electroBeam

Why is suicide discouraged?

125 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, Mikael89 said:

@Inliytened1 Very loving when someone gets tortured to death etc. Not.

"you do not yet know the realm of the Absolute.  But you will if you so desire."

Not true. Many people fail to get enlightened even if they have the desire.

If it wasn't for love, torture wouldn't be here. Neither would you or form. Unconditional love. Our notions of conditional love is adapted for our survival. 

It is all an expression of itself. Similarly to how characters in a book are an expression of the author. 

Edited by Shadowraix

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35 minutes ago, Shadowraix said:

If it wasn't for love, torture wouldn't be here. Neither would you or form. Unconditional love. Our notions of conditional love is adapted for our survival. 

It is all an expression of itself. Similarly to how characters in a book are an expression of the author. 

That logic breaks down completely. If there even is any logic. No there actually isn't any.

True love would mean this: no torture. 

And if you mean that somehow, for some weird far fetched reason, torture is a necessity, then I can say this:

True love would mean this: no torture. No me. No form.


Swami Sarvapriyananda about enlightenment and the Real (You): 

 

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@Mikael89

Q: Wouldn’t it be wonderful if we could spare our loved one's from all suffering?

Eckhart Tolle: No, it wouldn’t. They would not evolve as human beings and would remain shallow, identified with the external forms of things. Suffering drives you deeper. The paradox is that suffering is caused by identification with form and erodes identification with form. A lot of it is caused by the ego, although eventually suffering destroys the ego – but not until you suffer consciously.

Humanity is destined to go beyond suffering, but not the way the ego thinks. One of the egos many erroneous assumptions, one of its many deluded thoughts is “I should not have to suffer.” Sometimes the thought gets transferred to someone close to you: “My child should not have to suffer.” That thought itself lies at the root of suffering.

Suffering has a noble purpose: the evolution of consciousness and the burning up of the ego. The man on the cross is an archetypal image. He is every man and every woman. As long as you resist suffering, it is a slow process because the resistance creates more ego to burn up. When you accept suffering, however, there is an acceleration of that process which is brought about by the fact that you suffer consciously. You can accept suffering for yourself, or you can accept if for someone else, such as your child or parent.In the midst of conscious suffering, there is already the transmutation.

The fire of suffering becomes the light of consciousness.The ego says, “I shouldn’t have to suffer,” and that thought makes you suffer so much more. It is a distortion of the truth, which is always paradoxical. The truth is that you need to say yes to suffering before you can transcend it.

ECKHART TOLLE - A NEW EARTH


Light on Earth The power of love came into me,
and I became fierce like a lion,
then tender like the evening star.” - Rumi

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1 hour ago, Mikael89 said:

That logic breaks down completely. If there even is any logic. No there actually isn't any.

True love would mean this: no torture. 

And if you mean that somehow, for some weird far fetched reason, torture is a necessity, then I can say this:

True love would mean this: no torture. No me. No form.

This has been explained before.  God is itself so it needs to divide itself in order to share Love with itself.  In order to do that it has to create lesser beings or limit itself..if it was not limited beings there would be no distinctions so God would be back where he started.

When you have finite beings they arent conscious of Love yet so they commit murder and torture..which is still an unconscious form of Love.

 


We must not cease from exploration and at the end of all our exploring will be to arrive at the place where we began and to know the place for the first time.       --T.S Eliot

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2 hours ago, Mikael89 said:

True love would mean this: no torture. 

And if you mean that somehow, for some weird far fetched reason, torture is a necessity, then I can say this:

True love would mean this: no torture. No me. No form.

I am talking about unconditional love, this is much more radical than your typical notions of love. This is a common trend you'll find in this work.

When there is no ego calling the shots and you merge into oneness..there is only one thing to love. You.

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Posted (edited)

2 hours ago, mandyjw said:

@Mikael89

Q: Wouldn’t it be wonderful if we could spare our loved one's from all suffering?

Eckhart Tolle: No, it wouldn’t. They would not evolve as human beings and would remain shallow, identified with the external forms of things. Suffering drives you deeper. The paradox is that suffering is caused by identification with form and erodes identification with form. A lot of it is caused by the ego, although eventually suffering destroys the ego – but not until you suffer consciously.

Humanity is destined to go beyond suffering, but not the way the ego thinks. One of the egos many erroneous assumptions, one of its many deluded thoughts is “I should not have to suffer.” Sometimes the thought gets transferred to someone close to you: “My child should not have to suffer.” That thought itself lies at the root of suffering.

Suffering has a noble purpose: the evolution of consciousness and the burning up of the ego. The man on the cross is an archetypal image. He is every man and every woman. As long as you resist suffering, it is a slow process because the resistance creates more ego to burn up. When you accept suffering, however, there is an acceleration of that process which is brought about by the fact that you suffer consciously. You can accept suffering for yourself, or you can accept if for someone else, such as your child or parent.In the midst of conscious suffering, there is already the transmutation.

The fire of suffering becomes the light of consciousness.The ego says, “I shouldn’t have to suffer,” and that thought makes you suffer so much more. It is a distortion of the truth, which is always paradoxical. The truth is that you need to say yes to suffering before you can transcend it.

ECKHART TOLLE - A NEW EARTH

The problem I have with that idea is.. is God really that stupid and limited that He/She has to create suffering? Maybe He/She is.

2 hours ago, Inliytened1 said:

This has been explained before.  God is itself so it needs to divide itself in order to share Love with itself.  In order to do that it has to create lesser beings or limit itself..if it was not limited beings there would be no distinctions so God would be back where he started.

