How is pick up a low conscious activity?

[Zen LaCroix]

28 minutes ago, mr_engineer said:

 the big thing driving PUAs is insecurity about their attractiveness

Not necessarily true. If a guy doesn't know how to talk to women and can't get a girlfriend he has to learn

[Leo Gura]

Many serious PUAs are horndogs with overactive sex drives. They are like drug addicts for pussy, and they need new pussy constantly.

It's like being a pussy vampire.

Similar to how Jeffery Epstein was a sex vampire.

Or they are addicted to the excitement of it. Which is why they are incapable of committing to one girl.

Edited March 28 by Leo Gura

[StarStruck]

Holding frame is so important in game, more than any manipulation trick in the book.

[Nemra]

@Leo Gura

Can't someone be wise in their pleasure-seeking and not commit to anyone? Is not committing to someone an inherently unwise thing to do?

[Leo Gura]

13 minutes ago, Nemra said:

@Leo Gura

Can't someone be wise in their pleasure-seeking and not commit to anyone? Is not committing to someone an inherently unwise thing to do?

I'm not gonna examine every possible edge-case. You figure out for yourself whether something is conscious behavior or not.

[mr_engineer]

42 minutes ago, Zen LaCroix said:

Not necessarily true. If a guy doesn't know how to talk to women and can't get a girlfriend he has to learn

Right, so there are other ways to learn. Like, going to meetups, going to social events, going to concerts, talking to women at work, etc. Why pick-up? Why random women on the street? It's not obvious. 

Then, when you look farther into it, you realize that they're thinking with their dicks. They see a hot woman, their dick gets hard and now, instead of channeling their sexual-energy into their work, they go 'me want to fuck, me go talk to strange woman'. It is kinda objectifying, if we're going to be honest, to make the decision to pursue a woman just because of the way she looks.

This is the practical reality of pick-up. Now, you may say 'not necessarily, what if she made eye-contact with him and they had an instant connection? Shouldn't he know how to convert that?' What I'm talking about is the norm, this would be the edge-case. 

[Nemra]

@Leo Gura 

I was just asking for your perspective on that matter, but whatever. Of course figuring it out is my problem.

Edited March 28 by Nemra

[thierry]

29 minutes ago, StarStruck said:

Holding frame is so important in game, more than any manipulation trick in the book.

Holding frame is manipulation

[Husseinisdoingfine]

@Leo Gura In regards to sex, if it’s so low conscious, then why are there tantric gurus, such as Osho, who teach indulging in sex consciously?

Osho literally wrote a book called, “From sex to superconsciousness”.

Further more, why does the GREEN value system, promote openers towards sex and love?

1 hour ago, Leo Gura said:

No. It's not the same at all. Serious love and relationship takes commitment and effort. That's very different from chasing after sexual excitement.

If this is the case, then why does every generic normie get involved in relationships? If it’s so mainstream, then surely it has to be rather low consciousness.

If I’m having a hard time forming a serious intimate relationship, does that mean there’s something wrong with me or that I’m low in consciousness?

[Leo Gura]

Sex can be done in higher consciousness ways. But few people are doing that.

Most relationships are unconscious and dysfunctional.

[Miguel1]

12 minutes ago, Leo Gura said:

Most relationships are unconscious and dysfunctional.

Timing. Just finished watching this.
 

 

[Nemra]

@Husseinisdoingfine Sorry, you're not asking me, but...

People, especially young ones, are in relationships based on the positive image of how it's going to turn out well, not knowing what kind of biases they are going to form and how their partner will treat her or him. Eventually, their true character emerges, as it's inevitable, and then problems arise.

Edited March 28 by Nemra

[NoSelfSelf]

5 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

The manipulation of people to maximize sexual opportunity is low consciousness.

Just in general, sex and everything revolving around sex is low consciousness. The reason that is, is because the only reason you care about sex at all is because it is mechanically coded in your animal nature. And as you pursue that sex you lose consciousness to attain it. You lie. You manipulate. You cheat. You hurt others. All for a few minutes of pleasure and excitement.

Have sex if you wish. Just notice what you're doing to get it.

 

I would frame this on my wall if i could masterfully but simplisticly said, actualized.org manifesto.

Manipulation runs deep but if you want to take a short test answer this queastions to me.

1.What do you say the first minute talking to a woman?

2.Whats your endgame with a woman?

3.How much is your thinking aligned with your behaviour around women?

 

[Miguel1]

3 hours ago, thierry said:

Yes but in practice, even if you are a charismatic sexually appealing guy that makes women wet, you won’t get a lot of sex if you want to maintain your integrity and honor.

 

2 hours ago, thierry said:

Of course it is better to be that guy who gets a lot of girls, I am not talking about beliefs here, I am talking very practically. I am just saying practically getting a lot of girls whilst for example not lying at all( and she will ask you questions before sleeping with you in most cases..) not allowing yourself to fuck drunk girls, not using your social advantages (not fucking your secretary, not fucking who you are leading as a manager for example..) 

not using any kind of manipulation tricks.

