What is the best evidence you can find for the paranormal or supernatural?

[trenton]

I think this is an important part of spirituality in terms of demonstrating the limits of the materialist paradigm. I have been running into some problems with formulating a cleaner position for something like atheism. The problem happens if the atheist over claims in terms of how much is natural versus how much is supernatural. If too much is claimed to be natural such that everything is natural, it becomes indistinguishable from everything being supernatural or everything being God. I also noticed that there is no real principled line to draw between natural and supernatural.

For example, imagine ghosts were real. Why would we call a ghost supernatural if a ghost is still a naturally occurring phenomenon? We may as well just call ghosts natural. The lack of a principled distinction between natural and supernatural is part of why I feel inclined to reject this distinction as it doesn't seem tenable, especially if either everything is God or everything is not God. There is also the problem of what counts as proof and who gets to define these proof standards and the problem of why the naturalist explanation should be privileged over the supernatural explanation as that is a bias.

So for our purposes, I will be calling things like ghosts paranormal, granted it isn't really an objective distinction. There could be other phenomenon you would consider paranormal as well, but I will give a few examples.

I had an experience with a psychic who shouldn't have known that I had a girlfriend whose name started with 'Ali.' She just looked at me and then had this epiphany even though there is no way she should have known that. She was referring to Alice and without asking leading questions she somehow knew this. This experience makes it hard for me to dismiss psychic phenomenon, especially when paired with other outside evidence. In this case the outside evidence would be ghost tours I went on to see some pictures, psychics claiming to talk to ghosts, military experiments on remote viewing, and reports from skin walker ranch also done by the military.

 

I attached a photo of a ghost I got from a ghost tour. They had other good pictures and videos too such as orbs of light. Orbs of light were also reported at Skin Walker ranch. The Victorian Era woman is the bottom left hand corner.

If you have any good videos, recordings, experiences, or anything else you would consider proof of the supernatural, then I would like to see it. This is part of why in terms of formulating a decent position for atheism, I think the scope would need to be narrowed to "the supernatural claims of the Bible are nonsense." This would be a fair defensible claim, but if it is overextended I think it becomes easier to dispute. An overly broad scope would be sloppy.

What would you consider the best proof of the paranormal or supernatural?

[OBEler]

@trenton where is the orb in the photo? 

Skin walker ranch was a scam to get free money from government to explore non existent paranormal events. 

[Carl-Richard]

If you care about scientific evidence:

 

 

 

 

 

If you care about personal stories:

Tom Campbell recounting shared out-of-body experiences with his colleague at Monroe Institute back in the 70s:

8:13

 

Edited 22 hours ago by Carl-Richard

[Bashar]

19 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

If you care about scientific evidence:

 

 

 

 

 

If you care about personal stories:

Tom Campbell recounting shared out-of-body experiences with his colleague at Monroe Institute back in the 70s:

8:13

 

Yeah Tom and OBEs in general I'd say is best proof. Tom even had experiments of himself talking while out of body, having conversations with another OBEer at the same time while in separate rooms. And if you don't believe can just astral project yourself today, anyone can prove to themselves.

 

Also my friend wanted me to mention he is haunted by a ghost this very moment. He's living the paranormal. 

Edited 22 hours ago by Bashar

[Carl-Richard]

2 minutes ago, Bashar said:

Tom even had experiments of himself talking while out of body, having conversations with another OBEer at the same time while in separate rooms.

I believe that is what they're discussing in this clip.

[Bashar]

14 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

I believe that is what they're discussing in this clip.

My friend asks what you think of the ghost. 

 

 

 

Edited 21 hours ago by Bashar

[Natasha Tori Maru]

I enjoy John Cleese a lot - and these topics in general.

Fascinating.

[Salvijus]

There's no better proof of supernatural than this video. 

 

Edited 16 hours ago by Salvijus

[Salvijus]

It doesn't get more supernatural than this. 

