Conservative activist, Charlie Kirk, has been shot and killed at University

[Something Funny]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

It's fine to fight fascists, but killing civilians for their free speech is not that.

yeah, you are right. 

I was speaking mostly about this argument of "oh no, lets not anger the right wingers, because they will start a civil war". 

The things should actually be reversed. Trump should be sitting in the office, thinking "oh no, I can't go full dictator mode because leftists will start a civil war". Those people only understand strength, they don't understand being nice.

Imagine if Putin thought "I can't kill Navalnyi, because leftists will burn the Kremlin down". 

We would be living in a different world...

[Leo Gura]

The fatal flaw of the fascist worldview is that it foolishly overlooks that the violence it glorifies will boomerang on the fascist.

[Apparition of Jack]

Just now, Leo Gura said:

The fatal flaw of the fascist worldview is that it foolishly overlooks that the violence it glorifies will boomerang on the fascist.

I wonder if Hitler had similar thoughts in 1945  

[Terell Kirby]

Surprised why it isn't obvious to people that political violence is not a good look-no matter what cause behind it, is not a good look for any country looking to preserve its democracy.

Trump laid the groundwork for this with the Jan 6 invasion on Capitol Hill-but not a single MAGA head will admit Charlie Kirk's death is a result of the corruption of US politics which they contribute greatly.

We have long lost the days of respectful political discourse.

Edited Wednesday at 09:42 PM by Terell Kirby

[carterfelder]

Charlie was most likely talking about Hyper-Empathy.

"Hyper-Empathy is when your empathy for others makes you lose yourself by prioritizing the needs of others over yours. This can take the form of abandoning your personal boundaries, perceiving reality in a less objective or non-objective way, or losing energy in the form of pain and exhaustion. The DSM-V labels Hyper-Empathy as a characteristic of personality disorders."

Paul Bloom wrote a whole book about this called "Against Empathy."

[Something Funny]

Just now, Terell Kirby said:

Surprised why it isn't obvious to people that political violence-no matter what cause behind it, is not a good look for any country looking to preserve its democracy. Trump laid the groundwork for this with the Jan 6 invasion on Capitol Hill-but not a single MAGA head will admit Charlie Kirk's death is a result of the way they do politics. We have long lost the days of respectful political discourse

France: "Hold my baguette"

[Husseinisdoingfine]

1 minute ago, Leo Gura said:

The fatal flaw of the fascist worldview is that it foolishly overlooks that the violence it glorifies will boomerang on the fascist.

But isn't to call Charlie Kirk a fascist too extreme?

Fascism, in my opinion, is very niche and means something very specific. Autocracy, militarism, a head of state who posses absolute power, a one-party state, opposition to multi-party democracy, and more.

There's nothing to suggest that Kirk supported this. 

[AION]

They say you die how you live and he was literally trolling people who were concerned about gun violence and at that moment he hits the gutter. God might have hand in this. 

[Terell Kirby]

2 minutes ago, AION said:

They say you die how you live 

in the spirit of truth seeking, and existential inquiry- is this actually true? 

2 minutes ago, AION said:

God might have hand in this. 

God's hands are in everything. Even tragedy is LOVE in the end!

Edited Wednesday at 09:47 PM by Terell Kirby

[BlessedLion]

2 hours ago, Rafael Thundercat said:

Example when one goes around playing with untruth like life was a Sims Video game. Sims characters get erased too.

As much as I disagree with him, no one should be attacked for their viewpoints and opinions. That goes against the fundamental right of freedom of speech. 

[Recursoinominado]

7 minutes ago, Something Funny said:

lol, not with that attitude. Good thing you weren't born during the WW2 era or we would be fked right now.

I wasn't talking about myself, i workout, i am strong, trained in Brazilian jiu-jitsu and Muay Thai, and I put myself in violent situations for fun. But this isn't the left-wing spectrum. It is mostly women, lgbt people, and a few weak soyboys. Based on my experience, if i put all the right-wing people i know vs all the left-wing people i know, it would be a massacre. The best chance we have is by democratic means. Democracy favors the weak, and that's why fascists hate it. 

