Hardkill

Increase in vaccine coercion

442 posts in this topic

2 hours ago, Blackhawk said:

I.. just.. can't.. take.. the stupidity of anti-vaxxers. Man, I seriously need to stop reading this thread. You anti-vaxxers are insane.

This forum says your life is an illusion so anti vaxxers are illusion too.  

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46 minutes ago, Epikur said:

This forum says your life is an illusion so anti vaxxers are illusion too.  

What's an illusion? 

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My opinion:

Those who really need a vaccine, i don't blame them. There are many problems in society from a medical perspective. 

So, not every human being has the inclination as those very healthy. We must recognize that there are people prone to get affected by this pandemic and people who don't. 

As society you want to push this on those healthy? So that the less prone to adapt to this virus be as you? As a reasurrance? Society thinks is better to prevent by doing this? 

Who decides? The peer review documents or the vote? 

And the real real of reality is that not everybody needs it, the science medicine. There are higher powers in the human beings that can adapt, heal ANYTHING.

If you don't believe this, then why are you wasting time on "enlightenment"?Or bettering yourself? Just saying... 

I think i will decide for myself and you decide for yourself. Because, there is no higher authority than freedom of decision, personal decision. Even if this decision offends the opinion of others. 

 


Singer

14™

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6 hours ago, impulse9 said:

Here it comes, predictably. Call me what you want but no one's forcing anything into my body that I don't willingly agree to. You can try to persuade me in a civil manner and I have no issues with that, but it's my freedom and my choice to refuse if I so choose.

Hey. I don't have a horse in this race, but I would like to inquire more about this stance of yours. You said that "the fewer things I put into my body, the better". But... if you don't take the vaccine, aren't you just gonna take COVID instead? Because it feels like the virus might be lingering around the place for years, and it seems likely that eventually you'd come into contact with it. And from some of the research I've done, it would seem that Covid has a higher chance of having shitty long-term effects than the vaccine. So I'm just curious if you see it this way. That if you don't choose to put the vaccine into your body, you're choosing to put Covid inside you instead? How would you feel about that? Unless you live in a pretty isolated or unaffected area, and won't travel much.

Edited by Animo

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9 hours ago, impulse9 said:

Sorry Leo but this is the stupidest thing I ever heard you say. So when a psychiatrist tells me to load my body full of Xanax and go through years of unimaginable pain and suffering I should just accept that too because "it's not my body" anyway? Or when a woman wants to get abortion and she's not allowed to, it's fine because it's not her body anyway, right? 

Let's get our analogies straight. Not getting a vaccine is in the mildest case analogous to spitting in the coffee machine at work and giving everybody a cold, and in the worse case analogous to poisoning them with ricin.

Edited by Carl-Richard

Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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@Animo I'll take my chances. I trust my immune system more than I trust medicinal science. Fundamentally it's a philosophical issue for me, I don't believe in man-made intervention especially with something like this virus which the vast majority of healthy people get over just fine. If it was a virus with 99.9% mortality you bet your ass I'd be taking the vaccine the first chance I got. With this virus, I personally know a 92 year old person in extremely shaky general health who got it twice and barely showed symptoms. I also know another 50-something year old guy who got vaccinated and then spent a week in the hospital due to an extreme reaction.

@Carl-Richard So now you're equating simply doing nothing to actively spreading the virus? I live in quite an isolated place and I'm not very social these days. So who am I spreading it to exactly, my dog? You should try and parse your own false equivalencies.

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This is above what i said and my sincere:

Să trăiesc! Să trăiți! (so i continue living, so you continue living) This is my wish to me, humanity and the living creatures. above any dogma or knowledge. 

Edited by Goldzilla

Singer

14™

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44 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

So now you're equating simply doing nothing to actively spreading the virus? I live in quite an isolated place and I'm not very social these days. So who am I spreading it to exactly, my dog? You should try and parse your own false equivalencies.

Do you go to the store? Do you use the gas station? "Doing nothing" is exactly how the virus spreads.


Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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@Carl-Richard I do, and I wear a mask, I thoroughly disinfect my hands before and after I go into a store, I follow all hygienic protocols, including being mindful of what I touch, changing my clothes, taking a shower when I get home, disinfecting stuff I buy and avoiding crowded areas in general. I order online whenever I can and I've been living more or less like a hermit for the past few years just to avoid potentially getting infected and spreading the virus to anyone else. I'd never go into the store or meet anybody if I feel even a mild cough or any potential Covid symptom, I'm not an idiot like most people (who willingly do this, mind you). But even all this effort isn't enough for people like you, now you want to force a potentially hazardous substance into my body as well - well, this is where I draw the line. If you don't like it, that's not my problem.

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Vaccination could be ALTRUISTIC or NOT depending on its effect. There was talk that it could prevent Covid transmission, although that doesn't seem to be entirely right since there are massive amounts of people getting the virus despite vaccination. So this would suggest the vaccine is about preventing death and severe infection, not the transmission of the virus. If it doesn't affect transmission at all, it is a fact the virus is going to stay forever and continue mutating. And vaccination would not be altruistic. It would be a personal choice that young healthy people could make for themselves.

But if it seems like the vaccine does affect transmission based on what amount of virus is allowed to develop in the body after vaccination, it would be the moral and selfless choice to take the vaccine.