[oOo]

Thomas Campbell (above) is an interesting dude. I was expecting a lot more from his Theory of Everything however, for me it brought doubt on his ability to provide genuine high level judgements concerning. It doesn't mean he hasn't had genuine experiences or that he can't provide accurate accounts on psi, it is that on his supposedly most advanced theoretical work he falls well short of actually offering what is advertised. This deserves a closer look in light of how much he self-advertises his theory of everything. 

Otherwise, I think when we're children we're more sensitive to phenomenological experience of these realities. 

The natural ever-present psi isn't masked by decades of brainwashing, dismissal, obfuscation and attempts to discredit. 

People underestimate the level of counter ops against the reality of psi and the impacts this has on people's accurate discernment concerning, and that's regardless as to what camp you're in.

From a young age we're simply told to ignore the unspoken and more energetic in this sense, when the unspoken is where most of reality lives. 

Phenomenology never even becomes a subject until we're adults even though its more important to explore from a young age than most other subjects. And that's if we're lucky, most of us have to become "established adults" before we even broach the subject, which is even worse. "Established" refers to a level of indoctrination high enough that someone is sophisticated on all the ways in which they've been manipulated enough that they retract from their external experience to examine its alignment with the reality of their inner experience. The fact that most of us have to wait this long before we even develop an inner vocabulary on our introspective world that extends beyond the shallow all encompassing cultural frame of 'emotional intelligence' is utterly repugnant. 

 

[Nercohype]

This is what I found most convincing. He’s a Native American guy, really cool and friendly. He talks a lot about Native American spirituality, and I find their perspectives on supernatural phenomena very interesting.

Personally, I once saw a blue ball of light fly out of an apartment building and disappear into a dark forest. It could have been ball lightning, but I honestly don’t know.🤔😁

 

[Carl-Richard]

3 hours ago, Salvijus said:

There's no better proof of supernatural than this video. 

 

Now do it naked 😊

Edited 13 hours ago by Carl-Richard

[LastThursday]

I would define the supernatural as those things not having a natural explanation. That gets around the problem of a supernatural thing being common. Maybe before science came along explaining anything and everything, our natural inclination was supernatural. We still have a strong vestige of that way of being in our psyches.

Science can only explain a consensus repeatable reality, and so a lot off stuff slips through that net. But we all have our own individual science of how the world works, so there is room for atheists and wizards.

 

[Salvijus]

3 hours ago, Carl-Richard said:

Now do it naked 😊

Bruh. . . Inappropriate. 

[Ziran]

16 hours ago, trenton said:

What is the best evidence you can find for the paranormal or supernatural?

https://www.martialdevelopment.com/qigong-demonstration-zhou-ting-jue/

 

[Breakingthewall]

A large sum of money has been offered to anyone who demonstrates a paranormal ability, and no one has done so. The CIA also tried without results. 

[trenton]

20 hours ago, OBEler said:

@trenton where is the orb in the photo? 

In this photo there is no orb, just a Victorian era woman in the bottom left. The orbs appeared in a video, but it was something separate that I didn't get. If you go on a ghost tour and ask them for the most compelling evidence, they can show you more than just orb videos. They can show you beams of light, unexplained distortions, faces, and so on. I wish I had all of them, but I only have this one. It was in Colorado.

[Carl-Richard]

4 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

A large sum of money has been offered to anyone who demonstrates a paranormal ability, and no one has done so.

A large sum of money purportedly offered by a non-scientist who doesn't accept actual scientific evidence.

 

4 hours ago, Breakingthewall said:

The CIA also tried without results. 

1. The phenomena could be real but harder to control than one would like. 2. How do you know what the CIA does?

Edited 53 minutes ago by Carl-Richard

[Sugarcoat]

I don't care about evidence from others, I care about experiencing things myself, if I want to. Direct experience is sufficient imo

Edited 2 hours ago by Sugarcoat

[Oppositionless]

Two days ago I made fun of my friend for being a valley girl, a day later ended up on a date with a literal valley girl.