[Something Funny]

3 minutes ago, Terell Kirby said:

Surprised why it isn't obvious to people that political violence is not a good look-no matter what cause behind it, is not a good look for any country looking to preserve its democracy.

Trump laid the groundwork for this with the Jan 6 invasion on Capitol Hill-but not a single MAGA head will admit Charlie Kirk's death is a result of the corruption of US politics which they contribute greatly.

We have long lost the days of respectful political discourse.

On a serious note, how does the US becoming independent from the UK and also winning a war against the Confederacy / abolishing slavery fit into this worldview? 

[Leo Gura]

12 minutes ago, carterfelder said:

Charlie was most likely talking about Hyper-Empathy.

"Hyper-Empathy is when your empathy for others makes you lose yourself by prioritizing the needs of others over yours. This can take the form of abandoning your personal boundaries, perceiving reality in a less objective or non-objective way, or losing energy in the form of pain and exhaustion. The DSM-V labels Hyper-Empathy as a characteristic of personality disorders."

Paul Bloom wrote a whole book about this called "Against Empathy."

It is a well-known trope that right-wingers lack empathy, ridicule those who have empathy, and even demonize empathy.

That is of course until they themselves get hurt. Right-wingers don't take liberal causes seriously until it personally hurts them. That is how selfishness works. It's not an issue until it touches me. Well, Charlie was touched.

That is the tragedy of aggressive ignorance.

Edited Wednesday at 09:53 PM by Leo Gura

[carterfelder]

"It's worth to have the cost of, unfortunately, some guns deaths each year so we can have the 2nd Amendment."

This logic makes perfect sense. Think about auto accidents, for example. As long as we have cars being operated by humans, we will have many deaths. There's always a price to pay for the complex tools we use. Self-driving cars will soon end our car-driving privileges, because it will eventually become safe enough to drastically reduce auto accidents and deaths.

[BlessedLion]

1 hour ago, Hardkill said:

This is another reason why I miss the 1990s.

The 90s seemed awesome. Life pre 9/11 seemed like a different universe, way more innocent 

[enchanted]

this did not age well. He starts by saying " what a time to be alive". However if the Democrats took some of these talking points they might have had a chance. 

[Terell Kirby]

3 minutes ago, Something Funny said:

On a serious note, how does the US becoming independent from the UK and also winning a war against the Confederacy / abolishing slavery fit into this worldview? 

What worldview? Seems like you are making a charitable case for political violence, but i don't want to assume. What is your position?

[Something Funny]

1 minute ago, Recursoinominado said:

I wasn't talking about myself, i workout, i am strong, trained in Brazilian jiu-jitsu and Muay Thai, and I put myself in violent situations for fun. But this isn't the left-wing spectrum. It is mostly women, lgbt people, and a few weak soyboys. Based on my experience, if i put all the right-wing people i know vs all the left-wing people i know, it would be a massacre. The best chance we have is by democratic means. Democracy favors the weak, and that's why fascists hate it. 

it sounds like you are just indulging stereotypes. I wonder what the actual demographic data would say. Also it's not about the soyboys vs cowboys. War doesn't work like that. The biggest influence would probably be whose side will most of the military be on. 

If we are talking about just violent protests that lead to the change of government, then I think left wingers actually have more experience here, lol.

[Mathdaddyg]

From an outside perspective looking in Charlie Kirk spoke a lot about very highly energetic political topics whom he did indeed spike the flames with. It’s not what you say , it’s how you say it and the environment which Charlie Kirk created around political discourse directly created what happened today. He shouldn’t have been shot but he did create an environment for it to happen. 

[Something Funny]

@Terell Kirby your worldview that political violence is bad for any country looking to preserve its democracy. I just gave you two examples where political violence led to democracy, and human rights, and a better, more equal society. So I am asking how do they fit into this statement?

My position is that violence can lead to a positive change under right circumstances and that it's very simplistic, naive, and black and white to say that it can't and that "violence is never an asnwer", etc.