Should I Move Out of the US?

[soos_mite_ah]

Disclaimer: I know it's kind of weird that I'm asking for advice on a major life decision on this forum. I'm not expecting any prescriptive answers to my question rather I'm trying to find additional perspectives to consider as well as find questions to ask myself as I continue to introspect on this topic. 

 

I have been pretty conflicted about this decision for the past 5 months now. I've been seeing what's going on with politics here and I have a tiny voice that says *how much worse does this have to get until you decide enough is enough and get out of here?* pretty much everyday. This voice isn't alarmist. I can recognize that things aren't so bad right now to where I need to make an escape plan but at the same time, I still feel like I need to know what my options are just in case shit hits the fan. I want to take a more proactive approach and recognize the writing on the wall rather than wait until it's potentially too late if I were to leave. I don't know what exactly could happen in this country, but looking at the state of the U.S. feels like I'm staring into the void. I don't know how far this hole goes and I don't know how far we have come to where I can gage where rock bottom will be. I'm smelling something bad and I don't want to be here when the worst of it happens.

In addition to the safety aspect, I did always dream about living outside the U.S. at some point in my life either for a few months or a couple of years. I don't see this being a life long thing, rather a chapter in my life. I also want to experience living in a walkable area and feel comfortable with travelling outside of the country. I don't feel comfortable leaving the country and then coming back because of the shit that's happening with ICE (lord knows that if my phone gets searched I'm getting detained lol). I have a goal that I want to visit all 7 continents by the time I'm 30 and travel is really important to me. As for the walkability, while I have lived in the suburbs for my entire life, I have a stong desire to live in a walkable area. The suburbs quite honestly feel kind of depressing with how it breeds isolation, it's built for cars, and it encourages stagnation physically and mentally. That said, I can recognize that because I have lived in the suburbs my whole life, that I could very well be romanticizing walkable areas so I want to have that experience post college to know for sure how I feel in practice rather than in theory. 

Finally, I have a boyfriend who I am contemplating on marrying. But before I do that, I want to know what settling down looks like for me so that we can collaborate on what our futures will look like together. And for that, I need more life experience. We have been together for a little more than 3 years and while I know that we're only 25 and we met when we were young, I feel like I need to pick up the pace in figuring out the logistical aspects of settling down to get married. 

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As for why I don't think I should leave the U.S, I think much of it comes from a number of social obligations. I have a few new friends that I'm building a relationship with more so. Another couple of friends just got new places so I'm excited to host with them. I have family visiting the U.S. during the World Cup who I have been waiting for the past 25 years to come visit me. And I would hate it if the one time they came over was when I left.

My family also thinks I'm over reacting with my desire to leave this country and they're saying to wait one more year to see what's going on with this country politically. I do see their point as moving across the ocean is a big deal and shouldn't be taken lightly. But at the same time, knowing my dad and his trauma, he's not going to want to get out of the U.S. unless ICE is literally patrolling the streets of Dallas and going door to door yoinking people. I also see glimmers of hope from this country from progressives winning local and mayoral positions, Trump's health declining (and therefore the cult of personality has an approaching expiration date), people getting more dissatisfied with what's happening in this country, and the amount of backlash there has been agains ICE. My parents believe that we should wait until the 2026 midterms before coming up with a plan. Also, note, I'm a woman of color and especially in the state of Texas, a lot of people think I'm Hispanic. I was born and raised here and both of my parents are citizens (not to mention we're also upper middle class). While we are not the prime targets and I'm not hitting the panic button because I know that not everything is about me, I can also recognize that we're also not completely off the hook. 

At the same time, I feel like they're kind of naive in thinking that the Democrats can save us and that atrocities cannot happen in a first world country. The Democrats aren't being cruel enough in their opposition and as a result, rather than fighting, they're just stalling the inevitable. Also, lets be so for real, Nazi Germany was also a first world country back then and the Holocaust still happened. But at the same time, sometimes I wonder if I'm being too sensitive to what's going around me and I'm over thinking things or if the people around me are underthinking. And even safety aside, I still want to do things to help me figure out my life and my relationship. Part of me doesn't want to wait an entire year to decide to leave even if safety is not a concern. 

