Socially Stupid People

[LastThursday]

 

[LastThursday]

I've been socially stupid to the detriment of myself and others many times.  I like to think I won't be again, but who knows? The theory in the video seems to imply that some people are consistently one thing or another - I'm not sure about that so much.

[Yarco]

I'm not sure I agree with the loss to themselves / benefit to themselves dichotomy.

Sometimes I'll inflict losses on other people even if it's neutral or negative to myself. Sometimes spite or revenge or just watching someone suffer that you think deserves it is enough of a motivating factor to make it worth it. Although I guess that could be considered a sort of intangible benefit unto itself. If you want to call that stupid, sure. Maybe psychopathic is a better categorization that doesn't necessarily fit on the chart or get taken into account.

[Preety_India]

I never want anyone to suffer in life no matter what. But I have social calibration issues. 

[hyruga]

Social calibration is indeed very important. 

I made several mistakes. For example, I have a colleague whose working time ended earlier than me but she still doing her work. 

I then asked her,"How come you can go back already but you are still not going back?" (Stupid q to ask because obviously it means she has not finished her work).

The next day, after she worked overtime, I told her,"wow you are so hardworking." (Another not so clever comment. She might not like to be labelled as hardworking. She just cannot get the job done on time)

Wrong calibration.

 

[LastThursday]

2 hours ago, Yarco said:

Maybe psychopathic is a better categorization that doesn't necessarily fit on the chart or get taken into account.

That's a good observation. Psychopaths are definitely a minority, and I can imagine psychopaths falling anywhere on the four quadrants to be fair. I think psychopathy would be orthogonal to social stupidity. As the video mentions, stupidity does not depend on conventional intelligence or social standing, and probably not on psychopathy.

Edited February 26, 2022 by LastThursday

[LastThursday]

3 hours ago, Loba said:

I did learn something from it which is a great way to think about an action before one does it which is: "Does this not benefit me and does another person lose out as well?"  Very simple, but something I sometimes overlook.

Likewise. I like to excuse my past actions and just say I was impulsive and leave it at that. But I was actually socially stupid on those occasions, both unaware of the damage I was causing to myself and others. However it was never done out of spite, but more out of a lack of social awareness and calibration. I like to think I have a better handle on it nowadays and I too ask myself regularly: will this benefit others and will it benefit me?

[Preety_India]

41 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

Likewise. I like to excuse my past actions and just say I was impulsive and leave it at that. But I was actually socially stupid on those occasions, both unaware of the damage I was causing to myself and others. However it was never done out of spite, but more out of a lack of social awareness and calibration. I like to think I have a better handle on it nowadays and I too ask myself regularly: will this benefit others and will it benefit me?

Dude, nice topic. 

[Twenty]

What would u do when your fate had been swapped and rumbled? 

[LastThursday]

5 hours ago, modmyth said:

What's the threshold for "acting stupidly" vs. just "being stupid"?

Good question. I think there's a notion of repetition here. I have a friend whose sister is consistently socially stupid with regards to money, and damages both herself and her relationship with her family because of it. In this case she is "being stupid". Maybe I mishandled my finances by lending a large sum money to someone who wasn't able to pay it back, and in the process I damaged both myself and the relationship I had with them. In that case I was "acting stupidly". Arbitrarily, I would say more than two times and you're probably "being stupid" - because you really should have learned from your stupidity the first two times.

5 hours ago, modmyth said:

Or acting stupidly in some areas (but not in others, as we all tend to).

Yeah that's totally possible I'd say. The video kind of implies someone being stupid is being stupid in all areas, so I don't agree with that. Maybe you're good at throwing community parties that keep morale high (socially intelligent), but stupid with finances say.

6 hours ago, modmyth said:

It seems like it would be a bit more effective to conceptualize it on a spectrum

I guess the whole concept in the video hinges on actions being labelled either positive, negative or neutral. I would say most actions are either one or the other, some are both. There are definitely situations where there is short term negativity but long term positivity. Perhaps there are actions that are cumulatively bad, like ingesting heavy metals in your food or putting CO2 into the atmosphere, or behaving in ways that are socially tolerated but only for a while. I don't know, it's binary in a lot of instances, but less so in others.

[LastThursday]

8 hours ago, Preety_India said:

Dude, nice topic.

Thanks. I came across the video and it just clicked with me. It's simple, but effective in categorising how people behave.

[Human Mint]

Lots of stupid moves in my life (socially speaking). You start to work on your stupidity once you realize it backfires. The big challenge for me is to accept that i am more stupid than i think and to move in life not worrying about it as it is something bad, but learning from it. Monumental attachment creates stupidity.

Edited February 26, 2022 by Human Mint

[Roy]

Great video. I've been trying to cross from helpless to intelligent, it's tough.

[LastThursday]

@Roy that's the problem with generalised models, they don't translate easily into practice.