Asymptomatic healthy people DO spread the virus, but the vaccine might help to prevent the development of tiny imperceptive asymptomatic virus levels.

 

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7 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

@Carl-Richard I do, and I wear a mask, I thoroughly disinfect my hands before and after I go into a store, I follow all hygienic protocols, including being mindful of what I touch, changing my clothes, taking a shower when I get home, disinfecting stuff I buy and avoiding crowded areas in general. I order online whenever I can and I've been living more or less like a hermit for the past few years just to avoid potentially getting infected and spreading the virus to anyone else. I'd never go into the store or meet anybody if I feel even a mild cough or any potential Covid symptom, I'm not an idiot like most people (who willingly do this, mind you). But even all this effort isn't enough for people like you, now you want to force a potentially hazardous substance into my body as well - well, this is where I draw the line. If you don't like it, that's not my problem.

That is good, but remember that these are only half-measures at the end of the day. Even people who work at covid19 test stations, people who are professionally trained to follow anti-viral protocols and wear full-body anti-contamination gear, routinely get tested positive for covid19. This is actually a serious problem, because every single employee that has been in close contact with the positive employee has to be put in quarantine, which means that sometimes up to 25% of the total employees at one test station can get put in quarantine all at once, something which causes a significant shortage of workers at each shift.


Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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@Carl-Richard Yes, but consider that those people actually work with people all day long. I work from home a freelance programmer and barely have physical contact with anyone through the week. And vaccines aren't a full measure either, you can still get infected and have serious complications even after a vaccine.

Look, I'm not anti-vaxx, I simply don't like being preached as to what I should or shouldn't take in my body. I don't tell anyone that they shouldn't get vaccinated, it's your choice. But I also expect people not to guilt shame me into taking a vaccine. If I had a different job, if I had a different lifestyle, if I was in a high risk group or was actively endangering someone, then perhaps I would reconsider. The way things stand, I'll take my chances with the virus. I understand your concerns but please don't over-generalize, not every person in the world is in close contact with 1000 people every day.

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1 hour ago, impulse9 said:

@Carl-Richard I do, and I wear a mask, I thoroughly disinfect my hands before and after I go into a store, I follow all hygienic protocols, including being mindful of what I touch, changing my clothes, taking a shower when I get home, disinfecting stuff I buy and avoiding crowded areas in general. I order online whenever I can and I've been living more or less like a hermit for the past few years just to avoid potentially getting infected and spreading the virus to anyone else. I'd never go into the store or meet anybody if I feel even a mild cough or any potential Covid symptom

Congrats on being so mindful. 

But consider that if you took the vaccine you wouldn't have to think about most of this shit. 

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@Opo I don't trust it.

 

Also - I don't think taking the vaccine invalidates hygienic protocols. Isn't the first thing they tell you that you still have to follow those regardless? I mean you could be fully immunized against it, but you can still spread it to someone else if not directly than indirectly through touching things and not disinfecting.

Edited by impulse9

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4 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

@Opo I don't trust it.

Why? 

4 minutes ago, impulse9 said:

Also - I don't think taking the vaccine invalidates hygienic protocols. Isn't the first thing they tell you that you still have to follow those regardless? I mean you could be fully immunized against it, but you can still spread it to someone else if not directly than indirectly through touching things and not disinfecting.

Yea you could that's why I said most and not all. I still wear a mask and avoid groups of people. But disinfecting stuff and taking showers seems exhausting. 

Plus I haven't checked this but Bret Weinstein said that covid spreading though surfaces is incredibly rare. So since I'm fully vaccinated now I stopped caring about it. 

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1 hour ago, impulse9 said:

@Carl-Richard Yes, but consider that those people actually work with people all day long. I work from home a freelance programmer and barely have physical contact with anyone through the week.

I used that point to demonstrate that despite your half-measures, you're still putting other people in danger considerably more than if you had taken the vaccine.

It's easy to make it all about yourself when you're focused on your own life day to day, but when you collectively add up all these self-centered excuses that people deploy to rationalize doing half-measures, the sum of that is why we still have the virus in the first place. This is what lies behind the impetus for collective measures; that people generally don't care enough to voluntarily expand their circle of concern and see their place in the larger part of the puzzle.

 

1 hour ago, impulse9 said:

And vaccines aren't a full measure either, you can still get infected and have serious complications even after a vaccine.

My definition of a full-measure is doing the most that you possibly can do, not what is impossible to do, and that is what you're not doing.


Intrinsic joy is revealed in the marriage of meaning and being.

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To vaccinate, or not to vaccinate? Which of the choices is based more on fear, and which is based more on love? It’s interesting seeing different perspectives!

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Children under 12 and people who are autoimmune compromised cannot get this vaccine.

It's already shown that among those who are not vaccinated, that the virus is spreading, and mutating.

Get the vaccine retards.

Coercion?  Too bad, get over it.

If you're on this forum and have not been vaccinated, then you're stupid.  And should be remembered as such if you're so bold to point it out, how's that?

Do you think that increasing vaccine coercion amongst the unvaccinated people that remain throughout the whole US is wise or could it actually backfire?

No.  In fact we need laws that force all citizens to get this vaccine.

Edited by Loba

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23 minutes ago, Loba said:

No.  In fact we need laws that force all citizens to get this vaccine.

What would happen if you passed that law? 

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