It just naturally erases a lot of options. Could a guy still have lots of girls. Yes

I’m not saying I personally have more honor and integrity than anyone. I’m just saying this as what seems to be true about  how it really works.

Look, whenever I am single, I typically have sex with 1-3 new girls a week. Can we agree that this is a lot?

I want to see how exactly I am going against my integrity.

I don't go for drunk girls, I don't use my social advantages.

I don't lead anyone on to believe I want something more serious, when I don't. I don't need to do it. Precisely because game has allowed me abundance to choose from.

I do some lying, yes, but the lies are more akin to a spiritual teacher speaking at the level where the student is at (beginner). Is he saying the full truth? No, he is not. But he also knows that the student is not ready for the hard-core truth and saying it can just lead him astray. Is it good to teach a beginner in spirituality that solipsism is the truth? Even more advanced people on this forum can't handle that.

Now of course, when I lie with the girls, it is not exactly like that. But I only lie to make the girl more comfortable, socially.

For example: I suggest things like adventure, going to listen to good music, going to eat good food, instead of saying let's go have sex. I do this because I don't want her to feel slutty. Because that makes her feel uncomfortable. We apply game not because we want to do it as men but because the girls want to do it. We would much prefer to be direct and straight honest.

If she finds out that I am into spirituality and that she wants to hear more about it and I can sense that she can't handle even the basic form of spirituality, I am going to say some random stuff that has nothing to do with real spirituality, and change subject.

If she starts talking about politics, I will consciously change the subject because I know that politics can lead to arguments which is not fun and sexy. And I want to keep it fun and playful. Am I lying?

But if she really pushes it and asks me do I like Trump? I will say: ''no and if you like Trump, we are not going to get along.''

Yes of course there are techniques I use here and there to make the narrative / frame / me look better than it is. But that's just marketing. You can do more conscious marketing. You can do more conscious business like Google. It of course won't be as clean and pure as just going to a cave, sit in solitude, and eat plants.

But that also is not as clean and pure as killing yourself, rather than destroying other life forms (plants) for your own selfish survival agenda.

----

So how am I breaking integrity so badly? You guys make it seem like I am murdering people, stealing their money, and raping their wives.

In fact, I am giving these girls amazing experiences both physically and also emotionally - compared to what most guys out there would give them.

I would suggest that you NOT learning this skillset (which is VERY HARD to learn as we can see here) is most likely spiritual by-passing - and that would truly be against integrity, if you want to actualize yourself to your highest self and become this holy conscious person without unconscious biases.

Burn your sex karma so much that it doesn't appeal that much to you anymore, rather than repress it with all these holy ''integrity'' speeches - all the while the moment you get the chance to do it without anyone seeing you break integrity, you would immediately jump on the chance.

Edited March 28 by Miguel1

[Nemra]

43 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

Timing. Just finished watching this.
 

 

Perfect! That video could destroy a whole country. 🥲

[Miguel1]

2 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

Many serious PUAs are horndogs with overactive sex drives. They are like drug addicts for pussy, and they need new pussy constantly.

It's like being a pussy vampire.

Similar to how Jeffery Epstein was a sex vampire.

Or they are addicted to the excitement of it. Which is why they are incapable of committing to one girl.

Yes. This much is obviously toxic, unconscious and very unhealthy.

I guess I have just never been around these type of people here in Finland. We are one of the most developed countries after all.

Seems like I am very biased because I live in a bubble and don't know how bad it really is in the PUA community. Like I said, I was never much in the pickup community. I was never on the RSD forum. I just took some stuff here and there on YT that I found helpful, mostly from Owen and Todd, spread within like 5 years. I didn't follow Julien much at all. I didn't even know who JAL is before I joined this forum back in 2021.

Most PUA rubbed me off the wrong way. Including you Leo. I bumped into your early videos but had to stop following you because of the PUA videos. The surprise on my damn face when I bumped into Infinite Consciousness video of yours 7 years later.

But anyways, upon my deeper reflections here, I think I got my answer. My initial intuition towards PUA was so bad that I never truly allowed myself to dive deep into it and study the community. I only took the healthier stuff from the healthier coaches and a bit of them only at that. I loved Owen's life advice more so than his PUA advice.

So all in all, because of my initial intuition towards PUA, I never even allowed myself into the PUA community to really see how bad it is / was. No wonder I don't know how bad it was!

All I know after 2015 is that Julien was fucked up inside. But I thought he was an exception.

----

I also just realized that perhaps there is a lot of naturalness in me. Much more than I like to admit. Just because I am too biased towards self-development. And definitely way too biased and attached towards helping people grow.

I have always been a natural leader. I was the captain of my football teams throughout my childhood and teenage years. I am an extrovert with the personality type that is probably the most suited for socializing, charisma, and making people like me - ENFJ. And precisely also because of that personality type, I am so biased towards self-development and helping others grow.

