Leo's DemystifySci Podcast Appearance

[Terell Kirby]

1 hour ago, Joseph Maynor said:

They named the video War Between Truth and Survival.  Interesting.

Yea—putting the two on the same playing field, when in reality, survival is just a limited offshoot in the larger whole of Truth.

We need to cut to podcasters some slack, can’t expect them to understand it all in just 3 hours of speaking to Leo.

Understanding this stuff requires hundreds if not thousand of hours.

[Carl-Richard]

28 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

Or, you don’t get it. Infinity of Gods is a precise description of this insight/awakening.

"Insight" the way Leo has appropriated the term is so rife with self-deception. It's conceptual, it's belief.

 

30 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

Sorry, but the being lost in concepts is your case. You don’t even admit you are God. So what’s there to talk about.

When did I say that? 😂

 

31 minutes ago, Sincerity said:

My awakenings are from complete beginner’s mind, every time. And every time it’s the same thing (insights into Consciousness), but going deeper and deeper and deeper. I go where the truth is after I’m wiped out. It’s not just wherever.

Thinking, assumptions, beliefs.

 

29 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Move discussions of Infinity to another thread. This thread is about the podcast.

Then I will leave it on a commiserating note:

To avoid the logical error but still communicating the same general idea, you could do something like this:

Imagine God but ignore for a moment that you can only have one God. Let's it call it a demigod for the sake of clarity. So imagine you have a "God" (this big expansive thing) which we now call a demigod but then you also have another one, and another one, in fact infinitely many, separate from each other in/as their own "universes". "Ta-da!". The infinite "God" onion. Now, hang on for the next video on infinity of turtles, turtles all the way down.

[Joseph Maynor]

3 minutes ago, Terell Kirby said:

Yea—putting the two on the same playing field, when in reality, survival is just a limited offshoot in the larger whole of Truth.

We need to cut to podcasters some slack, can’t expect them to understand it all in just 3 hours of speaking to Leo.

Understanding this stuff requires hundreds if not thousand of hours.

True.  I was thinking about when I was first exposed to spiritual enlightenment and what my reaction was.

[LambdaDelta]

18 hours ago, Davino said:

Lmao, I was gonna ask where he bought it

You can sense the energy in it and both the pattern and the colour degradation is beautiful. But let's not distract ourselves with peanuts 

It's a cool piece no doubt. I don't have an eye for energies and whatnot, just aesthetics. And hey, it's not like I'd mind being caught dead in a similar getup, I myself am quite fond of all sorts of clothing, especially women's summer hats and bath robes. Suhrawardi's attitude is best — randomly alternating between extravagantly expensive and ragged clothes as to not get attached to either identity. 

Guess after years of seeing Leo and Ralston, two guys that look like dads killing time at the local bar while their kid finishes soccer practice, run circles around Indian gurus, Buddhist monks, and all these other clowns wrapped in layers of God knows what, my default assumption veered to the opposite end — spiritual-looking = doesn't know what they're talking about. Which is in fact typically more accurate, but alas there's always exceptions to watch out for. 

Quote

The world is names and signs, in truth it’s He
Whose being is its sole reality.
This world, the world to come, and all besides, Are Him;
know this, that nothing else abides.
There is one essence, but diffused, deflected,
There is one word, but variously inflected;
A man must know the King, and recognize Him,
Although a hundred different clothes disguise Him;
It’s not an error, in this way to see Him,
Since He is all, and everything must be Him –
The error’s when a man presumes to state
That what he sees and God are separate.

— Farid ud-Din Attar

 

[integral]

Believing in evil is like believing in Santa Claus.

People are acting out of there own selfish needs and desires. 

Its self-love.

They confuse self-love for evil its so twisted.

If someone enjoys harming others this is just a motivation.

Its like how pedophilies are born attracted to minors and there is nothing they can do about it.

There is nothing "wrong" with them..

