28 year old girl scheduled to die via AS due to depression

[Basman]

https://www.thefp.com/p/im-28-and-im-scheduled-to-die

Quote

Ter Beek, who lives in a little Dutch town near the German border, once had ambitions to become a psychiatrist, but she was never able to muster the will to finish school or start a career. She said she was hobbled by her depression and autism and borderline personality disorder. Now she was tired of living—despite, she said, being in love with her boyfriend, a 40-year-old IT programmer, and living in a nice house with their two cats. 

She recalled her psychiatrist telling her that they had tried everything, that “there’s nothing more we can do for you. It’s never gonna get any better.” 

At that point, she said, she decided to die. “I was always very clear that if it doesn’t get better, I can’t do this anymore.”

Terminal illness is one thing but this just seems like state mandated giving up. She is physically healthy and young. Thoughts?

[Bobby_2021]

Euthanasia for the sake of depression is crapshit. What a waste of life.

[OBEler]

That's unnecessary and scary..psychiatrist have limited access to tools. 

 

[Nivsch]

This is the danger of relying solely on (especially conventional) external sources that design your sense of self-efficacy.

But anyway this is carefully only based on what has written there. There is tons of missing information.

Edited April 21, 2024 by Nivsch

[enchanted]

I often wonder if suicide is wrong.

Death could be the best thing that ever happens to us. Why do we fear it so much? 

Is not transcendence the ultimate goal of spirituality?

Edited April 21, 2024 by enchanted

[BlueOak]

Mental Illness is Illness. There is just 'illness' to consider. This is important, as you can put her life into context. If only these people knew they'd reincarnate, possibly in the same situation they left, because issues lay unresolved.

This:
She recalled her psychiatrist telling her that they had tried everything, that “there’s nothing more we can do for you. It’s never gonna get any better.”

Is not something a therapist would say. Suicide is also not a contagious disease, nor is death a liberation; it is a cycle.

I agree that if someone is in enough physical pain for long enough, they should be able to end their life. To force a person to suffer for my own values is selfish (survival is a trait I admire). As someone who has had depression a great deal in my earlier years, I can compare it to accidents I've had in terms of pain.

I've had accidents that were 10/10 - separating my bicep from my shoulder, or 7/10 for pain - broken ribs.

I've been in depressive states; I would put at a 8/10 against those things, worse than living with a constant, regular broken rib sensation, but not as painful as the white-hot sensation of ripping two muscles. Imagine you live with this constant pain that sometimes is greater and sometimes less, but most of the time there is a full-bodied sensation of it, then I think you'd understand what depression, powerlessness, hopelessness, and shame feel like. 

There is a point where depression hits despair, and survival is no longer the main consideration, it's a very helpless state.

So would I let a person who lived like I lived kill themselves? If treatments and medications don't lift depression, over several years, different specialists, with different practices attempt to treat them, and it's severe enough that they are having suicidal thoughts anyway. Yes. However, if there are weeks that a person is not suicidal, then there are weeks that a person is not in chronic pain. There has to be honest accounting, getting someone to the point of honesty is often crucial in treating them, so the two things can coincide for a better result.

I would not want a person who was suffering a pain that could be managed/medicated to kill themselves no, I'd want them to get the support they need. Chronic pain is different.

Edited April 21, 2024 by BlueOak

[Bobby_2021]

26 minutes ago, LSD-Rumi said:

Experience 1 year of constant debliating depression and I bet you won't say this, let a lone 3 or 5 years. A lot of depressed people don't decide to commit suicide until they are sure they won't get better, in this case, it is a rational decision rather than emotional. 

But things will get better. They are imagining it in their mind that their life is shit and it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy. The idea that things will keep getting worse is an emotional decision, one that even the most intelligent people fall prey to. But that doesn't make it rational.

That woman had a great life that many millions of people dream of having. She doesn't value it enough and her "psychiatrist" is too ignorant to treat her well.

You think you are helping it, but you are legitimising taking life since you are depressed. 

Do you know how many people across the world are going to take their life due to depression, when they realize that depression is a legitimate reason to take their life. That's all what this is doing.

Listen, I am a great proponent of euthanasia for people who are actually suffering. But this is not actual suffering. This is self inflicted suffering. Which a lot of people do and is not a legitimate reason to take your life.

[BlueOak]

19 minutes ago, Bobby_2021 said:

But things will get better. They are imagining it in their mind that their life is shit and it becomes a self fulfilling prophesy. The idea that things will keep getting worse is an emotional decision, one that even the most intelligent people fall prey to. But that doesn't make it rational.

That woman had a great life that many millions of people dream of having. She doesn't value it enough and her "psychiatrist" is too ignorant to treat her well.

You think you are helping it, but you are legitimising taking life since you are depressed. 

Do you know how many people across the world are going to take their life due to depression, when they realize that depression is a legitimate reason to take their life. That's all what this is doing.

Listen, I am a great proponent of euthanasia for people who are actually suffering. But this is not actual suffering. This is self inflicted suffering. Which a lot of people do and is not a legitimate reason to take your life.