When you have finite beings they arent conscious of Love yet so they commit murder and torture..which is still an unconscious form of Love.

Read my comment above.

And I'll also add: why does God need to divide itself and start all siffering and misery and all that hassle? Why not just stay in the awesome Love bliss enlightenment Oneness and jump on fluffy happy clouds for all eternity?

1 hour ago, cetus56 said:

@Mikael89 The grass grows greener over the septic tank.

Haha :P

50 minutes ago, Shadowraix said:

I am talking about unconditional love, this is much more radical than your typical notions of love. This is a common trend you'll find in this work.

When there is no ego calling the shots and you merge into oneness..there is only one thing to love. You.

Yes I know that. Radical yadda yadda. 

It still doesn't make sense.

-------------------------------

I know you can't grasp this stuff with the mind yadda. It needs to be experienced and yadda.

So back to practices I guess.

Whateverrrr.

Edited by Mikael89

Swami Sarvapriyananda about enlightenment and the Real (You): 

 

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Why would anyone commit physical suicide when the can just as easily commit suicide of the mind. It's just as effective and a lot less messy.

 

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14 hours ago, Nahm said:

Why go on vacation when I’ll just be back home after?”

I 100% agree with that. Holidays are toxic - they are an escape from your ordinary reality.

I agree with sadhguru, make everyday life and work your holiday, you have no excuse not to

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Because the body will die at some point, whether you like it or not, so why not enjoy yourself while you suffer in the meantime?

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2 hours ago, Mikael89 said:

The problem I have with that idea is.. is God really that stupid and limited that He/She has to create suffering? Maybe He/She is.

Read my comment above.

And I'll also add: why does God need to divide itself and start all siffering and misery and all that hassle? Why not just stay in the awesome Love bliss enlightenment Oneness and jump on fluffy happy clouds for all eternity?

Haha :P

Yes I know that. Radical yadda yadda. 

It still doesn't make sense.

-------------------------------

I know you can't grasp this stuff with the mind yadda. It needs to be experienced and yadda.

So back to practices I guess.

Whateverrrr.

There can't be non-suffering without the existence of suffering. Without suffering what would it mean not to suffer? There has to be a contrast.

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8 hours ago, Mikael89 said:

The problem I have with that idea is.. is God really that stupid and limited that He/She has to create suffering? Maybe He/She is.

Read my comment above.

And I'll also add: why does God need to divide itself and start all siffering and misery and all that hassle? Why not just stay in the awesome Love bliss enlightenment Oneness and jump on fluffy happy clouds for all eternity?

 

If you were raised up in Christianity you'd know the doubtful thought that washed over you every now and then, "What the fuck are we going to DO in heaven? It sounds so boring." The best answer I ever got was that God might let us become some kind of angel, (think aliens) and we would be allowed to screw around with other people's flawed planets. If there's nothing to "fix" there's nothing to do. If there's nothing unwanted there's nothing to want. The beauty of creation is the beauty of duality. Oneness transcends but oneness includes separateness itself. 


Light on Earth The power of love came into me,
and I became fierce like a lion,
then tender like the evening star.” - Rumi

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I’ve found immersion in nature to be helpful in understanding the human mechanics of suffering. 

Within nature there is what humans would perceive and categorize as life/death, growth/decay, pretty/ugly, pleasure/pain etc. Yet nature has no such categories as these are human constructs. Nature simply IS, ISing along.  This is a “blank canvas” that provides contrast as we paint our human constructs onto it. Observing this takes a form of effort and concentration, to relax and let go of mental conditioning and human stories. 

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@mandyjw @Serotoninluv @TrynaBeTurquoise All brilliant insights.

12 hours ago, Mikael89 said:

I know you can't grasp this stuff with the mind yadda. It needs to be experienced and yadda.

So back to practices I guess.

Whateverrrr.

What an attitude!

You do realize you are inquiring about the nature of all of REALITY?

At least, that's what an honest inquiry of love leads to.

This is the ultimate undertaking. If anything should be approached with humility, it is this.

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2 hours ago, Serotoninluv said:

I’ve found immersion in nature to be helpful in understanding the human mechanics of suffering. 

Within nature there is what humans would perceive and categorize as life/death, growth/decay, pretty/ugly, pleasure/pain etc. Yet nature has no such categories as these are human constructs. Nature simply IS, ISing along.  This is a “blank canvas” that provides contrast as we paint our human constructs onto it. Observing this takes a form of effort and concentration, to relax and let go of mental conditioning and human stories. 

Very nice :x

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Posted (edited)

23 hours ago, RendHeaven said:

@mandyjw @Serotoninluv @TrynaBeTurquoise All brilliant insights.

What an attitude!

You do realize you are inquiring about the nature of all of REALITY?

At least, that's what an honest inquiry of love leads to.

This is the ultimate undertaking. If anything should be approached with humility, it is this.

Formless, infinite, eternal, ever present, attributeless, impersonal, Consciousness.

End of story.

Edited by Mikael89

Swami Sarvapriyananda about enlightenment and the Real (You): 

 

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12 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

Formless, infinite, eternal, ever present, Consciousness.

End of story.

Cool now drop your mind and questions and become it. You are it. 

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Posted (edited)

17 minutes ago, Mikael89 said:

Formless, infinite, eternal, ever present, Consciousness.

End of story.

All ideas until you actually see where the pointer is pointing to. :P

You talk a lot about this stuff but based on my previous conversations with you, you admit you haven't had any direct realization of such ideas. So be careful here. Its just ideology in such instances.

Edited by Shadowraix

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