7thLetter

Generally I’m happy, but the desire for women makes me unhappy.

50 posts in this topic

I feel that I’m quite happy on my own, I love my solitude. I don’t feel like I need anything really, other than to grow myself and to reach financial independence.

But then comes along an attractive female that I see at the gym or at work. I often try to prepare before I see her so I can maybe finally talk to her for the first time. Drink my tea, do yoga, meditation, listen to motivation audio, sleep well, etc. But then I don’t talk to her. These moments are the only few times I feel unhappy in life. My dating life is non-existent and makes me feel worthless.

Crazy thing is that I used to do pickup and approaching a stranger is nothing new to me. I’ve done hundreds of approaches back in the day and despite all that, it still feels difficult for me these days.


"Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death." - Albert Einstein

 

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Hi 7th Letter,

If you are comfortable in your own skin and solitude then use that independence and state of mind when attractive women come around in the gym.

When you derive your source of happiness from another person (an attractive woman) - it creates a goal you need to achieve when talking to her (and the failure of rejection if she says no). The thing is even when you talk to her, date her, maybe sleep with her - the happiness is fleeting and derived from a symbol in the mind (not from within).

When the source of happiness comes from within you won't need to chase attractive women or feel pressure when they walk past you. That's kind of when they will come to you - but again does it matter if they do?

If you were to die today would it matter how many hot women you've slept with? You must know this yourself we just live in a society where sex is heavily promoted.

If you are happy in your solitude then that's a very positive thing - I would say use that mindset when you're in the gym and don't chase. Not because there's something wrong with chasing but because it creates a situation where you need to create pressure in order to chase.

 

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Actually, I've never been able to approach a woman at the gym either. There's something to it, it's about the only place where I'm completely useless.

If you've done it in the past, then you know that, just like anything else, it is a muscle. Stop using it and it gets weaker until it atrophies.

Solution? Slowly get back on the horse, make it a goal to approach one woman. Just one. Gather all the strength you can muster and do that. After that you try again and it's less painful.. and so on and so forth, you know where this is going.

You'll be dating girls in no time. There's no reason not to go for it.

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@7thLetter Maybe you’re just craving some connection, which is human. Don’t overcomplicate things. Maybe you see a possibility for connection that you’re not using and it makes you sad. Sometimes being with another person grows you more than being alone.  Other people can challenge you immensely, you don’t need to be in solitude for growth to happen. Sometimes maybe, but sometimes not.

What good is all of this work if at the end of the day you can’t share it with anyone? I think there’s something inside of us that just wants to share. And sooner or later that need always comes back. 

Just because you’re not doing pickup anymore doesn’t mean you’ve outgrown the need for human connection.

Maybe you’re coming to the whole idea of dating from a different perspective this time? (Just my two cents, not sure if I’m in the right ballpark) How are you viewing woman now compared to ‘then’? What is it that would really make you happy with this girl? Talking? Sex? The fact that you pushed yourself out of your comfort zone? These are all indicating very different things.


"In proportion as he simplifies his life, the laws of the universe will appear less complex, and solitude will not be solitude, nor poverty poverty, nor weakness weakness." - Henry David Thoreau

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See how you create all this.

You give that girl at the gym or your dating life in general to much importance/meaning. 

Because its so meaningful to you, you become needy.

Then you decide because you dont have that, you want to be unhappy.

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@7thLetter How can you have done hundreds of approaches and still feel approach anxiety? How long was your hiatus? The need for sex is a base desire, bottom desire on the hierarchy. I might be better to just pursue sex, sate this sex need than alt right transcend it. It may even be easier.

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On 2019-10-29 at 10:20 AM, 7thLetter said:

I feel that I’m quite happy on my own, I love my solitude. I don’t feel like I need anything really, other than to grow myself and to reach financial independence.

But then comes along an attractive female that I see at the gym or at work. I often try to prepare before I see her so I can maybe finally talk to her for the first time. Drink my tea, do yoga, meditation, listen to motivation audio, sleep well, etc. But then I don’t talk to her. These moments are the only few times I feel unhappy in life. My dating life is non-existent and makes me feel worthless.

Crazy thing is that I used to do pickup and approaching a stranger is nothing new to me. I’ve done hundreds of approaches back in the day and despite all that, it still feels difficult for me these days.

Same here.

It's the only reason why I sometimes have suicidal thoughts.

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As the Buddha wisely pointed out 2500 years ago, all desire leads to suffering.

This problem is much broader than you realize.

With that said, stop being lazy and go get a date.

The only thing worse than desire is a desire that you are lazy about.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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@AlphaAbundance I haven’t done consistent pickup since 2016. Haven’t really been out much since then.

@Leo Gura Thanks for the straightforward answer. Being blunt is so me, which is probably why I resonate with your teachings.


"Intellectual growth should commence at birth and cease only at death." - Albert Einstein

 

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10 hours ago, AlphaAbundance said:

@7thLetter How can you have done hundreds of approaches and still feel approach anxiety? How long was your hiatus? The need for sex is a base desire, bottom desire on the hierarchy. I might be better to just pursue sex, sate this sex need than alt right transcend it. It may even be easier.

If the problem was sex itself then sleeping with a prostitute would make us happy, but it does not.

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7 hours ago, Leo Gura said:

As the Buddha wisely pointed out 2500 years ago, all desire leads to suffering.

This problem is much broader than you realize.

With that said, stop being lazy and go get a date.