Just like there is nothing "wrong" with being gay.

We just collectively and individual dont want any of that in our lives for obvious reasons.

[integral]

Everything Epstein did was out of self-love.

And the most loving thing to do is put him in prison or hang him.

Because we care about collective self-love.

The the less conscious and corrupt you are and selfish you are, you'll co-opt and twist all of this to hang Galileo.

Edited 3 hours ago by integral

[UnbornTao]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Look, dude, you are deep in the Ralston paradigm and I am way over it. I don't know how else to explain that to you. Ralston is severely limiting your understanding of this domain, great as Ralston is. I am not going to keep arguing with you over it.

Do not distract this thread with Ralston debates. Do that elsewhere.

How fitting. I don't mind teachers. You think I'm just believing someone. I was talking about Adi Da, in fact. If you got out of your paradigm and were as open as you like to think of yourself, you'd be able to listen to him. I'm not betting my money on that, though. The beliefs and fantasy are really what the followers find appealing here.

It's all connected, really. How do people relate to your teaching? They love the fantasy of it.

[UnbornTao]

If you try hard enough, even if unknowingly, you can create an experience consistent with whatever input your mind receives and thus perceive it as 'true' and real. And this can be fervently claimed and died for, like a religion - but it doesn't make it true. A concept isn't just a trivial notion that you have, but comprises your entire experience right now - even if you stop believing in Santa Claus or the most obvious forms of ideation.

[Miguel1]

33 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

How do people relate to your teaching? They love the fantasy of it.

Curious to hear what you think is the fantasy of Leo’s teaching? It’s the most black pilling there is lol (and that’s the beauty of it).

But we should really move this discussion elsewhere here soon.

[UnbornTao]

2 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

Curious to hear what you think is the fantasy of Leo’s teaching? It’s the most black pilling there is lol (and that’s the beauty of it).

But we should really move this discussion elsewhere here soon.

Anything you believe to be true relative to his way of viewing the world - you believe it and live as if it were true. That's the short version.

Leo should make a video on fantasy. The fake spirituality one might not have gone deep enough.

This should make for a good four-hour episode.

[Nemra]

@UnbornTao, you believe that there aren't states of consciousness.

I think that's the main thing that's limiting you here; treating states as a construction, which I think all of your critiques point to.

[UnbornTao]

2 hours ago, Nemra said:

@UnbornTao, you believe that there aren't states of consciousness.

I think that's the main thing that's limiting you here; treating states as a construction, which I think all of your critiques point to.

No matter your state, the truth doesn't change. State is state. Otherwise, what are talking about? 

State may be constructed. Be happy now. Fall in love now. Be sad now. Mess up with your brain chemistry (don't, just to be clear).

And then: What is true regardless of state? 

Maybe consciousness "precedes" state. Or isn't a state. What's consciousness? What are you calling state?

Edited 41 minutes ago by UnbornTao

[enchanted]

Awesome interview @Leo Gurayou have demonstrated yet again what a masterclass in discussion, philosophy, spirituality, etc looks like. You did it all while being entertaining, respectful, and collaborative. Thanks!

[Nemra]

@UnbornTao, in a delirious state, you might really believe that you are in a simulation.

And you are in a certain state right now.

Can you think clearly when drunk? No.

So, state is extremely crucial.

Furthermore, convincing yourself of some belief can change your mood, but that is not a change in state of consciousness.

However, my point was that your belief is limiting you. I think that's where your disagreements come from.

[Yimpa]

8 hours ago, AerisVahnEphelia said:

I once sent you a death threat during an existential crisis caused by the work. It was about 8 years ago. I was doing all of this very seriously and way too quickly, because I had nothing going on in my life, no work, no girlfriend, no sense of survival. I approached chasing truth like a cocaine addict.

 

[Leo Gura]

44 minutes ago, enchanted said:

Awesome interview @Leo Gurayou have demonstrated yet again what a masterclass in discussion, philosophy, spirituality, etc looks like. You did it all while being entertaining, respectful, and collaborative. Thanks!

