Raze

Frank Yang's video response to Leo's video - about stage Turquoise

259 posts in this topic

35 minutes ago, VeganAwake said:

There is no point and no meaning purpose or value to it either.

Enlightenment is the death of that which places imaginary values on top of reality.

 

:D


 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

God is no-self. God is Infinite Self.

There is no contradiction here at all.

Nothing = Infinity

BUT!!! Just because you realize no-self does not mean you realize God/Infinity. It's easier to realize no-self than it is to realize God/Infinity. And there are many degrees of realizing God/Infinity.

I don't know why you guys are so confused about these matters since this is basic nondual theory. There is nothing controversial here.

Yes Leo, there is no contradiction.

If we take this to the logical extreme, then it is JUST AS UNCOMMON TO REALIZE NO-SELF as IT IS TO REALIZE GOD.  

I think the only difference between what we're saying is I say it's more common to Experience God because one can get there through psychedelics or meditation or have a spontaneous Awakening experience, but it is not yet a full blown permanent Realization.  After a Realization it makes it that much easier to access God States.  And if one's only having experiences of God/Infinity and not a Realization, then there are levels to the thing...but Realization of No Self has no levels because ultimately it is of "non-existence" (A LIVING CESSATION) as you can't put levels or states of consciousness to something that is totally UN-LOCATABLE.  This is actually extremely radical because in a sense is not just  beyond the Mind but beyond "Consciousness"..  but the "manifestations" from this ________ can take many different levels because it is ALL OF REALITY.  

Saying anymore we're just making things more confusing and semantical 

Edited by Being Frank Yang

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

And another point I have been making is, before Realization is stabilized, it is extremely common for the reminder of the self/condition to re-attach and hijack GOd experiences into the new Self/self, thus making God-Realization murky and not as pure as it could be if it wasn't filtered through any lenses of perception.  


 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, Flowerfaeiry said:

Why put so much importance on it then? 

Because the freedom you get from it is unlike anything you can imagined. Beyond happiness/sadness or any of the dualistic human emotions you had experienced prior. And attachments to any states of Consciousness no matter how Divine will not get you to full freedom.


 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Flyboy said:

Frank, I love this and it has cleared up a lot for me, but something is still confusing me.

Leo talks about "everything is God", yet you speak of "No Self" (which to me means, basically, not even God exists?  that everything just is?)  I have a hard time with this because in a way it's coming back to reality being completely mysterious.  Is this what you truly mean?

Or is "God" still the point, just one that is truly All of the Above, as in Everything AND Nothing, Unity AND separation, Infinity AND dog poop.  This makes sense to me, but I'm still trying to understand what you really mean by No Self.

Here is another way to contemplate this.

What transcends the duality of existence and non-existence?

What goes beyond the distinction between even God and Nothingness?


 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, Being Frank Yang said:

 

You still think "Infinite Awareness", "Ultimate", and a "monkey"  and "true awareness" by your very own contextualization of the Thing don't you also need to deconstruct and dissolve all of the above?  

No I am just using this language because people here use it, it's all nonsense, literally. None of it is "true" at all. People on this forum don't have the problem that they don't know all the intellectual in and outs of models of enlightenment that you, Leo and others provide. None of this helps them, they know all of this shit. You are just circle jerking around pretending you are teaching others.

Most people here have the problem that they just think and interpret too much and spend way too much in the thinking mode of their mind, including even during meditation and tripping. They take all of this way too seriously, including the need to get to the path. It doesn't matter, it shouldn't be so stuck up and full of self importance. People actually think getting enlightened is more important than any other aspect of life. This only makes sense if you are suffering or have attachments, like wanting to know "truth".

 

Nobody needs to get enlightened, there is no point. If you want to, sure, but you will end up being unenlightened anyways. Where do you think you come from in the first place? There is no need for recognizing and becoming aware of any of this. You already have been and at that point you decided to become this very "unawareness" that you are.

 

 

If I was talking to different people, I would make up a whole different story, but this is the story that is appropriate here in my eyes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Scholar Your right that too much concept can be a negative.   I see one who chases enlightenment as the ego seizing awakening for Itself which paradoxically will keep someone from actually ever reaching awakening.  It is almost best if it's stumbled apon - because once it's turned into a goal forget it.  Unless you have completely given up your life for Truth which in itself is a selfless act. 


 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Posted (edited)

10 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

Unless you have completely given up your life for Truth which in itself is a selfless act. 

See, this is the dogma I am trying to point out. You have already completely given up on the highest enlightened state for Truth itself. This unawareness, this is the Truth that you sacrifice "Infinite Love" for. That is the most selfless act. It's not going back to being selfless, that's selfish! :D

To be truly selfless is to make ego, suffering and separation reality by letting go of the "highest Truth".

 

See, we can frame this any way we want. My framing isn't more truthful than yours. But notice how to take this "path" seriously you really need to pretend that your view is more truthful. You might intellectually agree with me, but deep down you actually do give more importance to your own viewpoint. Otherwise it wouldn't be your viewpoint.

And that's okay.