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As far as what the process will look like for me leaving the country, given my job and the locations they have, it will be as easy as me signing a few papers, interviewing for a position and then being sent off. They will take care of the work visa and other logistical matters. I still need to find out from them what compensation and taxes will look like to determine my final stance on this. The two locations I'm looking at are in London and Dubai. I also have family in both of those places. 

[Davino]

I wouldn't worry too much about the collective and focus more on what you want. I feel you really want to make the jump and your mind is trying to find reasons in politics and other areas to convince yourself about what you actually wanna do.

50 minutes ago, soos_mite_ah said:

As far as what the process will look like for me leaving the country, given my job and the locations they have, it will be as easy as me signing a few papers, interviewing for a position and then being sent off. They will take care of the work visa and other logistical matters. I still need to find out from them what compensation and taxes will look like to determine my final stance on this. The two locations I'm looking at are in London and Dubai. I also have family in both of those places. 

This is the most important part. If you have a stable source of income. 

Another point to consider is residency, it's important to leverage your contacts in those places. It's surprising how many opportunities are only available through contacts. When I was living in Rome I found a very nice cheap apartment thanks to my Italian teacher, I would have gotten a much worse deal via other methodologies, so leverage your contacts.

 

The only loose cable I see in your plan is regarding your boyfriend. You both gotta sit down and have the real conversation. Even if both of you agree, it may be quite a leap in the relationship which will make it or break it. Just beware.

[soos_mite_ah]

1 hour ago, Davino said:

I wouldn't worry too much about the collective and focus more on what you want. I feel you really want to make the jump and your mind is trying to find reasons in politics and other areas to convince yourself about what you actually wanna do.

I guess my desires to live abroad started when I was thinking of applying to colleges abroad. That didn't work out due to my dad's health at the time. Then, I got my corporate job for the time being and I thought of what I wanted to do after that. I do want to get into foreign services but after seeing what's going on with the Trump administration and how unstable those jobs are, it looks like I'm going to have to hold on to my corporate job longer than I hoped. I figured that depending on my foreign services job, I would be able to travel from there. Or at the very least I would live in D.C. rather than Texas. Now, because of the stuff that's happening here and knowing that my company is pretty good about relocating, it feels like a legit option. I wasn't thinking about relocating using my current corporate job until about March/April tbh. I feel like while I did have this underlying desire, the politics feels like a catalyst of sorts. 

1 hour ago, Davino said:

The only loose cable I see in your plan is regarding your boyfriend. You both gotta sit down and have the real conversation. Even if both of you agree, it may be quite a leap in the relationship which will make it or break it. Just beware.

Yeah, we've had multiple conversations about different possbilities and how we would handle them. As far as the communication goes, I feel like we're doing a good job at that and we're coming at it from a problem solving / collaborative standpoint. I feel like we have a pretty strong foundation to pull something like this off and honestly, this would be a good test on what planning our lives together would potentially look like. 

Honestly, I feel like friends feel more like a loose cable. I feel conflicted about leaving people behind and making such a drastic change that will land me in a place where I know like 3 people and that's it. 

[soos_mite_ah]

Also, any advice on how to handle situations where you feel conflicted are also helpful. 

[Staples]

If you do decide to move, try to make sure one of you will have a stable job and life to live before you leave. I once made the mistake of moving without a good plan and it took me nearly six months to properly recover.

[Davino]

5 hours ago, soos_mite_ah said:

Also, any advice on how to handle situations where you feel conflicted are also helpful. 

There are no perfect decisions, you just gotta cut the loses and move on.

[Salvijus]

From what state of conciousness are you making that decision? From the state of blame, frustration, worry, desire to escape, control? Or from a state of peace, passion, love, desire to expand, trust and faith? 

One is a mistake, another is wisdom and grace. 

Edited 7 hours ago by Salvijus

[Schizophonia]

Where do you want to go

[Daniel Balan]

Imagine wanting to leave America because your favorite party didn't win the elections... This is childish. The citizens of the first world countries are so spoiled and ungrateful, man it is almost comical. If you live in America, you don't even know what corruption is. Even if Trump becomes a de facto dictator, you still have a lifestyle which is 1000% better than almost any place in the world. I'd advice anyone who worries over politics, to grow a pair of balls. Regardless of who is president, or which party is governing, America is one of the best places to live on the planet. You can do basically anything, and as an ordinary citizen, you never experience corruption. The corruption in America is litteraly child's play compared to the corruption in Eastern Europe, Russia or the 3rd world in general.

