptorsin7 said:

For state of being, there are a number of ways to change your state. Weed, exercise, psychidelics, yoga, etc. But in my experience these methods can be inconsistent, and there's no guarantee that taking mushrooms for example will alter your state enough to allow for breakthroughs and insights.

Genetics is constant.

As far as state is concerned, go into psychedelic trips, record and remember as much as you can.  

Then try recollecting that in the sober state of being. Iterate this process till the work required to transition between sober and psychedelic state is close to zero.

Brute force this approach. I don't recommend any other technique. There may be many but if you are serious, you should pin point one technique and execute it to perfection.

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@Gesundheit2

Spirituality is more subtle than from some physical ability. You can't just tell people not to do it. It doesn't mean that all of them will be effective in it. It heavily depends on how you lived your life, which doesn't mean that it can't be altered in a way to do it effectively or help "unspiritual" people to noticed that there is spirituality or even help to reach higher states of consciousness and become more conscious from most people. In the end, from my perspective, we should test our limits and also keep in mind that we might not be able to do it with the same technique and be open to other techniques or more specifically psychedelics.

Edited by Understander

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35 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Where did you hear this? Are there enlightened animals?

It's a well known thing. Osho talked about a little bit. Sadhguru comments on it more on Sadhguru exclusive app.

35 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

How do you deal with avoidance and resistance?

Hmmm... i don't know :D

We all have avoidence and resistence to different degrees honestly. So that quote i made is not 100% accurate. But it points to smth significant. 

Im not sure what are the ways to deal with it. Perhaps there are more then one way. The way sadhguru goes about it is he fuels a seeker with intense longing for spirituality. He's really good at that. Idk how he does it. Somehow through grace. For no reason u can become fanatically obsessed with spirituality if u attend his programs and do his practices. I experienced that myself so i speak from experience. 

There are probably many other ways to go about it also.

Edited by Salvijus

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@Leo Gura I am enlightened, have been for the last three years. My family and relatives are some of the most unspiritual people you will find. Nobody in my extended family knows anything about enlightenment or spirituality of any kind.


"Wanting keeps me from the awareness I already have it. I already am it.” — Byron Katie

 

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@How to be wise What does that mean that you're enlightened?

What is the specific trait or thing you have that non-enlightened people don't have

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1 hour ago, How to be wise said:

@Leo Gura I am enlightened, have been for the last three years. My family and relatives are some of the most unspiritual people you will find. Nobody in my extended family knows anything about enlightenment or spirituality of any kind.

I have similiar situation. There is just so many factors. Speaking relatively maybe your family has good genes but young "Souls" if you believe in souls. Maybe they have good genes but they did not have the perfect  ombination of other non-gene factors like childhood trauma etc. 

Maybe you have a very wise old soul and good genes, but still using Leo's argument you would not be enlightened if you incarnated into dog. 

 

So it is important factor but still one of hundreds other necessary for such rare thing as enlightement.

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On 04.06.2022 at 5:48 PM, Leo Gura said:

It's obvious that spirituality is genetic because you cannot do spirituality as a dog. The only reason you can meditate is because you have the right genes for it. And if you didn't have the right genes no amount of meditation would ever help you.

This point here is correct. Many life forms like lizards, cats, dogs are simply too inflexible in their wiring to make any real dent in a spiritual development. And humans do exist in a spectrum. In theory, it is possible for life forms to appear in the future that makes any spiritual work made by humans as complete joke.

However, this is merely an excuse to not do the work in the way you portray this understanding. You are thankfully not a dog and a lizard. And thankfully you don't have a mental disorder that would make this work close to impossible. 

The entire 'genes' between 'spiritually gifted' people debate and how this makes any valid reasons as to why anyone can't progress spiritually is not just an unproven theory but obviously a trap in the path. As someone who knows about self-deception, I'm sure you can see sinister sides within this perception you've constructed and believe in so adamantly 

Edited by ardacigin

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The fact that this insight can be misused as an excuse does not change the fact that it is important factor.

The fact that this can be unmotivating for some people is an excuse not to look at the fact of genetics' importance.

I think we should advise people to investigate and then transcend. Not ignore.

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how does it feel pass by a nice church and know it was built for you?

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