And finally, precisely because of my personality type (very intuitive and in touch with their feelings), I intuitively knew not to dive deep into PUA. Especially the unhealthier parts. And since I focused mostly on the healthier parts (and didn't even need much) and unconsciously ignored the unhealthy parts, I have such a damn wrong and biased view of PUA. 

Edited March 28 by Miguel1

[thierry]

16 minutes ago, Miguel1 said:

 

Look, whenever I am single, I typically have sex with 1-3 new girls a week. Can we agree that this is a lot?

I want to see how exactly I am going against my integrity.

I don't go for drunk girls, I don't use my social advantages.

I don't lead anyone on to believe I want something more serious, when I don't. I don't need to do it. Precisely because game has allowed me abundance to choose from.

I do some lying, yes, but the lies are more akin to a spiritual teacher speaking at the level where the student is at (beginner). Is he saying the full truth? No, he is not. But he also knows that the student is not ready for the hard-core truth and saying it can just lead him astray. Is it good to teach a beginner in spirituality that solipsism is the truth? Even more advanced people on this forum can't handle that.

Now of course, when I lie with the girls, it is not exactly like that. But I only lie to make the girl more comfortable, socially.

For example: I suggest things like adventure, going to listen to good music, going to eat good food, instead of saying let's go have sex. I do this because I don't want her to feel slutty. Because that makes her feel uncomfortable. We apply game not because we want to do it as men but because the girls want to do it. We would much prefer to be direct and straight honest.

If she finds out that I am into spirituality and that she wants to hear more about it and I can sense that she can't handle even the basic form of spirituality, I am going to say some random stuff that has nothing to do with real spirituality, and change subject.

If she starts talking about politics, I will consciously change the subject because I know that politics can lead to arguments which is not fun and sexy. And I want to keep it fun and playful. Am I lying?

But if she really pushes it and asks me do I like Trump? I will say: ''no and if you like Trump, we are not going to get along.''

Yes of course there are techniques I use here and there to make the narrative / frame / me look better than it is. But that's just marketing. You can do more conscious marketing. You can do more conscious business like Google. It of course won't be as clean and pure as just going to a cave, sit in solitude, and eat plants.

But that also is not as clean and pure as killing yourself, rather than destroying other life forms (plants) for your own selfish survival agenda.

----

So how am I breaking integrity so badly? You guys make it seem like I am murdering people, stealing their money, and raping their wives.

In fact, I am giving these girls amazing experiences both physically and also emotionally - compared to what most guys out there would give them.

I would suggest that you NOT learning this skillset (which is VERY HARD to learn as we can see here) is most likely spiritual by-passing - and that would truly be against integrity, if you want to actualize yourself to your highest self and become this holy conscious person without unconscious biases.

Burn your sex karma so much that it doesn't appeal that much to you anymore, rather than repress it with all these holy ''integrity'' speeches - all the while the moment you get the chance to do it without anyone seeing you break integrity, you would immediately jump on the chance.

Bro I don’t know why you took my words that personally. If you manage to have sex 1-3times a week this way, congrats.

I am not talking about holy integrity, I am talking about something very tangible. You make it sound as if I am talking about some religious hypocritical stuff.

[Miguel1]

2 minutes ago, thierry said:

Bro I don’t know why you took my words that personally. If you manage to have sex 1-3times a week this way, congrats.

I am not talking about holy integrity, I am talking about something very tangible. You make it sound as if I am talking about some religious hypocritical stuff.

Because I VALUE integrity, consciousness, and healthy way of living which includes healthy dating and socializing.

Read my most recent respond to Leo and you'll understand why I take ya'lls criticism towards PUA more negatively than I should.

[NoSelfSelf]

@Miguel1 You saying that you sleep with 1-3 women a week almost immidietly puts my bullshit radar  on because if you about the game you never say stuff like that.Since you make it about that you automatically make it manipulative as fuck.Its like you need to prove something im writing this because its totally weird, you seem cool but you say stuff that doesnt make sense. Thats why for sex you turn yourself into self deception machine i never witnessed this.

[Miguel1]

8 minutes ago, NoSelfSelf said:

@Miguel1 You saying that you sleep with 1-3 women a week almost immidietly puts my bullshit radar  on because if you about the game you never say stuff like that.Since you make it about that you automatically make it manipulative as fuck.Its like you need to prove something im writing this because its totally weird, you seem cool but you say stuff that doesnt make sense. Thats why for sex you turn yourself into self deception machine i never witnessed this.

What are you on about?

My whole respond was to @thierry saying ''you won’t get a lot of sex if you want to maintain your integrity and honor.''

So obviously we need to establish first whetever I am having a lot of sex or not. I would say 1-3 is a lot. But perhaps in this case, he is talking about much more.

I could definitely have much more sex if I made it my full-time thing. It just gets extremely boring and meaningless.

So in that sense, 1-3 is not necessarily a lot.

Out of all that damn analysis, you got stuck on that one short sentence?

Edited March 28 by Miguel1