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@Natasha I wish it was true, but why does that all seem like a wishful thinking and unreal? I really want to put my mind around this, but i just cant get dedication, im too sceptical, i started strong determination sittings, i was doing it for one week and then i quit. oh man. now i have watched this neti neti method two times and im doing that guided meditation a lot on my own, but i dont know. Like once again as leo said i am nothingness that is self-aware, im not self-aware when my body is asleep. I just cant grasp it.

I just watched the Neti Neti video and it was extremely helpful. So much so that I really felt something towards the end close to an enlightenment experience and it got me thinking. So what happens when I die? And what was before I was born? If nothingness has awareness, does that not make it a thing? How can it really be properly aware if it has no senses? If a robot was to be created capable of all the senses and thoughts a human can have, would it also be this empty nothingness existentially? And would that imply then that all things, rocks, cars, trees are also this empty nothingness? I kind of understand this truth of no self and empty nothing but I just couldn't help but ask these questions. Then again, if I have to ask these questions, maybe I don't understand it at all. Can this please be moved to the enlightenment section? I put it here by mistake.

Ok, so in Leo's video on the Neti Neti method I noticed this trend of dismissing any thought about what you are, on the basis that you are not that thought itself. But obviously when you have some thought regarding your nature you are never claiming to be that thought, you are simply claiming that the thought describes or points to you true self. You are claiming that some thing exists which you are but you don't know much about it. This whole method seems to just create a strawman and defeat it. If it's said that any thing you identify with must be a thing you have experienced, and not just experienced for a while but experienced non-stop throughout your life you are bound to fail to find such a thing. Meanwhile, this nothingness did not have to be experienced all throughout your life. I hope it is somewhat understandable what my problem here is. I'm sure there were many people that did the Neti Neti method and it worked for them but I just felt cheated. Can anyone explain?

7539 summary of the weekend On Friday I went to sleep very late because a good friend of mine was leaving for a really long time and we might even never see each other again so I had a really long conversation that night which made me get up late on Saturday on which other friends asked me out and even though I was of the first people to leave I lost some time there which could had been spent more meaningfully (one hour of nature was maybe the best thing I did yesterday). Today was the first of May and since everyone was free and most us are busy for the next weeks or month I spent this day almost entirely with my friends in cost of productivity, creativity and reading. I watched the neti neti video though before meeting up to at least stay on track with my self actulization basics. I did not have an enlightenment experience but I am not surprised about it. It did something to me though and I think one important thing to discover was that even I, as an open minded person have difficulties to bring up such RADICAL open mindedness that is required as well as to hold it. If I stick to my plans then I won´t digg again into spirituality before Thursday... I´ll keep doing my meditations of course... I wonder if I did the right choices over the last days... It´s not like they dragged me down or that relationships are useless or my friends bad. Quite the opposite actually-I am lucky to have them and they have evolved to be quite qualitative but I am not sure for how long I will keep spending time with people doing things that don´t give me what something else could give and I know that this sounds so egoistic and advatage oriented but my time every day is limited, my energy is limited, my whole life is actually limited, so why not get more out of it if possible? Why not live up to the full potential? I am really curious of how, where and with who I will end up in the coming years because I can already feel big changes coming up... (^ ^)

Today's Sunday. Yesterday was Saturday (naturally. lol) Around 2am, I watched this week's Leo's video which is longer than 1 hour!?!? -- I fell asleep and woke up now. I remember it was during Neti neti guided meditation. Unlike me, I was busy going here and there yesterday and I was really tired. Today gonna be busy too. I will come back and watch Neti Neti guided meditation, probably this evening.

For my part I've found two really interesting ones. Neti neti meditation consists of: "what I can perceive is not me", so you sit down and whatever shows up(thoughts, emotions, body sensations, external objects, etc, etc) you disidentify from. Second is resting as awareness, best explaneid by adya here

Well Leo the I that doesn't exist is impressed that what you thought would be an infinitesimal number turned out to be the population of a small African nation. This many people seeking is quite astonishing. I liked your video - like Papaji and Ramanana it is clear that there is no religion here just simple facts that aren't that easy to see. Without wading through all the thousands of other stuff - where is the path - the gun to shoot ego - the suicide pill to get rid of the illusion - I have been on the path for a while - neti neti so much of myself, but still I am there, here still the worries and the clinging to form and formless. When does the penny drop for me that - I am that - not the father, brother, friend, professional, blah de blah that I live day by day. There is only isness - being - whatever - I too feel close - but maybe my wanting is getting in the way. Would love to talk to people who nearly non existent.

Maybe thats the ego throwing everything away in order to not identify with the situation, because of whatever negative beliefs about it(been there, done that). Here's a juicy excerp from Bentinho Massaro you may enjoy: "The Neti Neti Meditation has a potential trap when misused by an unbalanced entity, that out of fear of feeling further thoughts and emotions of a potentially hurtful nature compensates by leaning too far in the direction of separation from things, thoughts, feelings, and other-selves—to the point where one becomes, in a sense, disembodied from the well-rounded abundance of being connected to all-that-is, appreciative of all-that-is, and thus vibrating in harmony with all-that-is....As you explore Neti Neti’s purpose ...it is tempting to use this newfound freedom as a “stick to beat smaller sticks with.”I urge you to refrain from this type of behavior, and to not take your Neti Neti too seriously; or if you do, to Neti Neti that seriousness as well, and see that you are not the fearful extremist you are pretending to be...I also encourage you to not take it on as a life philosophy, for when used as such, it is extremely flawed and leads to imbalance. This imbalance can at any point in one’s process be corrected by feeling forgiveness/love to one’s self and the things one rejects as “not being who one truly is.”" If this is the case, love, forgiveness, acceptance and work on your beliefs can be a gateway to balance it out

Yeah. Totally true. People just switch their vocabulary but underderlying is the same structure. It is possible with every concept, also the "neti neti" approach. "Everything is illusion", "i am the whitness", "i am", "nothingness", "emptiness", "unity", "Self", "no self", "here and now", "love", "bliss", "be still", "you are that"... Different traditions have different words and concepts which can be taught to a parrot which doesn't render him awake. Even though "he is also the one". Of course. "Have you read the bible?" today is like "Have you read 'I am That'?". And "have you heard of Jesus?" now is almost like "have you heard of Ramana?". Expressions and pointers of truth can quickly become just concepts if not spoken from truth. But they all can be amazing pointers if they are spoken from truth.

In a way you can consider a philosopher a jnani-yogi. A jnani-yogi uses the methods of the intellect to achieve knowledge about the deeper aspects of surpreme reality. This he does by the neti, neti way what means not this, not that... Finally you end up with nothing, the thinking stops, the consciousness went back to the lila-point, back in itself. With the right intentions in the heart the consciousness transcends from there and knowledge will flow. The yogi knows that, he`s looking for that. But when one does that out of just a odd wanting of relative knowledge as the philosopher does, he can end up there as well, comparable with the `dark night of the soul`. He will not have the right intentions and coming out of it is eventually only granted by bliss or good luck if you want. Not able to get out you will become insane. Nietszche is a famous example, God was really dead for him... On the other hand the famous Schopenhauer always said he was saved by the knowledge of the Upanishads, thus saved by his heart.