 

 

Leo's entire philosophy contains like subtle morality. When he calls people devils for example, he implies some sort of objective "goal". But I could equally frame him for being a devil because he is escaping the most Selfless state because he is suffering. Now it would be silly  to do this, but equally it is silly to call a mother a devil because her love is limited to her child. That blindness is precisely what is so selfless ironically!

Edited by Scholar

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Scholar said:

See, this is the dogma I am trying to point out. You have already completely given up on the highest enlightened state for Truth itself. This unawareness, this is the Truth that you sacrifice "Infinite Love" for. That is the most selfless act. It's not going back to being selfless, that's selfish! :D

 

I think your wrong there or Leo is not enlightened.  His life was given away for Truth so that is a perfect example.  Me, I stumbled on it.


 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Inliytened1 said:

I think your wrong there or Leo is not enlightened.  His life was given away for Truth so that is a perfect example.  Me, I stumbled on it.

See this is where I think you are missing a piece of the puzzle. But it really doesn't matter.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Being Frank Yang said:

If we take this to the logical extreme, then it is JUST AS UNCOMMON TO REALIZE NO-SELF as IT IS TO REALIZE GOD.

No it isn't.

You are saying misleading things and I don't sense that you know what God is.

I said the things I said in my recent video precisely because no-self and enlightenment is not enough to realize God. I know many enlightened people, and few of them have realized God.

You can argue with this all you want, but I have made my position clear and that is what I teach. If you don't like it, feel free to teach whatever you want to your people.

Those few who some day realize what I have realized will understand why I stress what I stress and not something else. Realize what God is. The rest is childsplay.


You are God. You are Love. You are Infinity. You are Leo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Scholar said:

See, this is the dogma I am trying to point out. You have already completely given up on the highest enlightened state for Truth itself. This unawareness, this is the Truth that you sacrifice "Infinite Love" for. That is the most selfless act. It's not going back to being selfless, that's selfish! :D

 So what you are saying is God putting itself to sleep and being unaware that it is God is the most selfless act and God should stay asleep?  Nonsense.

In order for you to even make such a statement  one needs to first realize they are God.. 


 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

 

Those few who some day realize what I have realized will understand why I stress what I stress and not something else. Realize what God is. The rest is childsplay.

In the end there are no few.  That's the cost.


 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

 So what you are saying is God putting itself to sleep and being unaware that it is God is the most selfless act and God should stay asleep?  Nonsense.

In order for you to even make such a statement  one needs to first realize they are God.. 

If every single person realized what was up, the cosmic game would end. :(

Y'know, with those who actually believe in Eastern religious fables it surprises me when the followers of that faith wish for everyone to wake up. For example, I think in some Hindu traditions, God (us) had "Maya" built because he was lonely. If they believe that then to destroy Maya is to destroy the very purpose of the thing!

I think it is just that us humans have developed an ego to an UNHEALTHY level. That does not bother me personally as idc about spiritual growth etc. but it is probably more so that humans ought to have an ego no bigger than a cat or dog.

But I'm glad the practical joke of separation exists! "I know! They actually don't know they're us!"

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Inliytened1 said:

 So what you are saying is God putting itself to sleep and being unaware that it is God is the most selfless act and God should stay asleep?  Nonsense.

In order for you to even make such a statement  one needs to first realize they are God.. 

No, you are overthinking this. Too much analysis. Monkey mind won't help you.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Frank has gone further with No Self than Leo. Leo has gone further with God Realization than Frank. They both are naturally attached to the effectiveness of their school because it’s what worked best for them. Each seems to have experienced a more shallow version of the “opposing” school than the other person has. This is a good lesson on bias and how different people respond to different methods. 


You mistake my Raja Yoga. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If Leo is genuinely enlightened and Frank isn't, then I don't want to be enlightened.  Just looking at the content of their characters, way of life, manners of being etc Frank is leagues above Leo.  Call me biased, but I expect an enlightened person to have a smile on their face and their heart on their sleeve.  Although Leo says things which sound enlightened, he always does so in such a way that contradicts the things he says, and demonstrates a *very* high level of ego, far higher than even the average person posting on these forums.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, BipolarGrowth said:

Frank has gone further with No Self than Leo. Leo has gone further with God Realization than Frank. They both are naturally attached to the effectiveness of their school because it’s what worked best for them. Each seems to have experienced a more shallow version of the “opposing” school than the other person has. This is a good lesson on bias and how different people respond to different methods. 

No it's the same thing! When you become conscious of No self you become conscious of Self.   There is an integration process and a deepening of this understanding afterwards but it is what it is.


 

Wisdom.  Truth.  Love.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Raptorsin7 said:

Haha let the non-duality wars begin:ph34r:

That is a thing which shows human nature very well! And how we automatically war with anyone on the "other team".

If it was nondualists vs materialists, we would suddenly all feel a strong brotherhood and work together. If it was humans vs aliens, worldwide racism would go extinct immediately.

That is a random musing that I often think of. Sibling vs sibling, household vs household, street vs street, city vs city, country vs country, species vs species, Earth vs the planet Xenon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now