[Carl-Richard]

Putin's failed invasion is stupid.

[somegirl]

Interesting.
So stupid people constantly cause harm to others and to themselves. 

I'm glad (for my own personal reasons) that it is said in a video that eloquency, level of education, gender etc has nothing to do with how intelligent someone is. Someone can be eloquent in their speech, but actually stupid. It kinda helped to know that.

I would also not agree that someone is constantly one thing. Maybe they have one dominant side, but it's unlikely that anything in this world would be "always".

[LastThursday]

3 hours ago, Human Mint said:

The big challenge for me is to accept that i am more stupid than i think

I suspect accepting it is easier than knowing what to do about it. It's like you have to constantly be on guard against stupidity. Most of the time we probably behave like bandits, working in our own self interests, but not caring or understanding how it affects others. Sometimes it's a win-win sometimes not.

21 minutes ago, somegirl said:

I'm glad (for my own personal reasons) that it is said in a video that eloquency, level of education, gender etc has nothing to do with how intelligent someone is.

I guess it's a very specific type of intelligence and stupidy that's being talked about - more of a game theory idea of intelligence and stupidity.

33 minutes ago, Carl-Richard said:

Putin's failed invasion is stupid.

I would agree that war at a macro level is stupid. Diplomacy would be more intelligent as that intentionally looks for a win-win.

[Carl-Richard]

5 minutes ago, LastThursday said:

I would agree that war at a macro level is stupid. Diplomacy would be more intelligent as that intentionally looks for a win-win.

If his invasion is successful, then it's at least less stupid. It doesn't look like that though.

[ValiantSalvatore]

@LastThursday I've been going out more and more and generally still and really have issues with people who are into academia and socializing, it's like some people make it a loose-loose scenaroy in case you are not part of their social groups behaviour. As many others are just open-minded and cause more win-win scenarios. 

I took a course online and I speed ran it I think I did not even take notes, as I felt sort of scammed, yet I noticed it now more how important it is and I intuited it's very important to know that stuff as it's adressed towards people who want to lead at the cutting-edge and who are interested in integral theory and all the ken wilber stuff.

What I notice when I look at the map of the 5 laws of stupidity and consider the course is. That it's never mentioned it's a polarity and you could make a polarity map almost out of the map of the video. As everyone goes through all of these quadrants it's important to notice it's a polarity basically smth. like this. I do feel also this map is very applicable to the map above, it looks complex and! It is really not complex. https://sixseedpartners.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/Blog_PolarityMaps5_Seriously-Lightly-702x526.png

These are sort of polarity maps. Thanks for sharing the video! I never would have come up with the idea to share this idea and information. 
https://universityinnovation.org/wiki/Resource:Polarity_Mapping

My point basically is when the 5 laws of stupidity are applied there is a polarity you will inevitabely glide through all quadrants and find yourself at one more, using a polarity map would show that it's important to focus on an upward movement of the polarity. As this loop or infinity symbol in the picture I posted above shows, if it would be placed lower there negative dynamic would be more in place. As the polarity would move more backwards and forwards inside the negatively listed quadrants of the map.

This can be contrasted with everything. Social vs unsocial. Justice vs. unjustice, feminine vs masculine, globalization vs nationalism, inside vs outside, individual vs. collective, conservative vs progressive. Each has upsides and downsides the important part is moving the dynamic more upwards towards the positive. 

As the map in the video is not fully laid out to be a polarity map it's biased towards one quadrant. All I want to say is it's a dynamic and that it is important to see that this happens, a polarity map displays this not sort of so absolutist quadrant view and is still free of interpretations mainly. 

To give a personal example I am going out more and more and I notice I focus more on the social negative sides of the feminine that I do not like instead of the positive and mainly focus on the positive masculine polarity/dynamic. Assertivness, dominance, providing, protection, leading, confidence, more active Instead of the more negative ones. For e.g aggression, domination, unstable, abuse of power, control, hyper competitivness, physical violence etc. I barely notice the positive feminine support, caring, intuitive, creative, kindness, nuturing etc. and notice more the negatives witholding, manipulation, victimhood, over sentimental and over sensetive, neediness. 

I do notice as everyone has these qualities that it's not so easy to move into the positive polarity consistently where I feel you'd mostly feel the positive qualities which would automatically create a win-win. My masculine side also appreciate this a lot when I receive positive feminine care etc. 

Emboyding as well as transiently experiencing any of these emotions more often would lead to more intelligent people regardless of sex, color and creed etc. That would be my take on the video. Got me thinking because I am going out more... thanks for sharing! Hope this is informative and useful!

Edited February 26, 2022 by ValiantSalvatore

[Human Mint]

6 hours ago, LastThursday said:

Most of the time we probably behave like bandits, working in our own self interests, but not caring or understanding how it affects others.

Possibly