The only thing worse than desire is a desire that you are lazy about.

Leo, I want to add something here. It may or may not be a good idea to just go out and get a date. I'm not talking about being right and wrong here. I'm talking about the answer to each individual's needs are different. For example, suppose it's a bad date. Ok, if you date, just don't get attached to it once it ends. Sometimes when something ends, that's when the desire starts, and the suffering begins.

With that said, the individual has to discover a step-by-step process for himself/herself to transcend dating and relationships all together, and in healthy ways too. Looks like you can't do it all at once. You have to break it down into baby steps, and everyone is unique in the process.

The profound clip that you made here also applies to dating/relationships. However, even if you end up married with children, you have to realize that this situation has to be transcended one day. Relationships are good but are not the biggest fish to fry in this life. Buddha was married with child. When he returned home, he made a full circle. (And, not in the best way too.)

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@Key Elements I didn't tell him to desire to go on a date. He already desires it. I merely told him to not be lazy about his desire.

If he wants to drop the desire, by all means, go right ahead and drop it. But does he really want to drop it?

Either desire a thing and pursue it, or do not. If you waffle in the middle, expect hell.

A common trap of this work is to get so metaphysical and existential as to avoid following through on the basics of human life. It's pretty simple really, if you're a human, you want to fuck. Best to embrace that rather than deny it.

I don't like people pretending that they are above sex when they really aren't. You are only above sex when you genuinely no longer desire it.


"Be melting snow. Wash yourself of yourself." -- Rumi

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@Leo Gura yeah, I know. That's why I said step-by-step. In my first paragraph of what I wrote to you, I said, "Ok, if you date, just don't get attached to it once it ends. Sometimes when something ends, that's when the desire starts, and the suffering begins."

I wasn't getting metaphysical when I said this. I was only pointing out to attachments when a date ends. The person may keep wanting to renew that spark. This could get very desperate and needy, and something needs to be done about it. Getting date after date after date after date may not be the healthiest option. One has to look at other things in life. Who knows? If you pursue other things, you may get better dates, and you won't be as attached. It's also a matter of mindset.

And, I didn't say for anyone not to have sex, or pretend to be above it.

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9 minutes ago, Key Elements said:

@Leo Gura yeah, I know. That's why I said step-by-step. In my first paragraph of what I wrote to you, I said, "Ok, if you date, just don't get attached to it once it ends. Sometimes when something ends, that's when the desire starts, and the suffering begins."

I wasn't getting metaphysical when I said this. I was only pointing out to attachments when a date ends. The person may keep wanting to renew that spark. This could get very desperate and needy, and something needs to be done about it. Getting date after date after date after date may not be the healthiest option. One has to look at other things in life. Who knows? If you pursue other things, you may get better dates, and you won't be as attached. It's also a matter of mindset.

The key to non attachment is just letting the body live in the moment. Everything that needs to happen will happen. And when circumstances change the body adapts with no clinging to the past. Life is very easy in the now. You get what you want with no effort . 

But this requires living rather than intellectualizing , even intellectualizing about living in the now 

Edited by Nickyy

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7 minutes ago, Nickyy said:

The key to non attachment is just letting the body live in the moment. Everything that needs to happen will happen. And when circumstances change the body adapts with no clinging to the past. Life is very easy in the now. You get what you want with no effort . 

But this requires living rather than intellectualizing , even intellectualizing about living in the now 

Living and being in the moment has been talked about many times--lots of times! I'm sure by now everyone who has been here in the forum for quite some time understand this, but it's not working for them. We all know about not to intellectualize by now.

I think it's time for a change of activities and/or environment, or something. The individual has to figure that out. But, again, let me make it clear that I'm not saying not to have sex or go on dates.

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44 minutes ago, Nickyy said:

@Key Elements Living in the now is not working for them. Why do you suppose that is?

I can't say because I'm not them. I can't speak for someone else. But, if it is me in the same situation, and I can't live in the now, I would change my priorities, starting from small priorities, like cleaning/rearranging my room in order to make YouTube clips. Start by cleaning one corner of my room, like the table. I would try to live in the now when I do this. If I "fail," I would not make a big issue of this. I wouldn't go out and try to find dates. That could open a whole new can of worms. At least if I'm "down and desperate" like this, that would be the last thing I would be doing. I would feel that I'm not in the right frame of mind to find a proper date. I don't know if this makes any sense to you or anyone else.

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@7thLetter You have made an identity out of simple, mechanical, impersonal, conditioned biological processes, and now that self is threatened.

What would happen for your success if you saw through the identification? Saw that the identification is a phantom created by thoughts?

Would there be any fear?

You're not in any real danger talking to someone. So your endocrine system shouldn't really be firing up with stress hormones when approaching someone you want to have sex with.

It's only sex. 

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14 minutes ago, Key Elements said:

I can't say because I'm not them. I can't speak for someone else. But, if it is me in the same situation, and I can't live in the now, I would change my priorities, starting from small priorities, like cleaning/rearranging my room in order to make YouTube clips. Start by cleaning one corner of my room, like the table. I would try to live in the now when I do this. If I "fail," I would not make a big issue of this. I wouldn't go out and try to find dates. That could open a whole new can of worms. At least if I'm "down and desperate" like this, that would be the last thing I would be doing. I would feel that I'm not in the right frame of mind to find a proper date. I don't know if this makes any sense to you or anyone else.

Can you see that this is just a story? 

Point to a "can of worms" .

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