Edited 4 hours ago by Daniel Balan

[ryoko]

@Daniel Balan You gravely under estimate the consequences of living in a first world country. You're basically trapped to work for the country. In my eyes there's no worse slavery. If a person is considering leaving their country for any and all reason, it's valid. We don't know their full context, what they value. It's absolutely insensitive to judge people's choice of migration. I would encourage to trust their gut and make the move. But not to be blind to what they are getting into, and weigh in on that, themselves.

[Daniel Balan]

45 minutes ago, ryoko said:

@Daniel Balan You gravely under estimate the consequences of living in a first world country. You're basically trapped to work for the country. In my eyes there's no worse slavery. If a person is considering leaving their country for any and all reason, it's valid. We don't know their full context, what they value. It's absolutely insensitive to judge people's choice of migration. I would encourage to trust their gut and make the move. But not to be blind to what they are getting into, and weigh in on that, themselves.

What did you say? That people in the first world countries are trapped in endless work? This is beyond hilarious. As if in a 3rd world country you don't have to do the same amount of work. Hell, here we work even more in inhuman conditions. Have you tried to work for 4 dollars an hour, From Monday till Saturday, 13 hours a day? With no health insurance and no money for retirement? Try going to a hospital in Eastern Europe, you enter with a broken finger, and you exit with deadly bacteria on your wounds.

Man, you first worlders are so annoying that makes me wanna vomit. You are basically living in heaven yet you bitch and moan all the time. 

[Recursoinominado]

Sorry, i didn't read your post, it's too long, but:

Isn't this a bad time to go to the US? With Trump being unhinged and going after immigrants? 

How bad is your country, really? I live in Brazil and i don't see myself living in another country because when you do, you will always be "the immigrant", the one who doesn't really belong there, and many people will treat you this way. Maybe there are better places to live in your own country.

But, if you really want to have this experience, why don't you go to the US for like 3+ months and see what is really like?

[soos_mite_ah]

3 hours ago, Daniel Balan said:

Imagine wanting to leave America because your favorite party didn't win the elections... This is childish.

My "favorite party" didn't win in a number of elections. That's not a problem in of itself. The difference here is that there is an uptick in political violence, people getting deported without due process to god knows where, people in the government are getting arrested for speaking out against the president, and the president is trigger happy with employing the national guard and ICE in blue states and cities. Oh and there are camps being built and there are creepy parallels to 1930s Germany. Hell, my dad lived through a genocide/ war in a developing country and while he's not freaking out (he's gone through much worse) he is seeing the signs and is like *tensions are rising, have a back up plan.* 

7 hours ago, Salvijus said:

From what state of conciousness are you making that decision? From the state of blame, frustration, worry, desire to escape, control? Or from a state of peace, passion, love, desire to expand, trust and faith? 

I would say it's a mix. There is an element worry, but not in an anxious way but in a *I'm seeing the writing on the wall and it doesn't look good* kind of way. I would also say there is an element of anticipation/ hope of wanting to experience something new, and to learn more about myself and the world around me. 

2 hours ago, Recursoinominado said:

Sorry, i didn't read your post, it's too long, but:

Isn't this a bad time to go to the US? With Trump being unhinged and going after immigrants? 

How bad is your country, really? I live in Brazil and i don't see myself living in another country because when you do, you will always be "the immigrant", the one who doesn't really belong there, and many people will treat you this way. Maybe there are better places to live in your own country.

But, if you really want to have this experience, why don't you go to the US for like 3+ months and see what is really like?

I live in the U.S. lol and I'm thinking of getting out. 

[Princess Arabia]

2 hours ago, Recursoinominado said:

Sorry, i didn't read your post, it's too long, but:

Isn't this a bad time to go to the US? With Trump being unhinged and going after immigrants? 

How bad is your country, really? I live in Brazil and i don't see myself living in another country because when you do, you will always be "the immigrant", the one who doesn't really belong there, and many people will treat you this way. Maybe there are better places to live in your own country.

But, if you really want to have this experience, why don't you go to the US for like 3+ months and see what is really like?

You didn't even read the topic. Smh.