No thought is required for a depressive state. It can come about all by itself, like any emotion. Have you never felt an emotion without thinking anything?
Ex: The environment you are in can cause a depressive state. Enough failed expectations can cause a depressive state.
Physical illness is often the result of self-infliction due to how bad most people's diet and lifestyle habits are.
Depression can be constant, and maintaining a mild depression is a state that requires no effort at all.

Go tell someone who has just gone through a horrific series of events that they are not actually suffering, and look them in the eye when you say it. The only way through is by facing that they are suffering.

Now for some agreement.
Getting people to be thankful for what they have and are, then to look outside of themselves at others, not themselves, is one key to influencing depression.
Putting people in the now, not the past, and bringing all parts of their psyche forward is very therapeutic when done with care and attention, to the trapped traumas in the body's nervous system. 

You can't cure depression or not have depression in the way you describe it, it's an interwoven mix of behaviors, postures, associations, traumas and fears. You can start a lengthy process of healing, during which you'll experience a wide range of emotions, some of which will nose-dive you into great sadness or sorrow. At least you'll be conscious of it when it happens, not avoiding it, burying yourself in work, or drinking it away.

Edited April 21, 2024 by BlueOak

[Raze]

I sent her alternative depression treatments but she didn’t respond 

[Razard86]

4 hours ago, enchanted said:

I often wonder if suicide is wrong.

Death could be the best thing that ever happens to us. Why do we fear it so much? 

Is not transcendence the ultimate goal of spirituality?

It is the best thing that ever happens but let's not dishonor life just because death is pure love. If humanity knew how good death was.......do you think it was an accident God made death painful? 

Gotta do something to stop itself from being pure love so easily.

[Leo Gura]

Millions of people kill themselves each year. How is this any worse?

[Basman]

7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Millions of people kill themselves each year. How is this any worse?

People who are meant to help you tell you to kill yourself essentially

[Bobby_2021]

6 minutes ago, Basman said:

People who are meant to help you tell you to kill yourself essentially

Unreal world we live in.

[Salvijus]

The problem of suicide is that it is a choice you would never make out of love. And that should tell you the validity of such actions. All actions that are not of love are of ego. And such actions lead only to more suffering not less. Only love inspired actions can lead to kingdom you're so looking for in all the wrong places. 

Edited April 22, 2024 by Salvijus

[Princess Arabia]

26 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

And such actions lead only to more suffering not less

How is the dead suffering.

[Hojo]

@Princess Arabia When you die you are still there and you still have all your problems just no way to think about them. You start burning through it without thinking by experiencing it and it will go to the most extreme versions of those feelings.

Edited April 22, 2024 by Hojo

[Princess Arabia]

28 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

The problem of suicide is that it is a choice you would never make out of love. And that should tell you the validity of such actions. All actions that are not of love are of ego

This is why I started to question the validity of it all. This right here is just some thoughts put together out of belief systems and all beliefs are false.

God is supposed to be love, God is supposed to be everything which should include choices and also ego, because you're saying ego exists to make choices, but God made a choice out of what it isn't and the choice isn't valid because it was made by the ego which is still God. Hmmm

[BlueOak]

27 minutes ago, Salvijus said:

The problem of suicide is that it is a choice you would never make out of love. And that should tell you the validity of such actions. All actions that are not of love are of ego. And such actions lead only to more suffering not less. Only love inspired actions can lead to kingdom you're so looking for in all the wrong places. 

All choices are made seeking love, even the most horrific ones.

If someone is in enough pain, it is completely understandable. With an understanding of the need for social safeguards and properly documented attempts at therapy from different specialists and practices, It should be their choice, not mine or yours. The discussion then becomes about how to grade depression in terms of pain. I wrote it out as I had experienced it, and where I'd grade the level of suffering. An 8/10 on the upper end of suicidal spirals, but getting a person suffering in an honest place to tell you the truth can take a lot of work and trust, this is crucial in both deciding this and healing them.

If they have weeks they are not suicidal, then they have weeks they are not in chronic pain. it's important to take that into consideration in these kinds of discussions.

[Princess Arabia]

3 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@Princess Arabia When you die you are still there and you still have all your problems just no way to think about them. You start burning through it without thinking by experiencing it and it will go to the most extreme versions of those feelings.

Here goes the extraordinary imagination. Absolutely incredible. Lol

[BlueOak]

9 minutes ago, Hojo said:

@Princess Arabia When you die you are still there and you still have all your problems just no way to think about them. You start burning through it without thinking by experiencing it and it will go to the most extreme versions of those feelings.

Infinity still has those conditions yes. They are still part of infinity. You can choose to go back to them and reincarnate over and over again.
We pick this because we might not see why they are occurring, or we might want to perceive another aspect of infinity from that experience, or the opposite half of that experience. Even having the opposite half of the experience or a related aspect, we are still experiencing the same thing we left here doing.

Edited April 22, 2024 by BlueOak