Thanks!

[UnbornTao]

1 hour ago, Nemra said:

@UnbornTao, in a delirious state, you might really believe that you are in a simulation.

And you are in a certain state right now.

Can you think clearly when drunk? No.

So, state is extremely crucial.

Furthermore, convincing yourself of some belief can change your mood, but that is not a change in state of consciousness.

However, my point was that your belief is limiting you. I think that's where your disagreements come from.

The issue I see with this is that you seem to be talking about cognition, or a state of mind - the process of making sense of experience through interpretation. And consider this: existence was the case before you were born and had any state or the ability to cognize it.

Yeah, belief is powerful. Not denying that. People may be so convinced of their beliefs as to die for them. In certain cases beliefs can also be very beneficial.

Imagine that when Leo says "consciousness," he may well be talking about a different distinction from what someone like Adi Da or Ramana might be referring to.

I think you're one of the believers in the psychedelic camp who think drugs can increase consciousness. And, by the way, I've watched the videos and done the drugs, too. I was in that camp as well - until I had to be honest with myself and eventually outgrew it. There was a video by Adi Da - an actually enlightened guy - who made the point that this path is wrong (in this particular sense) and potentially deluding. This notion is something people here are passionately unwilling to give up. The Buddha himself - the legend of complete awakening - could come back, try a bunch of these substances, and claim, "That's not it," and people here would still have a hard time accepting it, or would just come up with excuses as to why that would be. I guess the closest we have to that are Ralston, Adi Da, and Ramana. And what do they have to say about this matter?

Seriously ponder that for a moment. It'd be a real bitch if they were telling the truth, right? You'd be chasing - what? A state? A fantasy? All while thinking that you were pursuing the truth along the way.

And to be clear, they can be incredibly beneficial in therapeutic work and so on. 

It's an easy trap to fall into: denigrating this thing called awakening, whatever it is, into an experience. I've certainly fallen for that before.

OK we should probably start another thread.

Edited 19 minutes ago by UnbornTao

[AerisVahnEphelia]

4 hours ago, UnbornTao said:

I'm not sure you're even as enlightened as you make us believe, just to be clear. This is what is meant by cosmology. And don't kid yourself, you are certainly arrogant too. Again, states are great, but are not awakening.

it doesn't matter that leo is enlightened or not, why the fuck anyone care to prove anything, the moment you'll get those level of insights you understand that really you're just yelling at walls.
no one is going to confirm, because god is absolute.
you really think you can share anything of your reality or that anyone can ( yes and no, absolutely yes ).
if that happen it's as miraculous as fucking cosmic heaven coliding stars, but fucking miracle happen all the time.

you all still using lasers & ruler when even using telepathy isn't possible in this space.
 

it doesn't even fucking matter, relatively the number of distinctions and construct you can produce is infinite & finite, but finite only for the human self, which cannot be grasb, so might aswell be basically infinite.

you all mad, everyone just confined to fucking insanity, thank god, I've enough sanity for all of us.

Edited 1 hour ago by AerisVahnEphelia

[Nemra]

@UnbornTao, I am not a believer in Leo, especially recently, which is not to say I won't agree with him.

Psychedelics annihilate the authority of Leo, to be honest. He is just a guide who can help.

31 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

I think you're one of the believers in the psychedelic camp who think drugs can increase consciousness.

I speak for myself.

Maybe psychedelics work on you differently. You have to consider that could be the case.

31 minutes ago, UnbornTao said:

And consider this: existence was the case before you were born and had any state or the ability to cognize it.

You can superficially make that logical connection, but if you didn't become conscious of what the universe was before you were born, then you don't really know what you are talking about.

Edited 1 hour ago by Nemra

[AerisVahnEphelia]

you know you did psychedelic well the moment you tell yourself you might never do it again